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[Probable Spam] 601HD(S): bottom fuse skin

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larry(at)macsmachine.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 5:09 pm Post subject: [Probable Spam] 601HD(S): bottom fuse skin

I remember the problem Carlos,

but the way I resolved it was by looking at the last two bulkheads and 

their relative positions. The rudder pivot plates and

extreme forward width required. With a 20mm overlap of these two pieces, 

bulkheads in place, or calculated for width,

I believe I made my second tail piece and allowed for the best fit to 

align side edges with start of the radius of the standard angle.

Getting proper edge distance using this approach make problems nearly 

inconsequential and the sides remain straight.

See attached links.

http://www.macsmachine.com/images/fuselage/full/fusaline.gif

http://www.macsmachine.com/images/fuselage/full/boxframe.gif



Best regards,



Larry McFarland





Carlos Sa wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   As I examined the fuselage plans, I noticed the bottom skin sides 

 aren't straight: where the front (6F1-1) and rear (6F1-2) parts join, 

 there is an angle.



 This raised a concern: as the bottom longeron is straight, won't I 

 have problems with edge distance when I drill holes on the longeron?

 (see attached drawing - obviously not on scale - where the blue part 

 is 6F1-2, the blue part is 6F1-1 and the longeron is the long blue 

 rectangle).



 Or I could make the bottom ski straight, but this could have a ripple 

 effect (i.e., 6F1-2 (front H.T. frame) might need to be wider, which 

 would in turn affect 6F2-6 (rear panel, top) and God know what else...).



 I would appreciate any comments from those that have been there (and 

 still remember).



 Carlos

 CH601-HD, plans

 Montreal, Canada



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carlossa52(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 8:33 pm Post subject: [Probable Spam] 601HD(S): bottom fuse skin

Larry, it appears you understood my concern - but I don't understand what you are saying.



Did you position the second tail frame differently from the plans? or did you make a rear bottom skin different from the plans, so the sides of 6F1-1 and -2 make a straight line ? (I don't understand the sentence "The rudder pivot plates and

  extreme forward width required.")



Your sentence at the end ("...the sides remain straight.") seems to indicate that you did modify 6F1-1 and/or -2 ...



Thanks for the links to the pictures - I have stared at them for a while, but I don't feel enlightened...

 

Attached is my modified diagram, now a little closer to the actual proportions of the parts involved.

The red dotted line represents the rivet line.

Thanks for your time and patience...



Carlos

 

On 4 April 2010 21:06, Larry McFarland <larry(at)macsmachine.com (larry(at)macsmachine.com)> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   --> Zenith-List message posted by: Larry McFarland <larry(at)macsmachine.com (larry(at)macsmachine.com)>

 

 I remember the problem Carlos,

 but the way I resolved it was by looking at the last two bulkheads and their relative positions. The rudder pivot plates and

 extreme forward width required. With a 20mm overlap of these two pieces, bulkheads in place, or calculated for width,

 I believe I made my second tail piece and allowed for the best fit to align side edges with start of the radius of the standard angle.

 Getting proper edge distance using this approach make problems nearly inconsequential and the sides remain straight.

 See attached links.

 http://www.macsmachine.com/images/fuselage/full/fusaline.gif

 http://www.macsmachine.com/images/fuselage/full/boxframe.gif

 

 Best regards,

 

 Larry McFarland

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larry(at)macsmachine.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 6:25 am Post subject: [Probable Spam] 601HD(S): bottom fuse skin

Yes, Carlos,

I did remake the bottom tail panel, but only slightly to get a straight 

enough shot at proper edge distance. All else seemed to fit when jigged

as per pictures shown. I don't perceive any curve in my tail longerons 

at this point. The pics were intended to show setup jigging used

to assess the rear bottom panel and the rest of the assembly. This is a 

fairly common arrangement. I remember using quick clamps to grip

the final assembly, so sides might not have been perfectly straight for 

drilling and clecoing along that line. Symmetry and centering

used up a lot of ink markers.



As a scratch builder, if I were so good at it, I'd not have had to make 

second and third pieces on 30% of my plane to finish it .



Larry McFarland 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com



Carlos Sa wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   Larry, it appears you understood my concern - but I don't understand 

 what you are saying.



 Did you position the second tail frame differently from the plans? or 

 did you make a rear bottom skin different from the plans, so the sides 

 of 6F1-1 and -2 make a straight line ? (I don't understand the 

 sentence "The rudder pivot plates and

 extreme forward width required.")

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carlossa52(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 7:01 am Post subject: [Probable Spam] 601HD(S): bottom fuse skin

Larry, thanks for the clarification.



I believe I have now enough information to proceed: I'll try to "convince" the longeron to follow the curve first, and if that doesn't work, make a second rear bottom skin. Thankfully aluminum is recyclable...

 



Thanks to all the replied and offered their thoughts and experience!



Now back to the workbench...



Carlos

CH601-HD, plans

Montreal, Canada

On 5 April 2010 11:24, Larry McFarland <larry(at)macsmachine.com (larry(at)macsmachine.com)> wrote:

 [quote]--> Zenith-List message posted by: Larry McFarland <larry(at)macsmachine.com (larry(at)macsmachine.com)>

  



 Yes, Carlos,

 I did remake the bottom tail panel, but only slightly to get a straight enough shot at proper edge distance. All else seemed to fit when jigged

 as per pictures shown. I don't perceive any curve in my tail longerons at this point. The pics were intended to show setup jigging used

 to assess the rear bottom panel and the rest of the assembly. This is a fairly common arrangement. I remember using quick clamps to grip

 the final assembly, so sides might not have been perfectly straight for drilling and clecoing along that line. Symmetry and centering

 used up a lot of ink markers.

 

 As a scratch builder, if I were so good at it, I'd not have had to make second and third pieces on 30% of my plane to finish it .

 

 Larry McFarland 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com

[b]

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Ron Lendon

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 685
Location: Clinton Twp., MI

Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 5:30 pm Post subject: Re: [Probable Spam] 601HD(S): bottom fuse skin

Carlos,



Your picture implies the longeron needs to be shaped to fit the sheet metal.  I'm not building a HDS but I do have experience shaping L-Angles, formed or extruded.  If I'm not understanding the problem, let me know.

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_________________
Ron Lendon
WW Corvair with Roy's Garage 5th bearing
CH 601 XLB
N601LT - Flying
http://www.mykitlog.com/rlendon
Corvair Engine Prints:
https://sites.google.com/site/corvairenginedata/

carlossa52(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 5:44 pm Post subject: [Probable Spam] 601HD(S): bottom fuse skin

Ron, that seems to be the case, judging from the comments I received.



Carlos

do not archive



On 5 April 2010 21:31, Ron Lendon <ron.lendon(at)gmail.com (ron.lendon(at)gmail.com)> wrote:

 [quote]--> Zenith-List message posted by: "Ron Lendon" <ron.lendon(at)gmail.com (ron.lendon(at)gmail.com)>

  

 Carlos,

 

 Your picture implies the longeron needs to be shaped to fit the sheet metal.  I'm not building a HDS but I do have experience shaping L-Angles, formed or extruded.  If I'm not understanding the problem, let me know.

  

 --------

 Ron Lendon, Clinton Township, MI

 WW Corvair with Roy's Garage 5th bearing

 Zodiac XL, ScrapBuilder 

 http://www.mykitlog.com/rlendon

 

 



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