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L-29 GLUT
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ca6209(at)flash.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2006 1:58 pm Post subject: L-29 GLUT

Your comments are on the mark and the worm doesn't have a clue about jets.

As I fly off a 3300' grass runway in my 29 it leaves behind a spitfire and

departs 700 feet later the the spit.

Not too good a look on a 2 ship departure.

Gary C.

Lets get a 29 fly-in in the works.



--

schwartzcompany(at)worldn
Guest

Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2006 2:06 pm Post subject: L-29 GLUT

Its funny. I did not know what anyone else would be writing. But, looks like 

we all about agree.  Bravo



Delfin 2819

From: "Gary Cole" <ca6209(at)flash.net>

To: <l29-list(at)matronics.com>

Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2006 2:34 PM

Subject: RE: L-29 GLUT

[quote] 



 Your comments are on the mark and the worm doesn't have a clue about jets.

 As I fly off a 3300' grass runway in my 29 it leaves behind a spitfire and

 departs 700 feet later the the spit.

 Not too good a look on a 2 ship departure.

 Gary C.

 Lets get a 29 fly-in in the works.



 --

jorgen.nielsen(at)mweb.co
Guest

Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2006 3:27 pm Post subject: L-29 GLUT

I know of several L-29 (outside of US) that sold in the last 12 months that

got their asking price, one for $150,000 and the other for $125,000.  Also

in UK they are priced higher.  Supply and demand I guess.  The flipside is

other L-29 and other warbirds that have not sold - it's a small market.



Bob you sum it up well, re overall ownership issues.  Flying them is great,

anyone who criticises has not flown in one.  Sure t/o requires a suitable

runway and time to cleanup, but thereafter its all fun.  Aeros are great

fun, you can chuck it around and with little worry about flame outs.  Even

the approach can be fun - I have had (aerobatic pilot) pax greying out on

initial.  The g's can wind up and stay there. 



Apart from the flying, the L-29 is a great aeroplane - build quality

excellent, reliable, low maintenance, etc.  Just go fly.



My experience with warbirds is that you get a lot of bang for the buck -

these days the contemporary trainer jets such as the L-159 and Hawk go for

between 12 and 20 million USD, the T-50 for 22 million, the M346 for 15

million.  Putting that into perspective today a new C172 costs $200k.  40

years back when the L-29 was introduced as a new design and new aircraft it

would have been similarly very expensive, with private ownership out of the

question.  To be able to buy and fly the L-29 now, even 40 years on is a

dream come true.



 

 	  Quote: 	
		   >>

 >> 

 >> schwartzcompany(at)worldnet.att.net>

 >>

 >> In response to Steve Roberts post:

 >>

 >> I've been involved in the L-29 community for almost 10 years and I 

 >> feel that a response to Mr. Roberts is necessary.

 >>

 >> When the L-29 first became available the prices were around 

 >> $100,000

 for

 >> a

 >> certified , flying nice aircraft.  The L-29 market was dramatically 

 >> affected by the introduction of the L-39 to the civilian market. 

 >> However, there was and still is no comparison between the 2 

 >> aircraft, except for the wonderful quality of Aero Vodochody 

 >> production.  The L-39 is a more sophisticated with more advanced 

 >> systems, a very expensive fan jet engine, costing over $100,000 to 

 >> replace and annualized routine maintained far above that of the 

 >> L-29. That being said, it is a wonderful aircraft and even in 

 >> today's marketplace of somewhat reduced prices, you are going to be 

 >> paying $175,000 and up for any decent flying aircraft.  While fuel 

 >> burn between the 2 aircrafts is very similar.

 >>

 >> Granted fuel costs have risen a lot !!!!.  But where can anyone buy 

 >> and operate an ex-military jet with the reliability, ease of 

 >> maintenance

 and

 >> parts availability that the L-29 affords for these prices?  NOWHERE.

 The

 >> L-29 remains the biggest bang for the buck in all of the warbird 

 >> community.

 >> Maybe you would prefer investing $70,000 in a YAK with a piston 

 >> engine that requires a quart of oil per hour. (Don't get on me, I 

 >> own one and love

 >> it!)

 >> Just a comparison.  A $50,000 car would be worth $5,000 -five years 

 >> latter.

 >> So, everything taken into consideration, its a wonderful aircraft 

 >> and affords the average guy the opportunity to live a dream on a 

 >> beer

 budget.

 >> With fuel being the single greatest operating cost, I suggest that

 every

 >> operator look at ways of relocating to airports that allow you to 

 >> own your own fuel tank, or allow you to truck in a fuel trailer 

 >> etc. After all, reducing fuel costs greatly enhances your hourly 

 >> ability to fly this aircraft.

 >>

 >> Times change and so will the market for the L-29. With surplus 

 >> engines becoming a big issue with the L-39, the L-29 could see a 

 >> revival in the coming months and years.  To address resale value.  

 >> The market is all over the place. I have seen  very nice , well 

 >> equipped aircraft sell for $100,000 and I have seen them in the box 

 >> for $18,000.  Every case is different

 and

 >> the condition and representation of each aircraft is different. It 

 >> takes  a nice aircraft, (more than just slapped together) and some 

 >> salesmanship

 to

 >> get the top dollar. But it is possible and I know of several that sold

 >> recently well above $50,000.    Let work together and stick together.

