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patreilly43(at)hotmail.co
Guest

Posted: Mon Mar 10, 2008 1:41 pm Post subject: Sprung Tailwheel

Kitfoxers, My Mod 3 tail wheel is mounted on an  approximately 1"x 1 1/4" rectangular aluminum bar. I want a mount with some  give in that tail wheel suspension.That aluminum bar has no spring to  it. Has anybody modified their similar tailwheel, replacing that aluminum  bar with a leaf spring? I think it could be done with a single  leaf.

  

 Pat Reilly

 Mod 3 Rebuild

 Rockford, IL 

   [quote][b]

Mnflyer

Joined: 15 May 2006
Posts: 78

Posted: Mon Mar 10, 2008 4:16 pm Post subject: Re: Sprung Tailwheel

My Model III came with a steel single leaf spring after about 150 hrs it broke while taxing for take off, replaced it with a Piper 3 leaf steel spring now 350+ hrs later and no problems it the only way to go IMHO.

_________________
GB
MNFlyer
Flying a HKS Kitfox III

kitfoxpilot(at)msn.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Mar 10, 2008 4:17 pm Post subject: Sprung Tailwheel

The original spring was a two leaf spring, the one you have sounds like the Grove tail wheel spring!  I would get rid of it, they had problems with them breaking.  Kitfox LLC sells the right spring for you.

  

 Ray

  	  Quote: 	
		    From: patreilly43(at)hotmail.com

To: kitfox-list(at)matronics.com

Subject: Sprung Tailwheel

Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 00:37:39 -0500



     Kitfoxers, My Mod 3 tail wheel is mounted on an approximately 1"x 1 1/4" rectangular aluminum bar. I want a mount with some give in that tail wheel suspension.That aluminum bar has no spring to it. Has anybody modified their similar tailwheel, replacing that aluminum bar with a leaf spring? I think it could be done with a single leaf.

  

 Pat Reilly

 Mod 3 Rebuild

 Rockford, IL 

 	  Quote: 	
		  



arget=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List

p://forums.matronics.com

blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution



	
	
Helping your favorite cause is as easy as instant messaging. You IM, we give. Learn more.  [quote][b]

Michel

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 966
Location: Norway

Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 1:22 am Post subject: Sprung Tailwheel

 	  Quote: 	
		   From: Pat Reilly [patreilly43(at)hotmail.com]

 I think it could be done with a single leaf.


	


I too broke the single leaf spring of my Kitfox 3 after about 450 hours and twice that number of landings. I have now two leafs and I think it should be enough.



Cheers,

Michel Verheughe

Norway

Kitfox 3 - Jabiru 2200

<pre><b><font size  color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">

_________________
Kitfox 3 - Jabiru 2200

Lynn Matteson

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 2778
Location: Grass Lake, Michigan

Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 4:56 am Post subject: Sprung Tailwheel

Pat-

Think about what will happen when that single leaf spring breaks. Any  

redundancy? Where does the fuselage go?

I had my original dual leaf spring break at the main leaf, and the  

fuse goes down, the tailwheel flops around and hits the rudder, and  

damage is done to the fabric at the very least. I replaced the dual  

spring....the second leaf is merely a helper, or booster leaf, and  

does nothing to retain the (by now) flopping tailwheel....with the  

three-leaf spring from John McBean. This three-leaf spring has two  

main leafs and one helper leaf. The two main leafs are retained on  

both ends by a bolt through the fuselage at the front, and a bolt  

through the tailwheel bracket at the rear. The chances of both main  

leafs breaking at the same time give this type of spring the  

redundancy that we seek in magnetos, etc.

Lynn Matteson

Grass Lake, Michigan

Kitfox IV Speedster  w/Jabiru 2200

flying w/475+ hrs



On Mar 10, 2008, at 1:37 AM, Pat Reilly wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   Kitfoxers, My Mod 3 tail wheel is mounted on an approximately 1"x 1  

 1/4" rectangular aluminum bar. I want a mount with some give in  

 that tail wheel suspension.That aluminum bar has no spring to it.  

 Has anybody modified their similar tailwheel, replacing that  

 aluminum bar with a leaf spring? I think it could be done with a  

 single leaf.



 Pat Reilly

 Mod 3 Rebuild

 Rockford, IL

 http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List_- 

 ============================================================ _- 

 forums.matronics.com_- 

 ============================================================ _- 

 contribution_- 

 ============================================================

_________________
Lynn
Kitfox IV-Jabiru 2200
N369LM

Lynn Matteson

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 2778
Location: Grass Lake, Michigan

Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 5:40 am Post subject: Sprung Tailwheel

My original "one main/one helper" spring broke at 587 landings, and I  

now have just over 1000 on the plane. The last 413+ are on the "two  

main/one helper" replacement spring. The original spring was  

subjected to grass and paved runways, and a 1300-mile trailer tow  

with the weight of the unfinished plane resting on the  

tailwheel.....I know better now! The replacement spring has been  

subjected to grass, paved, snow, and ice landings.

