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FAA Memorandum - 8130.2F
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dsavarese(at)elmore.rr.co
Guest

Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2007 4:45 pm Post subject: FAA Memorandum - 8130.2F

But if the FAA would have simply said, "This Memorandum, when carried in the 

aircraft, removes the restriction of the 300/600 NM proficiency area."  But 

no, they want to create paperwork havoc for the local FSDO guys.   Wait 

until the local FSDO inspectors get inundated with the requests.  It will 

take MONTHS to get your new OL's and Airworthiness Certificate.

Dennis



---

JBernier(at)dart.org
Guest

Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2007 5:15 pm Post subject: FAA Memorandum - 8130.2F

Take the slash ( / ) off the end of the address.

 Your welcome, Jim B



 	  Quote: 	
		  >> Doug Sapp <rvfltd(at)televar.com> 9/19/2007 10:17 AM >>>

Could not find http://forms.faa.gov/forms/faa8130-6d.pdf/  anyone able to download the form?
	




Doug Sapp



[quote]



://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List

nics.com



[b]

brian-1927(at)lloyd.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2007 5:22 pm Post subject: FAA Memorandum - 8130.2F

On Sep 19, 2007, at 5:45 PM, A. Dennis Savarese wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 <dsavarese(at)elmore.rr.com>



 But if the FAA would have simply said, "This Memorandum, when  

 carried in the aircraft, removes the restriction of the 300/600 NM  

 proficiency area."  But no, they want to create paperwork havoc for  

 the local FSDO guys.   Wait until the local FSDO inspectors get  

 inundated with the requests.  It will take MONTHS to get your new  

 OL's and Airworthiness Certificate.


	


I know and I agree. OTOH, it makes a very simple but perverse sort of  

sense. The guy in the field doesn't need to know nufin' but, "what's  

it say in da LOL? If'n it sez it in da' LOL, dat's what matters."  

This makes it very easy for a guy with an IQ of 80 to be a field  

inspector.



So, to make it easy for the guy in the field to determine if your  

airplane is airworthy, he looks at your AC which refers him to your  

LOL. He reads that. It says you have to be within 300nm. He doesn't  

need anything more nor does he need to think about it.



Frankly, I *WANT* a new LOL so I don't have to get into an argument  

in the field with the field inspector with an IQ of 80 because that  

is *precisely* the guy I'm going to get when I am ramp-checked.



--

Brian Lloyd                         3191 Western Drive

brian HYPHEN 1927 AT lloyd DOT com    Cameron Park, CA 95682

+1.916.367.2131 (voice)             +1.270.912.0788 (fax)



I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . .

— Antoine de Saint-Exupéry



PGP key ID:          12095C52A32A1B6C

PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0  CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C

c44588

Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 10

Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 6:20 pm Post subject: Re: FAA Memorandum - 8130.2F

Be careful.......



Had to send my OPSLIM into FAA this last spring following change of N number (requires new OPSLIM and Airworthiness Certificate), noticed by local FSDO after 4 years, and recieved much more restrictive OPSLIM back. Included requirement that local FSDO receive notice of AND approve of any maintenance flights, etc. Took me as an attorney the better part of 5 months of intense work with the FAA in association with EAA/Warbirds staff and AOPA legal to get it corrected.



I will wait until the subsequent automatic deletion of the requirement happens; in the meantime I would feel pretty good arguing that the FAA letter rendered warbird operating radius limits no longer enforceable.



Just know that a lot of subjectivity apparently still exists  in the issuance of warbird operating limitations. Be careful......



Jack Coe

CJ-6A :shock:  :shock:

dsavarese(at)elmore.rr.co
Guest

Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 6:36 pm Post subject: FAA Memorandum - 8130.2F

Jack,

Good for you for challenging and winning against the FAA.  As for waiting 

until it's automatic, be careful because as long as your aircraft's OL's are 

not rewritten, they will remain in force.  When the FAA rewrites the Order, 

the only way your present OL's we be made null and void is for your present 

OL's to be reissued.



As for the Memorandum, I completely agree with you the by reading the first 

paragraph, the proficiency area restriction no longer enforceable.  That 

would have been the easy and less paperwork way of doing things.  But not 

too many people will argue it in a court of law.

Dennis



---

bwade154(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 7:56 pm Post subject: FAA Memorandum - 8130.2F

Hi Dennis now that we can go anywhere in the US any time we want, how about that bladder fuel tank your working on for longer leg's. How close to compleation?

  Bill Wade



"A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese(at)elmore.rr.com> wrote:

  [quote]--> Yak-List message posted by: "A. Dennis Savarese" 



But if the FAA would have simply said, "This Memorandum, when carried in the 

aircraft, removes the restriction of the 300/600 NM proficiency area." But 

no, they want to create paperwork havoc for the local FSDO guys. Wait 

until the local FSDO inspectors get inundated with the requests. It will 

take MONTHS to get your new OL's and Airworthiness Certificate.

