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Lower Cowl Mounts
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wvu(at)ameritel.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Mar 04, 2008 7:46 pm Post subject: Lower Cowl Mounts

Hey who's using hinges for the lower cowl?! Don't do it.  Actually, I'm 

chiming in late but seems like most folks are aware of this issue.  Hinges 

were not a problem in my -6.  They did not last past 5 hours in the -10. 

They eyelets broke one at a time.  Just on the left side.  I replaced that 

side with nutplates/screws then the other side started to break, one eyelet 

at a time.  Eventually I fixed both sides.  I made the plates out of the old 

instrument panel. Didn't need shims since the hinge halves lined up in the 

first place.  I didn't want to patch up the existing holes on the cowl where 

the rivets used to be so I used six #8 nutplates/screws per side, with C/S 

washers.  Very solid as you would imagine.

Anh

N591VU - flying



---

LarryRosen

Joined: 16 Jan 2006
Posts: 415
Location: Medford, NJ

Posted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 5:21 am Post subject: Lower Cowl Mounts

Hate to say it, but William you are correct   .  I took a look at the 

original photos and the bottom ones do not have the same markings on 

that as the camlocs on the sides.



Larry



William Curtis wrote:

[quote] 



 Larry,



 Those bottom ones don't look like Camlocs, they look like screws with Tinnerman washers.  I know Vic sold the plane but is he still on the list?



 William

 http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/

 "Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind."

 -- Dr. Suess 



 ------

_________________
Larry Rosen
#40356
N205EN (reserved)
<http>

Tim Olson

Joined: 25 Jan 2007
Posts: 2879

Posted: Thu Mar 06, 2008 7:00 am Post subject: Lower Cowl Mounts

This is passed on from Vic as a reply...

From: Vicsyracuse

I read the archives, but don't have time to monitor the list. Sorry. But 

I saw your question. I used the skybolt fasteners top and sides, and 5 

#8 screws with tinnerman washers on the bottom on both sides of the air 

exit area. I did my rv-6 this way, and am doing the RV-7 the same. I 

used .063 for the aluminum on the 10, but am using .050 on the 7.

Vic

--

Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying

William Curtis wrote:

 	  Quote: 	

> Guys,

> did anyone use camlocks for the bottom cowling mounts?

> Michael

 I am.  Two per side on a 0.63 base. Four of each of the below:

 244-16    Floting Receptacle  2.89

 4002-4   Camloc Stud	    2.45

 4002-O  Camloc Grommet	    1.53

 R4G       Snap Rings	    0.20

 I used these on the horizontal sides of my Cardinal to replace the SouthCo fasteners and I like them a lot.  Not enough however to use them in place of the hinges on the 10 except on the cowl bottom.  

 The above prices are from Spruce, however if you go to OSH or Sun-N-Fun you can get them at the Aeromart for less.  If you want to pay even more you can get the adjustable receptacle version but since the -4 stud will fit the thickness range of our cowling, I don't see any reason to use them.

 William

 http://wcurtis.nerv10.com/

 "Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind."

 -- Dr. Suess

ron.mcgann(at)baesystems.
Guest

Posted: Thu Mar 06, 2008 1:37 pm Post subject: Lower Cowl Mounts

Has anyone tried stainless steel piano hinge on the lower cowl rather

than the standard aluminium ones?  If not, I will give it a try.



Cheers,

Ron

Finshing the cowl 



--

KiloPapa

Joined: 24 May 2006
Posts: 142
Location: Pearblossom, CA

Posted: Sat Mar 08, 2008 12:43 pm Post subject: Lower Cowl Mounts

Howdy,



Is the problem at the firewall/cowl margin or between the

top and bottom cowl halves?

Is the hinge you replaced on the side or bottom of the lower

cowl?  Would you have any pics?



Thanks,



Kevin

40494



----- Original Message Follows -----

From: "DejaVu" <wvu(at)ameritel.net>

To: <rv10-list(at)matronics.com>

Subject: Re: Lower Cowl Mounts

 	  Quote: 	
		  

Hey who's using hinges for the lower cowl?! Don't do it. 