Lynn Matteson

Grass Lake, Michigan

Kitfox IV Speedster  w/Jabiru 2200

flying w/475+ hrs

On Mar 11, 2008, at 5:19 AM, Michel Verheughe wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  > From: Pat Reilly [patreilly43(at)hotmail.com]

> I think it could be done with a single leaf.

 I too broke the single leaf spring of my Kitfox 3 after about 450  

 hours and twice that number of landings. I have now two leafs and I  

 think it should be enough.

 Cheers,

 Michel Verheughe

 Norway

 Kitfox 3 - Jabiru 2200

 <pre><b><font size  color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">

 List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List</a>

 forums.matronics.com</a>

 www.matronics.com/contribution</a>

 </b></font></pre>

_________________
Lynn
Kitfox IV-Jabiru 2200
N369LM

patreilly43(at)hotmail.co
Guest

Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 6:01 am Post subject: Sprung Tailwheel

Lynn, Thanks for the info. I have a message in to McBean, asking price. Another Kitfoxer said he has the Piper 3 leaf. Looking at Aircraft Spruce, the dimensions on the Piper are mighty close to the Kitfox. I'll use a 3 leafer.

 Do not Archieve

  

 Pat Reilly

 Mod 3 Rebuild

 Rockford, IL

 



 	  Quote: 	
		   From: lynnmatt(at)jps.net

 Subject: Re: Sprung Tailwheel

 Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 08:53:22 -0400

 To: kitfox-list(at)matronics.com

 

 --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt(at)jps.net>

 

 Pat-

 Think about what will happen when that single leaf spring breaks. Any 

 redundancy? Where does the fuselage go?

 I had my original dual leaf spring break at the main leaf, and the 

 fuse goes down, the tailwheel flops around and hits the rudder, and 

 damage is done to the fabric at the very least. I replaced the dual 

 spring....the second leaf is merely a helper, or booster leaf, and 

 does nothing to retain the (by now) flopping tailwheel....with the 

 three-leaf spring from John McBean. This three-leaf spring has two 

 main leafs and one helper leaf. The two main leafs are retained on 

 both ends by a bolt through the fuselage at the front, and a bolt 

 through the tailwheel bracket at the rear. The chances of both main 

 leafs breaking at the same time give this type of spring the 

 redundancy that we seek in magnetos, etc.

 

 

 Lynn Matteson

 Grass Lake, Michigan

 Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200

 flying w/475+ hrs

 

 

 

 On Mar 10, 2008, at 1:37 AM, Pat Reilly wrote:

 

 > Kitfoxers, My Mod 3 tail wheel is mounted on an approximately 1"x 1 

 > 1/4" rectangular aluminum bar. I want a mount with some give in 

 > that tail wheel suspension.That aluminum bar has no spring to it. 

 > Has anybody modified their similar tailwheel, replacing that 

 > aluminum bar with a leaf spring? I think it could be done with a 

 > single leaf.

 >

 > Pat Reilly

 > Mod 3 Rebuild

 > Rockford, IL

 > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List_- 

 > =================================== _- 

 > forums.matronics.com_- 

 > =================================== _- 

 > contribution_- 

 > ===================================

 

 &g==================

 

 

 


	


  [quote][b]

thesupe(at)hotmail.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 6:23 am Post subject: Sprung Tailwheel

I'm just wondering if those that have had the tailwheel spring break were all running the solid rubber Maule tailwheel.  I had that wheel on my Avid MK IV, and you can sure feel every little bump through the fusaloge.  I would guess that those sharp jolts fatigue the spring.  Last summer I replaced the wheel with a cheep 6' pneumatic castor wheel and it was much smoother, the tire really soaks up lots of the sharp jolts.  I got some better sealed bearings and put them in the wheel.  It would have been nice if Maule made a replacement 6' pneumatic tire but they don't.  This worked for me.  Jim Chuk   Avids  Mn

 	  Quote: 	
		   From: lynnmatt(at)jps.net

 Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Sprung Tailwheel

 Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 09:37:47 -0400

 To: kitfox-list(at)matronics.com

 --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt(at)jps.net>

 My original 'one main/one helper' spring broke at 587 landings, and I 

 now have just over 1000 on the plane. The last 413+ are on the 'two 

 main/one helper' replacement spring. The original spring was 

 subjected to grass and paved runways, and a 1300-mile trailer tow 

 with the weight of the unfinished plane resting on the 

 tailwheel.....I know better now! The replacement spring has been 

 subjected to grass, paved, snow, and ice landings.

