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Zenith.aero is down

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Z601c(at)anemicaardvark.c
Guest

Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2010 7:48 am Post subject: Zenith.aero is down

Has anyone else noticed that Zenith.zero is down? I get a "04: Not Found" 

message, which suggests that the URL isn't in the name server.

-- 

========================================

                                       Jim B. Belcher

                                       BS,MS Physics

                                            A&P/IA

                      General Radio Telephone Certificate

                               Instrument Rated Pilot

                     Retired Aerospace Technical Manager

                         Semi-proficient Househusband

========================================

carlossa52(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2010 8:50 am Post subject: Zenith.aero is down

I get a 404 as well. Possibly down for maintenance, or for a B Gates salute...





Carlos

On 5 August 2010 11:47, Jim Belcher <Z601c(at)anemicaardvark.com (Z601c(at)anemicaardvark.com)> wrote:

  [quote]--> Zenith-List message posted by: Jim Belcher <Z601c(at)anemicaardvark.com (Z601c(at)anemicaardvark.com)>

   

 Has anyone else noticed that Zenith.zero is down? I get a "04: Not Found"

 message, which suggests that the URL isn't in the name server.

 --

 ===============

                                        Jim B. Belcher

                                        BS,MS Physics

                                             A&P/IA

                       General Radio Telephone Certificate

                                Instrument Rated Pilot

                      Retired Aerospace Technical Manager

                          Semi-proficient Househusband

 ===============[b]

Mitch Hodges

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 45
Location: Powder Springs, GA

Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2010 8:52 am Post subject: Re: Zenith.aero is down

[quote="Z601c(at)anemicaardvark.c"]Has anyone else noticed that Zenith.zero is down? I get a "04: Not Found" 

quote]



The AMD site is still blank as well (http://www.newplane.com).  Its not actually down, the site is responding but the content has been removed from the site.  All links to the site (including subpages) come up blank but they are being served up.



I called the Mothership in Mexico.  Sebastian said (in the background) they were down for some maintenance but should be back up soon.

_________________
Mitch Hodges
N601MH (Zenith 601HDS)
Builder Log at http://www.hodges.aero
Wings Under Perpetual Construction

craig(at)craigandjean.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2010 11:03 am Post subject: Zenith.aero is down

Same here. And the AMD site (www.newplane.com) is blank. Thank god the ZAC

site is still up.



-- Craig



--

Bojac

Joined: 03 Mar 2009
Posts: 7
Location: North Carolina

Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2010 11:43 am Post subject: Zenith.aero is down

Word has it that AMD has been sold to a guy in Fla. He does not, as yet 

appear to be doing anything with it, nor is there any indication as to what 

exactly he "might" do with it.  I asked at the ZAC booth and the subject was 

danced around totally.  The Builder's aid guy in Fla is not the person who 

bought it.  Nothing to back this up but the Site status would seem to 

support this kind of action.  I did ask at the booth if it were so and did 

not get any firm, absolute denial from anyone.

---

_________________
Bob Fulmer
601 XL - Corvair
742SL reserved

Z601c(at)anemicaardvark.c
Guest

Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2010 12:54 pm Post subject: Zenith.aero is down

It's hard to be sure how good a rumor this is. I'm sure the problems with the 

XL have hurt Zenith financially, and they may need a cash infusion. 



At the same time, Piper is marketing virtually the same aircraft. If this 

rumor is true, it may hurt Zenith's sales. If I were Piper, I might argue that 

all the problems are with Zenith's aircraft, not Piper's.



But if I were Zenith, I might advertise that you can get the same plane 

cheaper from Zenith, and take advantage of the money Piper has spent on 

advertising.



Does Zenith really want to be in the semi-certificated aircraft business, or do 

they want to be in their long-term forte of kit planes?

On Thursday 05 August 2010 14:40:43 you wrote:

[quote] 

 

 Word has it that AMD has been sold to a guy in Fla. He does not, as yet

 appear to be doing anything with it, nor is there any indication as to what

 exactly he "might" do with it.  I asked at the ZAC booth and the subject

 was danced around totally.  The Builder's aid guy in Fla is not the person

 who bought it.  Nothing to back this up but the Site status would seem to

 support this kind of action.  I did ask at the booth if it were so and did

 not get any firm, absolute denial from anyone.

 ---

johnd

Joined: 09 Jun 2009
Posts: 27

Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2010 1:00 pm Post subject: Zenith.aero is down

Hi Jim,

Its my understanding that AMD and Zenith are two totally different 

companies.  There is/was a Heintz brother at each company though. I'm 

not sure how many folks who are buying PiperSports or AMD planes for 

that matter would buy a kit instead....

