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Engine mounted.

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bifft(at)xmission.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 8:24 pm Post subject: Engine mounted.

Got the engine hung over the weekend:



http://www.xmission.com/~bifft/img_2323.jpg



Wasn't too hard to do solo, just a few times wanted some help.  Most of

the time extra people would have just been in the way.



  Did end up having to remove the oil line that ran from the prop govener

to the front of the engine.  I'm going to go with fixed pitch, but I

assume I still need to hook up this line.  What say yall?



  Brian Huffaker, DSWL (bifft(at)xmission.com)

  RV-8A 80091 Engine hung.

  1/4 Starduster II N23UT flying

bicyclop(at)pacbell.net
Guest

Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 8:50 pm Post subject: Engine mounted.

For fixed pitch, you don't need the external line.       Put a plug in the case where it attaches. You need to make sure       that the aft crankshaft plug is pierced and then install one in       the front.

       

       Ed Holyoke

     

     On 8/1/2011 9:21 PM, Brian Huffaker wrote:     [quote]        	  Quote: 	
		  --> RV-List message posted by: Brian Huffaker <bifft(at)xmission.com> (bifft(at)xmission.com)

Got the engine hung over the weekend:



http://www.xmission.com/~bifft/img_2323.jpg



Wasn't too hard to do solo, just a few times wanted some help.  Most of

the time extra people would have just been in the way.



  Did end up having to remove the oil line that ran from the prop govener

to the front of the engine.  I'm going to go with fixed pitch, but I

assume I still need to hook up this line.  What say yall?



  Brian Huffaker, DSWL (bifft(at)xmission.com (bifft(at)xmission.com))

  RV-8A 80091 Engine hung.

  1/4 Starduster II N23UT flying



	
     [b]

chaskuss(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Aug 02, 2011 2:59 am Post subject: Engine mounted.

Brian,

 I assume that you have a prop governor adapter mounted on the engine? If so, you need to keep that oil line connected. The adapter and line allows you to keep the plugs in the front of the crankshaft, which would allow you to change to a constant speed prop at a later date, without having to replace a punctured inner prop plug. That line and adapter will allow any excess oil a way out of the nose of the crankshaft.

Charlie Kuss



--- On Tue, 8/2/11, Brian Huffaker <bifft(at)xmission.com> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   From: Brian Huffaker <bifft(at)xmission.com>

 Subject: Engine mounted.

 To: "rv-list" <rv-list(at)matronics.com>

 Date: Tuesday, August 2, 2011, 12:21 AM

 

 Brian Huffaker <bifft(at)xmission.com>

 

 

 Got the engine hung over the weekend:

 

 http://www.xmission.com/~bifft/img_2323.jpg

 

 Wasn't too hard to do solo, just a few times wanted some

 help.  Most of

 the time extra people would have just been in the way.

 

   Did end up having to remove the oil line that ran

 from the prop govener

 to the front of the engine.  I'm going to go with

 fixed pitch, but I

 assume I still need to hook up this line.  What say

 yall?

 

   Brian Huffaker, DSWL (bifft(at)xmission.com)

   RV-8A 80091 Engine hung.

   1/4 Starduster II N23UT flying

 

 Forum -

 FAQ,

    - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -

 List Contribution Web Site -

               -Matt

 Dralle, List Admin.

bifft(at)xmission.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:17 am Post subject: Engine mounted.

On Tue, 2 Aug 2011, Charles Kuss wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   



 Brian,

  I assume that you have a prop governor adapter mounted on the engine?


	


  I think so.  Don't really know engine stuff, but there is something

squarish that had this line attached.



 	  Quote: 	
		  If so, you need to keep that oil line connected. The adapter and line

allows you to keep the plugs in the front of the crankshaft, which would

allow you to change to a constant speed prop at a later date, without

having to replace a punctured inner prop plug. That line and adapter will

allow any excess oil a way out of the nose of the crankshaft.


	


  I don't think I can get the old line back on, it interferes with the

engine mount.  However, it would probably be easier to make a new line

than to do the crankshaft plug stuff.   And, leave the the possibility of

adding a constant speed prop at some point if I come into a lot of money

or something.

  Brian Huffaker, DSWL (bifft(at)xmission.com)

  RV-8A 80091 Thinking engine.

  1/4 Starduster II N23UT flying

n223rv(at)wolflakeairport
Guest

Posted: Tue Aug 02, 2011 8:13 am Post subject: Engine mounted.