 Lynn Matteson

 Grass Lake, Michigan

 Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200

 flying w/475+ hrs

 On Mar 11, 2008, at 5:19 AM, Michel Verheughe wrote:

 >> From: Pat Reilly [patreilly43(at)hotmail.com]

 >> I think it could be done with a single leaf.

 >

 > I too broke the single leaf spring of my Kitfox 3 after about 450 

 > hours and twice that number of landings. I have now two leafs and I 

 > think it should be enough.

 >

 > Cheers,

 > Michel Verheughe

 > Norway

 > Kitfox 3 - Jabiru 2200

 >

 >

 > <pre><b><font size=2 color='#000000' face='courier new,courier'>

 >

 > List'>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List</a>

 > forums.matronics.com</a>

 > www.matronics.com/contribution</a>

 >

 &=============

Need to know the score, the latest news, or you need your Hotmail®-get your "fix". Check it out.

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patreilly43(at)hotmail.co
Guest

Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 7:03 am Post subject: Sprung Tailwheel

Thanks for the suggestion on the pneumatic replacement tail wheel. I was looking at my solid one thinking it was a piece of junk for the reasons you state and it is heavy. I will find a pneumatic one to replace it.

 Do not archieve

 Pat Reilly

 Mod 3 Rebuild

 Rockford, IL

 [quote]  From: thesupe(at)hotmail.com

To: kitfox-list(at)matronics.com

Subject: RE: Sprung Tailwheel

Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 14:20:32 +0000

   .ExternalClass .EC_hmmessage P {padding:0px;} .ExternalClass EC_body.hmmessage {font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma;}  I'm just wondering if those that have had the tailwheel spring break were all running the solid rubber Maule tailwheel.  I had that wheel on my Avid MK IV, and you can sure feel every little bump through the fusaloge.  I would guess that those sharp jolts fatigue the spring.  Last summer I replaced the wheel with a cheep 6' pneumatic castor wheel and it was much smoother, the tire really soaks up lots of the sharp jolts.  I got some better sealed bearings and put them in the wheel.  It would have been nice if Maule made a replacement 6' pneumatic tire but they don't.  This worked for me.  Jim Chuk   Avids  Mn

 	  Quote: 	
		   From: lynnmatt(at)jps.net

 Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Sprung Tailwheel

 Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 09:37:47 -0400

 To: kitfox-list(at)matronics.com

 --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt(at)jps.net>

 My original 'one main/one helper' spring broke at 587 landings, and I 

 now have just over 1000 on the plane. The last 413+ are on the 'two 

 main/one helper' replacement spring. The original spring was 

 subjected to grass and paved runways, and a 1300-mile trailer tow 

 with the weight of the unfinished plane resting on the 

 tailwheel.....I know better now! The replacement spring has been 

 subjected to grass, paved, snow, and ice landings.

 Lynn Matteson

 Grass Lake, Michigan

 Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200

 flying w/475+ hrs

 On Mar 11, 2008, at 5:19 AM, Michel Verheughe wrote:

 >> From: Pat Reilly [patreilly43(at)hotmail.com]

 >> I think it could be done with a single leaf.

 >

 > I too broke the single leaf spring of my Kitfox 3 after about 450 

 > hours and twice that number of landings. I have now two leafs and I 

 > think it should be enough.

 >

 > Cheers,

 > Michel Verheughe

 > Norway

 > Kitfox 3 - Jabiru 2200

 >

 >

 > <pre><b><font size=2 color='#000000' face='courier new,courier'>

 >

 > List'>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List</a>

 > forums.matronics.com</a>

 > www.matronics.com/contribution</a>

 >

 &=============

  Need to know the score, the latest news, or you need your Hotmail®-get your "fix". Check it out. [b]

msm_9949(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 7:11 am Post subject: Sprung Tailwheel

Out of curiosity, Lynn, did you notice any substantial change in your CofG as a result of the 2 additional leaves?

   

  



Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt(at)jps.net> wrote:

  [quote]--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson 



Pat-

Think about what will happen when that single leaf spring breaks. Any 

redundancy? Where does the fuselage go?

I had my original dual leaf spring break at the main leaf, and the 

fuse goes down, the tailwheel flops around and hits the rudder, and 

damage is done to the fabric at the very least. I replaced the dual 

spring....the second leaf is merely a helper, or booster leaf, and 

does nothing to retain the (by now) flopping tailwheel....with the 

three-leaf spring from John McBean. This three-leaf spring has two 

main leafs and one helper  leaf. The two main leafs are retained on 

both ends by a bolt through the fuselage at the front, and a bolt 

through the tailwheel bracket at the rear. The chances of both main 

leafs breaking at the same time give this type of spring the 

redundancy that we seek in magnetos, etc.