 >> Happy

 >> Delfin Flying

 >>

 >> The Delfin Driver--2819

SD737(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2006 5:33 pm Post subject: L-29 GLUT

I wish they only burn 103 gallons an hour.... I plan 160 to 180 an  hour....

 

And yes, the L-29 market is very, very soft.  I know a guy in  California 

that has a beautiful L-29 with a spare overhauled zero time engine  with a great 

paint job and good radios and ALL the ground equipment and a set of  tires and 

spare parts and he cannot sell it at $50K.  He is a L-39 guy and  wants to 

unload his L-29, but the market is so bad he cannot dump it.

 

I'd be interested in selling mine.  

1968 L-29C

Put together by a factory Czech mechanic with NEW elevator, New aileron,  new 

generator, new voltage regulator, new nose gear, new tires, new wheels and  

brake assemblies, perfect canopy glass, King KX155 with localizer and 

glideslope  and I can provide a factory zero time engine preserved in the storage  

container with original logs.

 

I'd be happy to get $45K with the spare engine...

 

IF there's anyone out there in the market give me a call or email me and  

it's yours!

Scott Douglass

775-853-1946

_SD737(at)AOL.COM_ (mailto:SD737(at)AOL.COM)

SD737(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2006 5:53 pm Post subject: L-29 GLUT

It looks like the guy that wrote about the lousy soft L-29 market  started 

some good banter.

Unfortunately he is right on the mark!  The market has dropped about  $20K on 

L-29's over the winter.  Example the L-29 that sold for $60K would  be 

difficult to sell for $40K in today's market.  Good news however, the  oil future 

markets took a beating today saying there is a oil  surplus!   Hopefully that 

will work its way down to a kerosene price  drop this summer.

 

Ya, kerosene used to be .80 a gallon and over the course of a year jumped  to 

$2.75 a gallon out here in Reno, Nevada and that keeps me from flying much  

more than once a month.

 

There are  3 L-29 owners out here on the west coast that got  together a few 

weeks ago and flew over the Golden Gate and Alcatraz and the  Marin Headlands 

and we had a great time although it ended up being approximately  a$1,500.00 

day for me which is a lot of money to blow out the  tail pipe.  I had a back 

seater that threw $600.00 at the  cause. 

I fly the 757/767 to Hawaii and flying the L-29 still brings a bigger smile  

to my face than landing a 767 Heavy in SFO!

colyergreg(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2006 7:55 pm Post subject: L-29 GLUT

I think it was the guy in the back who brought a smile to your face:) sorry you left the door open, so to speak.... 

 

--

ainut(at)hiwaay.net
Guest

Posted: Sun Feb 12, 2006 11:10 am Post subject: L-29 GLUT

Yes, they are danged expensive to play with, not even including the 

buy-in costs.  Pigs, though?

Ok, let's call the bluff.

What are you guys finding for:



----------, I seem to recall

range,      600-900 miles

economy cruise speed, 360-390 kts at 26,000

fuel costs per hour, $480-600 (not including cheating)

insurance, (probably too many variables)

aerobatic speeds, Va? 350 kts

roll rate, 720 degrees per second

Vne, .87 Mach



Bear in mind, people do this for FUN!



David M.

Bill wrote:



[quote] 

 

 Sorry I'm late getting back into town. I still want to respond to eastcoast 

 flyer. Please don't come to any of our fly-ins or events. We all still have 

 fun flying them and enjoy each others company. I'll give you $30,000 for 

 your pig. Or do you even own one?

 

 Bill

 ---

Colyergreg(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Feb 12, 2006 1:00 pm Post subject: L-29 GLUT

What aircraft are you talking the speeds and range from?

ainut(at)hiwaay.net
Guest

Posted: Sun Feb 12, 2006 2:03 pm Post subject: L-29 GLUT

If you refer to my post, from my swiss cheese memory of the L-29.  I was 

asking for corrections .



David

Colyergreg(at)aol.com wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

 What aircraft are you talking the speeds and range from?

Colyergreg(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Feb 12, 2006 2:29 pm Post subject: L-29 GLUT

David,

  Range 397 Max with wing tanks 500, Max never exceed speed 440 Knots, or 

mach .75 (.70 with tanks on) 1000 liters internal fuel, another 300 liters with 

wing tanks.  Typical cruise though is 250 knots, 189 maneuvering speed.

czech6(at)kellin.net
Guest

Posted: Sun Feb 12, 2006 5:03 pm Post subject: L-29 GLUT

Best rate of climb is 189. Flight plan is 1 gallon/mile. Once you're at 

altitude you can recheck over your check points. But anymore than 1 1/2 hrs 

in the seat I want to jump. 330 nautical is a good starting point. I have 

actualy done a 402 nm leg at 14,500 no wind. Downwind the 200 liter light 

came on.



Hate to brag, but now I can do 500+ with reserve. I'm happy! It cost me 

enough to be happy, but like you say, thats why we fly these.

============================================================

SD737(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Feb 13, 2006 12:20 am Post subject: L-29 GLUT

What plane are you talking about... ??   LOL    

I sure wish my L-29 had those performance numbers....

 

26,000 feet?  By the time I could limp my L-29 to FL260 I'd be a  glider....

 

economy cruise speed, 360-390 kts at 26,000???  Maybe... if I pointed  it 

straight down with full throttle...

 

 

Vne, .87 Mach ???   You must be  talking about some other plane....

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