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daveleikam(at)wi.rr.com
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 Posted: Sun Jan 24, 2010 8:21 am Post subject: Windshield install |
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I want to post my experience with installing my front window yesterday afternoon. I had no problems at all using weld-on. The window turned out as good as I would have hoped. I started by getting the window to fit very well to the flange and did the usual due diligence in tapping off the inside edge and prepping the mating surfaces. Then mixed the weld-on and while my son held, scooped it into a squeeze bag. Cut a 1/4 inch opening off the end of the bag and ran a 1/4 inch bead of glue onto the flange right at the aft edge. Do not over apply the glue. We set the window in place and gently pushed till the weld-on flowed across the flange. Then we ran straps across the window connected to the wing spar to hold everything in place. I put blocks of foam and two rolled up leather gloves under the straps at specific points to ensure a tight fit but not along the glue joints. No crazing anywhere. I believe crazing comes from too much pressure at a point while the glue cures. It really makes some heat as it does. Using a squeeze bag to apply the product is also the way to go without question. It almost eliminates the strings and puts on a very uniform bead. After squeezing the bead, placing the window, adjusting the straps and checking the fit, I could still easily have squeezed more free flowing weld-on from that bag. Plenty of time to work with this way. Also, by putting the bead of glue at the aft or outer edge of the flange, cleanup on the inside was minimal. Remove the inside tape after about 30 minutes. I have one minor crack in all my windows from using fingers to hold in a back window during gluing. I would recommend weld-on and try to minimize any point pressure to the glue joints for good results. Just thought you might like to know.
Dave Leikam
RV-10 #40496
N89DA
Muskego, WI
[quote][b]
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jeff(at)westcottpress.com
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| Posted: Sun Jan 24, 2010 3:07 pm Post subject: Windshield install |
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Hi Dave,
What was your shop temperature during the installation?
Jeff Carpenter
40304
On Jan 24, 2010, at 8:18 AM, Dave Leikam wrote:
| Quote: | I want to post my experience with installing my front window yesterday afternoon. I had no problems at all using weld-on. The window turned out as good as I would have hoped. I started by getting the window to fit very well to the flange and did the usual due diligence in tapping off the inside edge and prepping the mating surfaces. Then mixed the weld-on and while my son held, scooped it into a squeeze bag. Cut a 1/4 inch opening off the end of the bag and ran a 1/4 inch bead of glue onto the flange right at the aft edge. Do not over apply the glue. We set the window in place and gently pushed till the weld-on flowed across the flange. Then we ran straps across the window connected to the wing spar to hold everything in place. I put blocks of foam and two rolled up leather gloves under the straps at specific points to ensure a tight fit but not along the glue joints. No crazing anywhere. I believe crazing comes from too much pressure at a point while the glue cures. It really makes some heat as it does. Using a squeeze bag to apply the product is also the way to go without question. It almost eliminates the strings and puts on a very uniform bead. After squeezing the bead, placing the window, adjusting the straps and checking the fit, I could still easily have squeezed more free flowing weld-on from that bag. Plenty of time to work with this way. Also, by putting the bead of glue at the aft or outer edge of the flange, cleanup on the inside was minimal. Remove the inside tape after about 30 minutes. I have one minor crack in all my windows from using fingers to hold in a back window during gluing. I would recommend weld-on and try to minimize any point pressure to the glue joints for good results. Just thought you might like to know.
Dave Leikam
RV-10 #40496
N89DA
Muskego, WI
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[quote][b]
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daveleikam(at)wi.rr.com
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| Posted: Sun Jan 24, 2010 5:36 pm Post subject: Windshield install |
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68.
Dave Leikam
RV-10 #40496
N89DA
Muskego, WI
[quote] ---
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jeff(at)westcottpress.com
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| Posted: Sun Jan 24, 2010 8:05 pm Post subject: Windshield install |
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at 98 the Weld-on 10 doesn't work so well
Sent from my iPhone
On Jan 24, 2010, at 5:22 PM, "Dave Leikam" <daveleikam(at)wi.rr.com (daveleikam(at)wi.rr.com)> wrote:
[quote] 68.
Dave Leikam
RV-10 #40496
N89DA
Muskego, WI
[quote] ---
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daveleikam(at)wi.rr.com
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| Posted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 9:57 am Post subject: Windshield install |
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My point in posting is just that I think the product gets more negative publicity than it should. Plan to install on a cooler day, and keep the product refrigerated until just prior to mixing. Using a squeeze bag makes a huge difference in application time as well. I bet it took me little more than 60-90 seconds once mixed to get the product in the bag and apply the bead to the flange including the time to reposition a step ladder from one side of the fuse to the other and I'm no artist! I did experimented with other products (3M Scotch Weld 2216 easily pops apart after 5 days curing) and in the end, I really feel confident with the strength of the bond using weld-on. That's all I have to say about that.