Lynn Matteson

Grass Lake, Michigan

Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200

flying w/475+ hrs



On Mar 10, 2008, at 1:37 AM, Pat Reilly wrote:



[quote] Kitfoxers, My Mod 3 tail wheel is mounted on an approximately 1"x 1 

 1/4" rectangular aluminum bar. I want a mount with some give in 

 that tail wheel suspension.That aluminum bar has no spring to it. 

 Has anybody modified their similar tailwheel, replacing that 

 aluminum bar with a leaf spring? I think it could be done with a 

 single leaf.



 Pat Reilly

 Mod 3 Rebuild

 Rockford, IL

 http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List_-      [quote][b]

Lynn Matteson

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 2778
Location: Grass Lake, Michigan

Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 8:25 am Post subject: Sprung Tailwheel

Just make sure that the 3-leafer has at least 2 main leafs, and that  

they are both bolted at each end...McBean's is like this.  As an  

aside....the one main leaf has a slightly larger hole to accommodate  

the different length of travel of one of the leaves as it bends. As I  

think about it, and recall mine, this will be the middle leaf of the  

3-leaf pack.



Lynn Matteson

Grass Lake, Michigan

Kitfox IV Speedster  w/Jabiru 2200

flying w/475+ hrs



On Mar 11, 2008, at 9:57 AM, patrick reilly wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   Lynn, Thanks for the info. I have a message in to McBean, asking  

 price. Another Kitfoxer said he has the Piper 3 leaf. Looking at  

 Aircraft Spruce, the dimensions on the Piper are mighty close to  

 the Kitfox. I'll use a 3 leafer.

 Do not Archieve



 Pat Reilly

 Mod 3 Rebuild

 Rockford, IL

 > From: lynnmatt(at)jps.net

 > Subject: Re: Sprung Tailwheel

 > Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 08:53:22 -0400

 > To: kitfox-list(at)matronics.com

 >

 > 

 >

 > Pat-

 > Think about what will happen when that single leaf spring breaks.  

 Any

 > redundancy? Where does the fuselage go?

 > I had my original dual leaf spring break at the main leaf, and the

 > fuse goes down, the tailwheel flops around and hits the rudder, and

 > damage is done to the fabric at the very least. I replaced the dual

 > spring....the second leaf is merely a helper, or booster leaf, and

 > does nothing to retain the (by now) flopping tailwheel....with the

 > three-leaf spring from John McBean. This three-leaf spring has two

 > main leafs and one helper leaf. The two main leafs are retained on

 > both ends by a bolt through the fuselage at the front, and a bolt

 > through the tailwheel bracket at the rear. The chances of both main

 > leafs breaking at the same time give this type of spring the

 > redundancy that we seek in magnetos, etc.

 >

 >

 > Lynn Matteson

 > Grass Lake, Michigan

 > Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200

 > flying w/475+ hrs

 >

 >

 >

 > On Mar 10, 2008, at 1:37 AM, Pat Reilly wrote:

 >

 > > Kitfoxers, My Mod 3 tail wheel is mounted on an approximately  

 1"x 1

 > > 1/4" rectangular aluminum bar. I want a mount with some give in

 > > that tail wheel suspension.That aluminum bar has no spring to it.

 > > Has anybody modified their similar tailwheel, replacing that

 > > aluminum bar with a leaf spring? I think it could be done with a

 > > single leaf.

 > >

 > > Pat Reilly

 > > Mod 3 Rebuild

 > > Rockford, IL

 > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List_-

 > > =================================== _-

 > > forums.matronics.com_-

 > > =================================== _-

 > > contribution_-

 > > ===================================

 >

 > &g==================

 >

 >

 >



 http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List_- 

 ============================================================ _- 

 forums.matronics.com_- 

 ============================================================ _- 

 contribution_- 

 ============================================================

_________________
Lynn
Kitfox IV-Jabiru 2200
N369LM

pwmac(at)sisna.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 8:32 am Post subject: Sprung Tailwheel

My experience with leaf springs (on off road vehicles) indicates that the failure mode is not vibration with small deflections but is the from long deflections. The home builder soft tail wheel has been discussed here on the list and is available from AC Spruce. The reports here on the list show good satisfaction for mostly a smooth ride. A great idea to get rid of the  shaking that affects the whole plane and lots of parts that do not like the associated vibrations.

 Does the soft tire solve the broken spring? I doubt that the root cause for broken springs has to do with the tire. I strongly suspect is due to low of a spring rate. This conclusion is based on reports with good results from the dual leaf spring that was (is?) sold by Skystar or John. Stiffer ride results from a stiffer spring that does not deflect as much. 

 Recognize that the tire is also a spring and is used in combination with the mechanical spring for the integrates solution

 The real fix is a stiffer spring combined with a soft tire.

 A tire with adjustable air pressure is good to allow control the tire spring rate.

