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delfin(at)mail.pf
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 Posted: Sun Feb 26, 2006 8:04 am Post subject: L29-List Digest: 12 Msgs - 02/24/06 |
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The L-29 whith were used in hot countries (Ouganda, Egypt) had a
special larger entry for cold air. I have one on my plane. It is a
little bit better
Le 24 fvr. 06 21:58, L29-List Digest Server a crit :
[quote] *
==================================================
Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
==================================================
Today's complete L29-List Digest can also be found in either of the
two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest
formatted
in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked
Indexes
and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII
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of the L29-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor
such as Notepad or with a web browser.
HTML Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/l29-list/Digest.L29-List.
2006-02-24.html
Text Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/l29-list/Digest.L29-List.
2006-02-24.txt
================================================
EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
================================================
L29-List Digest Archive
---
Total Messages Posted Fri 02/24/06: 12
Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:26 AM - Re: L-29 Air Conditioning (Jean de Roubin)
2. 09:47 AM - air con - real question (Jorgen Nielsen)
3. 09:52 AM - Re: air con - real question (RAMPEYBOY(at)aol.com)
4. 10:14 AM - Re: air con - real question (Ernest Martinez)
5. 11:24 AM - MANUAL ON CD? (RAMPEYBOY(at)aol.com)
6. 11:44 AM - Re: MANUAL ON CD? (Gary Cole)
7. 02:53 PM - Re: MANUAL ON CD? (Colyergreg(at)aol.com)
8. 02:56 PM - Re: air con - real question (Jorgen Nielsen)
9. 04:07 PM - Re: air con - real question (AI Nut)
10. 06:00 PM - Re: MANUAL ON CD? (Bill)
11. 11:47 PM - L-29 and other jets at Reno Air Races?
(SD737(at)aol.com)
12. 11:48 PM - More RARA jet info (SD737(at)aol.com)
________________________________ Message 1
_____________________________________
Time: 01:26:03 AM PST US
From: Jean de Roubin <delfin(at)mail.pf>
Subject: Re: L-29 Air Conditioning
Hi, could you try to send me directly the attachement for AC
With many thanks
Jean de Roubin
Le 22 f=E9vr. 06 =E0 23:52, SD737(at)aol.com a =E9crit :
>
>
> Ah, the attachment did not follow through the matronics system...
> sorry guys
________________________________ Message 2
_____________________________________
Time: 09:47:40 AM PST US
From: "Jorgen Nielsen" <jorgen.nielsen(at)mweb.co.za>
Subject: air con - real question
<jorgen.nielsen(at)mweb.co.za>
Has anyone ever stripped down the components of the air con
system? I can
accept that its not a great system, but I don't seem to get air
flow through
it.
Lots of cool air would be good, but even warm air blowing on me
would be
better than no air!
________________________________ Message 3
_____________________________________
Time: 09:52:04 AM PST US
From: RAMPEYBOY(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: air con - real question
OK I don't really know anything about jets, or systems, but I'll
throw in my
2 cents worth. Does the jet have a 110V AC power supply while in
the air? If
so, could you not strip down a $100 window unit AC like used in a
house,
reconfigure/reshape it so it will fit into whatever baggage space
you have?
Maybe replace the existing AC unit, and hook up to existing duct
work? How
ridiculous of an idea is this?
Boyce
already laughing at the idea....
________________________________ Message 4
_____________________________________
Time: 10:14:38 AM PST US
From: "Ernest Martinez" <erniel29(at)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: air con - real question
The L-29 air conditioning unit is a turbo-cooler design. Hot bleed air
fromthe compressor is sent through a diverter/mixer valve, one side of
the diverter valve goes straight into the cockpit to provide heat, the
air is turned on by pushing the cabin pressurization valve on. The
other side of the diverter valve goes through an air2air heat
exchanger to pre-cool the hot bleed air, the output of the heat
exchanger goes through a turbine. The act of turning turbine expends
enrgery and thereby cools the air. then it is mixed with the hot side
from the diverter valve to regulate the air temp. The diverter valve
is controlled by the 3 position switch in the cockpit, cold diverts
all air to to the heat exchanger, hot bypasses the heat exchanger, and
automat controls the diverter valve based on the thermostat in the
cokpit, mixing the hot and cold bleed air to the desired temp.
There are 2 major problems with the system. First the heat exchanger
relies on RAM air in order to cool the hot bleed air, when the jet is
stationary the heat exchanger does nothing due to lack of RAM air. The
second issue is that the cooler turbine is too small to really cool
the air sufficiently to work in extreme temps. A larger turbine cannot
be fitted (Like the L-39 unit) because the M-701 doesnt have
sufficient excess bleed air capacity to turn anything larger and still
maintain combustion pressures.