Speaking from experience with my RV-4, the only thing I would have changed on it was to add a constant speed prop.  I gave up a lot of top end speed and performance with the fixed pitch prop, and a lit of speed control on ascents and decents.  I flew it for 8 years and kicked myself most the time for not going with constant speed.  For me to change was a new engine (or at least crank shaft) new prop, and a new cowling, and paint for the cowl.  That was just too much of a tear up for me.  If I were to do it over again, I'd invest in a constant speed prop without question.

It is added money up front, but it is a LOT cheaper than doing it later!

YMMV

-Mike Kraus

Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 2, 2011, at 11:13 AM, Brian Huffaker <bifft(at)xmission.com> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	

 On Tue, 2 Aug 2011, Charles Kuss wrote:

> 

> 

> Brian,

> I assume that you have a prop governor adapter mounted on the engine?

  I think so.  Don't really know engine stuff, but there is something

 squarish that had this line attached.

> If so, you need to keep that oil line connected. The adapter and line

> allows you to keep the plugs in the front of the crankshaft, which would

> allow you to change to a constant speed prop at a later date, without

> having to replace a punctured inner prop plug. That line and adapter will

> allow any excess oil a way out of the nose of the crankshaft.

  I don't think I can get the old line back on, it interferes with the

 engine mount.  However, it would probably be easier to make a new line

 than to do the crankshaft plug stuff.   And, leave the the possibility of

 adding a constant speed prop at some point if I come into a lot of money

 or something.

  Brian Huffaker, DSWL (bifft(at)xmission.com)

  RV-8A 80091 Thinking engine.

  1/4 Starduster II N23UT flying

carl.froehlich(at)verizon
Guest

Posted: Tue Aug 02, 2011 8:41 am Post subject: Engine mounted.

Fully agree.  I had a FP on my 8A for six years.  Now have a Hartzell blended airfoil and have been amazed at the improvement in all flight aspects.  

Carl

Sent from my phone.Â  Please read past the typos.

-----Original message-----

From: Michael Kraus <n223rv(at)wolflakeairport.net>

To: "rv-list(at)matronics.com" <rv-list(at)matronics.com>

Sent: Tue, Aug 2, 2011 16:09:48 GMT+00:00

Subject: Re: RV-List: Engine mounted.

Speaking from experience with my RV-4, the only thing I would have changed on it was to add a constant speed prop.  I gave up a lot of top end speed and performance with the fixed pitch prop, and a lit of speed control on ascents and decents.  I flew it for 8 years and kicked myself most the time for not going with constant speed.  For me to change was a new engine (or at least crank shaft) new prop, and a new cowling, and paint for the cowl.  That was just too much of a tear up for me.  If I were to do it over again, I'd invest in a constant speed prop without question.

It is added money up front, but it is a LOT cheaper than doing it later!

YMMV

-Mike Kraus

Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 2, 2011, at 11:13 AM, Brian Huffaker <bifft(at)xmission.com> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	

 On Tue, 2 Aug 2011, Charles Kuss wrote:

> 

> 

> Brian,

> I assume that you have a prop governor adapter mounted on the engine?

  I think so.  Don't really know engine stuff, but there is something

 squarish that had this line attached.

> If so, you need to keep that oil line connected. The adapter and line

> allows you to keep the plugs in the front of the crankshaft, which would

> allow you to change to a constant speed prop at a later date, without

> having to replace a punctured inner prop plug. That line and adapter will

> allow any excess oil a way out of the nose of the crankshaft.

  I don't think I can get the old line back on, it interferes with the

 engine mount.  However, it would probably be easier to make a new line

 than to do the crankshaft plug stuff.   And, leave the the possibility of

 adding a constant speed prop at some point if I come into a lot of money

 or something.

  Brian Huffaker, DSWL (bifft(at)xmission.com)

  RV-8A 80091 Thinking engine.

  1/4 Starduster II N23UT flying

chaskuss(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Aug 02, 2011 10:37 am Post subject: Engine mounted.

Brian,

 Perhaps you could email me a photo of the area where the mount and the oil line collide? Would a change of fitting at the governor adapter help ease this issue? Is the problematic line rigid stainless steel? Or is it a flex hose? I am enclosing an attachment which details a small modification you "might" have to make to the block off plate at the rear of the governor adapter.

Charlie Kuss


--- On Tue, 8/2/11, Brian Huffaker <bifft(at)xmission.com> wrote:


 	  Quote: 	
		   From: Brian Huffaker <bifft(at)xmission.com>

 Subject: Re: Engine mounted.