 Paul

 ===============

 At 08:00 AM 3/11/2008, you wrote:

 [quote]Thanks for the suggestion on the pneumatic replacement tail wheel. I was looking at my solid one thinking it was a piece of junk for the reasons you state and it is heavy. I will find a pneumatic one to replace it.

 Do not archieve

 Pat Reilly

 Mod 3 Rebuild

 Rockford, IL

    From: thesupe(at)hotmail.com

  To: kitfox-list(at)matronics.com

  Subject: RE: Sprung Tailwheel

  Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 14:20:32 +0000

  I'm just wondering if those that have had the tailwheel spring break were all running the solid rubber Maule tailwheel.  I had that wheel on my Avid MK IV, and you can sure feel every little bump through the fusaloge.  I would guess that those sharp jolts fatigue the spring.  Last summer I replaced the wheel with a cheep 6' pneumatic castor wheel and it was much smoother, the tire really soaks up lots of the sharp jolts.  I got some better sealed bearings and put them in the wheel.  It would have been nice if Maule made a replacement 6' pneumatic tire but they don't.  This worked for me.  Jim Chuk   Avids  Mn

  > From: lynnmatt(at)jps.net

  > Subject: Re: Sprung Tailwheel

  > Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 09:37:47 -0400

  > To: kitfox-list(at)matronics.com

  > 

  > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt(at)jps.net>

  > 

  > My original 'one main/one helper' spring broke at 587 landings, and I 

  > now have just over 1000 on the plane. The last 413+ are on the 'two 

  > main/one helper' replacement spring. The original spring was 

  > subjected to grass and paved runways, and a 1300-mile trailer tow 

  > with the weight of the unfinished plane resting on the 

  > tailwheel.....I know better now! The replacement spring has been 

  > subjected to grass, paved, snow, and ice landings.

  > 

  > Lynn Matteson

  > Grass Lake, Michigan

  > Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200

  > flying w/475+ hrs

  > 

  > 

  > 

  > On Mar 11, 2008, at 5:19 AM, Michel Verheughe wrote:

  > 

  > >> From: Pat Reilly [patreilly43(at)hotmail.com]

  > >> I think it could be done with a single leaf.

  > >

  > > I too broke the single leaf spring of my Kitfox 3 after about 450 

  > > hours and twice that number of landings. I have now two leafs and I 

  > > think it should be enough.

  > >

  > > Cheers,

  > > Michel Verheughe

  > > Norway

  > > Kitfox 3 - Jabiru 2200

  > >

  > >

  > > <pre><b><font size=2 color='#000000' face='courier new,courier'>

  > >

  > > List'>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List</a>

  > > forums.matronics.com</a>

  > >  www.matronics.com/contribution</a>

  > >

  > &=============

  > 

  > 

  > 

   Need to know the score, the latest news, or you need your Hotmail®-get your "fix". Check it out. 

 [b]

Lynn Matteson

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 2778
Location: Grass Lake, Michigan

Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 8:35 am Post subject: Sprung Tailwheel

Hi Marco-

Actually it was only an additional one leaf, and the  difference  

wasn't enough to bother with. The extra one leaf, and an additional  

1/4" length in the associated hardware didn't amount to more than a  

pound, if that. I weighed it all, wrote it down, and figured the  

moment and weight didn't amount to bothering with....call me sloppy. : )

Lynn Matteson

Grass Lake, Michigan

Kitfox IV Speedster  w/Jabiru 2200

flying w/475+ hrs

do not archive

On Mar 11, 2008, at 11:08 AM, Marco Menezes wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   Out of curiosity, Lynn, did you notice any substantial change in  

 your CofG as a result of the 2 additional leaves?

 Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt(at)jps.net> wrote:

 Pat-

 Think about what will happen when that single leaf spring breaks. Any

 redundancy? Where does the fuselage go?

 I had my original dual leaf spring break at the main leaf, and the

 fuse goes down, the tailwheel flops around and hits the rudder, and

 damage is done to the fabric at the very least. I replaced the dual

 spring....the second leaf is merely a helper, or booster leaf, and

 does nothing to retain the (by now) flopping tailwheel....with the

 three-leaf spring from John McBean. This three-leaf spring has two

 main leafs and one helper leaf. The two main leafs are retained on

 both ends by a bolt through the fuselage at the front, and a bolt

 through the tailwheel bracket at the rear. The chances of both main

 leafs breaking at the same time give this type of spring the

 redundancy that we seek in magnetos, etc.

 Lynn Matteson

 Grass Lake, Michigan

 Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200

 flying w/475+ hrs

 On Mar 10, 2008, at 1:37 AM, Pat Reilly wrote:

 > Kitfoxers, My Mod 3 tail wheel is mounted on an approximately 1"x 1

 > 1/4" rectangular aluminum bar. I want a mount with some give in

 > that tail wheel suspension.That aluminum bar has no spring to it.

