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panamared505(at)brier.net
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 Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 8:39 am Post subject: Loop problem --- the rest of the story. |
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Just this past week we lost Vicki
| Quote: | Cruse, a highly capable aerobatic pilot and IAC president. If the best
can't survive, where do the 'weekend warrior' aerobatic pilots fit in???
|
No disrespect for anyone on the list, but I do have to comment.
Yes we lost Vicki last week, and last month we lost Chandy Clanton and Art
Shoal was lost in the 80's and Leo Loudenslager was lost in the 80's due to
a motorcycle accident. During this past year numerous civilian, military
and commercial aircraft have also crashed. In the future we will lose more!
Do we quit flying?
Vicki started her acrobatic career as a weekend warrior, as did most
competition pilots. When she crashed she was practicing a highly technical
unlimited aerobatic competition sequence on the deck that RV aircraft
physically can not perform. At the World Aerobatic Champtionship, many
pilots push their planes and themselves to the limit of their flying
abilities, weekend warriors have no motivation to do the same.
Just because she crashed, I fail to see how that has any impact on my, or
anyone else's weekend and weekday aerobatics. What does impact my
aerobatics are: airworthiness of the aircraft, pilot skill, knowledge and
attitude, practice, and practice and more practice.
I only fly my RV for competition style aerobatics. The more I fly the RV
the more I like it for aerobatics. I have had a few hours of aerobatic
instruction but most of the aerobatic maneuvers, I have learned on my own
(self taught): Hammerhead, Sharkstooth, Inverted Flying, 4 Point Roll, Knife
Edge, Cloverleaf, P-Loop, Split S. I have no unreasonable fear of
aerobatics in my RV, on the other hand I have a healthy respect for weather
and I never fly in IMC (that is really scary!). But many RV pilots fly IMC
all the time and are comfortable with that type of flying.
But let us not say after some high profile IFR pilot crashes in IMC that the
rest of us don't stand a chance flying IFR!
Bob
RV6 "Wicked Witch of the West
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RV6ator(at)aol.com
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 8:39 am Post subject: Loop problem --- the rest of the story. |
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Stein,
My apologies to Mike and anyone I have offended. But as an FAA employee He should know better than making reference to looping a non aerobatic certified aircraft. Yes it IS illegal. And yes the RV community is having a bad year regarding accidents. I personally am sick and tired of reading accident reports after accident reports of pilots who were just plain stupid and got killed performing aerobatic manuevers with some innocent passenger along for the ride. We all know what a joy it is to fly an RV, and they just beg you to go upside down. But one thing I have learned from 40 years and 24,000 hors of flying is as soon as you loose respect for the privilege of flight, and think you know it all, you are going to get killed, by your own stupidity. The exception to the rule are the countless Airshow legends that have amazed the crowds for eternity, Jimmy Franklin, Bobby Younkin ,Art Scholl , Max Karrant, and the list goes on. The unique difference there is that is their passion, they wouldn't have had it any other way.
Bill Mahoney
In a message dated 9/1/2009 11:44:01 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, stein(at)steinair.com writes:
| Quote: | Bill, you've been around this list for many years and you know better than to behave like that. There is no call for that at all.
Mike is both a well respected aviator as well as a respected FAA employee.
Cheers,
Stein
do not archive this drivel.
_________________________________________
The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon, this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you receive this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer.
| Quote: | -----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of RV6ator(at)aol.com
Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 6:11 PM
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: RV-List: Loop problem --- the rest of the story.
HEY DICKWEED, A LOOP IS AN AEROBATIC MANUEVER, AEROBATIC MANUEVERS SHOULD BE PERFORMED IN AIRCRAFT THAT IS CERTIFIED FOR AEROBATICS, LAST TIME I CHECKED A CHEROKEE WAS NOT APPROVED FOR AEROBATICS. BUT HEY, KNOCK YOURSELF OUT, BETTER YET GO KILL YOURSELF. PLENTY OF ASSHOLES LIKE YOU HAVE CRASHED AND BURNED WITH INNOCENT PASSENGERS ONBOARD>
In a message dated 8/31/2009 6:48:41 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, mrobert569(at)hotmail.com writes:
====================================
="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
====================================
ms.matronics.com/">http://forums.matronics.com
====================================
tp://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
====================================
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[quote][b]
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mrobert569(at)hotmail.com
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 8:40 am Post subject: Loop problem --- the rest of the story. |
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Thanks for the kind words. Although I have to admit that I have been in error a few times C I just can't remember them right now.