Dennis



---

dsavarese(at)elmore.rr.co
Guest

Posted: Fri Sep 21, 2007 1:52 am Post subject: FAA Memorandum - 8130.2F

I have the first set in my personal airplane which I am  presently testing.  So far they are working as expected....perfectly.   We have a few minor changes that we have to do to the bladders which will happen  on the next set.  Nothing significant.  Only refinement.  Quite  honestly, the hardest part of the installation so far was the taping of the  fuel cavity.  If you call that "hard".  It just takes time.   We're hoping to release them very soon.  No further details are available  at this time.

 Dennis

  

 [quote]   ---

cliff(at)gesoco.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Sep 21, 2007 4:31 am Post subject: FAA Memorandum - 8130.2F

Or...you can wet the wings ups. 



We've have successfully performed this modification on two aircraft with 

a third scheduled.



This provides an additional 10gal per side.



I haven't determined how to post pics onto this list server, so e-mail 

me if you're interested.



Steve said anyone can contact him about the fuel system we put in- 

stephenmorrey(at)gmail.com



Cheers,

Cliff Coy

Border Air Ltd.

802-868-2822

cliff(at)gesoco.com



A. Dennis Savarese wrote:



[quote] I have the first set in my personal airplane which I am presently 

 testing.  So far they are working as expected....perfectly.  We have a 

 few minor changes that we have to do to the bladders which will happen 

 on the next set.  Nothing significant.  Only refinement.  Quite 

 honestly, the hardest part of the installation so far was the taping 

 of the fuel cavity.  If you call that "hard".  It just takes time.  

 We're hoping to release them very soon.  No further details are 

 available at this time.

 Dennis

  



     ---

ReadeG(at)Cairnwood.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Sep 26, 2007 9:55 pm Post subject: FAA Memorandum - 8130.2F

Dennis:



Question re: 8130 and Op Lim Letter issued in 1990 -



Would an aircraft (e.g. Harvard Mark IV) that was issued its

airworthiness cert. and operation limit letter in the exhibition/show

category in 1990 be subject to the 300/600 mile proficiency area?  There

is nothing in the letter relating to this at all.  In fact it is the

most unencumbered OL that I have seen.  I realize this may be a mute

point with the issuance of the 9-11-07 FAA memo but I am curious as to

what is required to re-register such an aircraft as I believe the rules

were different in 1990.



Reade



Reade Genzlinger

Cairnwood Cooperative Corporation

mailto:readeg(at)cairnwood.com

215.914.0370



--

dsavarese(at)elmore.rr.co
Guest

Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2007 3:52 am Post subject: FAA Memorandum - 8130.2F

Reade,

Everything that is applicable to that specific including the 300/600 NM 

proficiency area will be written in the aircraft's operating limitations. 

My guess would be because the OL's were issued prior to 1993, there are no 

restrictions/no 300/600 NM proficiency area.  ie: "pre-moratorium" aircraft. 

Anyone who has a pre-moratorium aircraft is very lucky because the OL's were 

written under a different FAA Order.

Dennis



---

ReadeG(at)Cairnwood.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2007 6:08 am Post subject: FAA Memorandum - 8130.2F

Thanks, Dennis - I recall reading about the "pre-moratorium" status

aircraft on the list several years ago but since my Yak is 1996 I never

really paid any attention to it.  The letter on this particular aircraft

is one page long and as you said, it seems to be a very lucky situation.

Frankly, it is a much more reasonable letter than today's letters

although the rescission of the proficiency area restriction is a great

leap forward.



So it is my understanding that a "pre-moratorium" certificated aircraft

is treated like a normal category aircraft in a change of ownership i.e.

the Airworthiness Cert. and Op. Limit Letter go with the aircraft.

Other than re-registering is there anything else one would need to do? 



Reade  



Reade Genzlinger

Cairnwood Cooperative Corporation

mailto:readeg(at)cairnwood.com

215.914.0370



--

eyeballs(at)cox.net
Guest

Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2007 9:12 am Post subject: FAA Memorandum - 8130.2F

Actually there is a line in the current order that says that for any aircraft licensed before a date in 1992, this order does not apply.  There was no previous order relating to experimental exhibition aircraft.



EB

---- "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese(at)elmore.rr.com> wrote: 

 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

 Reade,

 Everything that is applicable to that specific including the 300/600 NM 

 proficiency area will be written in the aircraft's operating limitations. 

 My guess would be because the OL's were issued prior to 1993, there are no 

 restrictions/no 300/600 NM proficiency area.  ie: "pre-moratorium" aircraft. 

 Anyone who has a pre-moratorium aircraft is very lucky because the OL's were 

 written under a different FAA Order.

 Dennis

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