 |
Matronics Email Lists
Web Forum Interface to the Matronics Email Lists
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
wdaniell(at)etb.net.co
Guest
|
 Posted: Sun Oct 02, 2011 6:18 pm Post subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
 |
|
Something worked loose and vibrated in the slipstream - a landing light perhaps from your clue
Will
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
kjburns(at)btinternet.com
Guest
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 2:21 am Post subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
|
|
My thoughts would carb related maybe choke, maybe one choke cable slipped causing rich mixture and plugs to foul on one pair of cylinders, or some litter, bag , leaf etc ingested in to air intake, or colapsed air filter in to one carb intake or other ,
But a more simple reason could be:- more simply we are driven mad by a banging flap of plastic on our hanger door in 10 knot + breeze so sugest a flap of some sort, plastic, caught up on some part of the airframe banging in turbulent air at vairious prop speed/ angular settings !
Kevin.
From: Tim Ward <ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz>
To: "europa-list(at)matronics.com" <europa-list(at)matronics.com>
Sent: Sunday, 2 October 2011, 19:40
Subject: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Raimo,
The other is carb heat left on for take off?
Cheers,
Toby,
Tim's other son
Tim Ward 12 Waiwetu Street
Fendalton,
Christchurch, 8052
New Zealand.
ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz (ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz)
Ph 64 3 3515166
Mob 0210640221
On 3/10/2011, at 4:58 AM, "Raimo Toivio" <raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)> wrote:
[quote] All
I have got plenty of good guesses via list and also direct.
Some of you have hoped I will not publish them with their names and do not worry I wont´t.
Graham – I /we got an empty message from you – please retype it – I am sure it will be a good info.
One of you have guessed the problem was because a broken de-icing rubber in the prop blade. That´s good but unfortunately my Europa is so far still missing de-icing systems totally. They would be soon very useful in Finland.
***
No one has so far found a reason for my vibra.
So there are still a possibility to get an Xmas packet from Finland.
I quarantee the shipment will be worth of making a good guess.
***
Tips:
- the reason was off /on or black /white –type and very easy to repair; it was fixed in seconds.
- when finally found it was not invisible at all.
Go On!
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT
From: Raimo Toivio (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)
Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2011 10:44 PM
To: [url=mailto:europa-list(at)matronics.com]europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)[/url]
Subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
All
I have hope-so a nice riddle for you.
Maybe all the answers are useful – let´s collect them all:
***
Yesterday I took off from a very remote /small /windy (90 degrees 12 knots and gusting MUCH) grass strip. Soon until well over the ground at altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on and gears up I felt suddenly let us say medium or more shake and vibration. My immediate reaction was to go around and land immediately but abandoned because wind was so furious and I felt I cannot do that (a succesful landing).
I decided to try to fly to the next possible sensible airfield EFHV which was 10 minutes apart.
Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a 2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode (in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. My airspeed was w that selection about 110 knots but because of a strong headwind GS was only about 70 knots (wanted to be clearly over the ground at 3000 ft because it was well over sunset and totally dark, yesterday we got sunset around 1600 Zulutime and time was well over 1630 when flying).
So, I pushed home one looooong hour. All the aerodynamics were well. I was a bit worried my engine will separate or so. When trying to push more pwr it was more vibra and when trying to pull less pwr same. I Followed a main highway and decided to land there if feeling so. Cars there with lights are almost like a lighted runway...
Finally landing to the EFTP flawlesly.
***
Today we had a FHGP (Family Hangar Grill Party). I tried to check my plane as well as I can. I found something. Very small evidence but something anyway. I tried to fix it and had a test run. I elected to go to fly – hey I am a test pilot who else – and She was better than ever!
I managed to do 2 touches and goes when C172 did one with same runway.
140 knots during downwind makes me always happy.
***
So – dear Ladies and Gentlemen – what was wrong?
It would be nice and very life-useful to hear your opinions or guesses what was wrong.
***
The Rules: one single guess per person, please.
The Prize: The Best Guess will get a Very Special Xmas Present from Finland!
***
I will let you know a solution after a week – be patient.
Have a nice weekend and
Cheers, Raimo Toivio
<Europa%20A2A-ala2OK[1].png> Europa XS Mono OH-XRT #417
Updated flight hours /landings: 258,3
37500 Lempaala
FINLAND
p +358-3-3753 777
f +358-3-3753 100
toivio(at)fly.to (toivio(at)fly.to)
www.rwm.fi
el=nofollow target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List
et=_blank>http://forums.matronics.com
llow target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
[b]
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Justin(at)systemwise.co.u
Guest
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 3:00 am Post subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
|
|
Hey,
How about a spinner bolt missing?
Justin
G-ZTED Classic Monowheel
[quote][b]
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi
Guest
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 6:01 am Post subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
|
|
Hanna,
are you sure you are Hanna or in fact Tim, Hanna´s dad (who is going to try to win desperately the shipment from Finland) ? 
If you really are Hanna; you may try 2nd time, because you are a pilot´s daughter.
Please read my first mail once again carefully: I wrote
“Soon until well over the ground at altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on ... “
Notice also, these words below are really essential info, something maybe to do with prop/pwr –settings:
“Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a 2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode (in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. “
***
All,
One of you is now really close, physically say 50 mm /2" inches.
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT Finland
From: Tim Ward (ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz)
Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2011 9:39 PM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Raimo,
Two thoughts.
Fuel starvation with the fuel pumps not turned on for take off?
Cheers,
Hannah
Tim daughter
Tim Ward 12 Waiwetu Street
Fendalton,
Christchurch, 8052
New Zealand.
ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz (ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz)
Ph 64 3 3515166
Mob 0210640221
On 3/10/2011, at 4:58 AM, "Raimo Toivio" <raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)> wrote:
[quote] All
I have got plenty of good guesses via list and also direct.
Some of you have hoped I will not publish them with their names and do not worry I wont´t.
Graham – I /we got an empty message from you – please retype it – I am sure it will be a good info.
One of you have guessed the problem was because a broken de-icing rubber in the prop blade. That´s good but unfortunately my Europa is so far still missing de-icing systems totally. They would be soon very useful in Finland.
***
No one has so far found a reason for my vibra.
So there are still a possibility to get an Xmas packet from Finland.
I quarantee the shipment will be worth of making a good guess.
***
Tips:
- the reason was off /on or black /white –type and very easy to repair; it was fixed in seconds.
- when finally found it was not invisible at all.
Go On!
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT
From: Raimo Toivio (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)
Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2011 10:44 PM
To: [url=mailto:europa-list(at)matronics.com]europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)[/url]
Subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
All
I have hope-so a nice riddle for you.
Maybe all the answers are useful – let´s collect them all:
***
Yesterday I took off from a very remote /small /windy (90 degrees 12 knots and gusting MUCH) grass strip. Soon until well over the ground at altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on and gears up I felt suddenly let us say medium or more shake and vibration. My immediate reaction was to go around and land immediately but abandoned because wind was so furious and I felt I cannot do that (a succesful landing).
I decided to try to fly to the next possible sensible airfield EFHV which was 10 minutes apart.
Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a 2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode (in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. My airspeed was w that selection about 110 knots but because of a strong headwind GS was only about 70 knots (wanted to be clearly over the ground at 3000 ft because it was well over sunset and totally dark, yesterday we got sunset around 1600 Zulutime and time was well over 1630 when flying).
So, I pushed home one looooong hour. All the aerodynamics were well. I was a bit worried my engine will separate or so. When trying to push more pwr it was more vibra and when trying to pull less pwr same. I Followed a main highway and decided to land there if feeling so. Cars there with lights are almost like a lighted runway...
Finally landing to the EFTP flawlesly.
***
Today we had a FHGP (Family Hangar Grill Party). I tried to check my plane as well as I can. I found something. Very small evidence but something anyway. I tried to fix it and had a test run. I elected to go to fly – hey I am a test pilot who else – and She was better than ever!
I managed to do 2 touches and goes when C172 did one with same runway.
140 knots during downwind makes me always happy.
***
So – dear Ladies and Gentlemen – what was wrong?
It would be nice and very life-useful to hear your opinions or guesses what was wrong.
***
The Rules: one single guess per person, please.
The Prize: The Best Guess will get a Very Special Xmas Present from Finland!
***
I will let you know a solution after a week – be patient.
Have a nice weekend and
Cheers, Raimo Toivio
<Europa%20A2A-ala2OK[1].png>
Europa XS Mono OH-XRT #417
Updated flight hours /landings: 258,3
37500 Lempaala
FINLAND
p +358-3-3753 777
f +358-3-3753 100
toivio(at)fly.to (toivio(at)fly.to)
www.rwm.fi
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
[b]
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
zwakie
Joined: 03 Aug 2009
Posts: 157
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi
Guest
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 8:03 am Post subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
|
|
Jet,
you may also guess twice (because you are pilot´s
wife):
- notice that shaking and vibration was not
momentary! Every time I tried to change
powersettings up or down, more or less, an awful
trembling came back. Maybe I am a bit sensitive
(for trembling planes!) but that was really
alarming.
- 5400 rpm & 20 inches were in the lowest point of
that vibration curve
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT Finland
-----Alkuperäinen viesti-----
From: zwakie
Sent: Monday, October 03, 2011 5:34 PM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Heavy In-flight
Vibration Riddle
<mz(at)cariama.nl>
Some sort of contamination found it's way into the
spinner hole of one of the prop blades, preventing
full travel for just this blade's pitch?
Jet
(Marcel's wife) [Wink]
--------
Marcel
(Europa Classic Tri-Gear PH-MZW)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=353877#353877
browse
Un/Subscription,
FAQ,
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List
Forums!
List Admin.
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
europabill(at)bellsouth.n
Guest
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 8:24 am Post subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
|
|
Ramio,
Sounds like a throttle cable to one carb was loose causing the spring to
hold full throttle on the carb while you could vary the other as it was
connected properly.
Bill
A010 Classic Monowheel
---
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Speedbird
Joined: 18 Jan 2008
Posts: 9
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 8:27 am Post subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
|
|
Spark Plugs...?
Cheers!
-----Ursprungligt meddelande-----
From: Raimo Toivio
Sent: Monday, October 03, 2011 6:00 PM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Jet,
you may also guess twice (because you are pilot´s
wife):
- notice that shaking and vibration was not
momentary! Every time I tried to change
powersettings up or down, more or less, an awful
trembling came back. Maybe I am a bit sensitive
(for trembling planes!) but that was really
alarming.
- 5400 rpm & 20 inches were in the lowest point of
that vibration curve
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT Finland
-----Alkuperäinen viesti-----
From: zwakie
Sent: Monday, October 03, 2011 5:34 PM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Heavy In-flight
Vibration Riddle
<mz(at)cariama.nl>
Some sort of contamination found it's way into the
spinner hole of one of the prop blades, preventing
full travel for just this blade's pitch?