On the flip side C let me explain a bit further for everyone. What the gentleman was initially hanging his hat on is FAR 91.9(a). In that reg it states that you will NOT exceed any limitations in the approved flight manual C markings C and placards. So while the regs themselves do not state that aerobatics are illegal C they give an indirect answer. So check those manuals and placards to see what you can do.
An interesting side note is that 91.303 states that an aerobatic manuver is ANY intential manuver involving an abrupt change in the aircraft's attitude C an abnormal attitude C or abnormal acceleration C not necessary for NORMAL flight. Therefore C a lazy eight C some stalls C a chandelle C a steep turn C etc C are considered to be aerobatic manuvers under this definition.
Again C please for safety sake and for your families C I recommend getting training before doing anything you have not done before C but C legally C I C or any other inspector C may not be able to do anything about it if you do.
Mike Robertson
From: stein(at)steinair.com
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: RV-List: Loop problem --- the rest of the story.
Date: Tue C 1 Sep 2009 10:26:04 -0500
Bill C you've been around this list for many years and you know better than to behave like that. There is no call for that at all.
Mike is both a well respected aviator as well as a respected FAA employee.
Cheers C
Stein
do not archive this drivel.
_________________________________________
The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review C retransmission C dissemination or other use of C or taking of any action in reliance upon C this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you receive this in error C please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer.
[quote] --
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pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 9:14 am Post subject: Loop problem --- the rest of the story. |
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Bob, my comments were not to dissuade anyone from doing aerobatics .....
I'm addicted to them myself. My point was that (and you mentioned)
sometimes the skilled become a statistic. No mention of what caused the
accident. It happened. It was a perspective thingy. What I also
pointed out is that the character of the pilot usually comes into play
when doing the 'stupid pilot tricks'. So, refrain from an activity in
which someone didn't survive??? Absolutely not. But at least give the
proposed activity some careful thought and soul searching.
Y'all be safe out there.
Linn ..... last comment on this thread
do not archive
Panama Red wrote:
| Quote: |
Just this past week we lost Vicki
> Cruse, a highly capable aerobatic pilot and IAC president. If the best
> can't survive, where do the 'weekend warrior' aerobatic pilots fit in???
No disrespect for anyone on the list, but I do have to comment.
Yes we lost Vicki last week, and last month we lost Chandy Clanton and
Art Shoal was lost in the 80's and Leo Loudenslager was lost in the 80's
due to a motorcycle accident. During this past year numerous civilian,
military and commercial aircraft have also crashed. In the future we
will lose more! Do we quit flying?
Vicki started her acrobatic career as a weekend warrior, as did most
competition pilots. When she crashed she was practicing a highly
technical unlimited aerobatic competition sequence on the deck that RV
aircraft physically can not perform. At the World Aerobatic
Champtionship, many pilots push their planes and themselves to the limit
of their flying abilities, weekend warriors have no motivation to do the
same.
Just because she crashed, I fail to see how that has any impact on my,
or anyone else's weekend and weekday aerobatics. What does impact my
aerobatics are: airworthiness of the aircraft, pilot skill, knowledge
and attitude, practice, and practice and more practice.
I only fly my RV for competition style aerobatics. The more I fly the
RV the more I like it for aerobatics. I have had a few hours of
aerobatic instruction but most of the aerobatic maneuvers, I have
learned on my own (self taught): Hammerhead, Sharkstooth, Inverted
Flying, 4 Point Roll, Knife Edge, Cloverleaf, P-Loop, Split S. I have
no unreasonable fear of aerobatics in my RV, on the other hand I have a
healthy respect for weather and I never fly in IMC (that is really
scary!). But many RV pilots fly IMC all the time and are comfortable
with that type of flying.
But let us not say after some high profile IFR pilot crashes in IMC that
the rest of us don't stand a chance flying IFR!
Bob
RV6 "Wicked Witch of the West
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n343fd(at)yahoo.com
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 3:37 pm Post subject: Loop problem --- the rest of the story. |
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Now that is the way to make a point and have everyone read and think about it. Thanks
Mike Divan
N64GH - RV6 (flying)
http://n64gh.blogspot.com/
FREEDOM IS NOT FREE - THANK THE AMERICAN SOLDIER FOR YOURS!