John Davis

N601JD - 601XL

On 8/5/2010 4:53 PM, Jim Belcher wrote:

[quote] 

 It's hard to be sure how good a rumor this is. I'm sure the problems with the

 XL have hurt Zenith financially, and they may need a cash infusion.

 At the same time, Piper is marketing virtually the same aircraft. If this

 rumor is true, it may hurt Zenith's sales. If I were Piper, I might argue that

 all the problems are with Zenith's aircraft, not Piper's.

 But if I were Zenith, I might advertise that you can get the same plane

 cheaper from Zenith, and take advantage of the money Piper has spent on

 advertising.

 Does Zenith really want to be in the semi-certificated aircraft business, or do

 they want to be in their long-term forte of kit planes?

 On Thursday 05 August 2010 14:40:43 you wrote:

> 

>

> Word has it that AMD has been sold to a guy in Fla. He does not, as yet

> appear to be doing anything with it, nor is there any indication as to what

> exactly he "might" do with it.  I asked at the ZAC booth and the subject

> was danced around totally.  The Builder's aid guy in Fla is not the person

> who bought it.  Nothing to back this up but the Site status would seem to

> support this kind of action.  I did ask at the booth if it were so and did

> not get any firm, absolute denial from anyone.

> ---

craig(at)craigandjean.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2010 1:04 pm Post subject: Zenith.aero is down

Aero is back up.



-- Craig

Z601c(at)anemicaardvark.c
Guest

Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2010 2:03 pm Post subject: Zenith.aero is down

On Thursday 05 August 2010 15:59:34 you wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

   Hi Jim,

 

 Its my understanding that AMD and Zenith are two totally different

 companies.  There is/was a Heintz brother at each company though. I'm

 not sure how many folks who are buying PiperSports or AMD planes for

 that matter would buy a kit instead....


	


Good points, all. 



I'm not sure, in the fiction that surrounds corporations, how much difference 

there really is between the two companies. I was told once that all that was 

needed for two corporations was at least one person in each corporation who 

held one or more shares of stock, but who did not hold stock in the other 

corporation. Me, I'm not a lawyer, but a techie, so I don't know for sure.



I didn't mean to suggest that buyers of the kit were candidates for a finished 

plane, or vice-versa. Rather, I meant that AMD and Piper had virtually the 

same finished aircraft, competing for the same $.



-- 

========================================

                                       Jim B. Belcher

                              BS,MS Physics, Math, Computer Science

                                            A&P/IA

                             General Radio Telephone Certificate

                                   Instrument Rated Pilot

                           Retired Aerospace Technical Manager

                        

========================================

psm(at)att.net
Guest

Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2010 2:52 pm Post subject: Zenith.aero is down

Hi Folks,



I took a good look at the Piper plane at OSH, and I have followed

discussions of CZAW and their products for several years now.  In my

opinion, the Piper Sport is a derivative of the Zodiac XL rather than an

exact copy.  



The wing tips are quite different, but the center console is the same.  The

landing gear (I think) is composite while the Zodiac gear is solid aluminum

"Spring".  The Piper has a smaller baggage compartment with a rear shelf.  I

believe there are extensive structural changes in the wing spars and related

parts of the plane.  This suggests that whoever did the engineering on the

Sport Cruiser/Piper Sport took a different view of the structure than the

Heintz boys did.



The Sport Cruiser and Piper Sport have been flying for a number of years and

I don't think any of them have experienced structural failures.  Certainly

there have not been a rash of them like the XL.



After my long and productive conversation with the FAA guy at OSH, I wonder

if the Sport cruiser was a derivative of the Zodiac XL or it was the other

way around.  He definitely said the XL was originally designed to the 1200

pound European standard and just "Pencil whipped" to meet the US LSA

specified gross weight of 1320.  He also said he had proprietary information

from Zenair/Zenith that he would not disclose, but assured me he was not

hiding safety related information from me that would impact my own safety in

an XL.  I don't know what that information is, but it might have been

something relating to the design history and who exactly did the

engineering.  I certainly asked him about that and all he would say was that

"Zenair" provided the engineering for the upgrade and not the FAA.



About corporations, I do indeed know a fair amount on that subject.  I am

not aware of any requirement for there to be different owners and/or

officers from one corporation to another.  If so, that would be a state law

and certainly wouldn't impact two corporations in two different countries

like Zenair and Zenith.  



I have no knowledge of any transactions going on regarding any of these

companies.  However, I feel the Piper Sport is direct competition for the

AMD XL/650.  On the other hand both Piper and AMD offer many other models of

aircraft which have nothing to do with the other company's products.



Paul

Camas, WA

Currently installing upgrade in my XL.



