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Rotax carb heaters

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willie.harrison(at)tinyon
Guest

Posted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 1:04 am Post subject: Rotax carb heaters

Folks, 2 questions:



1. What experience does anyone have of electric or coolant-based carb  

heaters for Rotax engines?



2. Can anyone tell me whether either of these is regarded as a  

standard mod by the LAA?



Many thanks in advance.



Willie Harrison

G-BZNY

rick(at)amimotormanagemen
Guest

Posted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 1:21 am Post subject: Rotax carb heaters

Hi Willie



How's it?



I've used the Skydrive jackets for 4 years and 400 hours with  never a

problem. I would automatically fit them if I did another 912 kit. 



Not a issue with the LAA as far as I can remember.



Incidentally a lot of the Vans owning guys are looking jealously at our fuel

figures at the moment!!



All the best 



Rick

G-RIKS Tri 912S  

G-RMRV IO-360 RV7A



--

Carl Pattinson

Joined: 26 Sep 2007
Posts: 11

Posted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 1:46 am Post subject: Re: Rotax carb heaters

The Skydrive kit is an accepted engine mod and you shouldnt have a problem with then PFA.



The electric ones as far as I know are not an approved mod for the Europa unless someone has done this privately. I beleive it may be approved for Jabiru installations.



The Skydrive ones seem to be problem free and do not affect engine performance. They are left permanantly turned on so require no management like conventional carb heat systems.

craigb(at)onthenet.com.au
Guest

Posted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 2:20 am Post subject: Rotax carb heaters

"Incidentally a lot of the Vans owning guys are looking jealously at our

fuel

figures at the moment!!"

given the price of fuel now and the performace of the Europa I bet a lot of

the Cessna and piper

owners would be too.

It's great when your plane gets better fuel economy than your car as well

 : )



craig

Checked by AVG.

11:20 AM

jeff(at)rmmm.net
Guest

Posted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 6:37 am Post subject: Rotax carb heaters

On Jun 27, 2008, at 4:46 AM, Carl Pattinson wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   The Skydrive ones seem to be problem free and do not affect engine 

 performance. They are left permanantly turned on so require no 

 management like conventional carb heat systems.


	


You will want to install a simple on off 1/4 inch fuel valve on the sky 

drive carb heat coolant line. Before I did that my carbs were boiling 

fuel on hot summer days. Now I just pull the small knob under the panel 

if I want carb heat. The sky drive system works great. Just don't leave 

it on all the time if you taxi in hot weather on the hot tarmac.

Regards



Jeff R.

A258 - N128LJ / Gold Rush 127 hours and finally cooling nicely.

 	  Quote: 	
		  

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=190050#190050

g-iani(at)ntlworld.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 8:44 am Post subject: Rotax carb heaters

All the paperwork is done for the Skydrive Carb heaters to be a standard

mod.  I will send you a copy off list. I first submitted them in 2005 (in

conjunction with Skydrive) and they just sat on Francis's desk.



In April this year Andy Draper agreed that they should form part of a series

of mods for 91X engines, rather than being a Europa mod.  So I resubmitted

the application on 18th April.  So far nothing has happened.



Despite all this there should be no problem with the Mod but I do wish LAA

would do its paper work and make everybody's life a little simpler.



Ian Rickard G-IANI XS Trigear, 200 hours

Europa Club Mods Rep (Trigear)

e-mail mods(at)europaclub.org.uk   

   or direct g-iani(at)ntlworld.

raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi
Guest

Posted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 12:16 pm Post subject: Rotax carb heaters

1) I have cbchs and I am happy. So far no icing and flying almost all the time in icing conditions.

Think it is wise: air is cool and carburrettor body is warm. Mine is always on - no valve.



Raimo OH-XRT, between strikes again

---

rparigor(at)suffolk.lib.n
Guest

Posted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 1:23 pm Post subject: Rotax carb heaters

On the subject of carb. ice, has anyone gotten carb. ice on a 914? If yes

were you able to get rid of it by boosting manifold pressure?



Does anyone run water or electric carb heat on a 914?