Actually, I'm  chiming in late but seems like most folks

are aware of this issue.  Hinges  were not a problem in my

-6.  They did not last past 5 hours in the -10.  They

eyelets broke one at a time.  Just on the left side.  I

replaced that  side with nutplates/screws then the other

side started to break, one eyelet  at a time.  Eventually I

fixed both sides.  I made the plates out of the old 

instrument panel. Didn't need shims since the hinge halves

lined up in the  first place.  I didn't want to patch up

the existing holes on the cowl where  the rivets used to be

so I used six #8 nutplates/screws per side, with C/S 

washers.  Very solid as you would imagine. Anh

N591VU - flying

_________________
Kevin
40494

do not archive

tintopranch

Joined: 29 Jun 2007
Posts: 12

Posted: Sun Mar 09, 2008 7:19 pm Post subject: Re: Lower Cowl Mounts

I have 150 hrs on my RV10 and I am on my second left bottom hinge which as all ready lost one tab.  I am not sure why it happens but I agree that the best idea is to go with screws and nut plates from the start.  I will be changing my soon.

_________________
MARK SUTHERLAND
RV-10 40292
Flying since June 07

dav1111(at)erfwireless.ne
Guest

Posted: Mon Mar 10, 2008 3:28 am Post subject: Lower Cowl Mounts

I have 150 hrs on my RV10 and I am on my second left bottom hinge which as  all

      ready lost one tab.  I am not sure  why it happens but I agree that the best idea

       is to go with screws and nut plates from the start.  I will be changing  my

      soon.

       

      --------

       MARK SUTHERLAND

Instead of screws and nutplates you should  consider the floating camlocks from SkyBolt which I installed.

  

 Russ Daves

 N710RV - 190+ hours

    [quote][b]

planesmith(at)hotmail.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Mar 10, 2008 6:46 am Post subject: Lower Cowl Mounts

I'm planning on doing a cross between the two ideas and using floating nutplates:

  

     Two Lug Miniature Anchor Nuts        Part No. 

  Thread Size 

  Price

  Buy

   MF5000-06

  6-32

  $1.09

   

   MF5000-08

  8-32

  $0.91

   

   MF5000-3

(Manufactured Material Certification Available) 

  10-32

  $0.79

   



 

Aircraft Spruce is one source. They are also known as MS21059.



  

 Vern Smith (#324)



  	  Quote: 	
		    From: dav1111(at)erfwireless.net

To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com

Subject: Re: Lower Cowl Mounts

Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 06:25:22 -0500



     I have 150 hrs on my RV10 and I am on my second left bottom hinge which as all

      ready lost one tab.  I am not sure why it happens but I agree that the best idea

      is to go with screws and nut plates from the start.  I will be changing my

      soon.

      

      --------

      MARK SUTHERLAND

Instead of screws and nutplates you should consider the floating camlocks from SkyBolt which I installed.

  

 Russ Daves

 N710RV - 190+ hours

 	  Quote: 	
		  



get=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List

p://forums.matronics.com

blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution



	
	
Climb to the top of the charts! Play the word scramble challenge with star power. Play now!  [quote][b]

pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.
Guest

Posted: Mon Mar 10, 2008 7:30 am Post subject: Lower Cowl Mounts

My only concerns would be with wear to the cowl and subsequent 'looseness' if the screws backed out or weren't put in real tight, and the possibility of cowl shift after assembly.  I had a problem with the upper engine cowl on my Pitts (aluminum) where I must have been less than diligent tightening one screw.  Vibration wore a hole in the aluminum the size of the screw head.  Now has a finish washer there.  There appears to be a fair amount of stress on the hinges as evidenced by all the failures I'm reading here.  I'm becoming leery of the aluminum hinge, but like the solution of the carbhinge .... but not the price.  Cowls have had fixed nutplates on other designs with no obvious problems.

 Linn

 do not archive.

 

 Vernon Smith wrote:

 [quote]    .hmmessage P { margin:0px; padding:0px } body.hmmessage { FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY:Tahoma }   I'm planning on doing a cross between the two ideas and using floating nutplates:

  

                        Two Lug Miniature Anchor Nuts                                                                                               Part No. 

                                             Thread Size 

                                             Price

                                             Buy

                                                                       MF5000-06

                                             6-32

                                             $1.09

                                              

                                                                       MF5000-08

                                             8-32

                                             $0.91

                                              

                                                                       MF5000-3

               (Manufactured Material Certification Available) 

                                             10-32

                                             $0.79

                                              

                                                                           

   

 Aircraft Spruce is one source. They are also known as MS21059.

