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Rotax 377 on UltraStar

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jb92563

Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 314
Location: Southern California

Posted: Fri Nov 07, 2008 7:22 am Post subject: Rotax 377 on UltraStar

I have been fumbling with my Cuyuna UL-202 trying to get the CHT temps in range without much sucess.



The engine had seized a rear piston before I got it, but I replaced the piston & rings and honed the cylinder and now that is the cooler cylinder.



I have tried just about everything to get it  resolved without luck.



The front Fan cylinder always goes past 420 at WOT on the ground.



I did however find a good deal on a nearly new Rotax 377 and bought it.



I am thinking it should make a fine replacement and should not have the same cooling issues.



Has anyone tried a Rotax 377 on a Kolb?



I should be able to keep the existing belt re-drive with only a little modification to make it fit the 377.



The rest of the install should be straight forward as even the muffler is a perfect fit on the Rotax header.

_________________
Ray

Kolb UltraStar (Cuyuna UL-202)
Moni MotorGlider
Schreder HP-11 Glider
Grob 109 Motorglider

Do Not Archive

herbgh(at)nctc.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Nov 07, 2008 8:09 am Post subject: Rotax 377 on UltraStar

Ray



  Forgot to mention...have a new set of pistons and rings for the 

377.  green dot... 61.93 mm     Herb

At 09:22 AM 11/7/2008, you wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  



I have been fumbling with my Cuyuna UL-202 trying to get the CHT 

temps in range without much sucess.



The engine had seized a rear piston before I got it, but I replaced 

the piston & rings and honed the cylinder and now that is the cooler cylinder.



The front Fan cylinder always goes past 420 at WOT on the ground.



I did however find a good deal on a nearly new Rotax 377 and bought it.



I am thinking it should make a fine replacement and should not have 

the same cooling issues.



Has anyone tried a Rotax 377 on a Kolb?



I should be able to keep the existing belt re-drive with only a 

little modification to make it fit the 377.



The rest of the install should be straight forward as even the 

muffler is a perfect fit on the Rotax header.



--------

Ray



Kolb UltraStar (Cuyuna UL-202)

Moni MotorGlider

Schreder HP-11 Glider

Grob 109 Motorglider

Do Not Archive





Read this topic online here:



http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 12900#212900

jb92563

Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 314
Location: Southern California

Posted: Fri Nov 07, 2008 1:50 pm Post subject: Re: Rotax 377 on UltraStar

Herb, 



Did you mean that I should have some on hand due to the nature of the 377 or was that an offer to sell them to me for my next overhaul ?



Hard to figure out meaning sometimes on email.

_________________
Ray

Kolb UltraStar (Cuyuna UL-202)
Moni MotorGlider
Schreder HP-11 Glider
Grob 109 Motorglider

Do Not Archive

herbgh(at)nctc.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Nov 07, 2008 2:09 pm Post subject: Rotax 377 on UltraStar

Yeah~!!  Need to carry them in your flight bag..!!       Actually 

I have friends who fly 377's and they seem no more trouble prone than 

the rest..I fly a 447 on my Firefly..



   Just some extra parts that I bought over the years... New...  Wait 

til you see the price of  genuine rotax piston and ring sets!!   Hope 

you never need to of course..!! Herb



At 03:50 PM 11/7/2008, you wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  



Herb,



Did you mean that I should have some on hand due to the nature of 

the 377 or was that an offer to sell them to me for my next overhaul ?



Hard to figure out meaning sometimes on email. [Wink]



--------

Ray



Kolb UltraStar (Cuyuna UL-202)

Moni MotorGlider

Schreder HP-11 Glider

Grob 109 Motorglider

Do Not Archive





Read this topic online here:



http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 12950#212950

jb92563

Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 314
Location: Southern California

Posted: Fri Nov 07, 2008 2:54 pm Post subject: Re: Rotax 377 on UltraStar

I also have an option to buy a $1200 Rotax 447  but though I would try the 377 first.



I feel like the 447 might be overkill on an UltraStar.



Expensive? My little logo picture plane has a Limbach VW aeroconversion and the crank that I just replaced was $3700,  and the prop overhaul is likely going to come in at around $5K so yaa, I know about those expensive aircraft parts.....I guess everyone needs to make a living.

 



I would have thought however that Rotax's volumes would have lowered the price a bit.



What would the 377 piston/rings cost, and what are you selling yours for?

_________________
Ray

Kolb UltraStar (Cuyuna UL-202)
Moni MotorGlider
Schreder HP-11 Glider
Grob 109 Motorglider

Do Not Archive

herbgh(at)nctc.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Nov 07, 2008 3:35 pm Post subject: Rotax 377 on UltraStar

Ray



    You won't be shocked by rotax prices then!!      I would take 

60% of retail for them... according to the CPS catalog...which is the 

same for most dealers or so I am told...



     The Grob has a vw type engine?  wow!! and ouch!!!    Thats a lot 

of tows...



     There was an Ultra Star in Tenn. with a EA71 subaru ...direct 

drive..flew very well..  so the 447 would be a zippy little engine 

for it.. Recall that Dennis Souder had to fly way outside the 

envelope to destroy an Ultra star..and then the only failure was with 

the drag strut which was subsequently braced .. Wonder what the next 

weakest point is?? 



      Flying the Hp  ?  Started with sailplanes at the club in St. 

Louis...always wanted a motorized one...Herb

At 04:54 PM 11/7/2008, you wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  



I also have an option to buy a $1200 Rotax 447  but though I would 

try the 377 first.



I feel like the 447 might be overkill on an UltraStar.



Expensive? My little logo picture plane has a Limbach VW 

aeroconversion and the crank that I just replaced was $3700, so yaa, 

I know about those expensive aircraft parts.....I guess everyone 

needs to make a living.

