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FAA grounds 601 and 650
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JohnDRead(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 4:07 pm Post subject: FAA grounds 601 and 650

Just do it and live happily ever after! Lets not involve lawyers.

  

 John  Read

CH701 - Elbert CO - Jabiru 3300



Phone: 303-648-3261

Fax:  303-648-3262

Cell: 719-494-4567   

  In a message dated 11/11/2009 10:43:03 P.M. Mountain Standard Time,  chicago2paris(at)msn.com writes:

  	  Quote: 	
		  -->    Zenith-List message posted by: "Sabrina"    <chicago2paris(at)msn.com>



Craig,



If the upgrade is lawyer    driven, then we deserve better.  



I would still like to see the    new "numbers" for the original design.  



Once all the smoke    clears, I am hoping for a "light" version of the upgrade with a de-rated    airframe.  That is the maneuvering Paul speaks of.



I love my    lawyers!   :O)





Read this topic online    here:



http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272409#272409===============================================

_nbsp;             (And Get Some AWESOME FREE     to find   Gifts  tric  re  b  k you for  p;                        -Matt Dralle,    List  ========================   the  ties  Day  ================================================               - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS  ==================================================

JohnDRead(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 4:12 pm Post subject: FAA grounds 601 and 650

The flames are getting higher! 

  

 John  Read

CH701 - Elbert CO - Jabiru 3300



Phone: 303-648-3261

Fax:  303-648-3262

Cell: 719-494-4567   

  In a message dated 11/12/2009 12:22:38 A.M. Mountain Standard Time,  greg(at)gas-n-go.com.au writes:

 [quote]-->    Zenith-List message posted by: "Greg Cox"    <greg(at)gas-n-go.com.au>



Sabrina,

If you don't agree with CH's    upgrade, then design and carry out your own

upgrade then spend your money    testing your design. If yours is an

improvement on CH's then you should be    able to market it and sell it to

other builders without any    problems.



Regards,

Greg Cox

Zenith Zodiac    CH650

Sydney, Australia



--

sabrina

Joined: 15 Jun 2009
Posts: 170

Posted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 5:10 pm Post subject: Re: FAA grounds 601 and 650

Do Not Archive

Last edited by sabrina on Fri Nov 13, 2009 5:35 am; edited 1 time in total

aprazer

Joined: 24 Nov 2006
Posts: 93
Location: Boise, Idaho

Posted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 11:20 pm Post subject: FAA grounds 601 and 650

Sabrina, Sabrina,



Chris's statement that he was bound to confidentiality, because the NTSB

requires it, can be substantiated by what happened to the controllers after

the Boston helicopter accident. Remember, they were excluded from the

hearings, because they went public -- stating that the controller was

wrongly accused for the accident. 



Now, I'm sure that if your attorney discussed this point with NSTB's

attorneys instead of one of their investigators, this confidentiality clause

would have been confirmed..... 



What is this world coming to?   One cannot defend oneself!



You now say you will not modify your plane if the Heinz family base their

decisions on their lawyers advise. 



Do you realize what you are asking for?



I've watched this trash talking for well over a year -- so much so that I,

as well as others, have grown very tired of it. 



Many of you have been crying for a fix and now that you have it -- you don't

like it.



I suppose that you all want egg in your beer as well.



Mack Kreizenbeck

601XL/3300

_________________
The poh-oh-unemployed farm boy from Idaho

n801bh(at)netzero.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 6:30 am Post subject: FAA grounds 601 and 650

I agree 1000%.. I am telling ya.. This builder has their head screwed on straight for sure.. Even if she is a "girl".... <GG> 

do not archive 

 and as always tailwinds on every flight.

Ben Haas

N801BH

www.haaspowerair.com



--------

z601a(at)anemicaardvark.c
Guest

Posted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 6:46 am Post subject: FAA grounds 601 and 650

I'm glad to hear you haven't given up on it. 



On Thursday 12 November 2009 19:10, Sabrina wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   



 I must admit that the Zenith upgrade videos on their factory demo are good.



 I can't wait to see the center spar ones.



 I would really like to see the spar cap change out in person, esp. if

 anyone is solid riveting the new spar cap.



 I am driving from Chicago to Miami the weekend before Christmas and back

 the weekend after Christmas.   If anyone, by that time, has their upgrade

 kit in hand and aircraft apart along the route, I would love to be a second

 pair of hands for a few hours.



 I don't have enough free time to do anything on my airplane until Spring

 Break.   By that time we should have a couple dozen flying and proving the

 new design.





 Read this topic online here:



 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 72535#272535




	


-- 

=============================================

                Do not archive.

=============================================

                Jim B Belcher

    BS, MS Physics, Math, Computer Science

                  A&P/IA

     Retired aerospace technical manager



     Mathematics and alcohol do not mix.

         Do not drink and derive.

