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Smoke System Warning

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tamara_b(at)telus.net
Guest

Posted: Mon May 21, 2007 7:41 pm Post subject: Smoke System Warning

Group,



End of 2005 I had a "Smoking Airplanes" smoke

system installed in my CJ by a reputable AMO.

Today in the afternoon the cheap plastic elbow

near (and due) that heavy brass valve cracked

and the inside of my airplane is a living mess,

smoke oil everywhere.

So far for the MIL SPEC PARTS, now I am the

guy who is steaming - I do not need a smoke

system anymore.



I need a drink now.............



cheers



Elmar (C-FTKL)

-- 

Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/

viperdoc(at)mindspring.co
Guest

Posted: Mon May 21, 2007 8:26 pm Post subject: Smoke System Warning

Well that rules out smoking airplane as the manufacturer of my future smoke

system.

So who else out there makes a reasonable system for a YAK-50?

Doc Kemp



--

cjpilot710(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Mon May 21, 2007 9:24 pm Post subject: Smoke System Warning

In a message dated 5/22/2007 12:27:47 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  viperdoc(at)mindspring.com writes:

  

 I do not know what smoking gun s(whoever) charges for their stuff, but I am  will to bet you can build you own for almost the same price.  The most  expensive item would be the pump, particularly if you go to an STC'd aircraft  fuel pump.  You may want one that runs on 24V (pricey) but you can find no  aircraft rated pumps, much cheaper.

  

 Figure out where you want to mount the smoke oil tank.  Make a card  board model with scissor and masking type.  Figure how you'd want to mount  it and where would be the best place for a filler point.  Take the model to  almost any welding shop and have them weld it up out of  .040 aluminum. Your tank does not have to be large.  Mine holds a  little over 5 gals.  I made it the exact same size as the old ADF box and  mounted it on the same rack.  The tank and oil weight less than the  ADF did so the rack will hold it (and has now for over 500 hours) just  fine.  5 gals last long enough for most any show.

  

 I found a RED tagged 24v fuel pump that ran, but the bearings  were bad.  Since this in NOT a safety of flight item, it service  its purpose fine. It was very inexpensive. Common auto fuel hose from NAPA  and simple hose clamps, the hose runs for the tank, to the pump, to a though the  fire wall T fitting.  From there I use high press, stainless steel covered  flexible hose to the exhaust stacks.  

  

 Than all you need is a switch and wire to run the pump.

  

 BTW.  You can clean out the belly of the CJ fairly easy.  Get  some "Gunk" or other good degreaser.  Mix it 1/4 degreaser to 3/4 mineral  spirits.  Remove the ADF cover on the belly.  Have someone hang on the  tail skip while you put a couple of 2x4s under the nose wheel.  Now spray  inside the airframe.  Now rinse out with copious amounts of fresh  water.  You will not need high water pressure, just let the water flow  out.  Just don't go spraying water on electrical stuff of course.   Leave her in the sun for a few hours, and she'll dry out nicely.

  

 Smoke oil can be messy but it usually does not hurt the airframe.

  

  

 Jim "Pappy" Goolsby

  

  	  Quote: 	
		  -->    Yak-List message posted by: "viperdoc"    <viperdoc(at)mindspring.com>



Well that rules out smoking airplane as    the manufacturer of my future smoke

system.

So who else out there makes    a reasonable system for a YAK-50?

Doc Kemp



-----Original    Message-----

From:    owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com

[mailto:owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com]    On Behalf Of Elmar

Sent: Monday, May 21, 2007 10:42 PM

To:    yak-list(at)matronics.com

Subject: Smoke System    Warning



--> Yak-List message posted by: Elmar    <tamara_b(at)telus.net>

Group,



End of 2005 I had a    "Smoking Airplanes" smoke

system installed in my CJ by a reputable    AMO.