Remember it is the Solder, Sailor, Airman, Marine and Cost Guard that guarantee your freedom NOT the "community organizer"!
From: "RV6ator(at)aol.com" <RV6ator(at)aol.com>
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 1, 2009 9:26:34 AM
Subject: Re: Loop problem --- the rest of the story.
Stein,
My apologies to Mike and anyone I have offended. But as an FAA employee He should know better than making reference to looping a non aerobatic certified aircraft. Yes it IS illegal. And yes the RV community is having a bad year regarding accidents. I personally am sick and tired of reading accident reports after accident reports of pilots who were just plain stupid and got killed performing aerobatic manuevers with some innocent passenger along for the ride. We all know what a joy it is to fly an RV, and they just beg you to go upside down. But one thing I have learned from 40 years and 24,000 hors of flying is as soon as you loose respect for the privilege of flight, and think you know it all, you are going to get killed, by your own stupidity. The exception to the rule are the countless Airshow legends that have amazed the crowds for eternity, Jimmy Franklin, Bobby Younkin ,Art Scholl , Max Karrant, and the list goes on. The unique difference there is that is their passion, they wouldn't have had it any other way.
Bill Mahoney
In a message dated 9/1/2009 11:44:01 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, stein(at)steinair.com writes:
| Quote: | Bill, you've been around this list for many years and you know better than to behave like that. There is no call for that at all.
Mike is both a well respected aviator as well as a respected FAA employee.
Cheers,
Stein
do not archive this drivel.
_________________________________________
The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon, this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you receive this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer.
|
[quote]
[b]
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Vanremog(at)aol.com
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 6:39 pm Post subject: Loop problem --- the rest of the story. |
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I agree for the most part but IMO those Cost (sic) Guard guys haven't been protecting the cost of my stocks very well lately.
-N1GV
In a message dated 9/1/2009 4:38:10 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, n343fd(at)yahoo.com writes:
| Quote: | FREEDOM IS NOT FREE - THANK THE AMERICAN SOLDIER FOR YOURS!
Remember it is the Solder, Sailor, Airman, Marine and Cost Guard that guarantee your freedom NOT the "community organizer"! |
[quote][b]
| | - The Matronics RV-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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bell
Joined: 26 Aug 2009
Posts: 17
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| Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2009 5:52 am Post subject: Loop problem --- the rest of the story. |
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My first post but maybe somewhat relevant…we are building an 8A and have finished most of the subassemblys and are waiting on the lycon engine and the dynon nextgen…when someone comes by the hanger and wants to know what we are building we point to a photo of the really good looking 8A that we were told was at the bottom of the pacific ocean…we are duplicating the paint scheme except for painting the rudder solid red…we are using concept in gm white and gm victory red..the black accents will be vinyl…we will finish it with a three blade cato painted to match the fuse…we have been to osh the last two years and of all the paint schemes , we liked this the best…
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Boyd
Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 10:08 AM
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Loop problem --- the rest of the story.
Mike, we appreciate having you here on the list! Even if your first RV is somewhere on the bottom of the ocean near Hawaii  Don't be put off by the ill-manners of some. You are a welcome member of the community, and your restraint is admirable.
-Bill
RV-6A that's never been looped.
On Tue, Sep 1, 2009 at 10:43 AM, Mike Robertson <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com (mrobert569(at)hotmail.com)> wrote:
Excuse me but when did I ever call anyone a name. And you will also note I did not say whether I or anyone else should do it, just whether it was legal. I do not endorse or recommend anyone doing any aerobatics without training, even in an RV6ator, but if I tried to take them to task I would have a very rough time.
Mike Robertson
Federal Asshole please
| Quote: | | ========================= |
012345678901
[quote][b]
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pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2009 6:20 am Post subject: Loop problem --- the rest of the story. |
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Hmmm. I thought the Red-Tailed Devils had Merlins or Allisons in them!!!
Linn
Do not archive.
