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Landing in High Grass

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Dave Bigelow

Joined: 29 Jan 2006
Posts: 103
Location: Kamuela, Hawaii

Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2007 1:34 am Post subject: Landing in High Grass

My grass strip is short and has a 20 foot elevation difference from one end to the other.  I take off downhill and land uphill due to obstructions near the uphill end.  I mow the strip about 20 feet wide and have smooth ground next to the mowed part with about 6 inch high grass.



Sometimes when I come back from a flight, the wind has come up, and I have as much as a 10 mph tailwind, which makes stopping, even uphill a bit of a challenge.



I've been thinking of using the mowed portion for takeoff, but landing in the grass next to the mowed portion to help stop.  I'm not sure how high the grass would have to be to become a noseover danger while rolling out.



Here's the question:  How high can the grass be before it becomes too high to safely land on?  I'm sure there is a lot of experience out there, good and bad - sure would like to hear the stories.

_________________
Dave Bigelow
Kamuela, Hawaii
FS2, HKS 700E

ElleryWeld(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2007 7:14 am Post subject: Landing in High Grass

See AOL's top rated recipes and easy ways to stay in shape for winter.

  [quote][b]

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2007 8:12 am Post subject: Landing in High Grass

> My grass strip is short and has a 20 foot elevation difference from one 

end to the other.

 	  Quote: 	
		   Dave Bigelow


	


Dave B:



I'd opt for better braking which I have control over.



Length of grass, I have no control over the amount of drag once I am 

committed.  If the grass has too much drag, you may find yourself on your 

nose or back.



I moved the main gear and positioned of the axles 8" forward of their 

original position on my MKIII.  This improves my ability to use maximum 

braking without fear of going up on the nose.  It also gives me the ability 

to negotiate tall grass, weeds, brush, soft sand, mud, and other obstacles, 

and keep the tail wheel on the ground.  In addition, I can do a full power 

run up and keep the tail on the ground.



On the negative side, with a little over 100 lbs on the tail wheel, I no 

longer have the gentle ground handling characteristics found on standard 

Kolbs.  I have a true tail dragger.  If you doze at the controls, it will 

sway ends.  However, with a little experience and practice, a good set of 

differential brakes, it has not proven a problem for me, but a tremendous 

asset.



Take care,



john h

mkIII

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

NeilsenRM(at)comcast.net
Guest

Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2007 8:50 am Post subject: Landing in High Grass

Dave



I have a one way strip with about the same elevation change but my strip is 

almost 1400'. I do down wind takeoffs or down wind landings all the time 

with no problems but the length of the strip helps. I actually prefer down 

win landings over up wind because up wind landings can surprise you with 

decreasing air speed just as you get near the ground.



As for the length of maximum grass length. I don't think anyone can answer 

this for you. It depends on the rolling resistance of the grass, the CG of 

you plane at the time, the size of your tires, your landing technique, to 

name just a few. I frequently land at a friends strip that I swear the grass 

is a foot tall at times but it is a new strip so the grass is patchy and 

thin. This strip never causes me any problems. I had a forced landing in a 

bean field a few years ago that was a challenge. The beans were only 6-8" 

tall and I was able to put the main gear in the rows between the beans and 

the tail wheel down first in the beans. The tail got snagged by the beans 

and pulled me to a stop in 15-20 ft with no nose over. I was lucky!!!!!



My $.02 worth



Rick Neilsen

Redrive VW powered MKIIIC



---

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2007 8:55 am Post subject: Landing in High Grass

>  If you doze at the controls, it will 

 	  Quote: 	
		   sway ends.   > 


	


  Gang:



The above should have read "swap ends", not "sway ends."



john h

mkIII

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2007 9:48 am Post subject: Landing in High Grass

>  I actually prefer down

 	  Quote: 	
		   win landings over up wind because up wind landings can surprise you with 

 decreasing air speed just as you get near the ground.

 >
	


 	  Quote: 	
		   Rick Neilsen


	




Rick N:



Don't reckon the wind affects your airplane downwind, but does up wind?