Today in the afternoon the cheap plastic elbow

near (and due) that    heavy brass valve cracked

and the inside of my airplane is a living    mess,

smoke oil everywhere.

So far for the MIL SPEC PARTS, now I am    the

guy who is steaming - I do not need a smoke

system anymore.



I    need a drink now.............



cheers



Elmar (C-FTKL)

--    

Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client:    http://www.opera.com/mail/



	


 

  



See what's free at AOL.com. 

  [quote][b]

steve.fox(at)mac.com
Guest

Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 4:02 am Post subject: Smoke System Warning

Viper DocI know a number guys with The Smoking Airplane System, including myself, who have had zero problems. I had one small leak of my own doing. However, I am going to suggest to John at Smoking Airplanes that he change all his fittings over to ANR, as I have done. The vibrations in the Yak may just be too much for plastic.



Steve

On May 22, 2007, at 12:25 AM, viperdoc wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  

Well that rules out smoking airplane as the manufacturer of my future smoke 

system. 

So who else out there makes a reasonable system for a YAK-50? 

Doc Kemp 



 	




 Stephen Fox

Consulting Partner/Facilitator & Trainer

thinkx Intellectual Capital

Think Exponentially

308 Columbus Ave. #2

Boston, MA 02116

http://www.thinkxic.com

email: steve.fox(at)thinkxic.com (steve.fox(at)thinkxic.com)

Direct: 603.924.8660

Cell: 603.547.0448

SKYPE: jstephenfox



 



 [quote][b]

viperdoc(at)mindspring.co
Guest

Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 4:34 am Post subject: Smoke System Warning

Pappy and Steve,  

Thanks. It may be better to make my own since I can fit it in the hell hole very easily and not affect the cg hardly at all since it near the spar.   

Doc  

       

From: owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of cjpilot710(at)aol.com

 Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2007 12:22 AM

 To: yak-list(at)matronics.com

 Subject: Re: Smoke System Warning  

  

  

       

In a message dated 5/22/2007 12:27:47 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, viperdoc(at)mindspring.com writes:  

    

   

    

I do not know what smoking gun s(whoever) charges for their stuff, but I am will to bet you can build you own for almost the same price.  The most expensive item would be the pump, particularly if you go to an STC'd aircraft fuel pump.  You may want one that runs on 24V (pricey) but you can find no aircraft rated pumps, much cheaper.  

    

   

    

Figure out where you want to mount the smoke oil tank.  Make a card board model with scissor and masking type.  Figure how you'd want to mount it and where would be the best place for a filler point.  Take the model to almost any welding shop and have them weld it up out of .040 aluminum. Your tank does not have to be large.  Mine holds a little over 5 gals.  I made it the exact same size as the old ADF box and mounted it on the same rack.  The tank and oil weight less than the ADF did so the rack will hold it (and has now for over 500 hours) just fine.  5 gals last long enough for most any show.  

    

   

    

I found a RED tagged 24v fuel pump that ran, but the bearings were bad.  Since this in NOT a safety of flight item, it service its purpose fine. It was very inexpensive. Common auto fuel hose from NAPA and simple hose clamps, the hose runs for the tank, to the pump, to a though the fire wall T fitting.  From there I use high press, stainless steel covered flexible hose to the exhaust stacks.    

    

   

    

Than all you need is a switch and wire to run the pump.  

    

   

    

BTW.  You can clean out the belly of the CJ fairly easy.  Get some "Gunk" or other good degreaser.  Mix it 1/4 degreaser to 3/4 mineral spirits.  Remove the ADF cover on the belly.  Have someone hang on the tail skip while you put a couple of 2x4s under the nose wheel.  Now spray inside the airframe.  Now rinse out with copious amounts of fresh water.  You will not need high water pressure, just let the water flow out.  Just don't go spraying water on electrical stuff of course.  Leave her in the sun for a few hours, and she'll dry out nicely.  

    

   

    

Smoke oil can be messy but it usually does not hurt the airframe.  