Glenn Bell wrote:
| Quote: | My first post but maybe somewhat relevant
we are building an 8A and have
finished most of the subassemblys and are waiting on the lycon engine
and the dynon nextgen
when someone comes by the hanger and wants to know
what we are building we point to a photo of the really good looking 8A
that we were told was at the bottom of the pacific ocean
we are
duplicating the paint scheme except for painting the rudder solid red
we
are using concept in gm white and gm victory red..the black accents will
be vinyl
we will finish it with a three blade cato painted to match the
fuse
we have been to osh the last two years and of all the paint schemes
, we liked this the best
*From:* owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Bill Boyd
*Sent:* Tuesday, September 01, 2009 10:08 AM
*To:* rv-list(at)matronics.com
*Subject:* Re: Loop problem --- the rest of the story.
Mike, we appreciate having you here on the list! Even if your first RV
is somewhere on the bottom of the ocean near Hawaii Don't be put
off by the ill-manners of some. You are a welcome member of the
community, and your restraint is admirable.
-Bill
RV-6A that's never been looped.
On Tue, Sep 1, 2009 at 10:43 AM, Mike Robertson <mrobert569(at)hotmail.com
<mailto:mrobert569(at)hotmail.com>> wrote:
Excuse me but when did I ever call anyone a name. And you will also
note I did not say whether I or anyone else should do it, just whether
it was legal. I do not endorse or recommend anyone doing any aerobatics
without training, even in an RV6ator, but if I tried to take them to
task I would have a very rough time.
Mike Robertson
Federal Asshole please
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*http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List*
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*http://forums.matronics.com*
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*http://www.matronics.com/contribution*
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bell
Joined: 26 Aug 2009
Posts: 17
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| Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2009 6:45 am Post subject: Loop problem --- the rest of the story. |
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Just the slow ones
Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
--
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khorton01(at)rogers.com
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2009 1:14 pm Post subject: Loop problem --- the rest of the story. |
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We have a wide selection of approved flight manuals (AFMs) in the
reference library at work. I looked at AFMs for PA-28-140s from 1964
(the first year of production), 1971, 1973 and 1976. The all had the
same limitations and placards relevant to this question. The AFM
limitations section requires the many placards to be located in the
cockpit, in full view of the pilot. Among those placards we find:
"No acrobatic maneuvers (including spins) are approved for normal
category operations." and
"Utility category only
Acrobatic maneuvers are limited to the following:
Spins
Steep turns
Lazy eights
Chandelles"
Note: This is not a completely verbatim transcription of the placards,
as the AFM shows them as being in all-caps, the AFM lists entry speeds
for each of the approved aerobatic maneuvers, and spins are prohibited
for aircraft fitted with air conditioning or ventilation blowers.
I conclude that loops are prohibited in the Cherokee 140, using the
FAR references provided by Mike Robertson.
Kevin Horton
On 1-Sep-09, at 12:19 , Mike Robertson wrote:
[quote] Thanks for the kind words. Although I have to admit that I have
been in error a few times, I just can't remember them right now.
On the flip side, let me explain a bit further for everyone. What
the gentleman was initially hanging his hat on is FAR 91.9(a). In
that reg it states that you will NOT exceed any limitations in the
approved flight manual, markings, and placards. So while the regs
themselves do not state that aerobatics are illegal, they give an
indirect answer. So check those manuals and placards to see what
you can do.
An interesting side note is that 91.303 states that an aerobatic
manuver is ANY intential manuver involving an abrupt change in the
aircraft's attitude, an abnormal attitude, or abnormal acceleration,
not necessary for NORMAL flight. Therefore, a lazy eight, some
stalls, a chandelle, a steep turn, etc, are considered to be
aerobatic manuvers under this definition.
Again, please for safety sake and for your families, I recommend
getting training before doing anything you have not done before,
but, legally, I, or any other inspector, may not be able to do
anything about it if you do.
Mike Robertson
From: stein(at)steinair.com
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: Loop problem --- the rest of the story.
Date: Tue, 1 Sep 2009 10:26:04 -0500
Bill, you've been around this list for many years and you know
better than to behave like that. There is no call for that at all.
Mike is both a well respected aviator as well as a respected FAA
employee.
Cheers,
Stein
do not archive this drivel.
_________________________________________
The information transmitted is intended only for the person or
entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or
privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or
other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon, this
information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient
is prohibited. If you receive this in error, please contact the
sender and delete the material from any computer.
