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HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra

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robcannon

Joined: 22 Jun 2008
Posts: 39
Location: British Columbia

Posted: Wed Sep 23, 2009 5:50 am Post subject: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra

I have an HKS on a Mark I.  It does fine on this but the gross weight  is exceeded with an average weight passenger. I understand the fellow who clipped the trees has an Mark III with an HKS and would love to hear a flying report.

Rob Cannon

Saltspring Island BC

250-537-8733

slyck(at)frontiernet.net
Guest

Posted: Wed Sep 23, 2009 6:22 am Post subject: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra

In the same crowd with a low powered MkIII, I don't see how a normal  

landing would make

any difference.  -that is excluding unstable ar ledge landings at  

high altitudes.



The guy honestly admitted to temporary poor judgement.  I give him  

sympathy and a salute.

BB



On 23, Sep 2009, at 9:50 AM, robcannon wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   



 I have an HKS on a Mark I.  It does fine on this but the gross  

 weight  is exceeded with an average weight passenger. I understand  

 the fellow who clipped the trees has an Mark III with an HKS and  

 would love to hear a flying report.

 Rob Cannon

 Saltspring Island BC

 250-537-8733





 Read this topic online here:



 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 64509#264509

pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Sep 24, 2009 6:23 am Post subject: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra

I have an HKS on a Mark I.  It does fine on this but the gross weight  is 

exceeded with an average weight passenger. I understand the fellow who 

clipped the trees has an Mark III with an HKS and would love to hear a 

flying report.>>



Hi, Clipping the trees is nothing to do with power available. It is about 

getting the approach wrong.



Cheers



Pat

russkinne(at)mac.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Sep 24, 2009 1:34 pm Post subject: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra

Pat

You're absolutely right about  'getting the approach wrong'  causes a  

lot of accidents.

BUT if you have sufficient power, you can stop a descent and even  

make a go-round.

So IMHO power available does have something to do with clipping the  

trees.

If enough power's available, hopefully at least, no tree-clipping.

Russ

do not archive



On Sep 24, 2009, at 10:23 AM, pj.ladd wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   



 I have an HKS on a Mark I.  It does fine on this but the gross  

 weight  is exceeded with an average weight passenger. I understand  

 the fellow who clipped the trees has an Mark III with an HKS and  

 would love to hear a flying report.>>



 Hi, Clipping the trees is nothing to do with power available. It is  

 about getting the approach wrong.



 Cheers



 Pat

rickofudall

Joined: 19 Sep 2009
Posts: 1392
Location: Udall, KS, USA

Posted: Thu Sep 24, 2009 1:43 pm Post subject: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra

Russ, Depends on which side of the power curve you're on. Get on the back side and you can't climb out with out lowering the nose first. If the trees are too close for that, you're going in no matter how much power you have. 



Rick Girard

do not archive



On Thu, Sep 24, 2009 at 4:31 PM, russ kinne <russkinne(at)mac.com (russkinne(at)mac.com)> wrote:

 [quote]--> Kolb-List message posted by: russ kinne <russkinne(at)mac.com (russkinne(at)mac.com)>

  

 Pat

 You're absolutely right about  'getting the approach wrong'  causes a lot of accidents.

 BUT if you have sufficient power, you can stop a descent and even make a go-round.

 So IMHO power available does have something to do with clipping the trees.

 If enough power's available, hopefully at least, no tree-clipping.

 Russ

 do not archive

 

 On Sep 24, 2009, at 10:23 AM, pj.ladd wrote:

 

  	  Quote: 	
		   --> Kolb-List message posted by: "pj.ladd" <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com (pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com)>

 

 I have an HKS on a Mark I.  It does fine on this but the gross weight  is exceeded with an average weight passenger. I understand the fellow who clipped the trees has an Mark III with an HKS and would love to hear a flying report.>>

  

 Hi, Clipping the trees is nothing to do with power available. It is about getting the approach wrong.

 

 Cheers

 

 Pat

 

 

 

 

 

 	
 

 

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robcannon

Joined: 22 Jun 2008
Posts: 39
Location: British Columbia

Posted: Thu Sep 24, 2009 7:28 pm Post subject: Re: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra

I was actually just looking to hear how the hks does on the Mark III extra.  Will it climb with two aboard ? etc.  I must have poorly worded my original post.

Rob Cannon

lcottrell

Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 1494
Location: Jordan Valley, Or

Posted: Thu Sep 24, 2009 8:40 pm Post subject: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra

Just a guess on my part, since I have owned a Mark III  with a 582. The weight of my Firestar is pretty close to what most of the  lighter Mark III weigh. The wings on the 3 are larger so it would fly, but I  wouldn't want to own one.

 Larry

 [quote]   ---

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JetPilot

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1246

Posted: Fri Sep 25, 2009 6:05 pm Post subject: Re: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra

I have a MK III Xtra with a 100 HP Rotax 912-S, and its perfect.  I would not want much less power than I have though.  The 80 HP Rotax 912 is pretty cheap used, and would be a much better engine for the MK III Xtra than the HKS for this plane.  I think the MK III  would be ok, but not great with the Rotax 80 HP.