Isn't that why we carry a little more airspeed on approach when the wind is 

brisk and unpredictable, to compensate?



john h

mkIII

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

Richard Pike

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 1670
Location: Blountville, Tennessee

Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2007 11:41 am Post subject: Landing in High Grass

Excellent plan, but let me suggest an important modification, based on 

some personal experience-



Had done some work on the gas tank and thought I had cleaned all the 

fiberglass dust out of it. Bad mistake. Took from off a friends strip 

and got a couple major power surges off the departure end of the strip 

as the fuel filter clogged up. Did a 180 and landed downwind, hot and 

long. His strip had hay growing on both sides, two or three feet tall. I 

waited until I had the mains planted well and then just steered it off 

the mowed part into the hay, it stopped in about ten feet. Which was a 

much better option than running off the end of the strip, a little 

further on -



I would not land in tall grass, that starts to pull at the gear and 

lever the airplane over just at the point where the elevators are 

starting to become ineffective, I would get it on the ground and get the 

weight settling on the gear and then run it off into the tall grass.



 From the way you describe your strip, It sounds as if you might be able 

to do something similar, just let the grass on either side of the upper 

end get about 3' high.



Richard Pike

MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)



Dave Bigelow wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   



 My grass strip is short and has a 20 foot elevation difference from one end to the other.  I take off downhill and land uphill due to obstructions near the uphill end.  I mow the strip about 20 feet wide and have smooth ground next to the mowed part with about 6 inch high grass.



 Sometimes when I come back from a flight, the wind has come up, and I have as much as a 10 mph tailwind, which makes stopping, even uphill a bit of a challenge.



 I've been thinking of using the mowed portion for takeoff, but landing in the grass next to the mowed portion to help stop.  I'm not sure how high the grass would have to be to become a noseover danger while rolling out.



 Here's the question:  How high can the grass be before it becomes too high to safely land on?  I'm sure there is a lot of experience out there, good and bad - sure would like to hear the stories.



 --------

 Dave Bigelow

 Kamuela, Hawaii

 FS2, HKS 700E





 Read this topic online here:



 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=152300#152300

_________________
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0

Forgiving is tough, being forgiven is wonderful, and God's grace really is amazing.

ElleryWeld(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2007 11:43 am Post subject: Landing in High Grass

I have landed in Grass as high as my wheels  with no problem But I did Move my wheels more forward  and I believe this would be to my advantage

  

  Ellery

  

 do not archive



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  [quote][b]

lcottrell

Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 1494
Location: Jordan Valley, Or

Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2007 11:53 am Post subject: Landing in High Grass

 	  Quote: 	
		  

 My grass strip is short and has a 20 foot elevation difference from one 

 end to the other.  I take off downhill and land uphill due to obstructions 

 near the uphill end.  I mow the strip about 20 feet wide and have smooth 

 ground next to the mowed part with about 6 inch high grass.




	


I once landed in a cut hay field, that an uninformed friend picked out for 

me. My roll out was about 15 feet, since the hay had been cut about a month 

before and the grass was about 14 inches high. I just kept the stick back as 

far as I could and had no problem, but there was no way that I could taxi. 

There was a "howling" head wind which helped a lot. The only way that I 

could take off was to have my friend hold down on the tail and run with me 

as I attempted a take off. I instructed her to hold it down as long as she 

could keep up with me and let go when I exceeded her ability to run with me. 

Once I got a bit of wind under my wings the "wheel barrow" original tires 

ran on top of the grass and I was able to get out of there. I don't think 

that 6 inches of grass would be that much of a problem to your landing, but 

I would damn sure get some brakes on it as fast as UPS could deliver.



I finally succumbed to cabin fever yesterday and plowed the snow away from 

the hanger doors, and rolled out the Firestar. The snow is only about 4 

inches deep but a real powder, since even the snow is dry here. The temps 

were 27 degrees with a dew point of 16. I have a enclosure on the plane, but 

the back is open to the world, and of course the wind whistles up the sides 

of the doors. The heater pumps out all the heat that it can and makes it 

actually survivable. I was finally able to see my take off distance. ( not 

that much in this dense air) I stayed in the pattern until I was sure that I 

was not going to have any trouble with icing. Then for lack of something 

better to do I began to do my S turns across a road and turns around a 

point. I was surprised to find that I could still do them.   I then did 

some touch and goes on one of the small playa ponds. and when I touched down 

on the runway at the house found that I had been up for 20 minutes and 

wonder of wonders, I felt a lot better.