 > Has anybody modified their similar tailwheel, replacing that

 > aluminum bar with a leaf spring? I think it could be done with a

 > single leaf.

 >

 > Pat Reilly

 > Mod 3 Rebuild

 > Rockford, IL

 > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List_- _- 

 www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List _- 

 www.matronics.com/contribution _- 

 ============================================================

_________________
Lynn
Kitfox IV-Jabiru 2200
N369LM

Lynn Matteson

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 2778
Location: Grass Lake, Michigan

Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 9:01 am Post subject: Sprung Tailwheel

I had already changed over from the solid Maule tailwheel to the 6"   

"Homebuilders Special Tailwheel" as Spruce calls them. It is a much  

softer tire than the Maule, weighs less, and has less contact area  

with the ground than the Maule. The bearings that come with the  

Spruce wheel are terrible though.

By the way, I like the looks of your pneumatic job, Jim.



Lynn Matteson

Grass Lake, Michigan

Kitfox IV Speedster  w/Jabiru 2200

flying w/475+ hrs

On Mar 11, 2008, at 10:20 AM, Jim_and_Lucy Chuk wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   I'm just wondering if those that have had the tailwheel spring  

 break were all running the solid rubber Maule tailwheel.  I had  

 that wheel on my Avid MK IV, and you can sure feel every little  

 bump through the fusaloge.  I would guess that those sharp jolts  

 fatigue the spring.  Last summer I replaced the wheel with a cheep  

 6' pneumatic castor wheel and it was much smoother, the tire really  

 soaks up lots of the sharp jolts.  I got some better sealed  

 bearings and put them in the wheel.  It would have been nice if  

 Maule made a replacement 6' pneumatic tire but they don't.  This  

 worked for me.  Jim Chuk   Avids  Mn

_________________
Lynn
Kitfox IV-Jabiru 2200
N369LM

Fox5flyer
Guest

Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 10:34 am Post subject: Sprung Tailwheel

I agree with Paul on his comments below, to a  point.  I've been involved with Kitfoxes  since about 1990 and have witnessed not only  my own spring breaking, but  have heard the complaints of many list members who have suffered the same  problems, often with much collateral damage.   Mine bent the rudder,  but I was able to repair it without much of a problem.  However, I tend to  differ with Paul's statement below that the springs are too light.  My  experience with spring steel indicates that there are two things that make a  good tail wheel spring.  The proper steel and proper heat treating.   Both are very important.  I had a Piper Vagabond that was 50 years old and  the spring set was still intact.  I replaced  it not because  it broke, but because it had flattened out to the point that the tail wheel  kingpin was no longer vertical and I was getting a lot of shimmy.  My  opinion is that the tail wheel springs sold by Denny and Skystar just were not  manufactured to the correct specifications for the job.  Way too many of  them broke to be blaming it on over use.   My model 2 was only about  500 lbs and the spring was plenty strong enough.  It just wasn't  manufactured correctly.

 My opinion is worth what you paid for  it.

 Deke Morisse

Mikado Michigan

S5/Subaru/CAP  355+ TT

"The aim of an argument or discussion should not be victory, but  progress."

- Joseph Joubert

  

 [quote]   ---

patreilly43(at)hotmail.co
Guest

Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 2:20 pm Post subject: Sprung Tailwheel

John McBean at Kitfox now sells a 3 leaf tail spring. So does Aircraft Spruce but McBean's is $25 less money. I just ordered one. Hope it's as good as yours that lasted 50 years. I'll still be flying mine at age 115. Ha! Well maybe my grandkids will. 

 Do not Archieve

  

 Pat Reilly

 Mod 3 Rebuild

 Rockford, IL

 [quote]  From: fox5flyer(at)idealwifi.net

To: kitfox-list(at)matronics.com

Subject: Re: Sprung Tailwheel

Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 14:29:39 -0400



     I agree with Paul on his comments below, to a point.  I've been involved with Kitfoxes since about 1990 and have witnessed not only  my own spring breaking, but have heard the complaints of many list members who have suffered the same problems, often with much collateral damage.   Mine bent the rudder, but I was able to repair it without much of a problem.  However, I tend to differ with Paul's statement below that the springs are too light.  My experience with spring steel indicates that there are two things that make a good tail wheel spring.  The proper steel and proper heat treating.  Both are very important.  I had a Piper Vagabond that was 50 years old and the spring set was still intact.  I replaced  it not because it broke, but because it had flattened out to the point that the tail wheel kingpin was no longer vertical and I was getting a lot of shimmy.  My opinion is that the tail wheel springs sold by Denny and Skystar just were not manufactured to the correct specifications for the job.  Way too many of them broke to be blaming it on over use.   My model 2 was only about 500 lbs and the spring was plenty strong enough.  It just wasn't manufactured correctly.

 My opinion is worth what you paid for it.