--
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n343fd(at)yahoo.com
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Sep 04, 2009 6:22 pm Post subject: Loop problem --- the rest of the story. |
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Mike Divan
N64GH - RV6 (flying)
http://n64gh.blogspot.com/
FREEDOM IS NOT FREE - THANK THE AMERICAN SOLDIER FOR YOURS!
Remember it is the Solder, Sailor, Airman, Marine and Cost Guard that guarantee your freedom NOT the "community organizer"!
From: "Vanremog(at)aol.com" <Vanremog(at)aol.com>
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 1, 2009 7:38:19 PM
Subject: Re: Loop problem --- the rest of the story.
I agree for the most part but IMO those Cost (sic) Guard guys haven't been protecting the cost of my stocks very well lately.
-N1GV
In a message dated 9/1/2009 4:38:10 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, n343fd(at)yahoo.com writes:
| Quote: | FREEDOM IS NOT FREE - THANK THE AMERICAN SOLDIER FOR YOURS!
Remember it is the Solder, Sailor, Airman, Marine and Cost Guard that guarantee your freedom NOT the "community organizer"! |
[quote]
[b]
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Vanremog(at)AOL.COM
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Sep 04, 2009 9:13 pm Post subject: Loop problem --- the rest of the story. |
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I like that Solder is helping out too! People, especially you wacky right wingers, learn to spell.
-GV
In a message dated 9/4/2009 7:23:34 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, n343fd(at)yahoo.com writes:
| Quote: |
Mike Divan
N64GH - RV6 (flying)
http://n64gh.blogspot.com/
FREEDOM IS NOT FREE - THANK THE AMERICAN SOLDIER FOR YOURS!
Remember it is the Solder, Sailor, Airman, Marine and Cost Guard that guarantee your freedom NOT the "community organizer"!
From: "Vanremog(at)aol.com" <Vanremog(at)aol.com>
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 1, 2009 7:38:19 PM
Subject: Re: Loop problem --- the rest of the story.
I agree for the most part but IMO those Cost (sic) Guard guys haven't been protecting the cost of my stocks very well lately.
-N1GV
In a message dated 9/1/2009 4:38:10 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, n343fd(at)yahoo.com writes:
| Quote: | FREEDOM IS NOT FREE - THANK THE AMERICAN SOLDIER FOR YOURS!
Remember it is the Solder, Sailor, Airman, Marine and Cost Guard that guarantee your freedom NOT the "community organizer"! |
|
[quote][b]
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bo124rs(at)hotmail.com
Guest
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n343fd(at)yahoo.com
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Sep 05, 2009 4:54 am Post subject: Loop problem --- the rest of the story. |
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Blame the left wing school system I went to that thinks close is good enough and did not give out grades because it might make someone feel bad 
I think I spelled it correctly this time
Mike Divan
N64GH - RV6 (flying)
http://n64gh.blogspot.com/
FREEDOM IS NOT FREE - THANK THE AMERICAN FIGHTING MAN FOR YOURS!
Remember it is the Soldier, Sailor, Airman, Marine and Cost Guard that guarantee your freedom NOT the "community organizer"!
From: "Vanremog(at)aol.com" <Vanremog(at)aol.com>
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 10:00:02 PM
Subject: Re: Loop problem --- the rest of the story.
I like that Solder is helping out too! People, especially you wacky right wingers, learn to spell.
-GV
In a message dated 9/4/2009 7:23:34 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, n343fd(at)yahoo.com writes:
| Quote: |
Mike Divan
N64GH - RV6 (flying)
http://n64gh.blogspot.com/
FREEDOM IS NOT FREE - THANK THE AMERICAN SOLDIER FOR YOURS!
Remember it is the Solder, Sailor, Airman, Marine and Cost Guard that guarantee your freedom NOT the "community organizer"!
From: "Vanremog(at)aol.com" <Vanremog(at)aol.com>
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 1, 2009 7:38:19 PM
Subject: Re: Loop problem --- the rest of the story.
I agree for the most part but IMO those Cost (sic) Guard guys haven't been protecting the cost of my stocks very well lately.
-N1GV
In a message dated 9/1/2009 4:38:10 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, n343fd(at)yahoo.com writes:
| Quote: | FREEDOM IS NOT FREE - THANK THE AMERICAN SOLDIER FOR YOURS!