    

   

    

   

    

Jim "Pappy" Goolsby  

    

   

  [quote]  

--> Yak-List message posted by: "viperdoc" <viperdoc(at)mindspring.com>

 

 Well that rules out smoking airplane as the manufacturer of my future smoke

 system.

 So who else out there makes a reasonable system for a YAK-50?

 Doc Kemp

 

 --

david(at)mcgirt.net
Guest

Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 5:49 am Post subject: Smoke System Warning

Talk to Tim Williams - he has the list of parts and pumps we are using in 3 TW's , 1 CJ, and a couple straight Yak's.. simple stuff, aviation grade parts, and economical.  

   

   

       

From: owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Kemp

 Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2007 8:32 AM

 To: yak-list(at)matronics.com

 Subject: RE: Smoke System Warning  

  

  

   

Pappy and Steve,  

Thanks. It may be better to make my own since I can fit it in the hell hole very easily and not affect the cg hardly at all since it near the spar.   

Doc  

       

From: owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of cjpilot710(at)aol.com

 Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2007 12:22 AM

 To: yak-list(at)matronics.com

 Subject: Re: Smoke System Warning  

  

  

       

In a message dated 5/22/2007 12:27:47 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, viperdoc(at)mindspring.com writes:  

    

   

    

I do not know what smoking gun s(whoever) charges for their stuff, but I am will to bet you can build you own for almost the same price.  The most expensive item would be the pump, particularly if you go to an STC'd aircraft fuel pump.  You may want one that runs on 24V (pricey) but you can find no aircraft rated pumps, much cheaper.  

    

   

    

Figure out where you want to mount the smoke oil tank.  Make a card board model with scissor and masking type.  Figure how you'd want to mount it and where would be the best place for a filler point.  Take the model to almost any welding shop and have them weld it up out of .040 aluminum. Your tank does not have to be large.  Mine holds a little over 5 gals.  I made it the exact same size as the old ADF box and mounted it on the same rack.  The tank and oil weight less than the ADF did so the rack will hold it (and has now for over 500 hours) just fine.  5 gals last long enough for most any show.  

    

   

    

I found a RED tagged 24v fuel pump that ran, but the bearings were bad.  Since this in NOT a safety of flight item, it service its purpose fine. It was very inexpensive. Common auto fuel hose from NAPA and simple hose clamps, the hose runs for the tank, to the pump, to a though the fire wall T fitting.  From there I use high press, stainless steel covered flexible hose to the exhaust stacks.    

    

   

    

Than all you need is a switch and wire to run the pump.  

    

   

    

BTW.  You can clean out the belly of the CJ fairly easy.  Get some "Gunk" or other good degreaser.  Mix it 1/4 degreaser to 3/4 mineral spirits.  Remove the ADF cover on the belly.  Have someone hang on the tail skip while you put a couple of 2x4s under the nose wheel.  Now spray inside the airframe.  Now rinse out with copious amounts of fresh water.  You will not need high water pressure, just let the water flow out.  Just don't go spraying water on electrical stuff of course.  Leave her in the sun for a few hours, and she'll dry out nicely.  

    

   

    

Smoke oil can be messy but it usually does not hurt the airframe.  

    

   

    

   

    

Jim "Pappy" Goolsby  

    

   

  [quote]  

--> Yak-List message posted by: "viperdoc" <viperdoc(at)mindspring.com>

 

 Well that rules out smoking airplane as the manufacturer of my future smoke

 system.

 So who else out there makes a reasonable system for a YAK-50?

 Doc Kemp

 

 --

david(at)mcgirt.net
Guest

Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 6:09 am Post subject: Smoke System Warning

Here is a picture of that system at work..  

   

       

From: owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of David McGirt

 Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2007 9:47 AM

 To: yak-list(at)matronics.com

 Subject: RE: Smoke System Warning  

  

  

   

Talk to Tim Williams - he has the list of parts and pumps we are using in 3 TW's , 1 CJ, and a couple straight Yak's.. simple stuff, aviation grade parts, and economical.  

