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Vanremog(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 10:46 pm Post subject: Say What?

Lycoming announces this.

  

 Recognizing global concerns about the immediate and long-term availability  of aviation-grade 100LL fuel, Lycoming Engines announced this  week that it is working to get approval for the use of unleaded automotive  gasoline for its standard-compression-ratio O-360 and IO-360 product lines. Ian  Walsh, general manager for Lycoming Engines, told AVweb the approval will  not require any modification to the engines, the fuel will not need any  additives or special treatment, and there will be no degradation in engine  performance. "It's essentially a paperwork drill, to make this happen," he said.  He expects to have approval from the FAA by this fall, but owners cannot  implement the change until the airplane also gets certified. That is up to the  manufacturers, Walsh said, and he could not estimate how long that would take,  but said it is also essentially a paperwork issue. The engines will require a  specific type of unleaded 93 AKI automotive gas, designated as Euro Norm EN228  (in Europe) or ASTM D4814 (in the U.S.). This fuel is not difficult to find,  Walsh said, but users must verify that they are getting that particular type --  not just any unleaded auto gas will do.  

 

 

The unleaded automotive gas is generally cheaper than avgas and provides an  alternative in areas where avgas is scarce. Also, the continuing use of leaded  avgas provokes environmental concerns. The popular O-360 and IO-360 engines are  found on many GA aircraft, including Cessnas, Mooneys, Diamonds, and more. 

This makes it sound like a slam dunk.  Can it really be this easy? 

 

  

 N1GV (RV-6A, Flying 895hrs, O-360-A1A, C/S, Silicon  Valley) 



Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with Tyler Florence" on AOL Food.

  [quote][b]

jmsears(at)adelphia.net
Guest

Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2008 2:35 am Post subject: Say What?

Gee, golly.  I've been flying on mogas since 1986.  The

 big difference is that the manufacturer is actually saying

 it can run on it, now.  I don't know what one has to do to

 prove fuel meets their standard; but, it may be a nothing

 thing to do.  I also don't know what their feelings are

 concerning mogas with a little ethanol in it.  I guess I've

 flown over 1900 logged hours behind engines running on

 auto gas.  My airplanes haven't crashed and burned, 

 yet. 

  

 With the price of gas, these days, manufacturers have to

 do something to make it easier for us.  Otherwise, their

 market will shrink more than it already has.  I've logged very

 little time in my RV, this year.  I've used the money saved

 to help feed our other vehicles.  Selling my RV may be my

 next move. At $30+ per hour fuel cost, it's getting a bit out

 of line for my meager fixed income.         

  

 Jim Sears in KY

 RV-6A N198JS

 EAA Tech Counselor    

 [quote]   ---

timb

Joined: 16 Apr 2008
Posts: 77
Location: Frankston, Texas

Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2008 4:11 am Post subject: Say What?

Hi Jim,  

   

I would be interested to know what criteria you use for auto fuel in your RV-6.  Do you check for ethanol first?  Are you using premium?  Did you do anything special to the tanks, lines, carb to be able to use this without concern?  

   

I am running only avgas in my RV-6 for 100 hours now but would love to be comfortable using auto fuel.  

   

I tried to take this off line, but it bounced back from your email addy.  

     

[b]Tim Bryan[/b]  

[b]RV-6 Flying[/b]  

[b]N616TB 100 hours now[/b]  

          

  

From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Sears

 Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 5:27 AM

 To: rv-list(at)matronics.com

 Subject: Re: Say What?  

  

     

Gee, golly.  I've been flying on mogas since 1986.  The  

    

big difference is that the manufacturer is actually saying  

    

it can run on it, now.  I don't know what one has to do to  

    

prove fuel meets their standard; but, it may be a nothing  

    

thing to do.  I also don't know what their feelings are  

    

concerning mogas with a little ethanol in it.  I guess I've  

    

flown over 1900 logged hours behind engines running on  

    

auto gas.  My airplanes haven't crashed and burned,   

    

yet.   

    

   

    

With the price of gas, these days, manufacturers have to  

    

do something to make it easier for us.  Otherwise, their  

    

market will shrink more than it already has.  I've logged very  

    

little time in my RV, this year.  I've used the money saved  

    

to help feed our other vehicles.  Selling my RV may be my  

    

next move. At $30+ per hour fuel cost, it's getting a bit out  

    

of line for my meager fixed income.          