=============================================

leinad

Joined: 19 Sep 2006
Posts: 283
Location: Central Virginia

Posted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 5:59 pm Post subject: Re: FAA grounds 601 and 650

EAA posted the following on their web sight:



For the first time in history, the FAA has suspended issuance of any new airworthiness certificates for an entire fleet of special light-sport aircraft (S-LSA) - the Zodiac CH601XL and CH650 - and the FAA will not issue airworthiness certificates to experimental light-sport aircraft (E-LSA) and amateur built versions of CH601XL and CH650 aircraft until modified in a manner consistent with the manufacturer’s safety alert is performed.



Does any know what "until modified in a manner consistent with the manufacturer’s safety alert is performed" means. The first thing you read when look at the AMD safety alert is that all work must be done by a certified air craft mechanic.  That does sit well when you're building your own plane from scratch.



Dan

_________________
Scratch building XL with Corvair Engine

skyguynca

Joined: 05 Jun 2006
Posts: 128

Posted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 6:29 pm Post subject: FAA grounds 601 and 650

If you are the builder then you can do all the work yourself. The AMD's however are built by the factory, assembled and delivered so you have to have a LSA mechanics rating or a A&P.



David M.



--

sabrina

Joined: 15 Jun 2009
Posts: 170

Posted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 7:21 pm Post subject: Re: FAA grounds 601 and 650

Do Not Archive

Last edited by sabrina on Sun Dec 13, 2009 2:27 pm; edited 1 time in total

psm(at)att.net
Guest

Posted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 7:34 pm Post subject: FAA grounds 601 and 650

HI Dan,



The AMD planes are S-LSA.  They require a 

licensed mechanic to do just about anything - 

just like a type certificated plane.  That 

wouldn't apply to any form of experimental plane 

- either E-LSA or E-AB.  This has nothing to do 

with this particular change - just the way it is 

for planes like that.  I'm sure the change 

package issued by ZAC (when they finish it) will 

not call for a licensed mechanic to do the changes.



I don't know, but I guess the "Consistent" 

business is up to the DAR.  I suspect 

experimental planes will still have lee-way to do 

things differently from the documented 

procedure.  For example, you might decide to use 

hard rivets instead of bolts on your additional 

spar cap.  I suspect any DAR would be happy with 

that (assuming the work quality is OK).  Deciding 

not to add the new spar cap would probably not be consistent.



Paul

XL ready to order update kit

At 05:59 PM 11/13/2009, you wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  For the first time in history, the FAA has 

suspended issuance of any new airworthiness 

certificates for an entire fleet of special 

light-sport aircraft (S-LSA) - the Zodiac 

CH601XL and CH650 - and the FAA will not issue 

airworthiness certificates to experimental 

light-sport aircraft (E-LSA) and amateur built 

versions of CH601XL and CH650 aircraft until 

modified in a manner consistent with the 

manufacturer’s safety alert is performed.



Does any know what "until modified in a manner 

consistent with the manufacturer’s safety 

alert is performed" means. The first thing you 

read when look at the AMD safety alert is that 

all work must be done by a certified air craft 

mechanic.  That does sit well when you're building your own plane from scratch.



Dan

psm(at)att.net
Guest

Posted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 7:42 pm Post subject: FAA grounds 601 and 650

Hi Sabrina,



You are probably better informed than me on this point, but I thought 

anybody could work on experimental planes.  The license and repairman 

certificate stuff is all about signing off condition inspections 

rather than performing repairs and maintenance.



Paul

At 07:21 PM 11/13/2009, you wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  I was told in 2008 that once certified as airworthy, I could not 

"repair" my aircraft until I turned 18 since it was an E-LSA.

skyguynca

Joined: 05 Jun 2006
Posts: 128

Posted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 8:04 pm Post subject: FAA grounds 601 and 650

You are correct Paul. You must hold the repairman's certificate for the

experimental you purchased to do the annual condition inspection. All other

maintenance can be done by the owner. However the E_LSA is not the same as a

E_AB. All LSA aircraft regardless of the S or E you must have a LSA

repairman's certificate or a A&P. However the owner or anyone else may work

on any aircraft in the USA whether they build it or not, fixed wing or

helicopter if the work is supervised and appropriately signed off in

aircraft historicals by the supervising A&P or A or P or IA. Now that means

that Sabrina can do her own work as long as a A or A&P or IA is willing to

sign off the entry for the work Sabrina did. That is how some A&Ps get there

work experience to take the test for the A&P. In the regs it allows this and

by the way. The regs also say that supervision is not the person standing

over you while you do it. The supervising person must be able to be reached,

even by phone, during the work. The supervising person however must visually

inspect all work done before it is covered up and a final inspection before

returning the aircraft to service or test flight.



David M.



--

Afterfxllc(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 8:21 pm Post subject: FAA grounds 601 and 650

Ok I have figured out how to fix my 601 and it only took a few hours.....  And I applied full right rudder to keep it flying straight. Now if I lose a wing  I can pinwheel to earth.

  

 last step is to apply caster wheels to the main gear.

  

  

  

 

  

 I plan on starting the mods tomorrow and will video it if all goes as  planned.

  

 Jeff

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