I think the MK III Xtra would be HORRIBLE with the HKS.  I think climb would be so poor with the HKS that it would be dangerous.   This is just a guess as I have never flown an extra with that little power...  I do know what my MK III Xtra climbs like if I run just over half power, and it hardly qualifies as a climb.



Mike

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Richard Pike

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 1671
Location: Blountville, Tennessee

Posted: Fri Sep 25, 2009 7:03 pm Post subject: Re: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra

[quote="lcottrell"]Just a guess on my part, since I have owned a Mark III  with a 582. The weight of my Firestar is pretty close to what most of the  lighter Mark III weigh. The wings on the 3 are larger so it would fly, but I  wouldn't want to own one.

 Larry

  	  Quote: 	
		     --- 	




Reading this thread persuaded me to go back and dig out my April 1995 copy of General Aviation News and Flyer, which had a full article on the MKIII with the 503 and 582. In the article, the 503 is described as "perfectly adequate."



(I can scan the article and post pictures of it if anybody cares)



I got a chance to fly a dual carb 503 powered MKIII with a passenger on board & full fuel. This was a bare bones airplane, no electrical system, maybe just a strobe, it weighed (supposedly) 475 pounds. It was really pretty much a dog, and it was a cool morning. 



So IMO, although the HKS makes more power than a 503, but less than a 582, unless I lived in flat Midwest country, probably the HKS engine on a MKIII is not a happy choice.



Richard Pike

MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)

lcottrell

Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 1494
Location: Jordan Valley, Or

Posted: Fri Sep 25, 2009 8:17 pm Post subject: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra

So IMO, although the HKS makes more power than a 503, but less than a  582, unless I lived in flat Midwest country, probably the HKS engine on a MKIII  is not a happy choice.



Richard Pike

MKIII N420P  (420ldPoops)





Even though the HKS makes more  power than the 503, I find that it is offset by the additional weight. I   can fly faster with the HKS, but I cannot get off the ground as quick. The only  plus is the "apparent" safety factor of the four stroke, and the longer  TBO.

 Larry

   [quote][b]

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rickofudall

Joined: 19 Sep 2009
Posts: 1392
Location: Udall, KS, USA

Posted: Fri Sep 25, 2009 8:17 pm Post subject: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra

Well for what it's worth Richard,  the original J-3 Cub started life with a Continental A-40 engine of 37 hp and weighed 2/3 more than a Mk III. I was flying my neighbor's Taylorcraft last week with an A-65 Continental and it too weighs about 2/3 more than my Mk III. Flew real nice. My Mk III will out climb the T craft but he blows by me (relatively speaking) over 15 mph faster at slightly less fuel burn than my 582 can deliver. It's all relative. 



Rick Girard

do not archive



On Fri, Sep 25, 2009 at 10:03 PM, Richard Pike <richard(at)bcchapel.org (richard(at)bcchapel.org)> wrote:

 [quote]--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Richard Pike" <richard(at)bcchapel.org (richard(at)bcchapel.org)>

  

 [quote="lcottrell"]Just a guess on my part, since I have owned a Mark III  with a 582. The weight of my Firestar is pretty close to what most of the  lighter Mark III weigh. The wings on the 3 are larger so it would fly, but I  wouldn't want to own one.

   Larry

 

 >    ---

 

 

 Reading this thread persuaded me to go back and dig out my April 1995 copy of General Aviation News and Flyer, which had a full article on the MKIII with the 503 and 582. In the article, the 503 is described as "perfectly adequate."

  

 (I can scan the article and post pictures of it if anybody cares)

 

 I got a chance to fly a dual carb 503 powered MKIII with a passenger on board & full fuel. This was a bare bones airplane, no electrical system, maybe just a strobe, it weighed (supposedly) 475 pounds. It was really pretty much a dog, and it was a cool morning.

  

 So IMO, although the HKS makes more power than a 503, but less than a 582, unless I lived in flat Midwest country, probably the HKS engine on a MKIII is not a happy choice.

 

 Richard Pike

 MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=265067#265067

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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zeprep251(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Sat Sep 26, 2009 6:15 am Post subject: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra

Larry,

  One more plus,the fuel burn of the HKS. Just slightly more than half of the 503.

 

   G.Aman

 

   

 

 --

lcottrell

Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 1494
Location: Jordan Valley, Or

Posted: Sat Sep 26, 2009 8:45 am Post subject: HKS-700 on a Mark III or extra

Oh yeah, some how I forgot that. :-/ I just got back from  the Alvord Desert where some of the Top Fun Flyer's will be going for a weekend  fly out. I had a head wind of about 10 MPH going so ran full power cruise,  (5750) I burned 4 gallons for the round trip of 1.4 hours. The BLM is burning  the Steen's Mts. and visibility is terrible. It almost took the GPS to find the  place. :-/

  

 I only took one picture the whole trip. There were a  couple of wild horses on the rim overlooking the Desert.

  

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DSCF1292horses.JPG

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