I have worked on and off on a 24v powered auto air compressor, but
this also has its limitations. There is very little room in the nose
compartment for a sufficient size condensor. There is no good place to
place an decent size evaporator in the cockpit, and there is no easy
way to deal with condensation in the cockpit, so you would end up with
a whole lot of water in the belly.
I experimented with a marine type refrigeration 24v compressor but it
didnt have the capacity required for cooling. I may try again with a
24v syncronous motor which may have the required torque to turn the
compressor, but power draw will be on the order of about 60 amps.
Plumbing through the pressure vessel is also an issue which needs
resolution.
Ernie
On 2/24/06, RAMPEYBOY(at)aol.com <RAMPEYBOY(at)aol.com> wrote:
>
>
> OK I don't really know anything about jets, or systems, but I'll
> throw in my
> 2 cents worth. Does the jet have a 110V AC power supply while in
> the air? If
> so, could you not strip down a $100 window unit AC like used in a
> house,
> reconfigure/reshape it so it will fit into whatever baggage space
> you have?
> Maybe replace the existing AC unit, and hook up to existing duct
> work? How
> ridiculous of an idea is this?
> Boyce
> already laughing at the idea....
________________________________ Message 5
_____________________________________
Time: 11:24:03 AM PST US
From: RAMPEYBOY(at)aol.com
Subject: MANUAL ON CD?
I read on the list about the L-29 manual being available on CD.
How do I get
one, and how much? "Zach" was the reported contact person, but the
Email I
had for him bounced back. Thanks!
Boyce
________________________________ Message 6
_____________________________________
Time: 11:44:39 AM PST US
From: "Gary Cole" <ca6209(at)flash.net>
Subject: RE: MANUAL ON CD?
Try Z at www.warbirdseast.com
Gary
--
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schwartzcompany(at)worldn
Guest
|
| Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2006 10:28 am Post subject: L29-List Digest: 12 Msgs - 02/24/06 |
|
|
Jean , my understanding from overhaul facility is that some A/C changes were
made on Iraqi L29 aircraft. However, Egypt which were overhauled in 2000
did not have the mod. I am interested in more details if we can find
someone that worked on the Iraqi aircraft (yes, good luck)
Robert E. Schwartz
[quote]> *
>
> ==================================================
> Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
> ==================================================
>
> Today's complete L29-List Digest can also be found in either of the
> two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest
> formatted
> in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked
> Indexes
> and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII
> version
> of the L29-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor
> such as Notepad or with a web browser.
>
> HTML Version:
>
> http://www.matronics.com/digest/l29-list/Digest.L29-List.
> 2006-02-24.html
>
> Text Version:
>
> http://www.matronics.com/digest/l29-list/Digest.L29-List.
> 2006-02-24.txt
> ================================================
> EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
> ================================================
> L29-List Digest Archive
> ---
> Total Messages Posted Fri 02/24/06: 12
> Today's Message Index:
> ----------------------
>
> 1. 01:26 AM - Re: L-29 Air Conditioning (Jean de Roubin)
> 2. 09:47 AM - air con - real question (Jorgen Nielsen)
> 3. 09:52 AM - Re: air con - real question (RAMPEYBOY(at)aol.com)
> 4. 10:14 AM - Re: air con - real question (Ernest Martinez)
> 5. 11:24 AM - MANUAL ON CD? (RAMPEYBOY(at)aol.com)
> 6. 11:44 AM - Re: MANUAL ON CD? (Gary Cole)
> 7. 02:53 PM - Re: MANUAL ON CD? (Colyergreg(at)aol.com)
> 8. 02:56 PM - Re: air con - real question (Jorgen Nielsen)
> 9. 04:07 PM - Re: air con - real question (AI Nut)
> 10. 06:00 PM - Re: MANUAL ON CD? (Bill)
> 11. 11:47 PM - L-29 and other jets at Reno Air Races?
> (SD737(at)aol.com)
> 12. 11:48 PM - More RARA jet info (SD737(at)aol.com)
>
> ________________________________ Message 1
> _____________________________________
> Time: 01:26:03 AM PST US
> From: Jean de Roubin <delfin(at)mail.pf>
> Subject: Re: L-29 Air Conditioning
>
>
>
> Hi, could you try to send me directly the attachement for AC
> With many thanks
> Jean de Roubin
> Le 22 f=E9vr. 06 =E0 23:52, SD737(at)aol.com a =E9crit :
>
>>
>>
>> Ah, the attachment did not follow through the matronics system...