Remember it is the Solder, Sailor, Airman, Marine and Cost Guard that guarantee your freedom NOT the "community organizer"! |
|
[quote]
[b]
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Bret Smith
Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 178
Location: Mineral Bluff, GA
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| Posted: Sat Sep 05, 2009 5:36 am Post subject: Loop problem --- the rest of the story. |
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Now you need to get rid of, or fix the Republican on the end... the Cost Guard.
Bret Smith
RV-9A N16BL
Blue Ridge, Ga
www.FlightInnovations.com
From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mike Divan
Sent: Saturday, September 05, 2009 8:50 AM
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Loop problem --- the rest of the story.
Blame the left wing school system I went to that thinks close is good enough and did not give out grades because it might make someone feel bad
I think I spelled it correctly this time
Mike Divan
N64GH - RV6 (flying)
http://n64gh.blogspot.com/
FREEDOM IS NOT FREE - THANK THE AMERICAN FIGHTING MAN FOR YOURS!
Remember it is the Soldier, Sailor, Airman, Marine and Cost Guard that guarantee your freedom NOT the "community organizer"!
From: "Vanremog(at)aol.com" <Vanremog(at)aol.com>
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 10:00:02 PM
Subject: Re: Loop problem --- the rest of the story.
I like that Solder is helping out too! People, especially you wacky right wingers, learn to spell.
-GV
In a message dated 9/4/2009 7:23:34 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, n343fd(at)yahoo.com writes:
| Quote: |
Mike Divan
N64GH - RV6 (flying)
http://n64gh.blogspot.com/
FREEDOM IS NOT FREE - THANK THE AMERICAN SOLDIER FOR YOURS!
Remember it is the Solder, Sailor, Airman, Marine and Cost Guard that guarantee your freedom NOT the "community organizer"!
From: "Vanremog(at)aol.com" <Vanremog(at)aol.com>
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 1, 2009 7:38:19 PM
Subject: Re: Loop problem --- the rest of the story.
I agree for the most part but IMO those Cost (sic) Guard guys haven't been protecting the cost of my stocks very well lately.
-N1GV
In a message dated 9/1/2009 4:38:10 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, n343fd(at)yahoo.com writes:
| Quote: | FREEDOM IS NOT FREE - THANK THE AMERICAN SOLDIER FOR YOURS!
Remember it is the Solder, Sailor, Airman, Marine and Cost Guard that guarantee your freedom NOT the "community organizer"! |
|
[quote]
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
[b]
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Bret Smith
RV-9A (Emp) |
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ceengland(at)bellsouth.ne
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Sep 05, 2009 6:55 am Post subject: Loop problem --- the rest of the story. |
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Heh, heh, heh....
You know, I almost feel sorry for you, Mike. Almost. I think you're
trying to say that you think your spell checker spelled it correctly
this time. (It did, but the words were wrong.)
Isn't it interesting that both the 'left wing pinko liberals' and the
right wingnut 'conservatives' (and the rest of us, really) want to blame
someone else for their problems, when ultimately we are each responsible
for our own fate.
You say that your problem is rooted in a 'left wing' school that didn't
give grades. Really. The kids of people I know, and some of their
parents, went to 'right wing' (read that 'private') schools that were
created to keep 'em out of those 'left wing' schools (that admittedly,
really were pretty bad). One of those schools is still in operation
about 4 miles from my house. They have about 10 acres of immaculately
groomed athletic fields, and their students have to share textbooks.
There are people who graduated from that school who *can* spell (& have
'MD' after their names), & people who graduated from that school who
can't even speak in complete sentences, much less spell the words.
Here's what's really sad, and a little dangerous, about the quote in
that signature. I suspect that you weren't the original author, since
it's been forwarded with those same spelling errors all over the
internet hundreds of thousands of times. It was written by someone who,
at the very best, didn't bother to check his work for typos. It was
read, and passed on as fact, by, at minimum, hundreds of thousands of
others who didn't bother read & critically analyze what they read before
passing it on as fact. If you look back in history, nothing good has
ever come from large groups of people accepting without question the
words of the individuals they look to as their leaders.
I probably made twenty spelling errors & typos while typing this
(hopefully all corrected), but I do try to critically analyze everything
I read & hear, without regard to its wing of origin.
Charlie
Mike Divan wrote:
| Quote: | Blame the left wing school system I went to that thinks close is good
enough and did not give out grades because it might make someone feel
bad
I think I spelled it correctly this time
Mike Divan
N64GH - RV6 (flying)
http://n64gh.blogspot.com/
FREEDOM IS NOT FREE - THANK THE AMERICAN FIGHTING MAN FOR YOURS!