    

   

    

Jim Sears in KY  

    

RV-6A N198JS  

    

EAA Tech Counselor      

  [quote]    

---

_________________
Tim Bryan
RV-6 Flying
N616TB

pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.
Guest

Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2008 5:48 am Post subject: Say What?

Tim Bryan wrote:  	  Quote: 	
		           v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} .shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}  <![endif]-->      st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) }  <![endif]-->          <![endif]-->       <![endif]-->         

Hi Jim,   

 	
 I'm not Jim, but like him have been a mogas user for years.  	  Quote: 	
		        

I would be interested to know what criteria you use for auto fuel in your RV-6.   

 	
 I use mogas in my AA-1B (O-235-C2C) and my Pitts (O-360-A4A).  It was economics in the AA-1B, but it was the lead fouling problem in the Pitts.  For 13 years I hand-propped the Pitts, and lead fouling meant far more exercise.

  	  Quote: 	
		        

  Do you check for ethanol first?   

 	
 In Florida, pumps with alcohol were required to post whether or not alcohol was present.  Within the last month, pumps started sporting a placard that said "may contain up to 10% or less ethanol". Which means we have to test for it.  This is problematic for me.  If I test regular .... both planes will run on regular, but the Pitts will ping on it when the engine gets hot during aerobatics so I typically use high test ...... and there's alcohol, I can put in my vehicle and search elsewhere.  If I'm looking for high test, then I'll just have to pay the few pennies for the fuel I tested.  Gonna look funny on the credit card.

 

 To further make my life miserable, our governor is working on a bill to mandate the use of alcohol.  Crap!!!

  	  Quote: 	
		        

  Are you using premium?   

 	
 Only in the Pitts.

  	  Quote: 	
		        

  Did you do anything special to the tanks, lines, carb to be able to use this without concern?   

 	
 There should always be concern.  Early on (in the early 80's) before the signage requirement, I got some alcohol laced mogas that went into the Pitts.  It has a PS-5 pressure carburetor that operates on pressure differences on many diaphragms.  The alcohol ate the old black diaphragms causing them to crack and leak.  After spending a lot of my mogas money on the rebuild (with red silicone diaphragms) the alcohol problem went away ..... until now.  	  Quote: 	
		        

I am running only avgas in my RV-6 for 100 hours now but would love to be comfortable using auto fuel.   

 	
 Jim will have to reply to that one (RV-6), but you need to do the soul searching yourself.  In this case your mileage MAY differ.  I've known some RV pilots that had issues with vapor pressure in THEIR airplane.  I've known a whole lot more with NO issues with mogas.  	  Quote: 	
		        

 I tried to take this off line, but it bounced back from your email addy.   

 	
 I think this discussion should be left to the forum.  There are a lot more mogas users out there with experience and opinions that are invaluable in this discussion.  I hope they chime in.

 

 As an aside, the STCs in place for the certified aircraft prohibit alcohol in the mogas (and Lycoming does too in its new press release) for good reason.  It attacks rubber and is corrosive to aluminum (and will soften proseal over time).  How corrosive I don't know.  Hell, air is corrosive to aluminum!!!   Without alcohol (in the fuel, of course!), I have no qualms about using it ...... and will probably experiment with high test in my RV-10 when it flies.  

 

 Best of luck Tim ..... and we're all gonna need it in the fuel wars ..... 

 Linn ..... just one data point

 [quote]      

   

       

[b]Tim Bryan[/b]   

[b]RV-6 Flying[/b]   

   

 [b]

bmeyette

Joined: 14 Mar 2007
Posts: 72
Location: Cornish, NH

Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2008 8:58 am Post subject: Say What?

The problem I see with this is that it seems to be getting more & more difficult find auto fuel that isn’t at least 10% ethanol  

   

   

         

  

From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Vanremog(at)aol.com

 Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 2:40 AM

 To: rv-list(at)matronics.com

 Subject: Say What?  

  

     

Lycoming announces this.  