Jet
(Marcel's wife) [Wink]
--------
Marcel
(Europa Classic Tri-Gear PH-MZW)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=353877#353877
browse
Un/Subscription,
FAQ,
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List
Forums!
List Admin.
__________ Information från ESET Smart Security, version av
virussignaturdatabas 6513 (20111003) __________
Meddelandet har kontrollerats av ESET Smart Security.
http://www.esetscandinavia.com
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz
Guest
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 11:52 am Post subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
|
|
Hi Raimo,
Yes I am Tim’s daughter, Hannah, and my second guess is;
Was the Airmaster Auto/Man switch left on Man for the Take-off?
Cheers,
Hannah
Tim Ward,
12 Waiwetu Street,
Fendalton,
Christchurch 8052
New Zealand
Ph; 03 3515166
Mob; 0210640221
email; ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz
From: Raimo Toivio (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)
Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2011 2:58 AM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Hanna,
are you sure you are Hanna or in fact Tim, Hanna´s dad (who is going to try to win desperately the shipment from Finland) ?
If you really are Hanna; you may try 2nd time, because you are a pilot´s daughter.
Please read my first mail once again carefully: I wrote
“Soon until well over the ground at altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on ... “
Notice also, these words below are really essential info, something maybe to do with prop/pwr –settings:
“Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a 2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode (in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. “
***
All,
One of you is now really close, physically say 50 mm /2" inches.
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT Finland
From: Tim Ward (ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz)
Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2011 9:39 PM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Raimo,
Two thoughts.
Fuel starvation with the fuel pumps not turned on for take off?
Cheers,
Hannah
Tim daughter
Tim Ward 12 Waiwetu Street
Fendalton,
Christchurch, 8052
New Zealand.
ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz (ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz)
Ph 64 3 3515166
Mob 0210640221
On 3/10/2011, at 4:58 AM, "Raimo Toivio" <raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)> wrote:
[quote] All
I have got plenty of good guesses via list and also direct.
Some of you have hoped I will not publish them with their names and do not worry I wont´t.
Graham – I /we got an empty message from you – please retype it – I am sure it will be a good info.
One of you have guessed the problem was because a broken de-icing rubber in the prop blade. That´s good but unfortunately my Europa is so far still missing de-icing systems totally. They would be soon very useful in Finland.
***
No one has so far found a reason for my vibra.
So there are still a possibility to get an Xmas packet from Finland.
I quarantee the shipment will be worth of making a good guess.
***
Tips:
- the reason was off /on or black /white –type and very easy to repair; it was fixed in seconds.
- when finally found it was not invisible at all.
Go On!
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT
From: Raimo Toivio (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)
Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2011 10:44 PM
To: [url=mailto:europa-list(at)matronics.com]europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)[/url]
Subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
All
I have hope-so a nice riddle for you.
Maybe all the answers are useful – let´s collect them all:
***
Yesterday I took off from a very remote /small /windy (90 degrees 12 knots and gusting MUCH) grass strip. Soon until well over the ground at altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on and gears up I felt suddenly let us say medium or more shake and vibration. My immediate reaction was to go around and land immediately but abandoned because wind was so furious and I felt I cannot do that (a succesful landing).
I decided to try to fly to the next possible sensible airfield EFHV which was 10 minutes apart.
Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a 2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode (in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. My airspeed was w that selection about 110 knots but because of a strong headwind GS was only about 70 knots (wanted to be clearly over the ground at 3000 ft because it was well over sunset and totally dark, yesterday we got sunset around 1600 Zulutime and time was well over 1630 when flying).
So, I pushed home one looooong hour. All the aerodynamics were well. I was a bit worried my engine will separate or so. When trying to push more pwr it was more vibra and when trying to pull less pwr same. I Followed a main highway and decided to land there if feeling so. Cars there with lights are almost like a lighted runway...
Finally landing to the EFTP flawlesly.
***
Today we had a FHGP (Family Hangar Grill Party). I tried to check my plane as well as I can. I found something. Very small evidence but something anyway. I tried to fix it and had a test run. I elected to go to fly – hey I am a test pilot who else – and She was better than ever!
I managed to do 2 touches and goes when C172 did one with same runway.
140 knots during downwind makes me always happy.
***
So – dear Ladies and Gentlemen – what was wrong?
It would be nice and very life-useful to hear your opinions or guesses what was wrong.
***
The Rules: one single guess per person, please.
The Prize: The Best Guess will get a Very Special Xmas Present from Finland!
***
I will let you know a solution after a week – be patient.
Have a nice weekend and
Cheers, Raimo Toivio
<Europa%20A2A-ala2OK[1].png>
Europa XS Mono OH-XRT #417
Updated flight hours /landings: 258,3
37500 Lempaala
FINLAND
p +358-3-3753 777
f +358-3-3753 100
toivio(at)fly.to (toivio(at)fly.to)
www.rwm.fi
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
[b]
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
bill.sue(at)orcon.net.nz
Guest
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 12:33 pm Post subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
|
|
Hi Raimo,
I suggest your spinner cracked at the rear and lost a piece of metal or the retaining screw.
Cheers from New Zealand
ZK CHV
MONO XS. 914. Airmaster.
950hrs
On 4/10/2011 8:49 a.m., Tim Ward wrote: [quote] Hi Raimo,
Yes I am Tim’s daughter, Hannah, and my second guess is;
Was the Airmaster Auto/Man switch left on Man for the Take-off?