 Deke Morisse

Mikado Michigan

S5/Subaru/CAP 355+ TT

"The aim of an argument or discussion should not be victory, but progress."

- Joseph Joubert

  

 [quote] ---

patreilly43(at)hotmail.co
Guest

Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 2:39 pm Post subject: Sprung Tailwheel

Lynn, I see p/n 06-03600 Homebuilders 6" replacement wheel $29.90 page 247 Aircraft spruce. Is that the one? Is it for a 1/2" axle. It lists "longlife" bearings for $4.65 and states that they are superior to the standard bearings. It doesn't state solid or pneumatic, which is odd?

  

 Pat Reilly

 Mod 3 Rebuild

 Rockford,IL 



 	  Quote: 	
		   From: lynnmatt(at)jps.net

 Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Sprung Tailwheel

 Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 12:57:20 -0400

 To: kitfox-list(at)matronics.com

 

 --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt(at)jps.net>

 

 I had already changed over from the solid Maule tailwheel to the 6" 

 "Homebuilders Special Tailwheel" as Spruce calls them. It is a much 

 softer tire than the Maule, weighs less, and has less contact area 

 with the ground than the Maule. The bearings that come with the 

 Spruce wheel are terrible though.

 By the way, I like the looks of your pneumatic job, Jim.

 

 Lynn Matteson

 Grass Lake, Michigan

 Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200

 flying w/475+ hrs

 

 

 On Mar 11, 2008, at 10:20 AM, Jim_and_Lucy Chuk wrote:

 

 > I'm just wondering if those that have had the tailwheel spring 

 > break were all running the solid rubber Maule tailwheel. I had 

 > that wheel on my Avid MK IV, and you can sure feel every little 

 > bump through the fusaloge. I would guess that those sharp jolts 

 > fatigue the spring. Last summer I replaced the wheel with a cheep 

 > 6' pneumatic castor wheel and it was much smoother, the tire really 

 > soaks up lots of the sharp jolts. I got some better sealed 

 > bearings and put them in the wheel. It would have been nice if 

 > Maule made a replacement 6' pneumatic tire but they don't. This 

 > worked for me. Jim======

 

 

 


	


  [quote][b]

Lynn Matteson

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 2778
Location: Grass Lake, Michigan

Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 6:56 pm Post subject: Sprung Tailwheel

That's the one. Yes, get the longlife bearings from them or from a  

local bearing dealer, as the one's shipped with the wheel are poor  

quality...A word of warning....the description says "bearings" but  

that means one bearing, and you will need to order two, unless  

they've changed their tune since I ordered mine. You'll have to make  

a sleeve for the bearings to fit the Maule axle. I used a length of  

4130 tubing, Spruce part number 03-03900, which will have to be  

polished a few thousandths (mine did anyway) to fit the bearings. I'm  

pretty sure that the bore of this tubing fit the axle just right.

You'll have to forgive Spruce for their lack of full explanations of  

each of their products...they try hard (I'm being kind here...), but  

they miss the mark a lot. : )



Lynn Matteson

Grass Lake, Michigan

Kitfox IV Speedster  w/Jabiru 2200

flying w/475+ hrs

On Mar 11, 2008, at 6:35 PM, patrick reilly wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   Lynn, I see p/n 06-03600 Homebuilders 6" replacement wheel $29.90  

 page 247 Aircraft spruce. Is that the one? Is it for a 1/2" axle.  

 It lists "longlife" bearings for $4.65 and states that they are  

 superior to the standard bearings. It doesn't state solid or  

 pneumatic, which is odd?



 Pat Reilly

 Mod 3 Rebuild

 Rockford,IL



 > From: lynnmatt(at)jps.net

 > Subject: Re: Sprung Tailwheel

 > Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 12:57:20 -0400

 > To: kitfox-list(at)matronics.com

 >

 > 

 >

 > I had already changed over from the solid Maule tailwheel to the 6"

 > "Homebuilders Special Tailwheel" as Spruce calls them. It is a much

 > softer tire than the Maule, weighs less, and has less contact area

 > with the ground than the Maule. The bearings that come with the

 > Spruce wheel are terrible though.

 > By the way, I like the looks of your pneumatic job, Jim.