Remember it is the Soldier, Sailor, Airman, Marine and Cost Guard that
guarantee your freedom NOT the "community organizer"!
------------------------------------------------------------------------
*From:* "Vanremog(at)aol.com" <Vanremog(at)aol.com>
*To:* rv-list(at)matronics.com
*Sent:* Friday, September 4, 2009 10:00:02 PM
*Subject:* Re: Loop problem --- the rest of the story.
I like that Solder is helping out too! People, especially you wacky
right wingers, learn to spell.
-GV
In a message dated 9/4/2009 7:23:34 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
n343fd(at)yahoo.com writes:
Mike Divan
N64GH - RV6 (flying)
http://n64gh.blogspot.com/
FREEDOM IS NOT FREE - THANK THE AMERICAN SOLDIER FOR YOURS!
Remember it is the Solder, Sailor, Airman, Marine and Cost Guard
that guarantee your freedom NOT the "community organizer"!
------------------------------------------------------------------------
*From:* "Vanremog(at)aol.com" <Vanremog(at)aol.com>
*To:* rv-list(at)matronics.com
*Sent:* Tuesday, September 1, 2009 7:38:19 PM
*Subject:* Re: Loop problem --- the rest of the story.
I agree for the most part but IMO those Cost (sic) Guard guys
haven't been protecting the cost of my stocks very well lately.
-N1GV
In a message dated 9/1/2009 4:38:10 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
n343fd(at)yahoo.com writes:
FREEDOM IS NOT FREE - THANK THE AMERICAN SOLDIER FOR YOURS!
Remember it is the Solder, Sailor, Airman, Marine and Cost
Guard that guarantee your freedom NOT the "community organizer"!
|
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n343fd(at)yahoo.com
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Sep 05, 2009 7:18 am Post subject: Loop problem --- the rest of the story. |
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Well at least I know I got my tail number spelled correctly and RV6 which for me is great. Any way time to go fly that RV and have some fun - keeping it RV related. It is all good and I enjoy the list and topics. Just not the occasional ... well I suppose we all put our foot in our mouth from time to time. Me probably more than most.
Y'all enjoy the day and get in the air if ya can
Mike Divan
N64GH - RV6 (flying)
http://n64gh.blogspot.com/
FREEDOM IS NOT FREE - THANK THE AMERICAN SOLDIER FOR YOURS!
Remember it is the Soldier, Sailor, Airman, Marine and Coast Guard that guarantee your freedom NOT the "community organizer"!
From: "Vanremog(at)aol.com" <Vanremog(at)aol.com>
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Friday, September 4, 2009 10:00:02 PM
Subject: Re: Loop problem --- the rest of the story.
I like that Solder is helping out too! People, especially you wacky right wingers, learn to spell.
-GV
In a message dated 9/4/2009 7:23:34 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, n343fd(at)yahoo.com writes:
| Quote: |
Mike Divan
N64GH - RV6 (flying)
http://n64gh.blogspot.com/
FREEDOM IS NOT FREE - THANK THE AMERICAN SOLDIER FOR YOURS!
Remember it is the Solder, Sailor, Airman, Marine and Cost Guard that guarantee your freedom NOT the "community organizer"!
From: "Vanremog(at)aol.com" <Vanremog(at)aol.com>
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 1, 2009 7:38:19 PM
Subject: Re: Loop problem --- the rest of the story.
I agree for the most part but IMO those Cost (sic) Guard guys haven't been protecting the cost of my stocks very well lately.
-N1GV
In a message dated 9/1/2009 4:38:10 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, n343fd(at)yahoo.com writes:
| Quote: | FREEDOM IS NOT FREE - THANK THE AMERICAN SOLDIER FOR YOURS!
Remember it is the Solder, Sailor, Airman, Marine and Cost Guard that guarantee your freedom NOT the "community organizer"! |
|
[quote]
[b]
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jsflyrv(at)verizon.net
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Sep 05, 2009 7:27 am Post subject: Loop problem --- the rest of the story. |
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I sure hope his message gets to all the schools in all _*57*_ states.
Nothing funny to laugh at when you have someone trying to destroy
freedom of choice in this country.