   

   

       

From: owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Kemp

 Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2007 8:32 AM

 To: yak-list(at)matronics.com

 Subject: RE: Smoke System Warning  

  

  

   

Pappy and Steve,  

Thanks. It may be better to make my own since I can fit it in the hell hole very easily and not affect the cg hardly at all since it near the spar.   

Doc  

       

From: owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of cjpilot710(at)aol.com

 Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2007 12:22 AM

 To: yak-list(at)matronics.com

 Subject: Re: Smoke System Warning  

  

  

       

In a message dated 5/22/2007 12:27:47 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, viperdoc(at)mindspring.com writes:  

    

   

    

I do not know what smoking gun s(whoever) charges for their stuff, but I am will to bet you can build you own for almost the same price.  The most expensive item would be the pump, particularly if you go to an STC'd aircraft fuel pump.  You may want one that runs on 24V (pricey) but you can find no aircraft rated pumps, much cheaper.  

    

   

    

Figure out where you want to mount the smoke oil tank.  Make a card board model with scissor and masking type.  Figure how you'd want to mount it and where would be the best place for a filler point.  Take the model to almost any welding shop and have them weld it up out of .040 aluminum. Your tank does not have to be large.  Mine holds a little over 5 gals.  I made it the exact same size as the old ADF box and mounted it on the same rack.  The tank and oil weight less than the ADF did so the rack will hold it (and has now for over 500 hours) just fine.  5 gals last long enough for most any show.  

    

   

    

I found a RED tagged 24v fuel pump that ran, but the bearings were bad.  Since this in NOT a safety of flight item, it service its purpose fine. It was very inexpensive. Common auto fuel hose from NAPA and simple hose clamps, the hose runs for the tank, to the pump, to a though the fire wall T fitting.  From there I use high press, stainless steel covered flexible hose to the exhaust stacks.    

    

   

    

Than all you need is a switch and wire to run the pump.  

    

   

    

BTW.  You can clean out the belly of the CJ fairly easy.  Get some "Gunk" or other good degreaser.  Mix it 1/4 degreaser to 3/4 mineral spirits.  Remove the ADF cover on the belly.  Have someone hang on the tail skip while you put a couple of 2x4s under the nose wheel.  Now spray inside the airframe.  Now rinse out with copious amounts of fresh water.  You will not need high water pressure, just let the water flow out.  Just don't go spraying water on electrical stuff of course.  Leave her in the sun for a few hours, and she'll dry out nicely.  

    

   

    

Smoke oil can be messy but it usually does not hurt the airframe.  

    

   

    

   

    

Jim "Pappy" Goolsby  

    

   

  [quote]  

--> Yak-List message posted by: "viperdoc" <viperdoc(at)mindspring.com>

 

 Well that rules out smoking airplane as the manufacturer of my future smoke

 system.

 So who else out there makes a reasonable system for a YAK-50?

 Doc Kemp

 

 --

CIMG1892.JPG

Description:

Filesize:

11.16 KB

Viewed:

153 Time(s)

cliff(at)gesoco.com
Guest

Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 9:02 am Post subject: Smoke System Warning

Or if you want to go whole hog....



Cheers,

Cliff



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5_K7exnVys

 



David McGirt wrote:



[quote] Here is a picture of that system at work..



  



  



 *From:* owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com 

 [mailto:owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *David McGirt

 *Sent:* Tuesday, May 22, 2007 9:47 AM

 *To:* yak-list(at)matronics.com

 *Subject:* RE: Smoke System Warning



  



 Talk to Tim Williams - he has the list of parts and pumps we are using 

 in 3 TW's , 1 CJ, and a couple straight Yak's.. simple stuff, aviation 

 grade parts, and economical.