   

  

 Vern Smith (#324)

   

    	  Quote: 	
		       From: dav1111(at)erfwireless.net (dav1111(at)erfwireless.net)

 To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com (rv10-list(at)matronics.com)

 Subject: Re: Lower Cowl Mounts

 Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 06:25:22 -0500

     

                    I have 150 hrs on my RV10 and I am on my second left bottom hinge which as all

       ready lost one tab.  I am not sure why it happens but I agree that the best idea

       is to go with screws and nut plates from the start.  I will be changing my

       soon.

       

       --------

       MARK SUTHERLAND

     Instead of screws and nutplates you should consider the floating camlocks from SkyBolt which I installed.

      

     Russ Daves

     N710RV - 190+ hours

      	  Quote: 	
		  



get=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List

p://forums.matronics.com

blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution



	
   	
   

   Climb to the top of the charts! Play the word scramble challenge with star power. Play now!    	  Quote: 	
		  

	
 [b]

AV8ORJWC

Joined: 13 Jul 2006
Posts: 1149
Location: Aurora, Oregon "Home of VANS"

Posted: Mon Mar 10, 2008 8:44 am Post subject: Lower Cowl Mounts

I originally posted the information on John Barrett and his carbinge, not because of price but the use of similar material and correct adhesive.  I have seen rivets through composite cowls pop and fail all too often.  There is a tremendous weight and vibration which are transferred into the fasteners.  I found the reinforcement plate and use of solid, removable fasteners much superior to the use of rivets.  Just as an aluminum hinge on an aluminum cowl made sense, I was concluding a composite hinge on a composite cowl made sense.  

   

Attachment is the issue to the airframe.  Reducing the vibration as much as practical saves on fasteners and stress riser cracking.  

   

John Cox (#600)  

   

PS - My thoughts are with a safe solution to Mark Ritter at this moment  

         

  

From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of linn Walters

 Sent: Monday, March 10, 2008 8:28 AM

 To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com

 Subject: Re: Lower Cowl Mounts  

  

   

My only concerns would be with wear to the cowl and subsequent 'looseness' if the screws backed out or weren't put in real tight, and the possibility of cowl shift after assembly.  I had a problem with the upper engine cowl on my Pitts (aluminum) where I must have been less than diligent tightening one screw.  Vibration wore a hole in the aluminum the size of the screw head.  Now has a finish washer there.  There appears to be a fair amount of stress on the hinges as evidenced by all the failures I'm reading here.  I'm becoming leery of the aluminum hinge, but like the solution of the carbhinge .... but not the price.  Cowls have had fixed nutplates on other designs with no obvious problems.

 Linn

 do not archive.

 

 Vernon Smith wrote:

 

   

I'm planning on doing a cross between the two ideas and using floating nutplates:

            

[b]Two Lug Miniature Anchor Nuts[/b]             

                       

[b]Part No. [/b]               

[b]Thread Size [/b]               

[b]Price[/b]               

[b]Buy[/b]                       

MF5000-06               

6-32               

$1.09               

                       

MF5000-08               

8-32               

$0.91               

                       

MF5000-3

     (Manufactured     Material Certification Available)                

10-32               

$0.79               

               

        



 

 Aircraft Spruce is one source. They are also known as MS21059.

 

  

 Vern Smith (#324)      

  

From: dav1111(at)erfwireless.net (dav1111(at)erfwireless.net)

 To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com (rv10-list(at)matronics.com)

 Subject: Re: Lower Cowl Mounts

 Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 06:25:22 -0500    

I have 150 hrs on my RV10 and I am on my second left bottom hinge which as all

       ready lost one tab.  I am not sure why it happens but I agree that the best idea

       is to go with screws and nut plates from the start.  I will be changing my

       soon.

       

       --------

       MARK SUTHERLAND

 Instead of screws and nutplates you should consider the floating camlocks from SkyBolt which I installed.  

    

   

    

Russ Daves  

    

N710RV - 190+ hours  

   	  Quote: 	
		    get=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-Listp://forums.matronics.comblank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution 	
  

       

  

Climb to the top of the charts! Play the word scramble challenge with star power. Play now!    	  Quote: 	
		     	
  

   [quote]  http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-Listhttp://forums.matronics.comhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution [b]

Albert Gardner

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 455
Location: Yuma, AZ

Posted: Mon Mar 10, 2008 9:18 am Post subject: Lower Cowl Mounts

I have used nutplates on my RV-9A (850 hrs) and on the RV-10 (68 hrs) and their strong point is reliability and expense.   

Albert Gardner  

Yuma, AZ  

   

--

_________________
RV-9A N872RV
RV-10 N991RV

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