 To: rv-list(at)matronics.com

 Date: Tuesday, August 2, 2011, 11:13 AM

 

 Brian Huffaker <bifft(at)xmission.com>

 

 On Tue, 2 Aug 2011, Charles Kuss wrote:

 

 > 

 >

 > Brian,

 >  I assume that you have a prop governor adapter

 mounted on the engine?

 

   I think so.  Don't really know engine stuff,

 but there is something

 squarish that had this line attached.

 

 >If so, you need to keep that oil line connected. The

 adapter and line

 >allows you to keep the plugs in the front of the

 crankshaft, which would

 >allow you to change to a constant speed prop at a later

 date, without

 >having to replace a punctured inner prop plug. That

 line and adapter will

 >allow any excess oil a way out of the nose of the

 crankshaft.

 

   I don't think I can get the old line back on, it

 interferes with the

 engine mount.  However, it would probably be easier to

 make a new line

 than to do the crankshaft plug stuff.   And,

 leave the the possibility of

 adding a constant speed prop at some point if I come into a

 lot of money

 or something.

 

 

   Brian Huffaker, DSWL (bifft(at)xmission.com)

   RV-8A 80091 Thinking engine.

   1/4 Starduster II N23UT =====================

Modifying_A_Governor_Adapter_Block_Off_Plate_to_Allow_Easy_Conversion_from_Constant_Speed_Propeller_to_Fixed_Pitch.pdf

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Kellym

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1705
Location: Sun Lakes AZ

Posted: Tue Aug 02, 2011 6:39 pm Post subject: Engine mounted.

Keep in mind that aluminum fittings are banned by AD as is an aluminum 

oil line. You have to have either aircraft hose or stainless line with 

steel fittings. Yeah, I know all the arguments on ADs. This is one you 

don't want to ignore, as you can lose all the engine oil in a flash if 

it breaks.

On 8/2/2011 6:58 PM, Brian Huffaker wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   On Tue, 2 Aug 2011, Charles Kuss wrote:

> Brian,

> I look forward to seeing that photo. Please also take photos of the area

> on the rear of the engine where the SS line attaches, and your blanking

> plate.

 http://www.xmission.com/~bifft/img_2329.jpg

 this shows the line as close as I can get to where I took it off of.  It

 was attached to where the red plug now is.  Looking at it, it may be an

 aluminum line instead of stainless.  The fittings are all Al.

 http://www.xmission.com/~bifft/img_2326.jpg

 shows the governor adaptor.  No blocking plate, whoever pickled the engine

 took off the accessories and then covered the holes with aluminum tape.

 /font></pre>

_________________
Kelly McMullen
A&P/IA, EAA Tech Counselor # 5286
KCHD

chaskuss(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:15 pm Post subject: Engine mounted.

Kelly gives good advice here. Lycoming went to the SS tube because of failures of the old, aluminum tube. 

Charlie



--- On Tue, 8/2/11, Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   From: Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com>

 Subject: Re: Engine mounted.

 To: rv-list(at)matronics.com

 Date: Tuesday, August 2, 2011, 10:36 PM

 

 Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com>

 

 Keep in mind that aluminum fittings are banned by AD as is

 an aluminum oil line. You have to have either aircraft hose

 or stainless line with steel fittings. Yeah, I know all the

 arguments on ADs. This is one you don't want to ignore, as

 you can lose all the engine oil in a flash if it breaks.

 

 

 On 8/2/2011 6:58 PM, Brian Huffaker wrote:

 > On Tue, 2 Aug 2011, Charles Kuss wrote:

 > 

 >> Brian,

 >> I look forward to seeing that photo. Please also

 take photos of the area

 >> on the rear of the engine where the SS line

 attaches, and your blanking

 >> plate.

 > http://www.xmission.com/~bifft/img_2329.jpg

 > this shows the line as close as I can get to where I

 took it off of.  It

 > was attached to where the red plug now is. 

 Looking at it, it may be an

 > aluminum line instead of stainless.  The fittings

 are all Al.

 > 

 > http://www.xmission.com/~bifft/img_2326.jpg

 > shows the governor adaptor.  No blocking plate,

 whoever pickled the engine

 > took off the accessories and then covered the holes

 with aluminum tape.

 > /font></pre>

 

 Forum -

 FAQ,

    - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -

 List Contribution Web Site -

               -Matt

 Dralle, List Admin.

chaskuss(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:27 pm Post subject: Engine mounted.