[Shocked]



I would have thought however that Rotax's volumes would have lowered 

the price a bit.



What would the 377 piston/rings cost, and what are you selling yours for?



--------

Ray



Kolb UltraStar (Cuyuna UL-202)

Moni MotorGlider

Schreder HP-11 Glider

Grob 109 Motorglider

Do Not Archive





Read this topic online here:



http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 12956#212956

jb92563

Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 314
Location: Southern California

Posted: Fri Nov 07, 2008 3:56 pm Post subject: Re: Rotax 377 on UltraStar

Yep, I fly the HP-11 when ever conditions seem promising.



The HP-11 actually has a LOT of room behind the cockpit and I am actually considering putting an engine in it for self launch capability and 

have it retract into the fuselage for pure gliding.



The Rotax 377 would be a good engine for that but I was initially considering a small jet engine, but determined that the cost and duration 

and large amount of fuel required for the jet would detract too much from its gliding capabilities of 37:1



Once I get my Moni completed in 2009 the HP-11 will be going into the garage for its power package install in 2010.



The Grob 109 Motor glider (Logo pic) is my long range ship....600 nm on a tank full and more if I do some gliding along the way. Does 90 kts on cruise at 2.5 gal/hr.



Now I just need to get my Kolb in the air.

_________________
Ray

Kolb UltraStar (Cuyuna UL-202)
Moni MotorGlider
Schreder HP-11 Glider
Grob 109 Motorglider

Do Not Archive

herbgh(at)nctc.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Nov 07, 2008 4:08 pm Post subject: Rotax 377 on UltraStar

Woops

    Thought we were on the Yahoo list for Early Kolbs...



   Any rate...sounds as if you have the toys...you need a twin...Herb



    At 05:56 PM 11/7/2008, you wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  



Yep, I fly the HP-11 when ever conditions seem promising.



The HP-11 actually has a LOT of room behind the cockpit and I am 

actually considering putting an engine in it for self launch capability and

have it retract into the fuselage for pure gliding.



The Rotax 377 would be a good engine for that but I was initially 

considering a small jet engine, but determined that the cost and duration

and large amount of fuel required for the jet would detract too much 

from its gliding capabilities of 37:1



Once I get my Moni completed in 2009 the HP-11 will be going into 

the garage for its power package install in 2010.



The Grob 109 Motor glider (Logo pic) is my long range ship....600 nm 

on a tank full and more if I do some gliding along the way. Does 90 

kts on cruise at 2.5 gal/hr.



Now I just need to get my Kolb in the air.



--------

Ray



Kolb UltraStar (Cuyuna UL-202)

Moni MotorGlider

Schreder HP-11 Glider

Grob 109 Motorglider

Do Not Archive





Read this topic online here:



http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 12963#212963

WhiskeyVictor36(at)aol.co
Guest

Posted: Fri Nov 07, 2008 7:41 pm Post subject: Rotax 377 on UltraStar

In a message dated 11/7/2008 10:23:36 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,  jb92563(at)yahoo.com writes:

  	  Quote: 	
		     Has anyone tried a Rotax 377 on a Kolb?



Ray



Kolb    UltraStar (Cuyuna UL-202)

    

      Hi Ray,

    

   The early (85~) FireStar kits were supplied with the    Rotax 377 engine.  I flew mine for 442 hours.  It ran much nicer    than my current 447 model.  It was smoother running.  Other than the    bore size, about the only other major difference was the compression ratio was    higher (don't recall what it was and no longer have the operators    manual).  I used premium fuel.  Also it had points ignition, but did    not require an unusual amount of maintenance to keep the point gap or timing    within spec.  You'll like it.

    

   Sometimes I regret changing it out for the 447.  But at    the time I thought the crankshaft was due for replacement (preventive    maintenance) and got a slightly used 447 at a good price.  Since    then, I've learned that a lot of fellows have gone 600 and 700 hours on the    same crankshaft.  Live and learn.     

   Bill    Varnes

Original Kolb FireStar

Audubon NJ

Do Not    Archive

	




AOL Search: Your one stop for directions, recipes and all o92382x1200798498/aol?redir=http://searchblog.aol.com/2008/11/04/happy-holidays-from-aol-search/?ncid=emlcntussear00000001 ">Search Now.

  [quote][b]

jb92563

Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 314
Location: Southern California

Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 2:35 pm Post subject: Re: Rotax 377 on UltraStar

Thats good news Bill.



I am sure the 377 will work out fine for me.



If not then perhaps a pair of AMT450 jet engines

_________________
Ray

Kolb UltraStar (Cuyuna UL-202)
Moni MotorGlider
Schreder HP-11 Glider
Grob 109 Motorglider

Do Not Archive

jb92563

Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 314
Location: Southern California

Posted: Wed Nov 26, 2008 8:46 am Post subject: Re: Rotax 377 on UltraStar

The conversion From Cuyuna UL-202 to Rotax 377 on my UltraStar is going well.



I am drilling holes in the engine mount for the Rotax.



Strangely it is nearly a perfect fit to the cross bars with the holes just being slightly off center in the square tubes.



Are those chromoly tubes....they are hard to drill!



I'll snap some pictures and post the whole conversion process in case someone else want to go that way as well.



Interestingly I have been able to use the Cuyuna redrive and exhaust with only minor modifications on the Rotax.



I milled out the redrive a little to clear some engine case features and flared the exhaust coupler a bit to fit the Rotax header.



All thats left to do is mount the engine and the exhaust pipe.

_________________
Ray

Kolb UltraStar (Cuyuna UL-202)
Moni MotorGlider
Schreder HP-11 Glider
Grob 109 Motorglider

Do Not Archive

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