Cheers,
Hannah
Â
Tim Ward,
12 Waiwetu Street,
Fendalton,
Christchurch 8052
New Zealand
Ph; 03 3515166
Mob; 0210640221
email; ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz (ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz)
Â
From: Raimo Toivio (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)
Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2011 2:58 AM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Â
Hanna,
Â
are you sure you are Hanna or in fact Tim, Hanna´s dad (who is going to try to win desperately the shipment from Finland) ?
Â
If you really are Hanna; you may try 2nd time, because you are a pilot´s daughter.
Â
Please read my first mail once again carefully: I wrote
Â
“Soon until well over the ground at altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on ... “
Â
Notice also, these words below are really essential info, something maybe to do with prop/pwr –settings:
Â
“Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a 2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode (in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. “
Â
***
Â
All,
Â
Â
One of you is now really close, physically say 50 mm /2" inches.
Â
Â
Â
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT Finland
Â
Â
Â
Â
Â
Â
From: Tim Ward (ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz)
Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2011 9:39 PM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Â
Raimo,
Two thoughts.
Fuel starvation with the fuel pumps not turned on for take off?
Â
Cheers,
Â
Hannah
Â
Tim daughter
Tim Ward 12 Waiwetu Street
Fendalton,
Christchurch, 8052
New Zealand.
Â
ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz (ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz)
Â
Ph 64 3 3515166
Mob 0210640221
Â
On 3/10/2011, at 4:58 AM, "Raimo Toivio" <raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)> wrote:
| Quote: | All
Â
I have got plenty of good guesses via list and also direct.
Some of you have hoped I will not publish them with their names and do not worry I wont´t.
Â
Graham – I /we got an empty message from you – please retype it – I am sure it will be a good info.
Â
One of you have guessed the problem was because a broken de-icing rubber in the prop blade. That´s good but unfortunately my Europa is so far still missing de-icing systems totally. They would be soon very useful in Finland.
Â
***
Â
No one has so far found a reason for my vibra.
Â
So there are still a possibility to get an Xmas packet from Finland.
I quarantee the shipment will be worth of making a good guess.
Â
***
Tips:
Â
- the reason was off /on or black /white –type and very easy to repair; it was fixed in seconds.
- when finally found it was not invisible at all.
Â
Go On!
Â
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT
Â
Â
  Â
Â
From: Raimo Toivio (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)
Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2011 10:44 PM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Â
All
Â
I have hope-so a nice riddle for you.
Â
Maybe all the answers are useful – let´s collect them all:
Â
***
Â
Yesterday I took off from a very remote /small /windy (90 degrees 12 knots and gusting MUCH) grass strip. Soon until well over the ground at altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on and gears up I felt suddenly let us say medium or more shake and vibration. My immediate reaction was to go around and land immediately but abandoned because wind was so furious and I felt I cannot do that (a succesful landing).
Â
I decided to try to fly to the next possible sensible airfield EFHV which was 10 minutes apart.
Â
Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a 2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode (in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. My airspeed was w that selection about 110 knots but because of a strong headwind GS was only about 70 knots (wanted to be clearly over the ground at 3000 ft because it was well over sunset and totally dark, yesterday we got sunset around 1600 Zulutime and time was well over 1630 when flying).
Â
So, I pushed home one looooong hour. All the aerodynamics were well. I was a bit worried my engine will separate or so. When trying to push more pwr it was more vibra and when trying to pull less pwr same. I Followed a main highway and decided to land there if feeling so. Cars there with lights are almost like a lighted runway...
Â
Finally landing to the EFTP flawlesly.
Â
***
Â
Today we had a FHGP (Family Hangar Grill Party). I tried to check my plane as well as I can. I found something. Very small evidence but something anyway. I tried to fix it and had a test run. I elected to go to fly – hey I am a test pilot who else – and She was better than ever!
Â
I managed to do 2 touches and goes when C172 did one with same runway.
Â
140 knots during downwind makes me always happy.
Â
***
Â
So – dear Ladies and Gentlemen – what was wrong?
Â
It would be nice and very life-useful to hear your opinions or guesses what was wrong.
Â
***
Â
The Rules: one single guess per person, please.
Â
The Prize: The Best Guess will get a Very Special Xmas Present from Finland!
Â
***
Â
I will let you know a solution after a week – be patient.
Â
Have a nice weekend and
Â
Cheers, Raimo Toivio
<Europa%20A2A-ala2OK[1].png>
Europa XS Mono OH-XRT #417
Updated flight hours /landings: 258,3
37500 Lempaala
FINLAND
p +358-3-3753 777
f +358-3-3753 100
toivio(at)fly.to (toivio(at)fly.to)
www.rwm.fi
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
|
[b]
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
kingsnjan(at)westnet.com.
Guest
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 1:01 pm Post subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
|
|
Raimo,
I don't know if you use tapes to seal any of the flying surfaces but if so, I suspect one might have come unstuck.
Cheers
Kingsley
[quote][b]
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
zwakie
Joined: 03 Aug 2009
Posts: 157
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Trevpond(at)aol.com
Guest
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 1:33 pm Post subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
|
|
Hi Raimo,
Sticky carbuerettor slide.
regards
Trev
G-LINN
In a message dated 03/10/2011 21:33:37 GMT Daylight Time, bill.sue(at)orcon.net.nz writes:
| Quote: | Hi Raimo,
I suggest your spinner cracked at the rear and lost a piece of metal or the retaining screw.
Cheers from New Zealand
ZK CHV
MONO XS. 914. Airmaster.
950hrs
On 4/10/2011 8:49 a.m., Tim Ward wrote: | Quote: | Hi Raimo,
Yes I am Tim’s daughter, Hannah, and my second guess is;
Was the Airmaster Auto/Man switch left on Man for the Take-off?