Larry C



do not archive

_________________
do not archive

rowedenny(at)windstream.n
Guest

Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2007 12:06 pm Post subject: Landing in High Grass

John H wrote:

 In addition, I can do a full power

 	  Quote: 	
		   run up and keep the tail on the ground.


	


John, others,

My standard Mk -3 can also do full power runups without tipping on its nose.

As long as the stick is held back I'll bet no Kolbs will nose over at full 

power run ups, plenty of elevator authority with all that prop blast.



Denny Rowe

PS: A couple of years back I took a full power pass through a patch of 

ragweed with two up in my bird. Miss judged the take off distance in a 

friends field on a hot day and could not out climb the rising weeds at the 

departure end, entered the waist high jungle with the mains about knee high, 

"ohh ohh", did not cut power till the weeds pulled me to nearly stopped, 

figured I would need all the elevator possible to keep it from nosing over.

I suppose if I had tried to land in there with the power off I would have 

wound up upside down as the elevator would have had a lot less authority.

As far as leaving a patch of grass longer for slowing down on landing, my 

buddy John Tevelonis has done that for years at his home strip, works great.

I would recommend 6 to 10 inches at the far end of the landing zone, touch 

down in the regular cut and roll into the longer stuff, even helps slow down 

Pterodactyls with their tall skinny tires.

 	  Quote:

jbhart(at)onlyinternet.ne
Guest

Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2007 5:27 pm Post subject: Landing in High Grass

At 01:34 AM 12/15/07 -0800, you wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  

...........................
	


 	  Quote: 	
		  Here's the question:  How high can the grass be before it becomes too high to safely land on?  I'm sure there is a lot of experience out there, good and bad - sure would like to hear the stories.




	


Dave,



When I became interested in the Kolb FireFly, I ask the company for the name 

of someone who had one flying in south east Missouri.  They supplied a name, 

address and telephone number.  I called and met the fellow at his home.  He 

was a machinist, who had a piece of land out side town.  He had build a shop 

out there and that is were he built his Firestar.  His landing strip was 

along a north south fence that bordered a hay field.  We walked out and 

uncovered the folded Firestar on a trailer.  The trailer was interesting in 

that he used Volkswagen Rabbit rear axle spindles and trailing links so that 

he could rotate the links and squat the trailer so that one rolled the plane 

at ground level.  Before removing the plane from the trailer, I helped him 

unfold the wings and held them while he put the pins in place.  He had not 

completely covered the inboard rib.  Squirrels had been storing nuts in side 

the wing and you could hear them rolling around in there.  He cranked it up 

and back taxied to the north end of the strip.  I was worried because their 

were trees in the fence row and a fairly strong wind from the west.  He had 

no problems getting off and handling the rotor off the trees.  He put on a 

good show for me and I was impressed.  When he landed he negotiated the 

rotors again and when he passed by me and the trailer, he whipped it out 

into the uncut hay field and then back around toward the trailer.  When it 

stopped he was able to step out of the cockpit onto the strip.  I was 

amazed.  I looked at the elevator and it showed no damage even though there 

was some hay hanging on the lower cables.  I helped him refold the wings, 

thanked him, and I went home and ordered the FireFly.



Jack B. Hart FF004

Winchester, IN



do not archive

NeilsenRM(at)comcast.net
Guest

Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2007 8:50 pm Post subject: Landing in High Grass

OK John H, I guess my comment deserves an explanation.



My strip has trees on three sides so it is almost never windy at ground 

level. When the wind is blowing 10 MPH it is maybe 2 MPH on the ground. So 

when I'm landing up wind the wind will drop 8 MPH from 20 ft to ground 

level. My normal approach speed is 60MPH (that speed works for me) with one 

notch of flaps. As you say I add some speed when the wind is brisk. If I add 

8 MPH to my approach speed I'm getting close to the maximum speed I have set 

for flap usage so if the wind is more brisk than that I improvise and use 

more power. The result is usually something other than a greaser.



