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Air-to-air comm radio

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sidsel.svein(at)oslo.onli
Guest

Posted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 1:11 am Post subject: Air-to-air comm radio

Just returned from a very interesting experience in flying from Norway to Deauville in Normandy in company with LN-STE, I have concluded that a second VHF radio will be on top of my list of winter projects.  

   

We missed a good means of communicating between us when the weather deteriorated (as forecasted), or just for the feeling of companionship.  We tried hand-held Icoms, but they were far too weak.  

   

We also experienced some intermittent difficulties in communicating with the air traffic controllers which we believe was due to the non-omnidirectional characteristics of the Archer tape antenna in the fin.  Finally, to fly between Luxemburg and the Normandy coast  below 5000 ft MSL (no Mode S) with a sudden loss of communication would not have been nice.  I am therefore interested in learning what recommendations/experience others may have with respect to:  

   

<![if !supportLists]>-          <![endif]>Really small, yet fully-fledged VHF radio  

<![if !supportLists]>-          <![endif]>Fitting a VHF whip antenna inside the fuselage  

<![if !supportLists]>-          <![endif]>Connecting a second radio to the headset - I suppose parallel inputs/outputs is all that is required, with a separate PTT push button for the extra radio far away from the standard radio PTT (to avoid mixing them up) will work?  

   

Svein  

LN-SKJ  

(what a great touring aircraft the Europa is!!!!)  

   

        [quote][b]

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frans(at)privatepilots.nl
Guest

Posted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 2:48 am Post subject: Air-to-air comm radio

On 07/07/2010 10:15 AM, Sidsel & Svein Johnsen wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   Just returned from a very interesting experience in flying from Norway


	


Well, I just returned from a very interesting experience in flying IN

Norway. 

For any of those interested in a nice flying vacation, I can highly

recommend Norway! Beautifull country, nice airfields, nice and helpfull

people everywhere, and they all speak English too.



 	  Quote: 	
		   Deauville in Normandy in company with LN-STE, I have concluded that a second

 VHF radio will be on top of my list of winter projects.


	


I have a Garmin SL-30, and it has two channels with the possibility to

monitor the standby frequency. The SL-40 model has that too.

We used in heavily when flying into Voss. For the other readers: This is

an airfield at sea level, surrounded by huge Fjords of 5000 feet on all

sides. This by itself is a challenge to get in. In addition there was

heavy para activity on the field, two big twin-engine airplanes with

reversible props where taking up the parachutists to FL125, and they

came in so steep that they landed each time before the parachutists they

dropped where down. This made circling above the field a

non-possibility. So we had the field with the para droppers on one

channel, and the regional radar service on the other one, with both

talking to us, and keeping us informed where everyone was. Creeping over

the trees we could safely side slip the Europa in.



 	  Quote: 	
		   We also experienced some intermittent difficulties in communicating with the

 air traffic controllers which we believe was due to the non-omnidirectional

 characteristics of the Archer tape antenna in the fin.


	


I have said it before, and will repeat it here: there is no antenna that

can improve upon the standard Europa antenna in the fin. It is a half

wave dipole, with an omnidirectional pattern. You can not get any gain

over that without compromising the omnidirectional pattern, just as that

you can't get gain from any light bulb without creating shadows in other

directions.

The antenna in the fin has proved that we always were able to

communicate as far as the "line of sight" would allow us to. In any

direction.



 	  Quote: 	
		   -          Fitting a VHF whip antenna inside the fuselage


	


I would not recommend using two separate VHF radio's. The Europa is too

small to allow you to use two separate VHF antenna's without creating

interference between them. It will create all kinds of havoc, spoil your

radiation pattern, and likely create radio interference.



 	  Quote: 	
		   -          Connecting a second radio to the headset - I suppose parallel

 inputs/outputs is all that is required, with a separate PTT push button for

 the extra radio far away from the standard radio PTT (to avoid mixing them

 up) will work?


	


This idea is also likely to give troubles as well. Mismatches in

impedances between mic-inputs, and if you start transmitting on one

radio, the other, still receiving radio will probably scream for mercy,

sending out audible distress signals over the headset and mic-line.



It is best to buy a radio with two channels, where you can monitor into

the standby-channel. Then you have just one antenna, one mic-input, one

PTT button, etc. It will automatically mute the standby-channel while

transmitting, and allow you to toggle instantly to a new primary frequency.



 	  Quote: 	
		   (what a great touring aircraft the Europa is!!!!)


	


I fully agree!



Frans

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John Wighton

Joined: 18 May 2010
Posts: 241

Posted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 7:56 am Post subject: Re: Air-to-air comm radio

I have had some recent concerns about radio transmission quality (MicroAir 760 using standard fin mounted antenna).  The reception is 5/5, but transmission on the ground is weak (especially after start up and in hot environmental conditions (thats is >18 deg C in the UK).  I am frequently asked to repeat Tx and told that strength is 5/5/ but readability is 2/5 or worse.



In the air things are better but Tx readability reduces in hot weather.  Yesterday it was around 23 degC, l found changing track 30 deg allowed ATC to hear my Tx better.



I am switching to an SL30 - partially because the MicroAir space is being used for a Trig TT21 and also because l want to monitor the 2nd freq.  Hopefully the Tx problem will go away with a new radio, or am l hoping to luck?

- The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum -

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

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