Cheers,
Hannah
Tim Ward,
12 Waiwetu Street,
Fendalton,
Christchurch 8052
New Zealand
Ph; 03 3515166
Mob; 0210640221
email; ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz (ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz)
From: Raimo Toivio (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)
Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2011 2:58 AM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Hanna,
are you sure you are Hanna or in fact Tim, Hanna´s dad (who is going to try to win desperately the shipment from Finland) ?
If you really are Hanna; you may try 2nd time, because you are a pilot´s daughter.
Please read my first mail once again carefully: I wrote
“Soon until well over the ground at altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on ... “
Notice also, these words below are really essential info, something maybe to do with prop/pwr –settings:
“Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a 2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode (in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. “
***
All,
One of you is now really close, physically say 50 mm /2" inches.
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT Finland
From: Tim Ward (ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz)
Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2011 9:39 PM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Raimo,
Two thoughts.
Fuel starvation with the fuel pumps not turned on for take off?
Cheers,
Hannah
Tim daughter
Tim Ward 12 Waiwetu Street
Fendalton,
Christchurch, 8052
New Zealand.
ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz (ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz)
Ph 64 3 3515166
Mob 0210640221
On 3/10/2011, at 4:58 AM, "Raimo Toivio" <raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)> wrote:
| Quote: | All
I have got plenty of good guesses via list and also direct.
Some of you have hoped I will not publish them with their names and do not worry I wont´t.
Graham – I /we got an empty message from you – please retype it – I am sure it will be a good info.
One of you have guessed the problem was because a broken de-icing rubber in the prop blade. That´s good but unfortunately my Europa is so far still missing de-icing systems totally. They would be soon very useful in Finland.
***
No one has so far found a reason for my vibra.
So there are still a possibility to get an Xmas packet from Finland.
I quarantee the shipment will be worth of making a good guess.
***
Tips:
- the reason was off /on or black /white –type and very easy to repair; it was fixed in seconds.
- when finally found it was not invisible at all.
Go On!
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT
From: Raimo Toivio (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)
Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2011 10:44 PM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
All
I have hope-so a nice riddle for you.
Maybe all the answers are useful – let´s collect them all:
***
Yesterday I took off from a very remote /small /windy (90 degrees 12 knots and gusting MUCH) grass strip. Soon until well over the ground at altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on and gears up I felt suddenly let us say medium or more shake and vibration. My immediate reaction was to go around and land immediately but abandoned because wind was so furious and I felt I cannot do that (a succesful landing).
I decided to try to fly to the next possible sensible airfield EFHV which was 10 minutes apart.
Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a 2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode (in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. My airspeed was w that selection about 110 knots but because of a strong headwind GS was only about 70 knots (wanted to be clearly over the ground at 3000 ft because it was well over sunset and totally dark, yesterday we got sunset around 1600 Zulutime and time was well over 1630 when flying).
So, I pushed home one looooong hour. All the aerodynamics were well. I was a bit worried my engine will separate or so. When trying to push more pwr it was more vibra and when trying to pull less pwr same. I Followed a main highway and decided to land there if feeling so. Cars there with lights are almost like a lighted runway...
Finally landing to the EFTP flawlesly.
***
Today we had a FHGP (Family Hangar Grill Party). I tried to check my plane as well as I can. I found something. Very small evidence but something anyway. I tried to fix it and had a test run. I elected to go to fly – hey I am a test pilot who else – and She was better than ever!
I managed to do 2 touches and goes when C172 did one with same runway.
140 knots during downwind makes me always happy.
***
So – dear Ladies and Gentlemen – what was wrong?
It would be nice and very life-useful to hear your opinions or guesses what was wrong.
***
The Rules: one single guess per person, please.
The Prize: The Best Guess will get a Very Special Xmas Present from Finland!
***
I will let you know a solution after a week – be patient.
Have a nice weekend and
Cheers, Raimo Toivio
<Europa%20A2A-ala2OK[1].png>
Europa XS Mono OH-XRT #417
Updated flight hours /landings: 258,3
37500 Lempaala
FINLAND
p +358-3-3753 777
f +358-3-3753 100
toivio(at)fly.to (toivio(at)fly.to)
www.rwm.fi
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
|
ef="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List
s.matronics.com/">http://forums.matronics.com
p://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
|
|
[quote][b]
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
rambug
Joined: 19 Sep 2010
Posts: 4
Location: Montréal
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 3:14 pm Post subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
|
|
Hello this is Françoise, Luc's wife.
Could it be something that obstructed the airflow to the airbox in an intermittent manner ? Such as a leaf flapping ?
I assume that now, as all spouses, I do get a 2nd chance... I will use it soon...
Regards from Montreal,
Françoise, Luc and little Iris...
On Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 09:58, Raimo Toivio <raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)> wrote:
[quote] Hanna,
are you sure you are Hanna or in fact Tim, Hanna´s dad (who is going to try to win desperately the shipment from Finland) ?
If you really are Hanna; you may try 2nd time, because you are a pilot´s daughter.
Please read my first mail once again carefully: I wrote
“Soon until well over the ground at altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on ... “
Notice also, these words below are really essential info, something maybe to do with prop/pwr –settings:
“Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a 2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode (in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. “
***
All,
One of you is now really close, physically say 50 mm /2" inches.
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT Finland
From: Tim Ward (ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz)
Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2011 9:39 PM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Raimo,
Two thoughts.
Fuel starvation with the fuel pumps not turned on for take off?
Cheers,
Hannah
Tim daughter
Tim Ward 12 Waiwetu Street
Fendalton,
Christchurch, 8052
New Zealand.
ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz (ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz)
Ph 64 3 3515166
Mob 0210640221
On 3/10/2011, at 4:58 AM, "Raimo Toivio" <raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)> wrote:
| Quote: | All
I have got plenty of good guesses via list and also direct.
Some of you have hoped I will not publish them with their names and do not worry I wont´t.
Graham – I /we got an empty message from you – please retype it – I am sure it will be a good info.
One of you have guessed the problem was because a broken de-icing rubber in the prop blade. That´s good but unfortunately my Europa is so far still missing de-icing systems totally. They would be soon very useful in Finland.
***
No one has so far found a reason for my vibra.
So there are still a possibility to get an Xmas packet from Finland.
I quarantee the shipment will be worth of making a good guess.
***
Tips:
- the reason was off /on or black /white –type and very easy to repair; it was fixed in seconds.
- when finally found it was not invisible at all.
Go On!
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT
From: Raimo Toivio (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)
Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2011 10:44 PM
To: (europa-list(at)matronics.com)europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
All
I have hope-so a nice riddle for you.
Maybe all the answers are useful – let´s collect them all:
***
Yesterday I took off from a very remote /small /windy (90 degrees 12 knots and gusting MUCH) grass strip. Soon until well over the ground at altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on and gears up I felt suddenly let us say medium or more shake and vibration. My immediate reaction was to go around and land immediately but abandoned because wind was so furious and I felt I cannot do that (a succesful landing).
I decided to try to fly to the next possible sensible airfield EFHV which was 10 minutes apart.
Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a 2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode (in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. My airspeed was w that selection about 110 knots but because of a strong headwind GS was only about 70 knots (wanted to be clearly over the ground at 3000 ft because it was well over sunset and totally dark, yesterday we got sunset around 1600 Zulutime and time was well over 1630 when flying).
So, I pushed home one looooong hour. All the aerodynamics were well. I was a bit worried my engine will separate or so. When trying to push more pwr it was more vibra and when trying to pull less pwr same. I Followed a main highway and decided to land there if feeling so. Cars there with lights are almost like a lighted runway...
Finally landing to the EFTP flawlesly.
***
Today we had a FHGP (Family Hangar Grill Party). I tried to check my plane as well as I can. I found something. Very small evidence but something anyway. I tried to fix it and had a test run. I elected to go to fly – hey I am a test pilot who else – and She was better than ever!
I managed to do 2 touches and goes when C172 did one with same runway.
140 knots during downwind makes me always happy.
***
So – dear Ladies and Gentlemen – what was wrong?
It would be nice and very life-useful to hear your opinions or guesses what was wrong.
***
The Rules: one single guess per person, please.
The Prize: The Best Guess will get a Very Special Xmas Present from Finland!
***
I will let you know a solution after a week – be patient.
Have a nice weekend and
Cheers, Raimo Toivio
<Europa%20A2A-ala2OK[1].png>
Europa XS Mono OH-XRT #417
Updated flight hours /landings: 258,3
37500 Lempaala
FINLAND
p [url=tel:%2B358-3-3753%20777]+358-3-3753 777[/url]
f [url=tel:%2B358-3-3753%20100]+358-3-3753 100[/url]
toivio(at)fly.to (toivio(at)fly.to)
www.rwm.fi
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
|
| Quote: |
arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
|
[b]
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List |
|
_________________
Luc Michaud
Europa Monowheel A059
Canadian Registration C-GLOB (in progress)
Montreal, Québec, Canada |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
grahamsingleton(at)btinte
Guest
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 3:17 pm Post subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
|
|
Could be Trev. One carb on fixed power and the other on variable therefore only smooth at one power setting. Must have been a glide approach when you got home Raimo?
Graham
From: "Trevpond(at)aol.com" <Trevpond(at)aol.com>
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, 3 October, 2011 22:31:05
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Hi Raimo,
Sticky carbuerettor slide.
regards
Trev
G-LINN
In a message dated 03/10/2011 21:33:37 GMT Daylight Time, bill.sue(at)orcon.net.nz writes:
| Quote: | Hi Raimo,
I suggest your spinner cracked at the rear and lost a piece of metal or the retaining screw.
Cheers from New Zealand
ZK CHV
MONO XS. 914. Airmaster.
950hrs
On 4/10/2011 8:49 a.m., Tim Ward wrote: | Quote: | Hi Raimo,
Yes I am Tim’s daughter, Hannah, and my second guess is;
Was the Airmaster Auto/Man switch left on Man for the Take-off?
Cheers,
Hannah
Tim Ward,
12 Waiwetu Street,
Fendalton,
Christchurch 8052
New Zealand
Ph; 03 3515166
Mob; 0210640221
email; ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz (ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz)
From: Raimo Toivio (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)
Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2011 2:58 AM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Hanna,
are you sure you are Hanna or in fact Tim, Hanna´s dad (who is going to try to win desperately the shipment from Finland) ?
If you really are Hanna; you may try 2nd time, because you are a pilot´s daughter.
Please read my first mail once again carefully: I wrote
“Soon until well over the ground at altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on ... “
Notice also, these words below are really essential info, something maybe to do with prop/pwr –settings:
“Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a 2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode (in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. “
***
All,
One of you is now really close, physically say 50 mm /2" inches.
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT Finland
From: Tim Ward (ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz)
Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2011 9:39 PM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Raimo,
Two thoughts.
Fuel starvation with the fuel pumps not turned on for take off?
Cheers,
Hannah
Tim daughter
Tim Ward 12 Waiwetu Street
Fendalton,
Christchurch, 8052
New Zealand.
ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz (ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz)
Ph 64 3 3515166
Mob 0210640221
On 3/10/2011, at 4:58 AM, "Raimo Toivio" <raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)> wrote:
| Quote: | All
I have got plenty of good guesses via list and also direct.
Some of you have hoped I will not publish them with their names and do not worry I wont´t.
Graham – I /we got an empty message from you – please retype it – I am sure it will be a good info.
One of you have guessed the problem was because a broken de-icing rubber in the prop blade. That´s good but unfortunately my Europa is so far still missing de-icing systems totally. They would be soon very useful in Finland.
***
No one has so far found a reason for my vibra.
So there are still a possibility to get an Xmas packet from Finland.
I quarantee the shipment will be worth of making a good guess.
***
Tips:
- the reason was off /on or black /white –type and very easy to repair; it was fixed in seconds.
- when finally found it was not invisible at all.
Go On!
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT
From: Raimo Toivio (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)
Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2011 10:44 PM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
All
I have hope-so a nice riddle for you.
Maybe all the answers are useful – let´s collect them all:
***
Yesterday I took off from a very remote /small /windy (90 degrees 12 knots and gusting MUCH) grass strip. Soon until well over the ground at altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on and gears up I felt suddenly let us say medium or more shake and vibration. My immediate reaction was to go around and land immediately but abandoned because wind was so furious and I felt I cannot do that (a succesful landing).
I decided to try to fly to the next possible sensible airfield EFHV which was 10 minutes apart.
Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a 2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode (in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. My airspeed was w that selection about 110 knots but because of a strong headwind GS was only about 70 knots (wanted to be clearly over the ground at 3000 ft because it was well over sunset and totally dark, yesterday we got sunset around 1600 Zulutime and time was well over 1630 when flying).
So, I pushed home one looooong hour. All the aerodynamics were well. I was a bit worried my engine will separate or so. When trying to push more pwr it was more vibra and when trying to pull less pwr same. I Followed a main highway and decided to land there if feeling so. Cars there with lights are almost like a lighted runway...
Finally landing to the EFTP flawlesly.
***
Today we had a FHGP (Family Hangar Grill Party). I tried to check my plane as well as I can. I found something. Very small evidence but something anyway. I tried to fix it and had a test run. I elected to go to fly – hey I am a test pilot who else – and She was better than ever!
I managed to do 2 touches and goes when C172 did one with same runway.
140 knots during downwind makes me always happy.
***
So – dear Ladies and Gentlemen – what was wrong?
It would be nice and very life-useful to hear your opinions or guesses what was wrong.
***
The Rules: one single guess per person, please.
The Prize: The Best Guess will get a Very Special Xmas Present from Finland!
***
I will let you know a solution after a week – be patient.
Have a nice weekend and
Cheers, Raimo Toivio
<Europa%20A2A-ala2OK[1].png>
Europa XS Mono OH-XRT #417
Updated flight hours /landings: 258,3
37500 Lempaala
FINLAND
p +358-3-3753 777
f +358-3-3753 100
toivio(at)fly.to (toivio(at)fly.to)
www.rwm.fi
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">[url= target=]http://www.matronhref=[/url]"http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">[url= target=]http://www.matronhref=[/url]"http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
|
ef="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List
s.matronics.com/">http://forums.matronics.com
p://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
|
|
| Quote: | http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Eurank" href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://www.matronics.com/contri===
|
[quote][b]
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
grahamsingleton(at)btinte
Guest
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 3:17 pm Post subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
|
|
that's what I guessed too
Graham
From: zwakie <mz(at)cariama.nl>
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, 3 October, 2011 22:07:19
Subject: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
--> Europa-List message posted by: "zwakie" <mz(at)cariama.nl (mz(at)cariama.nl)>
Thanks Raimo for offering me a second chance (Marcel already told me you seem to have a weak spot for women [Wink] )
My second guess: one of the carb venting tubes got detached from the plenum chamber.
Jet
--------
Marcel
(Europa Classic Tri-Gear PH-MZW)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=353931#353931
http://forums.matronics.  tronics.com/contribution" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contri================
[quote][b]
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
rlborger(at)mac.com
Guest
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 5:02 pm Post subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
|
|
Raimo,
I think that Graham is very close. I was thinking that on advancing the throttle only one carb was advancing, that's why it ran better at low throttle setting and with a light load (high rpm setting on prop). One cable kinked in the throttle box so only one carb advanced.
Blue skies & tail winds,
Bob Borger
On Oct 1, 2011, at 2:44 PM, Raimo Toivio wrote:
| Quote: | All
I have hope-so a nice riddle for you.
Maybe all the answers are useful – let´s collect them all:
***
Yesterday I took off from a very remote /small /windy (90 degrees 12 knots and gusting MUCH) grass strip. Soon until well over the ground at altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on and gears up I felt suddenly let us say medium or more shake and vibration. My immediate reaction was to go around and land immediately but abandoned because wind was so furious and I felt I cannot do that (a succesful landing).
I decided to try to fly to the next possible sensible airfield EFHV which was 10 minutes apart.
Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a 2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode (in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. My airspeed was w that selection about 110 knots but because of a strong headwind GS was only about 70 knots (wanted to be clearly over the ground at 3000 ft because it was well over sunset and totally dark, yesterday we got sunset around 1600 Zulutime and time was well over 1630 when flying).
So, I pushed home one looooong hour. All the aerodynamics were well. I was a bit worried my engine will separate or so. When trying to push more pwr it was more vibra and when trying to pull less pwr same. I Followed a main highway and decided to land there if feeling so. Cars there with lights are almost like a lighted runway...