If I'm landing down wind I usually approach a bit slower but never below 

55MPH. I have to adjust my turn to final and power to compensate for the 

wind as I do up or down wind. The thing I like landing down wind is that the 

wind will never drop as I get close to the ground. My strip is long enough 

and up hill enough that I will never run out of run way no matter how fast 

my ground speed is in my Kolb. It is truly amazing how fast these planes 

slow with flaps, no power, and flying up hill at 60MPH. But I have a one-way 

strip so if the wind is blowing I take the landing I'm given.



At Scott T strip in the UP of Michigan this summer I landed down wind with a 

15 MPH tail wind that I had been fighting all the way from Oshkosh. I choose 

the down wind landing primarily due to the layout of his strip. The thing 

that surprised me was the down draft I got as I cleared the trees on final. 

The down draft took me down to about ten feet and quit. The landing was one 

of the easiest I have ever done there stopping just beyond the narrow spot 

at the dog leg. Yes I like down wind landings.



Now with all that said if I'm landing at a GA strip 3,000 + feet with no 

trees the wind doesn't diminish near as much at ground level so up wind 

landings are best. If there is traffic you fit in (with in reason).



Sorry for the length of the post



Do not archive



Rick Neilsen

Redrive VW powered MKIIIC



---

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Sun Dec 16, 2007 3:21 am Post subject: Landing in High Grass

> OK John H, I guess my comment deserves an explanation.



 	  Quote: 	
		  

 Rick Neilsen


	




Rick N:



Cut some of those trees on the east end of your strip and you will be able 

to land and take off into the wind, either east or west.



john h

mkIII

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
Guest

Posted: Sun Dec 16, 2007 9:22 am Post subject: Landing in High Grass

Dave,

The nice part about it being your own field is that you can experiment, 

and also know how it is each time. 

I've nosed over in ~10" grass and most of it wasn't very thick.  This on 

17" tundra tires, taxiing from shorter (~6") and sparser grass where I 

landed.  The nose-over was nearly nothing because of very slow speed.  A 

very similar thing happened long ago on dry mud; I broke through a crust 

layer when slowing down to nearly stopped.  It's a big concern to me, 

partly for the nose-over at speed, and partly for what may be obstructed 

by the grass.  It definitely pays to check with sure visuals and some 

touches on fields not designed for anything besides jackrabbits, 

especially when they are green instead of dry. (Green almost always 

means soft dirt or mud too.)  Again, great advantage in simply gaining 

some experience on your own field -- if it wants to nose over at slow 

taxi, I wouldn't want to land on it.  Obviously, the high thrust line 

works against us for taxi, so in a way knowing that point of trouble 

means landing and no power on the same stuff is likely within bounds.

-Ben

 FS KXP



Dave Bigelow wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   



 My grass strip is short and has a 20 foot elevation difference from one end to the other.  I take off downhill and land uphill due to obstructions near the uphill end.  I mow the strip about 20 feet wide and have smooth ground next to the mowed part with about 6 inch high grass.



 Sometimes when I come back from a flight, the wind has come up, and I have as much as a 10 mph tailwind, which makes stopping, even uphill a bit of a challenge.



 I've been thinking of using the mowed portion for takeoff, but landing in the grass next to the mowed portion to help stop.  I'm not sure how high the grass would have to be to become a noseover danger while rolling out.



 Here's the question:  How high can the grass be before it becomes too high to safely land on?  I'm sure there is a lot of experience out there, good and bad - sure would like to hear the stories.



 --------

 Dave Bigelow

 Kamuela, Hawaii

 FS2, HKS 700E





 Read this topic online here:



 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=152300#152300

dcreech3(at)hotmail.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Dec 16, 2007 3:04 pm Post subject: Landing in High Grass

For what it's worth, I once (inadvertently) landed my Firestar II in thick knee-high fescue with no ill effects.  There was a lot of the stuff wrapped around the axles, brake cables and stablizer wires, but no noseover. It probably helped that it was a power-off, full-stall landing into a short field.  And yes, it was a VERY short rollout, but still probably not a procedure to be recommended.