    

   

    

Recognizing global concerns about the immediate and long-term availability of aviation-grade 100LL fuel, Lycoming Engines [b]announced[/b] this week that it is working to get approval for the use of unleaded automotive gasoline for its standard-compression-ratio O-360 and IO-360 product lines. Ian Walsh, general manager for Lycoming Engines, told AVweb the approval will not require any modification to the engines, the fuel will not need any additives or special treatment, and there will be no degradation in engine performance. "It's essentially a paperwork drill, to make this happen," he said. He expects to have approval from the FAA by this fall, but owners cannot implement the change until the airplane also gets certified. That is up to the manufacturers, Walsh said, and he could not estimate how long that would take, but said it is also essentially a paperwork issue. The engines will require a specific type of unleaded 93 AKI automotive gas, designated as Euro Norm EN228 (in Europe) or ASTM D4814 (in the U.S.). This fuel is not difficult to find, Walsh said, but users must verify that they are getting that particular type -- not just any unleaded auto gas will do.   

The unleaded automotive gas is generally cheaper than avgas and provides an alternative in areas where avgas is scarce. Also, the continuing use of leaded avgas provokes environmental concerns. The popular O-360 and IO-360 engines are found on many GA aircraft, including Cessnas, Mooneys, Diamonds, and more.  

This makes it sound like a slam dunk.  Can it really be this easy?  

   

    

   

    

N1GV (RV-6A, Flying 895hrs, O-360-A1A, C/S, Silicon  Valley)   

  



 

         

  

Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with Tyler Florence" on AOL Food.  

  

      	  Quote: 	
		  



href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List

href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com

href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c

	
No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG.  Release Date: 6/3/2008 7:31 PM  Checked by AVG.  Release Date: 6/4/2008 4:40 PM     [quote][b]

_________________
Brian Meyette, Cornish, NH

RV-7A QB tipup, supercharged Subaru STi engine, MT CS prop, all glass day/night/IFR panel, being built with solar and wind power

N432MM

http://brian76.mystarband.net/RV-7Ahome.htm

Kellym

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1705
Location: Sun Lakes AZ

Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2008 8:05 pm Post subject: Say What?

Note that the ASTM std they chose does permit alcohol. Also beware that mogas is a solvent for at least the older varieties of PRC sealant. Some folks that tried using it in older Mooneys soon developed significant fuel leaks.

 

 Brian Meyette wrote: [quote]         v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} .shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}  <![endif]-->      st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) }  <![endif]-->             

The problem I see with this is that it seems to be getting more & more difficult find auto fuel that isn’t at least 10% ethanol   

    

    

          

   

From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com) [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com)] On Behalf Of Vanremog(at)aol.com (Vanremog(at)aol.com)

   Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 2:40 AM

   To: rv-list(at)matronics.com (rv-list(at)matronics.com)

   Subject: Say What?   

   

       

Lycoming announces this.   

      

    

      

Recognizing global concerns about the immediate and long-term availability of aviation-grade 100LL fuel, Lycoming Engines [b]announced[/b] this week that it is working to get approval for the use of unleaded automotive gasoline for its standard-compression-ratio O-360 and IO-360 product lines. Ian Walsh, general manager for Lycoming Engines, told AVweb the approval will not require any modification to the engines, the fuel will not need any additives or special treatment, and there will be no degradation in engine performance. "It's essentially a paperwork drill, to make this happen," he said. He expects to have approval from the FAA by this fall, but owners cannot implement the change until the airplane also gets certified. That is up to the manufacturers, Walsh said, and he could not estimate how long that would take, but said it is also essentially a paperwork issue. The engines will require a specific type of unleaded 93 AKI automotive gas, designated as Euro Norm EN228 (in Europe) or ASTM D4814 (in the U.S.). This fuel is not difficult to find, Walsh said, but users must verify that they are getting that particular type -- not just any unleaded auto gas will do.    

The unleaded automotive gas is generally cheaper than avgas and provides an alternative in areas where avgas is scarce. Also, the continuing use of leaded avgas provokes environmental concerns. The popular O-360 and IO-360 engines are found on many GA aircraft, including Cessnas, Mooneys, Diamonds, and more.   

This makes it sound like a slam dunk.  Can it really be this easy?   

    

      

    

      

N1GV (RV-6A, Flying 895hrs, O-360-A1A, C/S, Silicon Valley)    

   



      

 [b]

_________________
Kelly McMullen
A&P/IA, EAA Tech Counselor # 5286
KCHD

timb

Joined: 16 Apr 2008
Posts: 77
Location: Frankston, Texas

Posted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 4:50 am Post subject: Say What?

