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Use of Vans ES14684 60A Alternator

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jjflyboy(at)gmail.com
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Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2008 12:46 pm Post subject: Use of Vans ES14684 60A Alternator

Sorry if this question has been dealt with before, but I would like to know if use of a Vans ES 14684 60A alternator with internal regulation would be suitable in a system designed around Bob's Z-11 Generic Light Aircraft Electrical System.  As this alternator is internally regulated, is the generic "Ford" regulator still needed or should it be eliminated?  I am also considering purchase of the Overvoltage Module (OVM-14) from B & C but see there is a caution about using OV protection with this alternator on Vans site.  The caution concerns a need to contact the manufacturer of the OV device to ensure any special wiring requirements are met.  Would the Z-11 diagram show the correct wiring for use of this device with this alternator?

 

I also have a Grand Rapids (model 4000) EIS I am planning on using so I plan on eliminating the low voltage monitor module (AEC 9005 - 101) as I believe this function is included in the EIS.  Any comments?



Thanks for your help.

 

Regards,

Jerry

  [quote][b]

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nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect
Guest

Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2008 5:47 am Post subject: Use of Vans ES14684 60A Alternator

At 02:45 PM 12/2/2008, you wrote:

  	  Quote: 	
		  Sorry if this question has been dealt with before, but I would like to know if use of a Vans ES 14684 60A alternator with internal regulation would be suitable in a system designed around Bob's Z-11 Generic Light Aircraft Electrical System.  As this alternator is internally regulated, is the generic "Ford" regulator still needed or should it be eliminated? 	


   It's eliminated.



  	  Quote: 	
		    I am also considering purchase of the Overvoltage Module (OVM-14) from B & C but see there is a caution about using OV protection with this alternator on Vans site.  The caution concerns a need to contact the manufacturer of the OV device to ensure any special wiring requirements are met.  Would the Z-11 diagram show the correct wiring for use of this device with this alternator? 	


    I was recently offered a tour of an alternator/

    starter remanufacturing facility that produces about

    22,000 units a day. They box product for a host of customers

    not the least of which is AC Delco and includes many of

    big-name chain stores.



    I learned that it's exceedingly difficult if not impossible

    for a "small" users of alternators to acquire a factory-fresh

    device . . . The folks who build brand new product want to

    schedule car-loads of units to a minimum number of deliveries.

    This is because transportation and handling is a MAJOR cost of

    the product.



    I'm working on a white-paper that will publish details of

    what I learned but the short answer now is that we don't

    know where Van's alternators come from. We do know that SOME

    parts were vulnerable to their own load dump transients

    in the past.



    I do know that the factory, QA and IR&D facilities I toured

    produces products intended to withstand a series of five, max-rpm,

    max-current, high-temperature load-dumps in a row without damage

    to its internals. I witnessed one such demonstration in their labs.



    14684 is a "Lester Number" . . . an industry cataloging

    system that brings parts of like functionality into a

    specific application. While this part number MIGHT

    get you a device with all original parts from the

    likes of Nipon Denso or Bosch, it's not a guarantee

    and most likely, the part has been disassembled for

    some manner of refurbishment.



    If you want to buy 100 pcs minimum per month, you

    can put your hands on brand-new 14684 machines 

    here:



     http://tinyurl.com/5sguzm 



    Bottom line is that there are dozens of alternators

    from DOZENS OF SOURCES that are adaptable to your

    engine. By adaptable we mean that the alternator

    requires appropriate mounting configuration to

    bolt to your machine. Van offers a kit of tension

    arm and bracket to adapt a "14684" alternator to

    Lycoming engines at:



     http://tinyurl.com/5uz5n6 



    I'll call the reader's attention to the caveat on

    Van's page that reads as follows:



          Caution: Builders planning to utilize overvoltage protection with

         Van's internally regulated 60 amp alternator should consult with

         the manufacturer of the overvoltage device to insure that any

         special wiring requirements are met during installation.



    I've never enjoyed direct conversation with folks

    at Van's in spite of specific attempts 

    to enter into constructive dialog. Their

    initial reaction to reported failures of

    alternators combined with b-lead disconnect

    contactors was not so measured as the statement

    above. As it turns out, not all alternators

    are potential victims to their own load-dump

    transients in spite of the fact that they

    have THE SAME part number.



    The short answer is that installing ANY internally

    regulated alternator with external ov protection

    described in:



     http://tinyurl.com/5n989y 



    . . . is a perfectly rational thing to do. Just

    be wary of turning the alternator OFF under

    load at more than idle RPM until the final

    solution described is available.



    Alternatively, one may certainly run the alternator

    "barefoot" as many folks recommend. This discussion

    isn't about imperatives. It's about risk reduction.



 



  	  Quote: 	
		  I also have a Grand Rapids (model 4000) EIS I am planning on using so I plan on eliminating the low voltage monitor module (AEC 9005 - 101) as I believe this function is included in the EIS.  Any comments? 	


    The low voltage annunciation on your EIS is

    a useful substitution for independent low

    voltage warning.



    Bob . . .    [quote][b]

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