  



  



  



 *From:* owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com 

 [mailto:owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Roger Kemp

 *Sent:* Tuesday, May 22, 2007 8:32 AM

 *To:* yak-list(at)matronics.com

 *Subject:* RE: Smoke System Warning



  



 Pappy and Steve,



 Thanks. It may be better to make my own since I can fit it in the hell 

 hole very easily and not affect the cg hardly at all since it near the 

 spar.



 Doc



  



 *From:* owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com 

 [mailto:owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of 

 *cjpilot710(at)aol.com

 *Sent:* Tuesday, May 22, 2007 12:22 AM

 *To:* yak-list(at)matronics.com

 *Subject:* Re: Smoke System Warning



  



 In a message dated 5/22/2007 12:27:47 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, 

 viperdoc(at)mindspring.com writes:



  



 I do not know what smoking gun s(whoever) charges for their stuff, but 

 I am will to bet you can build you own for almost the same price.  The 

 most expensive item would be the pump, particularly if you go to an 

 STC'd aircraft fuel pump.  You may want one that runs on 24V (pricey) 

 but you can find no aircraft rated pumps, much cheaper.



  



 Figure out where you want to mount the smoke oil tank.  Make a card 

 board model with scissor and masking type.  Figure how you'd want to 

 mount it and where would be the best place for a filler point.  Take 

 the model to almost any welding shop and have them weld it up out of 

 .040 aluminum. Your tank does not have to be large.  Mine holds a 

 little over 5 gals.  I made it the exact same size as the old ADF box 

 and mounted it on the same rack.  The tank and oil weight less than 

 the ADF did so the rack will hold it (and has now for over 500 hours) 

 just fine.  5 gals last long enough for most any show.



  



 I found a RED tagged 24v fuel pump that ran, but the bearings were 

 bad.  Since this in NOT a safety of flight item, it service its 

 purpose fine. It was very inexpensive. Common auto fuel hose from NAPA 

 and simple hose clamps, the hose runs for the tank, to the pump, to a 

 though the fire wall T fitting.  From there I use high press, 

 stainless steel covered flexible hose to the exhaust stacks. 



  



 Than all you need is a switch and wire to run the pump.



  



 BTW.  You can clean out the belly of the CJ fairly easy.  Get some 

 "Gunk" or other good degreaser.  Mix it 1/4 degreaser to 3/4 mineral 

 spirits.  Remove the ADF cover on the belly.  Have someone hang on the 

 tail skip while you put a couple of 2x4s under the nose wheel.  Now 

 spray inside the airframe.  Now rinse out with copious amounts of 

 fresh water.  You will not need high water pressure, just let the 

 water flow out.  Just don't go spraying water on electrical stuff of 

 course.  Leave her in the sun for a few hours, and she'll dry out nicely.



  



 Smoke oil can be messy but it usually does not hurt the airframe.



  



  



 Jim "Pappy" Goolsby



  



     



     Well that rules out smoking airplane as the manufacturer of my

     future smoke

     system.

     So who else out there makes a reasonable system for a YAK-50?

     Doc Kemp



     --

viperdoc(at)mindspring.co
Guest

Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 9:39 am Post subject: Smoke System Warning

If I can get him to answer his cell phone or his email, I will. May just have to fly over there on a regualar basis circling his hanger until I catch him home! Damned early retirement must be great! What did I do wrong…oh forgot…agreed to accept BC/BS PMD and Medicare! F*&$#^(at)! Thieves!  

Doc  

       

From: owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of David McGirt

 Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2007 8:47 AM

 To: yak-list(at)matronics.com

 Subject: RE: Smoke System Warning  

  

  

   

Talk to Tim Williams - he has the list of parts and pumps we are using in 3 TW's , 1 CJ, and a couple straight Yak's.. simple stuff, aviation grade parts, and economical.  