Hi Linn,  

   

Great info to ponder, Thanks for your comments!  

Do Not Archive  

     

[b]Tim Bryan[/b]  

[b]RV-6 Flying[/b]  

[b]N616TB almost 100 hours now[/b]  

          

  

From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of linn Walters

 Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 8:42 AM

 To: rv-list(at)matronics.com

 Subject: Re: Say What?  

  

   

Tim Bryan wrote:   

      <![endif]-->                 <![endif]-->Hi Jim,  

I'm not Jim, but like him have been a mogas user for years.   

I would be interested to know what criteria you use for auto fuel in your RV-6.  

I use mogas in my AA-1B (O-235-C2C) and my Pitts (O-360-A4A).  It was economics in the AA-1B, but it was the lead fouling problem in the Pitts.  For 13 years I hand-propped the Pitts, and lead fouling meant far more exercise.

 

   

  Do you check for ethanol first?  

In Florida, pumps with alcohol were required to post whether or not alcohol was present.  Within the last month, pumps started sporting a placard that said "may contain up to 10% or less ethanol". Which means we have to test for it.  This is problematic for me.  If I test regular .... both planes will run on regular, but the Pitts will ping on it when the engine gets hot during aerobatics so I typically use high test ....... and there's alcohol, I can put in my vehicle and search elsewhere.  If I'm looking for high test, then I'll just have to pay the few pennies for the fuel I tested.  Gonna look funny on the credit card.

 

 To further make my life miserable, our governor is working on a bill to mandate the use of alcohol.  Crap!!!

 

   

  Are you using premium?  

Only in the Pitts.

 

   

  Did you do anything special to the tanks, lines, carb to be able to use this without concern?  

There should always be concern.  Early on (in the early 80's) before the signage requirement, I got some alcohol laced mogas that went into the Pitts.  It has a PS-5 pressure carburetor that operates on pressure differences on many diaphragms.  The alcohol ate the old black diaphragms causing them to crack and leak.  After spending a lot of my mogas money on the rebuild (with red silicone diaphragms) the alcohol problem went away ..... until now.   

I am running only avgas in my RV-6 for 100 hours now but would love to be comfortable using auto fuel.  

Jim will have to reply to that one (RV-6), but you need to do the soul searching yourself.  In this case your mileage MAY differ.  I've known some RV pilots that had issues with vapor pressure in THEIR airplane.  I've known a whole lot more with NO issues with mogas.   

 I tried to take this off line, but it bounced back from your email addy.  

I think this discussion should be left to the forum.  There are a lot more mogas users out there with experience and opinions that are invaluable in this discussion.  I hope they chime in.

 

 As an aside, the STCs in place for the certified aircraft prohibit alcohol in the mogas (and Lycoming does too in its new press release) for good reason.  It attacks rubber and is corrosive to aluminum (and will soften proseal over time).  How corrosive I don't know.  Hell, air is corrosive to aluminum!!!   Without alcohol (in the fuel, of course!), I have no qualms about using it ...... and will probably experiment with high test in my RV-10 when it flies.  

 

 Best of luck Tim ..... and we're all gonna need it in the fuel wars ..... 

 Linn ..... just one data point

 

   

     

[b]Tim Bryan[/b]    

[b]RV-6 Flying[/b]  

  

    	  Quote: 	
		    http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List 	
0 	  Quote: 	
		   	
1 	  Quote: 	
		   	
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5 	  Quote: 	
		   	
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9

  

        [quote][b]

_________________
Tim Bryan
RV-6 Flying
N616TB

AV8ORJWC

Joined: 13 Jul 2006
Posts: 1149
Location: Aurora, Oregon "Home of VANS"

Posted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 5:21 pm Post subject: Say What?

No, ethanol additions will undermine the effort.



 



John Cox



 



From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com

[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of

Vanremog(at)aol.com

Sent: Wednesday, June 04, 2008 11:40 PM

To: rv-list(at)matronics.com

Subject: Say What?



 



Lycoming announces this.



