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Shorai LiFePO4

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jan_de_jong(at)casema.nl
Guest

Posted: Mon Jan 31, 2011 9:48 am Post subject: Shorai LiFePO4

Check out "Shorai".

New light weight Japanese LiFePO4 battery with quite enthousiastic 

motorcyclist customers.

Works well enough at low temperatures.

Max. charging current 18A (no external shunts). Higher ratings coming.

Has a 5 pin plug that I suspect may give access to the 4 cells.

For our use I might want to monitor max. cell voltage to see <4V or 

interrupt charging.



Cheers,

Jan de Jong

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klehman(at)albedo.net
Guest

Posted: Sun Feb 06, 2011 3:25 pm Post subject: Shorai LiFePO4

There is lots of info on how great these things are and little on the 

downside. Unfortunately the following link makes the chemistry sound 

unsuitable for an airplane.

manuals.hobbico.com/hca/lifesource-manual-v2.pdf

Ken



On 1/31/2011 12:16 PM, Jan de Jong wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   

 <jan_de_jong(at)casema.nl>



 Check out "Shorai".

 New light weight Japanese LiFePO4 battery with quite enthousiastic

 motorcyclist customers.

 Works well enough at low temperatures.

 Max. charging current 18A (no external shunts). Higher ratings coming.

 Has a 5 pin plug that I suspect may give access to the 4 cells.

 For our use I might want to monitor max. cell voltage to see <4V or

 interrupt charging.



 Cheers,

 Jan de Jong

- The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum -

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

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jan_de_jong(at)casema.nl
Guest

Posted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 4:31 am Post subject: Shorai LiFePO4

Hi Ken,



Re http://manuals.hobbico.com/hca/lifesource-manual-v2.pdf

It sure sounds ominous.

Let me think of some reasons why it may be too ominous.

- the hobbico batteries regularly crash to earth - it is part of their job

(in a real airplane a battery would crash at most once and even then be 

more protected as part of a larger object;

thanks to its light weight it may well stay in its designated place too;

if it is not physically damaged there is no danger; the chemistry needs 

more than 900 'C to burn)

- the hobbico batteries are composed of random cells of the same manufacture

(the Shorai battery cells may be designed/manufactured/selected to be 

part of the same battery)

- the hobby user may be suspected of not appreciating the energy 

contained in so light a package

(we do a one-time carefully considered installation with switches and 

contactors all around)

- a cya component



My concern is mostly whether in our normal use where we keep our 

batteries generally fully charged with something close enough to the 

required CC/CV regime the cells of a LFP battery will over time always 

converge in state of charge.



It will be interesting to see how the motorcyclists will be doing with that.



Jan de Jong

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klehman(at)albedo.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2011 8:17 am Post subject: Shorai LiFePO4

thanks Jan



My outstanding concern is what is the worst case risk of rupturing a 

cell after extended times (occasionally 8 hour days) at 14.5 volts with 

no cell balancing? It sounds like a ruptured cell could be bad news. If 

that was not a concern then I'd be willing to experiment with some 

equalization and temperature monitoring for long x-country flights if 

that substantially extended the service life. My batteries sit between 

my rudder pedals. I need electricity to keep the engine running but 

aircraft integrity and breathable air to keep me running is even more 

important.



I will be watching the motorcycle experience as well. Life expectancy is 

not a concern for me to try them but failure modes definitely are. 

Please keep posting any further info.



Ken



On 2/7/2011 7:25 AM, Jan de Jong wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   

 <jan_de_jong(at)casema.nl>



 Hi Ken,



 Re http://manuals.hobbico.com/hca/lifesource-manual-v2.pdf

 It sure sounds ominous.

 Let me think of some reasons why it may be too ominous.

 - the hobbico batteries regularly crash to earth - it is part of their job

 (in a real airplane a battery would crash at most once and even then be

 more protected as part of a larger object;

 thanks to its light weight it may well stay in its designated place too;

 if it is not physically damaged there is no danger; the chemistry needs

 more than 900 'C to burn)

 - the hobbico batteries are composed of random cells of the same

 manufacture

 (the Shorai battery cells may be designed/manufactured/selected to be

 part of the same battery)

 - the hobby user may be suspected of not appreciating the energy

 contained in so light a package

 (we do a one-time carefully considered installation with switches and

 contactors all around)

 - a cya component



 My concern is mostly whether in our normal use where we keep our

 batteries generally fully charged with something close enough to the

 required CC/CV regime the cells of a LFP battery will over time always

 converge in state of charge.



 It will be interesting to see how the motorcyclists will be doing with

 that.



 Jan de Jong

- The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum -

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

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nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect
Guest

Posted: Sun Feb 13, 2011 12:23 pm Post subject: Shorai LiFePO4

At 11:16 AM 1/31/2011, you wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  



Check out "Shorai".

New light weight Japanese LiFePO4 battery with quite enthousiastic 

motorcyclist customers.

Works well enough at low temperatures.

Max. charging current 18A (no external shunts). Higher ratings coming.

Has a 5 pin plug that I suspect may give access to the 4 cells.

For our use I might want to monitor max. cell voltage to see <4V or 

interrupt charging.


	


    Interesting offering. I had some conversation with

    my battery guru of more than 30 years (Skip Koss)

    last week. He was telling me of a Lithium product

    being sold onto come of the smaller bizjets. Amazing

    power to weight ratios when warm. But won't deliver

    more than 200A at 0C. Operators take the battery

    indoors for overnight storage at low temperatures.



    He also told me that GM was on their third supplier

    of lithium cells for offerings into the all

    electric car market. Qualification hoop-jumping levied

    by automobile manufacturers on purchased goods is

    about 3x the thickness of an FAA qual package. It

    does not bode well that a game of musical batteries

    has not produced a solid winner so late in the

    commitment to field a product. As the King of Siam

    might note, "curiouser and curiouser".



    Watch this space . . .



    Bob . . .

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