Ron Parigoris

g-iani(at)ntlworld.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 11:31 pm Post subject: Rotax carb heaters

Ron



In 250 hour flown in the UK never any sign of carb ice and we have flown all

winter.  So, as I have read elsewhere, no need for carb heaters.  Same

experience with G-IRON.



Ian Rickard G-IANI XS Trigear, 914, 250 hours

Europa Club Mods Rep (Trigear)

e-mail mods(at)europaclub.org.uk   

   or direct g-iani(at)ntlworld.com

pjeffers(at)talktalk.net
Guest

Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2008 12:20 am Post subject: Rotax carb heaters

Hi all,



Running a 912 (Classic Europa) for 1250 hrs in the often cold moist air of

the UK with no carb heater has resulted in a reasonably regular indication

of carb icing.

The thing to be aware of is that with the Rotax 900 series engines carb

icing manifests itself rather differently from your Continentals and

Lycomings.

In the case of Rotax it shows itself as the occasional cough or what seems

like misfire  as each carb in turn ingests bits of ice shed from the throat.

When it happens (and nowadays I have become quite good at predicting it)the

solution is to warm the core temp of the engine by making it work hard for

two or three minutes. IE open the throttle to climb power. Depending on the

severity of the icing will determine how long it is before getting a

recurrence. I have found that even in moderate icing conditions a period of

at least 20 mins elapses before a need to re warm the engine.

Now to the Rotax carb heater which uses coolant water to warm the carb

throat.  Inevitably this will only work effectively if the coolant temp is

kept high enough. 

Quite often I have flown Rotax engined A/C where the coolant temp in cruise

drops to 55 or 60 degrees C. In icing conditions, even with a carb heater

installed and low coolant temps I have still encountered carb icing on a

number of occasions.

So to sum up avoidance of carb icing, with or without a heater, it is

essential to keep your coolant (and Oil) temps minimums up around the 90

degree area. 



Pete Jeffers

--

ploucandco

Joined: 16 Sep 2007
Posts: 69

Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2008 11:08 am Post subject: Re: Rotax carb heaters

Hi Ron, Ian,



Concerning the 914, the following documents section 18 is interesting:

http://www.rotax-owner.com/support/UNDERSTANDING%20THE%20914%20ROTAX.pdf

All depends if you have an intercooler or not.



Jacques.

milneab(at)btinternet.com
Guest

Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2008 11:18 pm Post subject: Rotax carb heaters

Willie,



In my XS Trigear G-CBYN I have 450 hours behind a non induction heated 912S 

and 100 hours on one with a coolant heated connector on the manifold side of 

the carb as supplied by Skydrive.



The former has regularily given a burble as ice is swallowed from each carb. 

Before the burble the effect of the ice on performance is unnoticeable. 

The twitches generated on me are not.



With the heater I have never had a suggestion of the burble.



The heating is effective and I am sticking with it on the new aircraft. 

Installation is simple but moves the intake plenum chamber rearwards about 

15mm.



The inspector did not consider it as a mod and just signed up the logbook.

Alasdair Milne





---

willie.harrison(at)tinyon
Guest

Posted: Mon Jun 30, 2008 4:04 am Post subject: Rotax carb heaters

Thanks to all for some very helpful replies. My recent switch to  

MOGAS seems to have turned a very occasional double cough into  

something worse. Two weeks ago in wet warm air I lost power for a  

couple of seconds (but felt longer). Not what you really want.



I'll ask Andy/Francis to clarify/formalise the situation regarding  

Ian's mod application.



Thanks again, folks.



Willie

On 27 Jun 2008, at 17:41, G-IANI wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   



 All the paperwork is done for the Skydrive Carb heaters to be a  

 standard

 mod.  I will send you a copy off list. I first submitted them in  

 2005 (in

 conjunction with Skydrive) and they just sat on Francis's desk.

rick(at)amimotormanagemen
Guest

Posted: Mon Jun 30, 2008 6:45 am Post subject: Rotax carb heaters

Hi Willie



Maybe there are other issues.........  I ran mine for a summer before

fitting the jackets and never even got near to a couple of seconds power

loss only ever a mild cough. Sounds a bit like fuel vaporisation to me.



All the best

Rick

--

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