 



Recognizing global concerns about the immediate and long-term

availability of aviation-grade 100LL fuel, Lycoming Engines announced

<http://www.lycoming.com/news-and-events/press-releases/release-06-02-08

.jsp>  this week that it is working to get approval for the use of

unleaded automotive gasoline for its standard-compression-ratio O-360

and IO-360 product lines. Ian Walsh, general manager for Lycoming

Engines, told AVweb the approval will not require any modification to

the engines, the fuel will not need any additives or special treatment,

and there will be no degradation in engine performance. "It's

essentially a paperwork drill, to make this happen," he said. He expects

to have approval from the FAA by this fall, but owners cannot implement

the change until the airplane also gets certified. That is up to the

manufacturers, Walsh said, and he could not estimate how long that would

take, but said it is also essentially a paperwork issue. The engines

will require a specific type of unleaded 93 AKI automotive gas,

designated as Euro Norm EN228 (in Europe) or ASTM D4814 (in the U.S.).

This fuel is not difficult to find, Walsh said, but users must verify

that they are getting that particular type -- not just any unleaded auto

gas will do. 



The unleaded automotive gas is generally cheaper than avgas and provides

an alternative in areas where avgas is scarce. Also, the continuing use

of leaded avgas provokes environmental concerns. The popular O-360 and

IO-360 engines are found on many GA aircraft, including Cessnas,

Mooneys, Diamonds, and more.



This makes it sound like a slam dunk.  Can it really be this easy?



 



 



N1GV (RV-6A, Flying 895hrs, O-360-A1A, C/S, Silicon Valley) 



________________________________



Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with Tyler

Florence" on AOL Food

<http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4?&NCID=aolfod00030000000002>

ceengland(at)bellsouth.ne
Guest

Posted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 6:28 pm Post subject: Say What?

What many people want is for some 'authority' to tell them that 'x' has 

been tested & it's either ok or not. Unfortunately, all we can get in 

the short term is anecdotes (data points with incomplete info on the 

parameters).



Point: The same authority (Lyc) that spent the last 3 decades telling us 

that mogas will kill us all is suddenly, with clear knowledge of the 

risk of lawsuits, telling us that it's perfectly ok. (Kinda makes you 

feel like the runup to the Iraq war...)



Point: Several corn belt RV's have been flying with supposedly stock 

lycs on almost pure ethanol for many years (over a decade, I think).

Point: In 1990, I visited a small airport across the river from Natchez 

MS in the 160HP Thorp T-18 I owned at the time. When I asked for fuel, 

the lineman asked if I wanted avgas or mogas. I said that since I had 

the 160 hp engine, I'd better get avgas. He responded that he'd been 

feeding his 160 hp Tripacer a steady diet of mogas for at least a decade 

with no problems.

Point: A few times in the past, I've run mogas regular in my current 160 

hp RV-4 when we were out of avgas on the field. The plane has limited 

engine instrumentation, but it seemed to run with noticeably higher CHT 

& oil temp and I could never get totally comfortable with how it 'felt' 

at cruise.



Point: During one of our more recent outages, I decided to try mogas 

premium, 1st mixed with avgas & eventually just the premium mogas. The 

engine runs *much* better on premium mogas. With avgas, plugs are fouled 

at every startup. (Sub-data point: I lean aggressively & consistently as 

soon as I pull power back after climbout.) With premium, plugs are 

always clean at startup. (This is a 1700hr+ SMOH engine with compression 

in the high 70's but blowing about 1  qt of oil past the chrome 

cylinders & out the breather every 3 hrs.) It runs great! No 

intermittent 'auto-rough' like I get on avgas. No noticeable evidence of 

running hot. The only problem is that premium is pushing $4.20/gal now & 

we have a 10,000 gallon supply of avgas that was mistakenly delivered to 

a neighbor's ag operation at $3.60/gal. What's a mother to do??



Hope these data points are helpful.



Charlie



Tim Bryan wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  

 Hi Linn,



  



 Great info to ponder, Thanks for your comments!



 Do Not Archive



  



 **Tim Bryan**



 **RV-6 Flying**



 **N616TB almost 100 hours now**



 ------------------------------------------------------------------------



 *From:* owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com 

 [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *linn Walters

 *Sent:* Thursday, June 05, 2008 8:42 AM

 *To:* rv-list(at)matronics.com

 *Subject:* Re: Say What?



  



 Tim Bryan wrote:



 Hi Jim,



 I'm not Jim, but like him have been a mogas user for years.