 >

 > Lynn Matteson

 > Grass Lake, Michigan

 > Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200

 > flying w/475+ hrs

 >

 >

 > On Mar 11, 2008, at 10:20 AM, Jim_and_Lucy Chuk wrote:

 >

 > > I'm just wondering if those that have had the tailwheel spring

 > > break were all running the solid rubber Maule tailwheel. I had

 > > that wheel on my Avid MK IV, and you can sure feel every little

 > > bump through the fusaloge. I would guess that those sharp jolts

 > > fatigue the spring. Last summer I replaced the wheel with a cheep

 > > 6' pneumatic castor wheel and it was much smoother, the tire  

 really

 > > soaks up lots of the sharp jolts. I got some better sealed

 > > bearings and put them in the wheel. It would have been nice if

 > > Maule made a replacement 6' pneumatic tire but they don't. This

 > > worked for me. Jim======

 >

 >

 >



 http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List_- 

 ============================================================ _- 

 forums.matronics.com_- 

 ============================================================ _- 

 contribution_- 

 ============================================================

_________________
Lynn
Kitfox IV-Jabiru 2200
N369LM

thesupe(at)hotmail.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 8:13 pm Post subject: Sprung Tailwheel

Lynn,  Is that tailwheel soft rubber or actually a pneumatic wheel?  As far as the bearings go,  I would bet that it wouldn't be to hard to find  bearings that fit the wheel and have a 1/2" center so it would fit the Maule axle.  Thanks,  Jim Chuk  Avids  MN



 	  Quote: 	
		   From: lynnmatt(at)jps.net

 Subject: Re: Sprung Tailwheel

 Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 22:54:21 -0400

 To: kitfox-list(at)matronics.com

 

 --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt(at)jps.net>

 

 That's the one. Yes, get the longlife bearings from them or from a 

 local bearing dealer, as the one's shipped with the wheel are poor 

 quality...A word of warning....the description says "bearings" but 

 that means one bearing, and you will need to order two, unless 

 they've changed their tune since I ordered mine. You'll have to make 

 a sleeve for the bearings to fit the Maule axle. I used a length of 

 4130 tubing, Spruce part number 03-03900, which will have to be 

 polished a few thousandths (mine did anyway) to fit the bearings. I'm 

 pretty sure that the bore of this tubing fit the axle just right.

 You'll have to forgive Spruce for their lack of full explanations of 

 each of their products...they try hard (I'm being kind here...), but 

 they miss the mark a lot. : )

 

 Lynn Matteson

 Grass Lake, Michigan

 Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200

 flying w/475+ hrs

 

 

 On Mar 11, 2008, at 6:35 PM, patrick reilly wrote:

 

 > Lynn, I see p/n 06-03600 Homebuilders 6" replacement wheel $29.90 

 > page 247 Aircraft spruce. Is that the one? Is it for a 1/2" axle. 

 > It lists "longlife" bearings for $4.65 and states that they are 

 > superior to the standard bearings. It doesn't state solid or 

 > pneumatic, which is odd?

 >

 > Pat Reilly

 > Mod 3 Rebuild

 > Rockford,IL

 >

 > > From: lynnmatt(at)jps.net

 > > Subject: Re: Sprung Tailwheel

 > > Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 12:57:20 -0400

 > > To: kitfox-list(at)matronics.com

 > >

 > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt(at)jps.net>

 > >

 > > I had already changed over from the solid Maule tailwheel to the 6"

 > > "Homebuilders Special Tailwheel" as Spruce calls them. It is a much

 > > softer tire than the Maule, weighs less, and has less contact area

 > > with the ground than the Maule. The bearings that come with the

 > > Spruce wheel are terrible though.

 > > By the way, I like the looks of your pneumatic job, Jim.

 > >

 > > Lynn Matteson

 > > Grass Lake, Michigan

 > > Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200

 > > flying w/475+ hrs

 > >

 > >

 > > On Mar 11, 2008, at 10:20 AM, Jim_and_Lucy Chuk wrote:

 > >

 > > > I'm just wondering if those that have had the tailwheel spring

 > > > break were all running the solid rubber Maule tailwheel. I had

 > > > that wheel on my Avid MK IV, and you can sure feel every little

 > > > bump through the fusaloge. I would guess that those sharp jolts

 > > > fatigue the spring. Last summer I replaced the wheel with a cheep

 > > > 6' pneumatic castor wheel and it was much smoother, the tire 

 > really

 > > > soaks up lots of the sharp jolts. I got some better sealed

 > > > bearings and put them in the wheel. It would have been nice if

 > > > Maule made a replacement 6' pneumatic tire but they don't. This

 > > > worked for me. Jim======

 > >

 > >

 > >

 >

 > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List_- 

 > =================================== _- 

 > forums.matronics.com_- 

 > =================================== _- 

 > contribution_- 

 > ===================================

&g=======================
	


[quote] 

 

 

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		  [b]

Catz631(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 4:20 am Post subject: Sprung Tailwheel

I too had the aluminum tailspring but found it too rough for my grass runway (and all the breakage reports) so I sold it on EBAY and installed the 3 leaf spring ,removed the Maule tailwheel, and installed a Matco tailwheel.The weight difference for the combination was less than 1/2 pound. I now have a flexable tailwheel that rides much better on grass and pavement!

                                   Dick Maddux

                                   Fox 4-1200

                                   Pensacola,Fl



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