You have an extreme left winger on this list calling others extreme
"right winger wackos."
Step back a moment and take a look at the extreme wackos this president
has surrounded himself with
and appointed to his cabinet. Nuff said
FREEDOM IS NOT FREE - THANK THE AMERICAN SOLDIER FOR YOURS!
Remember it is the "_Soldier"_, Sailor, Airman, Marine and_ __"Coast_"
Guard that guarantee your freedom NOT the "community organizer"!
"FIXED"
Dana Overall wrote:
| Quote: | I like that Solder is helping out too! People, especially you wacky
right wingers, learn to spell.
-GV
I was thinking the same thing.......must be something prevalent within
the wingnut birther, death panel, he's going to brainwash my child
Tuesday, "movemont". Hum, come to think of it, there might actually
be some good come out of the "right winger" parents going to school
Tuesday with their children............I'm just sayin:-)
Come on folks, laugh a little
Dana Overall
Richmond, KY i39
do not archive
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Vanremog(at)aol.com
Date: Sat, 5 Sep 2009 01:00:02 -0400
Subject: Re: Loop problem --- the rest of the story.
To: rv-list(at)matronics.com
I like that Solder is helping out too! People, especially you wacky
right wingers, learn to spell.
-GV
In a message dated 9/4/2009 7:23:34 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
n343fd(at)yahoo.com writes:
Mike Divan
N64GH - RV6 (flying)
http://n64gh.blogspot.com/
FREEDOM IS NOT FREE - THANK THE AMERICAN SOLDIER FOR YOURS!
Remember it is the Solder, Sailor, Airman, Marine and Cost Guard
that guarantee your freedom NOT the "community organizer"!
------------------------------------------------------------------------
*From:* "Vanremog(at)aol.com" <Vanremog(at)aol.com>
*To:* rv-list(at)matronics.com
*Sent:* Tuesday, September 1, 2009 7:38:19 PM
*Subject:* Re: Loop problem --- the rest of the story.
I agree for the most part but IMO those Cost (sic) Guard guys
haven't been protecting the cost of my stocks very well lately.
-N1GV
In a message dated 9/1/2009 4:38:10 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
n343fd(at)yahoo.com writes:
FREEDOM IS NOT FREE - THANK THE AMERICAN SOLDIER FOR YOURS!
Remember it is the Solder, Sailor, Airman, Marine and Cost
Guard that guarantee your freedom NOT the "community organizer"!
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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jsflyrv(at)verizon.net
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Sep 05, 2009 1:50 pm Post subject: Loop problem --- the rest of the story. |
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Was going to post the email that Ralph thought fit to send to me in
private email but thought better of it so as not to offend
any woman or kids that might read this list.
A lot of my old list friends are gone because of people like Ralph and
RV6ator and their narrow minded opinions and filty worded text messages
and no
tolerance for people that think different than they do. Just to bad that
people like Ralph are such cowards that they well not say in public
what they feel must be said in private.
Have not been on this list as long as some but have been here longer
than most. Its not fun anymore and as the group
of RV builders get larger seem the mentality of builders.....well never
mind.
See ya all later.
Bye
Jerry Springer
first flight RV-6 July 14, 1989
Second customer built RV-6 to take to the skies
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Terry Watson
Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 290
Location: Seattle, WA USA
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| Posted: Sat Sep 05, 2009 4:11 pm Post subject: Loop problem --- the rest of the story. |
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Yes, Jerry, it makes you and I smokin' each other seem kind of innocent and
uplifting now, doesn't it? Some of those 4,000 hours (or was it 40,000?)
that the guy spent flying would have been better spent in an etiquette class
with heavy emphasis on grammar appropriate to the setting. What bugged me
most about that little episode of low-life diatribe was that it was directed
at someone who has been particularly willing to help out anyone who asked
for help AND that it totally missed the carefully defined point that was
being made. No wonder thoughtful people think twice before posting now. Can
you imagine a gentleman like the late Eustace Bowhay participating in the
same conversation?
I don't suppose it really matters now, but I am quite sure I read in his
autobiography that Bob Hoover taught himself aerobatics. That doesn't mean
that I could or should or would, but it does mean that some far better
pilots that the Ultimate Authority with the Limited Vocabulary (UALV) have
decided for themselves contrary to UALV'S edict.
Terry
--
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