 Lee

 	  Quote: 	
		   Date: Sun, 16 Dec 2007 09:22:19 -0800

 From: bransom(at)ucdavis.edu

 To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com

 Subject: Re: Landing in High Grass

 --> Kolb-List message posted by: Ben Ransom <bransom(at)ucdavis.edu>

 Dave,

 The nice part about it being your own field is that you can experiment, 

 and also know how it is each time. 

 I've nosed over in ~10" grass and most of it wasn't very thick. This on 

 17" tundra tires, taxiing from shorter (~6") and sparser grass where I 

 landed. The nose-over was nearly nothing because of very slow speed. A 

 very similar thing happened long ago on dry mud; I broke through a crust 

 layer when slowing down to nearly stopped. It's a big concern to me, 

 partly for the nose-over at speed, and partly for what may be obstructed 

 by the grass. It definitely pays to check with sure visuals and some 

 touches on fields not designed for anything besides jackrabbits, 

 especially when they are green instead of dry. (Green almost always 

 means soft dirt or mud too.) Again, great advantage in simply gaining 

 some experience on your own field -- if it wants to nose over at slow 

 taxi, I wouldn't want to land on it. Obviously, the high thrust line 

 works against us for taxi, so in a way knowing that point of trouble 

 means landing and no power on the same stuff is likely within bounds.

 -Ben

 FS KXP

 Dave Bigelow wrote:

 > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Dave Bigelow" <up_country(at)hotmail.com>

 >

 > My grass strip is short and has a 20 foot elevation difference from one end to the other. I take off downhill and land uphill due to obstructions near the uphill end. I mow the strip about 20 feet wide and have smooth ground next to the mowed part with about 6 inch high grass.

 >

 > Sometimes when I come back from a flight, the wind has come up, and I have as much as a 10 mph tailwind, which makes stopping, even uphill a bit of a challenge.

 >

 > I've been thinking of using the mowed portion for takeoff, but landing in the grass next to the mowed portion to help stop. I'm not sure how high the grass would have to be to become a noseover danger while rolling out.

 >

 > Here's the question: How high can the grass be before it becomes too high to safely land on? I'm sure there is a lot of experience out there, good and bad - sure would like to hear the stories.

 >

 > --------

 > Dave Bigelow

 > Kamuela, Hawaii

 > FS2, HKS 700E

 >

 >

 >

 >

 > Read this topic online here:

 >

 > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=152300#152300

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 > > 

i’m is proud to present Cause Effect, a series about real people making a difference. Learn more  [quote][b]

Thom Riddle

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1597
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA (9G0)

Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 8:44 am Post subject: Landing in High Grass

....I'll bet no Kolbs will nose over at full power run ups, plenty of elevator authority with all that prop blast..      

Denny,



I'm guessing you've never flown an early Firestar with 377. It would nose over with the least bit of encouragement.Even on smooth pavement, take-off required gradual throttle advancing to prevent nose-over. My current early FS has longer than standard main gear legs and 447 and suffers no such problem.



Thom in Buffalo

 [quote][b]

_________________
Thom Riddle
Buffalo, NY (9G0)

Don't worry about old age... it doesn't last very long.
- Anonymous

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 9:16 am Post subject: Landing in High Grass

Thom:



A couple comments to wake the List up.



Sounds to me like you are either exagerating or need to improve your 

piloting technique.



Not hard for a low time, ham fisted pilot to put one on its nose.  For that 

matter, I have put my old FS, factory MKIII and FF on their noses, when 

flying with a fat passenger and/or had momentary brain lock.  MKIII and FF 

nose overs always seem to occur in front of a crowd, especially at Sun and 

Fun.



However, I don't believe the Kolbs are nearly as prone to nose over as you 

describe.  Maybe initially, but with a little time the pilot soon learns to 

compensate and think ahead of the airplane.



"Even on smooth pavement, take-off required gradual throttle advancing to 

prevent nose-over."