Brian,

 Replace that aluminum fitting with the correct steel one. The fittings at both ends should be made of steel.

 FYI, I may have given you a bum steer regarding the part numbers for the fittings. The AN816, AN822 & AN823 fittings are NPT to flare. Check the fitting in the governor adapter. It may well be straight thread, in which case, the numbers above are not correct. Best to go by the part numbers listed in the two Service Instructions I included in the earlier email. You will note that the drawing in one of the SIs I sent, shows a 45 degree fitting pointed up. That may well be what you need, with a modified SS tube. 

 FYI, it is VERY important to install the Adel clamps as shown in the SI to support the SS tube. Failure to install them could cause the tube to fail, from excessive vibration.

Charlie



--- On Tue, 8/2/11, Brian Huffaker <bifft(at)xmission.com> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   From: Brian Huffaker <bifft(at)xmission.com>

 Subject: Re: Engine mounted.

 To: "Charles Kuss" <chaskuss(at)yahoo.com>

 Date: Tuesday, August 2, 2011, 9:58 PM

 On Tue, 2 Aug 2011, Charles Kuss

 wrote:

 

 > Brian,

 > I look forward to seeing that photo. Please also take

 photos of the area

 >on the rear of the engine where the SS line attaches,

 and your blanking

 >plate.

 

 http://www.xmission.com/~bifft/img_2329.jpg

 this shows the line as close as I can get to where I took

 it off of.  It

 was attached to where the red plug now is.  Looking at

 it, it may be an

 aluminum line instead of stainless.  The fittings are

 all Al.

 

 http://www.xmission.com/~bifft/img_2326.jpg

 shows the governor adaptor.  No blocking plate,

 whoever pickled the engine

 took off the accessories and then covered the holes with

 aluminum tape.

 

 > To ease the interference issue, you could simply omit

 the governor

 >adapter [and the shaft/gear inside it], install the

 block off plate and

 >gasket directly to the rear of the accessory housing.

 You can simply

 >drill and tap for a 45 or 90 degree fitting [whichever

 works best for

 >your application] anywhere on the new blanking plate.

 FYI, you can make

 >your own gasket, or simply buy one.

 

 That would probably be best, why carry the weight if I'm

 not going to use

 it.  Could even T off of that line and hook it up to

 the inverted oil

 seperator like on the Starduster.  As for making a

 gasket, I suppose the

 auto form-a-gasket stuff would work?

 

 >Check out the two photos in the link below. They show

 the rear of a

 >Lycoming engine with a prop governor [flaked off black

 paint] installed.

 >The governor adapter is the part [better view in the

 bottom photo] which

 >goes between the black governor and the accessory

 housing. See

 

 >http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showpost.php?p=389128&postcount=1

 

 >The gray part with the steel AN816 [straight] fitting

 pointing to the

 >right, is where your SS tube is supposed to attach. If

 you have

 >interference issues, you could do any or any

 combination of the following

 >to cure the problem.

 

 

 yep, except the fitting is Al instead of steel.

 

 

 >#1  Replace the AN816 [straight] fitting with an AN82

 [90 degree] or

 >    AN823 [45 degree] fitting.

 >#2  Obtain a new, longer piece of SS tube and bend it

 as required to make

 >    it work. This is experimental aviation,

 after all.

 

   this would probably be the easiest, cheapest and

 lightest way to go.  Be

 a bit tricky to route around the mount, I know the engine

 moves alot on

 shutdown and startup.

 

 >#3  Replace the SS tube with a fire sleeved flexible

 oil hose. This is

 >    even approved by Lycoming for certified

 aircraft. See Lycoming SI

 >    1435. [Brian, I've sent a copy of SI 1435

 to you]

 

   Thanks for all the help, this is clearing up my

 questions very well.

 

   Brian Huffaker, DSWL (bifft(at)xmission.com)

   RV-8A 80091

   1/4 Starduster II N23UT flying

 <pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000"

 face="courier new,courier">

 

 Forum -

 FAQ,

    - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -

 List Contribution Web Site -

               -Matt

 Dralle, List Admin.

 

 </b></font></pre>

bifft(at)xmission.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:39 pm Post subject: Engine mounted.

On Tue, 2 Aug 2011, Charles Kuss wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   



 Kelly gives good advice here. Lycoming went to the SS tube because of

failures of the old, aluminum tube.


	


  All the more reason to replace.



  Brian Huffaker, DSWL (bifft(at)xmission.com)

  RV-8A 80091

  1/4 Starduster II N23UT flying

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