 I would be interested to know what criteria you use for auto fuel in 

 your RV-6.



 I use mogas in my AA-1B (O-235-C2C) and my Pitts (O-360-A4A).  It was 

 economics in the AA-1B, but it was the lead fouling problem in the 

 Pitts.  For 13 years I hand-propped the Pitts, and lead fouling meant 

 far more exercise.



   Do you check for ethanol first?



 In Florida, pumps with alcohol were required to post whether or not 

 alcohol was present.  Within the last month, pumps started sporting a 

 placard that said "may contain up to 10% or less ethanol". Which means 

 we have to test for it.  This is problematic for me.  If I test 

 regular ..... both planes will run on regular, but the Pitts will ping 

 on it when the engine gets hot during aerobatics so I typically use 

 high test ....... and there's alcohol, I can put in my vehicle and 

 search elsewhere.  If I'm looking for high test, then I'll just have 

 to pay the few pennies for the fuel I tested.  Gonna look funny on the 

 credit card.



 To further make my life miserable, our governor is working on a bill 

 to mandate the use of alcohol.  Crap!!!



   Are you using premium?



 Only in the Pitts.



   Did you do anything special to the tanks, lines, carb to be able to 

 use this without concern?



 There should always be concern.  Early on (in the early 80's) before 

 the signage requirement, I got some alcohol laced mogas that went into 

 the Pitts.  It has a PS-5 pressure carburetor that operates on 

 pressure differences on many diaphragms.  The alcohol ate the old 

 black diaphragms causing them to crack and leak.  After spending a lot 

 of my mogas money on the rebuild (with red silicone diaphragms) the 

 alcohol problem went away ..... until now.



 I am running only avgas in my RV-6 for 100 hours now but would love to 

 be comfortable using auto fuel.



 Jim will have to reply to that one (RV-6), but you need to do the soul 

 searching yourself.  In this case your mileage MAY differ.  I've known 

 some RV pilots that had issues with vapor pressure in THEIR airplane.  

 I've known a whole lot more with NO issues with mogas.



  I tried to take this off line, but it bounced back from your email addy.



 I think this discussion should be left to the forum.  There are a lot 

 more mogas users out there with experience and opinions that are 

 invaluable in this discussion.  I hope they chime in.



 As an aside, the STCs in place for the certified aircraft prohibit 

 alcohol in the mogas (and Lycoming does too in its new press release) 

 for good reason.  It attacks rubber and is corrosive to aluminum (and 

 will soften proseal over time).  How corrosive I don't know.  Hell, 

 air is corrosive to aluminum!!!   Without alcohol (in the fuel, of 

 course!), I have no qualms about using it ...... and will probably 

 experiment with high test in my RV-10 when it flies. 



 Best of luck Tim ..... and we're all gonna need it in the fuel wars 

 ......

 Linn ..... just one data point



  



 **Tim Bryan**



 **RV-6 Flying**



  



 * *

 * *

 **

 **

 **

 *http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List*

 **

 *http://forums.matronics.com*

 **

 **

 **

 * *

 *

 *

 ------------------------------------------------------------------------

 Checked by AVG.

JFLEISC(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2008 3:19 am Post subject: Say What?

In a message dated 6/6/2008 10:30:42 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  ceengland(at)bellsouth.net writes:

  	  Quote: 	
		  eventually just the premium mogas. The 

engine runs *much* better on    premium mogas. With avgas, plugs are fouled 

at every startup. (Sub-data    point: I lean aggressively & consistently as 

soon as I pull power back    after climbout.) With premium, plugs are 

always clean at startup. (This is    a 1700hr+ SMOH engine with compression 

in the high 70's but blowing about    1  qt of oil past the chrome 

cylinders & out the breather every 3    hrs.) It runs great! No 

intermittent 'auto-rough' like I get on avgas. No    noticeable evidence of 

running hot. 	
  

 My experience exactly.

  

 Jim

 

  



Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with Tyler Florence" on AOL Food.

  [quote][b]

n395v

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 450

Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2008 5:20 am Post subject: Re: Say What?

 	  Quote: 	
		  (Kinda makes you 

feel like the runup to the Iraq war...) 

	


 If you are a liberal running for national office

Do not archive

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Milt

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