   

   

       

From: owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger Kemp

 Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2007 8:32 AM

 To: yak-list(at)matronics.com

 Subject: RE: Smoke System Warning  

  

  

   

Pappy and Steve,  

Thanks. It may be better to make my own since I can fit it in the hell hole very easily and not affect the cg hardly at all since it near the spar.   

Doc  

       

From: owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of cjpilot710(at)aol.com

 Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2007 12:22 AM

 To: yak-list(at)matronics.com

 Subject: Re: Smoke System Warning  

  

  

       

In a message dated 5/22/2007 12:27:47 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, viperdoc(at)mindspring.com writes:  

    

   

    

I do not know what smoking gun s(whoever) charges for their stuff, but I am will to bet you can build you own for almost the same price.  The most expensive item would be the pump, particularly if you go to an STC'd aircraft fuel pump.  You may want one that runs on 24V (pricey) but you can find no aircraft rated pumps, much cheaper.  

    

   

    

Figure out where you want to mount the smoke oil tank.  Make a card board model with scissor and masking type.  Figure how you'd want to mount it and where would be the best place for a filler point.  Take the model to almost any welding shop and have them weld it up out of .040 aluminum. Your tank does not have to be large.  Mine holds a little over 5 gals.  I made it the exact same size as the old ADF box and mounted it on the same rack.  The tank and oil weight less than the ADF did so the rack will hold it (and has now for over 500 hours) just fine.  5 gals last long enough for most any show.  

    

   

    

I found a RED tagged 24v fuel pump that ran, but the bearings were bad.  Since this in NOT a safety of flight item, it service its purpose fine. It was very inexpensive. Common auto fuel hose from NAPA and simple hose clamps, the hose runs for the tank, to the pump, to a though the fire wall T fitting.  From there I use high press, stainless steel covered flexible hose to the exhaust stacks.    

    

   

    

Than all you need is a switch and wire to run the pump.  

    

   

    

BTW.  You can clean out the belly of the CJ fairly easy.  Get some "Gunk" or other good degreaser.  Mix it 1/4 degreaser to 3/4 mineral spirits.  Remove the ADF cover on the belly.  Have someone hang on the tail skip while you put a couple of 2x4s under the nose wheel.  Now spray inside the airframe.  Now rinse out with copious amounts of fresh water.  You will not need high water pressure, just let the water flow out.  Just don't go spraying water on electrical stuff of course.  Leave her in the sun for a few hours, and she'll dry out nicely.  

    

   

    

Smoke oil can be messy but it usually does not hurt the airframe.  

    

   

    

   

    

Jim "Pappy" Goolsby  

    

   

  [quote]  

--> Yak-List message posted by: "viperdoc" <viperdoc(at)mindspring.com>

 

 Well that rules out smoking airplane as the manufacturer of my future smoke

 system.

 So who else out there makes a reasonable system for a YAK-50?

 Doc Kemp

 

 --

ByronMFox(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 9:46 am Post subject: Smoke System Warning

Once again, John at Smoking Airplanes has responded as I knew he would. Never met a man more sincere about his product. You can absolutely trust him to do the right thing.

  

 His system in my CJ has operated flawlessly for more than three years with its original plastic elbow.

  

 ....Blitz

  

  



See what's free at AOL.com. 

  [quote][b]

jeffpritchard(at)cox.net
Guest

Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 10:26 am Post subject: Smoke System Warning

I just visited with John about a system for  my CJ.  Due to the problem with Linedog's CJ, he now provides metal  fittings for all of his systems.

 Fiddler

 [quote]   --

Jetj01(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 2:22 pm Post subject: Smoke System Warning

As has ours in the YAK 50s.  Since we know the YAKs/CJs do vibrate a  lot and have greater Gs to them than average, I'd recommend checking over them  every few hours and making sure everything is still airworthy.  I never  read anything on the smoke system instructions that said, "Fly and  forget..."

  

 Jj

 YAK 50



See what's free at AOL.com. 

  [quote][b]

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