--

jaybannist(at)cs.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2010 2:54 pm Post subject: Zenith.aero is down

The way I see it, the Piper and AMD 650 have essentially the same bones, but so do the Camry and the Lexus ES.   The reason one costs more than the other is primarily an upscaled interior finish and a prestigious name; the latter being the greatest.  EVERYONE knows Piper.  Who knows AMD ?

 

 Jay Bannister

  

     

  

    

     

  

     

  

    --

sabrina

Joined: 15 Jun 2009
Posts: 170

Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2010 3:20 pm Post subject: Re: Zenith.aero is down

Do Not Archive

Last edited by sabrina on Sun Aug 22, 2010 10:25 pm; edited 1 time in total

Tim Juhl

Joined: 21 Mar 2006
Posts: 488
Location: "Thumb" of Michigan

Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2010 6:31 pm Post subject: Re: Zenith.aero is down

AMD www.newplane.com is up too.

_________________
______________
CFII
Champ L16A flying
Zodiac XL - Jabiru 3300A
Almost done! It'll fly in spring!

bryanmmartin

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1018

Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 1:47 am Post subject: Zenith.aero is down

And I still say the FAA guy you talked to was full of shit. The development of the XL started at least two years before the Sport Pilot rule was even thought of. It was developed as a replacement for the HD in the US market, which had a gross weight of 1200 lbs. The earliest brochures for the XL listed the gross weight at 1400 lbs, later brochures listed 1300 lbs for the E-AB version and 1232 lbs for the LSA compliant version. (The original proposed gross weight for the LSA rule was 1232 lbs and ended up as 1320 lbs in the final rule.) Your FAA guy was possibly confused by the Czech built version that was intended for the European market. Just because somebody works for the government doesn't mean he knows what he's talking about.



On Aug 5, 2010, at 6:51 PM, Paul Mulwitz wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

 Hi Folks,

 

 After my long and productive conversation with the FAA guy at OSH, I wonder

 if the Sport cruiser was a derivative of the Zodiac XL or it was the other

 way around.  He definitely said the XL was originally designed to the 1200

 pound European standard and just "Pencil whipped" to meet the US LSA

 specified gross weight of 1320. 


	




-- 

Bryan Martin

N61BM, CH 601 XL,

RAM Subaru, Stratus re-drive.

do not archive.

_________________
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru.
do not archive.

Z601c(at)anemicaardvark.c
Guest

Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 5:14 am Post subject: Zenith.aero is down

Good point, Jay. As usual, those willing to investigate a little may get the 

better deal.



On Thursday 05 August 2010 17:58:02 you wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		    The way I see it, the Piper and AMD 650 have essentially the same bones,

 but so do the Camry and the Lexus ES.   The reason one costs more than the

 other is primarily an upscaled interior finish and a prestigious name; the

 latter being the greatest.  EVERYONE knows Piper.  Who knows AMD ?

 

 Jay Bannister


	


-- 

========================================

                                       Jim B. Belcher

                              BS,MS Physics, Math, Computer Science

                                            A&P/IA

                             General Radio Telephone Certificate

                                   Instrument Rated Pilot

                           Retired Aerospace Technical Manager

                        

========================================

malcolmhunt(at)mha1.fsbus
Guest

Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 7:02 am Post subject: Zenith.aero is down

Hi Paul et al



It is worth remembering that the Sport Cruiser was developed by CZAW who 

provided kits of the Zenith aircraft, including the 601XL, for the European 

market.



The CZAW version of the 601XL had some very significant differences to the 

American, including composite gear, different angle of attack for the wings 

and different canopy details.



I saw the first Sport Cruiser to be completed in the UK and this had some 

very familiar details to the European 601XL,  including the gear and canopy. 

Looking at the latest kits there has been some significant developments 

including the canopy, which is now bonded, and the internal fitments to the 

newer aircraft look very smart, many of which have glass cockpits.



We have all been through the mill over the mods but I think it is now time 

to encourage Zenith to start actively promoting the 650B which I consider a 

great aircraft and at the original price great value.  Lets start enjoying 

the construction and flying again of the 600 series!



Hope this is of interest.



Malcolm Hunt



CH601XL Plans builder in England

Juan Vega Jr

Joined: 13 Jan 2009
Posts: 157

Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 6:32 pm Post subject: Zenith.aero is down

Paul,



Sippin too many beers again in the barn or too many karate hits to the brain...  The Chech plane is an exact replica, save for a face lift.  I flew both, the check one and the 601 are the same.  Like the 601 cause frankly with a 3300 engine, it launches off the runway  versus the rotax fred flinstone in 90 degree heat.



as the the design the Heintz boys would be looking at talking to themselves if they asked to speak to the sport cruiser designers.

--

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