With the stick back, the elevator has plenty of authority to keep from 

nosing over.  In my case during a lapse of pilot technique, I stuck the tail 

in the wind, forgot to get the stick forward, then let a little power, 

forward weight, and tail wind wake me up.



john h

mkIII

"I'm guessing you've never flown an early Firestar with 377. It would nose 

over with the least bit of encouragement.Even on smooth pavement, take-off 

required gradual throttle advancing to prevent nose-over. My current early 

FS has longer than standard main gear legs and 447 and suffers no such 

problem.

Thom in Buffalo"

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

Thom Riddle

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1597
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA (9G0)

Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 4:06 pm Post subject: Re: Landing in High Grass

John,



Yes and No. My first early FS would nose over very easily. No exaggeration, just fact. And Yes, I learned to deal with it after about two nose-overs and it was no longer a problem for me, but the tendency to nose-over did not change, just the pilot's experience. One of the contributing factors was that particular early FS was very light with only about 35 lb. on the tail in three-point. Another was that the pilot at that time was weighing in at 235 lb. I'm not quite so heavy now and my longer FS legs plus heavier tail make a big difference. As you know, every homebuilt airplane is unique, sometimes in subtle ways, other times in major ways.

_________________
Thom Riddle
Buffalo, NY (9G0)

Don't worry about old age... it doesn't last very long.
- Anonymous

bransom(at)ucdavis.edu
Guest

Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 4:48 pm Post subject: Landing in High Grass

I was a little rattled/embarrassed on my first too, even tho nobody for 

miles around.  That didn't last a minute tho when I realized it was 

corrected by sticking my foot out the left side and pushing on the dirt 

...settle, clunk, back on the tail.  Now I have side lexan farings on 

the cockpit so have to be more careful.  

-Ben



Thom Riddle wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   



 John,



 Yes and No. My first early FS would nose over very easily. No exaggeration, just fact. And Yes, I learned to deal with it after about two nose-overs and it was no longer a problem for me, but the tendency to nose-over did not change, just the pilot's experience. One of the contributing factors was that particular early FS was very light with only about 35 lb. on the tail in three-point. Another was that the pilot at that time was weighing in at 235 lb. I'm not quite so heavy now and my longer FS legs plus heavier tail make a big difference. As you know, every homebuilt airplane is unique, sometimes in subtle ways, other times in major ways.



 --------

 Thom in Buffalo

 N221FA Allegro 2000 912UL

 N197BG FS1/447

 --------------------

 Believe nothing, no matter where you read it or who has said it, not even if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense.

 - Buddha





 Read this topic online here:



 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=152781#152781

Dave Bigelow

Joined: 29 Jan 2006
Posts: 103
Location: Kamuela, Hawaii

Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2008 1:00 am Post subject: Re: Landing in High Grass

 	  Quote: 	
		  My grass strip is short and has a 20 foot elevation difference from one end to the other. I take off downhill and land uphill due to obstructions near the uphill end. I mow the strip about 20 feet wide and have smooth ground next to the mowed part with about 6 inch high grass. 



Sometimes when I come back from a flight, the wind has come up, and I have as much as a 10 mph tailwind, which makes stopping, even uphill a bit of a challenge. 



I've been thinking of using the mowed portion for takeoff, but landing in the grass next to the mowed portion to help stop. I'm not sure how high the grass would have to be to become a noseover danger while rolling out. 

	


Probably an odd subject when half the Kolbs in the US are in the hanger or trailer and the grass is brown, but it's sure growing fast and furious here in West Hawaii.



I divided my grass strip into three sections.  One half of the entire width of the strip is mowed short for takeoff.  The other half of the width of the strip is mowed four inches high (max height of mower) for the first third of the length for touchdown.  The grass on the last two thirds is about six inches high.



There is no nose over tendency that I can feel while landing in the four inch high grass on the first third of the runway, and the six inch high grass on the last two thirds does a nice job of stopping without having to use the brakes at all.  Full back stick while rolling into the higher grass seems to keep the tail down easily, and also keeps the elevators up and out of the grass while rolling out.

_________________
Dave Bigelow
Kamuela, Hawaii
FS2, HKS 700E

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