>> sorry guys
>>
>>
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 2
> _____________________________________
> Time: 09:47:40 AM PST US
> From: "Jorgen Nielsen" <jorgen.nielsen(at)mweb.co.za>
> Subject: air con - real question
>
>
> <jorgen.nielsen(at)mweb.co.za>
>
> Has anyone ever stripped down the components of the air con
> system? I can
> accept that its not a great system, but I don't seem to get air
> flow through
> it.
>
> Lots of cool air would be good, but even warm air blowing on me
> would be
> better than no air!
>
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 3
> _____________________________________
> Time: 09:52:04 AM PST US
> From: RAMPEYBOY(at)aol.com
> Subject: Re: air con - real question
>
>
>
> OK I don't really know anything about jets, or systems, but I'll
> throw in my
> 2 cents worth. Does the jet have a 110V AC power supply while in
> the air? If
> so, could you not strip down a $100 window unit AC like used in a
> house,
> reconfigure/reshape it so it will fit into whatever baggage space
> you have?
> Maybe replace the existing AC unit, and hook up to existing duct
> work? How
> ridiculous of an idea is this?
> Boyce
> already laughing at the idea....
>
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 4
> _____________________________________
> Time: 10:14:38 AM PST US
> From: "Ernest Martinez" <erniel29(at)gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: air con - real question
>
>
>
> The L-29 air conditioning unit is a turbo-cooler design. Hot bleed air
> fromthe compressor is sent through a diverter/mixer valve, one side of
> the diverter valve goes straight into the cockpit to provide heat, the
> air is turned on by pushing the cabin pressurization valve on. The
> other side of the diverter valve goes through an air2air heat
> exchanger to pre-cool the hot bleed air, the output of the heat
> exchanger goes through a turbine. The act of turning turbine expends
> enrgery and thereby cools the air. then it is mixed with the hot side
> from the diverter valve to regulate the air temp. The diverter valve
> is controlled by the 3 position switch in the cockpit, cold diverts
> all air to to the heat exchanger, hot bypasses the heat exchanger, and
> automat controls the diverter valve based on the thermostat in the
> cokpit, mixing the hot and cold bleed air to the desired temp.
>
> There are 2 major problems with the system. First the heat exchanger
> relies on RAM air in order to cool the hot bleed air, when the jet is
> stationary the heat exchanger does nothing due to lack of RAM air. The
> second issue is that the cooler turbine is too small to really cool
> the air sufficiently to work in extreme temps. A larger turbine cannot
> be fitted (Like the L-39 unit) because the M-701 doesnt have
> sufficient excess bleed air capacity to turn anything larger and still
> maintain combustion pressures.
>
> I have worked on and off on a 24v powered auto air compressor, but
> this also has its limitations. There is very little room in the nose
> compartment for a sufficient size condensor. There is no good place to
> place an decent size evaporator in the cockpit, and there is no easy
> way to deal with condensation in the cockpit, so you would end up with
> a whole lot of water in the belly.
>
> I experimented with a marine type refrigeration 24v compressor but it
> didnt have the capacity required for cooling. I may try again with a
> 24v syncronous motor which may have the required torque to turn the
> compressor, but power draw will be on the order of about 60 amps.
> Plumbing through the pressure vessel is also an issue which needs
> resolution.
>
> Ernie
>
> On 2/24/06, RAMPEYBOY(at)aol.com <RAMPEYBOY(at)aol.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> OK I don't really know anything about jets, or systems, but I'll
>> throw in my
>> 2 cents worth. Does the jet have a 110V AC power supply while in
>> the air? If
>> so, could you not strip down a $100 window unit AC like used in a
>> house,
>> reconfigure/reshape it so it will fit into whatever baggage space
>> you have?
>> Maybe replace the existing AC unit, and hook up to existing duct
>> work? How
>> ridiculous of an idea is this?
>> Boyce
>> already laughing at the idea....
>>
>>
>
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 5
> _____________________________________
> Time: 11:24:03 AM PST US
> From: RAMPEYBOY(at)aol.com
> Subject: MANUAL ON CD?
>
>
>
> I read on the list about the L-29 manual being available on CD.
> How do I get
> one, and how much? "Zach" was the reported contact person, but the
> Email I
> had for him bounced back. Thanks!
> Boyce
>
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 6
> _____________________________________
> Time: 11:44:39 AM PST US
> From: "Gary Cole" <ca6209(at)flash.net>
> Subject: RE: MANUAL ON CD?
>
>
>
> Try Z at www.warbirdseast.com
> Gary
>
> --
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Colyergreg(at)aol.com
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2006 1:38 pm Post subject: L29-List Digest: 12 Msgs - 02/24/06 |
|
|
I think they are all dead now!
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