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Cable Tensions for 601XL?
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ideaz1(at)sbcglobal.net
Guest

Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 7:36 am Post subject: Cable Tensions for 601XL?

Hi Juan,

I agree again with you regarding the maintenance issue of cables and I do 

think this is a good reason for using pushrods as they are easy to check. A 

little feel of the aileron on pre flight will tell you if there is something 

loose or worn as you can feel the play. If a cable is loose from stretching 

it may still have tension an you wont feel the difference. Are cable users 

going to do a tension test every time they fly? I know I wouldn't so I 

choose to make that problem not a possibility for me. Simple choice.



I do also believe (am I right?, I hope so.) that the bigger issue is balance 

of the ailerons on this plane. As designed there is NO balancing of these 

control surfaces. This drastically limits the operating speed ( and creates 

most of the heavy feel of the ailerons). This web site has some very good 

info and explanation on the subject  PLEASE CHECK IT OUT! 

http://www.theaerodrome.com/forum/aircraft/32996-balanced-ailerons.html 

Ailerons are balanced in two main ways, with weight and  air pressure. Both 

methods require the hinge point to be somewhere behind the leading edge of 

the control surface. The XL as designed is just forward of the leading edge 

and therefore cannot be balanced as is. The simplest fix (if I may use that 

term) is to extend the lower skin enough to add weights to it (look at a 

Cessna, this is how my 150's ailerons are balanced). The result is that 

control pressure remains the same throughout the speed range of the 

aircraft. Another simple method (using pressure) would be to add spades to 

the ailerons.



At least this should be food for your thoughts. At best you may get a 

better(safer) aircraft.



Cheers,

Dirk

notsew_evets(at)frontiern
Guest

Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 7:48 am Post subject: Cable Tensions for 601XL?

I m thinking of a simple under the aileron mass balance.

There are a lot  of airplanes that have a small hanging "spade" type 

balance and it works.  With the 601 ailerons being so light I m sure it 

wouldn take much lead (Forward) of the hinge line to get that neutral 

condition...

SW

---

Joe Kidd

Joined: 01 Aug 2008
Posts: 15
Location: TN

Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 9:16 am Post subject: Cable Tensions for 601XL?

Have you considered a casting instead of the milled part? You'd only need access to a CNC router to achieve that, then a geared head or knee mill to finish out the part. Would love to help you more but only have a South Bend 9A lathe and don't have a milling machine yet. However, I have done a bit of casting and have found that most regional casting compainies of fabrication shop's are more than up to such a challange.

  

 JWS



 

   From: Sabrina <chicago2paris(at)msn.com>

To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com

Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2008 10:45:12 AM

Subject: Re: Cable Tensions for 601XL?



--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Sabrina" <chicago2paris(at)msn.com (chicago2paris(at)msn.com)>



Attached are renderings of a part.  Given its size, is there anyone on the list with the capability of machining it to very close tolerances from a CATIA part file.  I don't have cash, but I do have access to Engelhard silver to barter with.  I am told that it would take a 5 axis CNC mill.  I am hoping that it could be machined from a 530 x 600 x 180mm billet on a 3 axis mill white side up, flipped         [quote][b]

ihab.awad(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 9:35 am Post subject: Cable Tensions for 601XL?

On Thu, Nov 13, 2008 at 8:45 AM, Sabrina <chicago2paris(at)msn.com> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   Attached are renderings of a part.  Given its size, is there anyone on the list with the capability

 of machining it to very close tolerances from a CATIA part file.


	


What are your tolerances? Given that you don't mind the material,

would it be adequate to make it in a 3D printer out of plastic? Some

hint of what you need it for might give people a clue as to how they

could help -- like, is this a wind tunnel model?



Ihab



-- 

Ihab A.B. Awad, Palo Alto, CA

ihab.awad(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 10:37 am Post subject: Cable Tensions for 601XL?

On Thu, Nov 13, 2008 at 10:05 AM, Sabrina <chicago2paris(at)msn.com> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   If a 3D printer could punch out just 1, much less 120 of the attached Q parts, I would be forever grateful.


	






One thought could be to 3D print a *negative* of the part, then use it

as a mold for 120 fiberglass layups. I guess it depends on your

budget. Also, depending on your needs, 120 slabs of metal in a 3 meter

sphere could be way heavy; if you made them out of fiberglass then

stuck the borders together with epoxy or whatever, you could end up

with a lightweight yet strong part. As in, "Use the monocoque, Luke."



