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Airshow Compensation and comm lic req.

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L39parts(at)hotmail.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Mar 15, 2006 7:30 pm Post subject: Airshow Compensation and comm lic req.

Drew,

  

 It is very illustrative that you returned with this  advice from the NWOC.  There is no FAR 91.500 and 91.501 has nothing  whatsoever to due with the issue of compensation for display at  airshows:

  

  Sec. 91.501   Applicability.

    (a) This subpart prescribes operating  rules, in addition to those 

prescribed in other subparts of this part,  governing the operation of 

large airplanes of U.S. registry,  turbojet-powered multiengine civil 

airplanes of U.S. registry, and  fractional ownership program aircraft...

  

 Was it a good party at least?  Were all of the  other technical issues handled with smoke and mirrors too?  You, and the  feeble-minded bureaucrats in DC, need to figure out that there are a few of us  who know how to read.  You go to a high level summit with the ruling class  and return with this crap!  Was this boondoggle at the expense of the  association?

 [quote]   ---

viperdoc(at)mindspring.co
Guest

Posted: Thu Mar 16, 2006 7:27 am Post subject: Airshow Compensation and comm lic req.

Ron,

 I think your shooting the messenger here. The beaurearcrate (sp) that needs to shot is Jeff...whoever he is! Sounds to me like "Jeff" just reached up the backside and pulled one out knowing that the poor RPA pilot would not have a clue at that time! Or he was just the usual beaureacrtatic idiot dazzling one and all with Bull Shit!

 Doc

  

 



  

 [quote] ---

david(at)mcgirt.net
Guest

Posted: Thu Mar 16, 2006 8:27 am Post subject: Airshow Compensation and comm lic req.

Ron,  

   

  Please secure your happiness, Drew went to the meetings on our behalf, asked questions on our behalf of a FAA guy, and returned with the answer that the FAA guy gave him.  If you want to point out that you think we got bad information, and Drew should follow back up for us, that might be a good use of our collective time.  I am sure that is what you meant, not the simple minded bashing that it seemed to be.  

   

With that said, Drew – maybe we could get some clarification from your contacts there?  

   

   

David  

   

         

  

From: owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ron Davis

 Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2006 10:30 PM

 To: yak-list(at)matronics.com

 Subject: Re: Airshow Compensation and comm lic req.  

  

     

Drew,  

    

   

    

It is very illustrative that you returned with this advice from the NWOC.  There is no FAR 91.500 and 91.501 has nothing whatsoever to due with the issue of compensation for display at airshows:  

    

   

    

 Sec. 91.501  Applicability.

     (a) This subpart prescribes operating rules, in addition to those 

 prescribed in other subparts of this part, governing the operation of 

 large airplanes of U.S. registry, turbojet-powered multiengine civil 

 airplanes of U.S. registry, and fractional ownership program aircraft...  

    

   

    

Was it a good party at least?  Were all of the other technical issues handled with smoke and mirrors too?  You, and the feeble-minded bureaucrats in DC, need to figure out that there are a few of us who know how to read.  You go to a high level summit with the ruling class and return with this crap!  Was this boondoggle at the expense of the association?  

  [quote]    

---

rvfltd(at)televar.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Mar 16, 2006 9:06 am Post subject: Airshow Compensation and comm lic req.

Drew  and all those interested in the compensation issue,

 As you  all know, this matter is of great interest to me and mis-information or  incorrect facts only serves to make both the effort and myself appear  amateurish.  

  

 I find  it hard to believe that even with our differences Drew would attempt to feed me  bad info.  But that being said I do believe we all deserve a  clarification.  

  

 Drew  referred to a Jeff Weller of the DC FAA, does anyone out there have his  email address?

  

 Always Yakin,

Doug Sapp  

 [quote]   --

Scooter

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 155

Posted: Thu Mar 16, 2006 9:58 am Post subject: Re: Airshow Compensation and comm lic req.

This is from Drew's post:



" 1. Research the regulation and rule extensively, the best way to argue the merits of your position is to have an equal command of that regulation a s the does the enforcer/interpreter. Jeff mentioned the details could be found in 91.500 or 501 which should be online - warning, I've never met a FSDO who could remember every regulation, but take a look. "



Seems like he included a pretty clear disclaimer in there.  He said to research it and understand it.  You did, you do and it doesn't apply.  Big deal.

L39parts(at)hotmail.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 4:47 am Post subject: Airshow Compensation and comm lic req.

My comments do seem a bit harsh in the bright light of  day.  There are other possible explanations for Drew quoting 91.500 and  91.501.  Several times I've been to high level government problem-solving  summits when one of the strippers knocked over a bottle and got beer on the  napkin I was taking notes on.  A lot of times you don't even notice until  next day and then it's difficult to relate the exact details of the  meeting.   

 [quote]   ---

L39parts(at)hotmail.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 5:03 am Post subject: Airshow Compensation and comm lic req.

Seriously, although the prior post was an exageration  rather than a fabrication, my BS meter started trending upscale when I read the  numbers 91.500 and 91.501. It took less than a minute to look them  up.  Even if Drew isn't familiar enough with the FARs to know  those were bad numbers when he first heard them, it wouldn't have been much  trouble for him to look up the references.  He could have then announced on  the list that the FAA sent clueless buffoons to NWOC and maintained his own  prestige.  Instead, he tried to pursuade us that he was a party to a  serious discussion of our problems and was working to find solutions.  Give  a guy enough rope...