Dave Leikam
RV-10 #40496
N89DA
Muskego, WI
[quote] ---
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n223rv(at)wolflakeairport
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| Posted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 10:53 am Post subject: Windshield install |
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I am just a bit surprised that you are vocally recommending a product that did put a small crack in 1 of 5 windows..... I built 1 RV-10 with Weld on, and I personally will not use the product again. Especially after talking with the windscreen manufacturer in Ohio and 'wishes Vans didn't recommend weld on.'. I have used SikaFlex with great success and I don't need to worry about point loading as you do with Weld On. Sure Weld On works if you happen to have parts that fit perfectly and if you do everything exactly right, but if one of the windows doesn't fit just right and you need to pull it in place, Weld On is way less forgiving.
YMMV, That's just my experience.
-Mike Kraus
RV-4 Flying
RV-10 wiring
Sent from my iPhone
On Jan 25, 2010, at 9:16 AM, "Dave Leikam" <daveleikam(at)wi.rr.com (daveleikam(at)wi.rr.com)> wrote:
[quote] My point in posting is just that I think the product gets more negative publicity than it should. Plan to install on a cooler day, and keep the product refrigerated until just prior to mixing. Using a squeeze bag makes a huge difference in application time as well. I bet it took me little more than 60-90 seconds once mixed to get the product in the bag and apply the bead to the flange including the time to reposition a step ladder from one side of the fuse to the other and I'm no artist! I did experimented with other products (3M Scotch Weld 2216 easily pops apart after 5 days curing) and in the end, I really feel confident with the strength of the bond using weld-on. That's all I have to say about that.
Dave Leikam
RV-10 #40496
N89DA
Muskego, WI
[quote] ---
| | - The Matronics RV10-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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rv10builder(at)verizon.ne
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| Posted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 11:39 am Post subject: Windshield install |
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Thanks Dave! I have had no issues with Weld-on, windows fit fine and I'll probably go this route for the windscreen so your feedback is appreciated.
Pascal
From: Dave Leikam (daveleikam(at)wi.rr.com)
Sent: Monday, January 25, 2010 6:16 AM
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com (rv10-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Windshield install
My point in posting is just that I think the product gets more negative publicity than it should. Plan to install on a cooler day, and keep the product refrigerated until just prior to mixing. Using a squeeze bag makes a huge difference in application time as well. I bet it took me little more than 60-90 seconds once mixed to get the product in the bag and apply the bead to the flange including the time to reposition a step ladder from one side of the fuse to the other and I'm no artist! I did experimented with other products (3M Scotch Weld 2216 easily pops apart after 5 days curing) and in the end, I really feel confident with the strength of the bond using weld-on. That's all I have to say about that.
Dave Leikam
RV-10 #40496
N89DA
Muskego, WI
[quote] ---
| | - The Matronics RV10-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List |
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MauleDriver(at)nc.rr.com
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| Posted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 1:47 pm Post subject: Windshield install |
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I feel the same way. It does form a very strong bond based on some test
pieces I bashed around. Seems like all the alternatives may be a bit
easier to work with. The strenght of the alternatives may or may not be
all there but it may not be needed.
Clearly there are some challenges and warnings with Weld-on's use.
This list seems to have identified them along with work arounds and that
makes a big difference. Thanks all!
So, I used the tongues and clecos for the 4 windows, takes 15mins or
less to do the job, removed everything in about an hour - no cracks,
nice bonds, only spread some mess around on one of them when I didn't
use the bag.
Plan to do the windsheild and expect no problems.
Bill
[quote] Thanks Dave! I have had no issues with Weld-on, windows fit fine and
I'll probably go this route for the windscreen so your feedback is
appreciated.
Pascal
*From:* Dave Leikam <mailto:daveleikam(at)wi.rr.com>
*Sent:* Monday, January 25, 2010 6:16 AM
*To:* rv10-list(at)matronics.com <mailto:rv10-list(at)matronics.com>
*Subject:* Re: Windshield install
My point in posting is just that I think the product gets more
negative publicity than it should. Plan to install on a cooler day,
and keep the product refrigerated until just prior to mixing. Using a
squeeze bag makes a huge difference in application time as well. I
bet it took me little more than 60-90 seconds once mixed to get the
product in the bag and apply the bead to the flange including the time
to reposition a step ladder from one side of the fuse to the other and
I'm no artist! I did experimented with other products (3M Scotch
Weld 2216 easily pops apart after 5 days curing) and in the end, I
really feel confident with the strength of the bond using weld-on.
That's all I have to say about that.
Dave Leikam
RV-10 #40496
N89DA
Muskego, WI
---
| | - The Matronics RV10-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List |
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