Ihab



-- 

Ihab A.B. Awad, Palo Alto, CA

tjs22t(at)verizon.net
Guest

Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 10:55 am Post subject: Cable Tensions for 601XL?

For some of the old timers on the list might I make a  request: if you're going to leave a topic please change the subject line - the  reason should be obvious.

  

 thank you

  

 jeff    do not archive

  

  

  

 >I was going to use the part to create a mold to make  the "green" portion of the

 	  Quote: 	
		  rendering.   120 of those green  portions assemble into a 3 meter sphere.  The

gray portion was added  to give a flat surface during milling of the top, green

surface.   Tolerances are important but not vital.  If a 3D printer could  punch

out just 1, much less 120 of the attached Q parts, I would be  forever grateful.


	




   [quote][b]

JAPhillipsGA(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 3:20 pm Post subject: Cable Tensions for 601XL?

What strap? What modification?  I have not heard of this. Please inform me. Bill 

**************

Get the Moviefone Toolbar. Showtimes, theaters, movie news &ir=http://toolbar.aol.com/moviefone/download.html?ncid=emlcntusdown00000001)  [quote][b]

JAPhillipsGA(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 3:23 pm Post subject: Cable Tensions for 601XL?

It had to be connected to a covair motor, right?

**************

Get the Moviefone Toolbar.00000075x1212774565x1200812037/aol?redir=http://toolbar.aol.com/moviefone/download.html?ncid=emlcntusdown00000001)  [quote][b]

jaybannist(at)cs.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 3:48 pm Post subject: Cable Tensions for 601XL?

Bill,

 

 I'm assuming that this "strap" was added to versions earlier than mine.  It is included in my drawings dated 08/05; page 6-T-3.  It is Part No. 6T3-8, and is called a "Bent Strip".  It is .040", 6061-T6, 20mm wide, 100mm long, with the ends bent up to a 95 deg angle to the base, the base being 62mm long.  It is riveted to the Elevator Center Channel (6T3-2) with three A5 rivets; to the Upper Elevator Horn (6T3-4) base leg with  an AS5 (stainless steel) rivet and to the base leg of the Lower Elevator Horn (6T3-5) with an AS5 rivet. Let me know if you need more information.

 

 Jay in Dallas

 Do not archive

 

   

 

   

 

 --

hills(at)sunflower.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 4:11 pm Post subject: Cable Tensions for 601XL?

Actually, it was a new prop, it broke off after 2 hours of operation,

A manufactures defect caused it to flutter (for a while) then fatigue and

break



Roger

--

Flydog1966(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 4:55 pm Post subject: Cable Tensions for 601XL?

OK, OK, help me get off the Zenith list and onto the 701 list!

   The problem I'm having is I click on the list I'm interested in,I  get the verification e-mail where I'm supposed to click on the link. Problem is  it is not bold? or blue? like other links I've seen. I click on it anyway, and  nothing happens. Yes,"disable links" is "off"

   Phil

  

  In a message dated 11/13/2008 7:12:49 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,  hills(at)sunflower.com writes:

 [quote]-->    Zenith-List message posted by: "Roger & Lina Hill"    <hills(at)sunflower.com>

Actually, it was a new prop, it broke    off after 2 hours of operation,

A manufactures defect caused it to flutter    (for a while) then fatigue and

break



Roger

-----Original    Message-----

From:    owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com

[mailto:owner-zenith-list-server(at)matronics.com]    On Behalf Of Juan Vega

Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2008 8:13 AM

To:    zenith-list(at)matronics.com; zenith-list(at)matronics.com

Subject: RE:    Re: Cable Tensions for 601XL?



--> Zenith-List message    posted by: Juan Vega <amyvega2005(at)earthlink.net>



next time    balance the prop,  people tend to forget that little    part.



--

jeyoung65(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 5:21 pm Post subject: Cable Tensions for 601XL?

Noo to worry, in the 1950 we were going to put it in aircrafts.

 

 --

JAPhillipsGA(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Nov 14, 2008 1:21 pm Post subject: Cable Tensions for 601XL?

Jay, thanks for the info. I finished my XL over three years  ago and built the tail feathers back in '03 so I don't remember this. I need to  check my plans and look to see if I did this mod. Thanks, Bill of  Georgia

 do not archive



Get the Moviefone Toolbar. Showtimes, theaters, movie news & more!

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