 [quote]   ---

L39parts(at)hotmail.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 5:08 am Post subject: Airshow Compensation and comm lic req.

It's too bad DREW didn't follow that advice.  Better at giving advice than 

taking it...hmmm...it sounds like Drew missed his calling, should be with 

the FAA.



---

cjpilot710(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 5:39 am Post subject: Airshow Compensation and comm lic req.

  "_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _  the FAA sent clueless  buffoons to NWOC "

  

 Clueless buffoons they  may be, BUT they are the clueless buffoons in charge.  Of course you can  right the wrongs perceived by getting a job at the FAA (pays very well, better  job security than any airline, and you do get to fly a lot) and start your  crusade to right the wrongs in the most effective place there.   

  

 It still comes to the  fact that you need a commercial and a current 2nd class physical to receive  fuel, rooms, food, hooker, etc etc etc.

  

 Pappy

  

 [quote]   ---

mjbjhf(at)charter.net
Guest

Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 6:13 am Post subject: Airshow Compensation and comm lic req.

Hookers!!??!!  Nobody told me about the  Hookers!

 Now we are going to get my CJ back in the air this  weekend, then I'm going for my medical and checkride!!  Let me know when  the next show is Pappy!

  

 (laughs)

  

 And thanks for the information Pappy.   Putting it  to use today and FSDO is scheduled for Sunday.  Some of those guys are  pretty good people to work on a Sunday wouldn'y ya say.

  

 Michael "Mighty" Bolton

 "if it doesn't sound round, WHY LOOK?"

 [quote]   ---

viperdoc(at)mindspring.co
Guest

Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 6:56 am Post subject: Airshow Compensation and comm lic req.

OK, I agree one should research the data you publish for public educification. Truthfully, my hard copy of the FARs is a 2000 edition and sits on a remote shelf in my study.  Yeh, I could go to the web to FAA.Gov to find them. But as things go, I don't unless it has a direct impact on me. This issue really does not affect me, others yes. The bottomline as an old Chief told me once as a young pup..."If you don't look out for yourself, Lt., nobody else will." Research and know your regs before picking your fight.

 So Drew, 20 lashes with a wet noodle and next time protect that napkin from the stripper and your beer so those notes are not faded and running. Besides, there are social diseases not even discribed in medical literature yet found in strippers these days!

 Doc

  

 



  

 [quote] ---

brian

Joined: 02 Jan 2006
Posts: 643
Location: Sacramento, California, USA

Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 7:29 am Post subject: Airshow Compensation and comm lic req.

Ron Davis wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   Seriously, although the prior post was an exageration rather than a 

 fabrication, my BS meter started trending upscale when I read the 

 numbers 91.500 and 91.501. It took less than a minute to look them up.  

 Even if Drew isn't familiar enough with the FARs to know those were bad 

 numbers when he first heard them, it wouldn't have been much trouble for 

 him to look up the references.  He could have then announced on the list 

 that the FAA sent clueless buffoons to NWOC and maintained his own 

 prestige.  Instead, he tried to pursuade us that he was a party to a 

 serious discussion of our problems and was working to find solutions.  

 Give a guy enough rope...


	


God knows, Drew and I have our differences. But I don't think that Drew 

does anything with malice of forethought. As I see it, the most likely 

scenarios are:



1. the FAA boneheads transcribed the citation incorrectly and Drew 

accurately wrote down what they said;



2. Drew mis-heard what they said and transcribed it incorrectly.



Give him a chance to get the correct information.



Something to think about: has anyone thought to exclude FAA personnel 

from the "pilots lounge" at a show? I doubt many FAA personnel have 

pilot's licenses. That would make it difficult for them to find out that 

someone with only a PPSEL has committed the most heinous crime of eating 

a vendor-provided hot dog.



And if, heaven forbid, some PPSEL has inadvertently received fuel in his 

airplane because it was sitting on the ramp, it is pretty hard to prove 

if everyone just keeps their fool mouths shut. You think the FAA is 

going to demand an audit of all fuel and how it was paid for? I doubt 

that the FAA is going to go to the trouble to get a subpoena for the 

information. And even if they do it is possible that somehow the records 

can't be located.



And, yes, I am a malcontent who is advocating civil disobedience.



-- 

Brian Lloyd                         361 Catterline Way

brian-yak at lloyd dot com          Folsom, CA 95630

+1.916.367.2131 (voice)             +1.270.912.0788 (fax)



I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . .

- Antoine de Saint-Exupery

_________________
Brian Lloyd
brian-yak at lloyd dot com
+1.916.367.2131 (voice) +1.270.912.0788 (fax)

I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . .
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery

Scooter

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 155

Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 7:54 am Post subject: Re: Airshow Compensation and comm lic req.

Wow, you guys are tough on each other.  Are you a Yak or a CJ guy Ron?  I couldn't find you on the red star roster.

 	  L39parts(at)hotmail.com wrote: 	
		  It's too bad DREW didn't follow that advice.  Better at giving advice than 

taking it...hmmm...it sounds like Drew missed his calling, should be with 

the FAA.



---

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