Finally landing to the EFTP flawlesly.
***
Today we had a FHGP (Family Hangar Grill Party). I tried to check my plane as well as I can. I found something. Very small evidence but something anyway. I tried to fix it and had a test run. I elected to go to fly – hey I am a test pilot who else – and She was better than ever!
I managed to do 2 touches and goes when C172 did one with same runway.
140 knots during downwind makes me always happy.
***
So – dear Ladies and Gentlemen – what was wrong?
It would be nice and very life-useful to hear your opinions or guesses what was wrong.
***
The Rules: one single guess per person, please.
The Prize: The Best Guess will get a Very Special Xmas Present from Finland!
***
I will let you know a solution after a week – be patient.
Have a nice weekend and
Cheers, Raimo Toivio
<Europa%20A2A-ala2OK[1].png>
Europa XS Mono OH-XRT #417
Updated flight hours /landings: 258,3
37500 Lempaala
FINLAND
p +358-3-3753 777
f +358-3-3753 100
toivio(at)fly.to (toivio(at)fly.to)
www.rwm.fi
<Europa_2011_vibration_grill_party.jpg><Europa_2011_just_before_test_flight.jpg><Europa_2011_just_before_shakeing.jpg><Europa_2011_going_fast.jpg> |
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
keithhickling(at)clear.ne
Guest
|
| Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 5:21 pm Post subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
|
|
Or one of the springs that open the throttles come off - it only took 2 seconds to fix remember, and was quite visible. I think the springs come off quite easily.
Keith Hickling,
New Zealand.
"I was thinking that on advancing the throttle only one carb was advancing, that's why it ran better at low throttle setting and with a light load (high rpm setting on prop). One cable kinked in the throttle box so only one carb advanced. "
Blue skies & tail winds,
Bob Borger
[quote][b]
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2011 9:12 am Post subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
|
|
Dear Graham,
that was a good one. But is was not reality this time: when I took power off during a long and high final, it was really off.
So it was a glide abroach but only because I wanted so (and the engine was idling).
Raimo OH-XRT Finland
From: GRAHAM SINGLETON (grahamsingleton(at)btinternet.com)
Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2011 2:14 AM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Could be Trev. One carb on fixed power and the other on variable therefore only smooth at one power setting. Must have been a glide approach when you got home Raimo?
Graham
From: "Trevpond(at)aol.com" <Trevpond(at)aol.com>
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, 3 October, 2011 22:31:05
Subject: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Hi Raimo,
Sticky carbuerettor slide.
regards
Trev
G-LINN
In a message dated 03/10/2011 21:33:37 GMT Daylight Time, bill.sue(at)orcon.net.nz writes:
| Quote: | Hi Raimo,
I suggest your spinner cracked at the rear and lost a piece of metal or the retaining screw.
Cheers from New Zealand
ZK CHV
MONO XS. 914. Airmaster.
950hrs
On 4/10/2011 8:49 a.m., Tim Ward wrote: | Quote: | Hi Raimo,
Yes I am Tim’s daughter, Hannah, and my second guess is;
Was the Airmaster Auto/Man switch left on Man for the Take-off?
Cheers,
Hannah
Tim Ward,
12 Waiwetu Street,
Fendalton,
Christchurch 8052
New Zealand
Ph; 03 3515166
Mob; 0210640221
email; ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz (ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz)
From: Raimo Toivio (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)
Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2011 2:58 AM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Hanna,
are you sure you are Hanna or in fact Tim, Hanna´s dad (who is going to try to win desperately the shipment from Finland) ?
If you really are Hanna; you may try 2nd time, because you are a pilot´s daughter.
Please read my first mail once again carefully: I wrote
“Soon until well over the ground at altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on ... “
Notice also, these words below are really essential info, something maybe to do with prop/pwr –settings:
“Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a 2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode (in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. “
***
All,
One of you is now really close, physically say 50 mm /2" inches.
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT Finland
From: Tim Ward (ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz)
Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2011 9:39 PM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Raimo,
Two thoughts.
Fuel starvation with the fuel pumps not turned on for take off?
Cheers,
Hannah
Tim daughter
Tim Ward 12 Waiwetu Street
Fendalton,
Christchurch, 8052
New Zealand.
ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz (ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz)
Ph 64 3 3515166
Mob 0210640221
On 3/10/2011, at 4:58 AM, "Raimo Toivio" <raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)> wrote:
| Quote: | All
I have got plenty of good guesses via list and also direct.
Some of you have hoped I will not publish them with their names and do not worry I wont´t.
Graham – I /we got an empty message from you – please retype it – I am sure it will be a good info.
One of you have guessed the problem was because a broken de-icing rubber in the prop blade. That´s good but unfortunately my Europa is so far still missing de-icing systems totally. They would be soon very useful in Finland.
***
No one has so far found a reason for my vibra.
So there are still a possibility to get an Xmas packet from Finland.
I quarantee the shipment will be worth of making a good guess.
***
Tips:
- the reason was off /on or black /white –type and very easy to repair; it was fixed in seconds.
- when finally found it was not invisible at all.
Go On!
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT
From: Raimo Toivio (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)
Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2011 10:44 PM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
All
I have hope-so a nice riddle for you.
Maybe all the answers are useful – let´s collect them all:
***
Yesterday I took off from a very remote /small /windy (90 degrees 12 knots and gusting MUCH) grass strip. Soon until well over the ground at altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on and gears up I felt suddenly let us say medium or more shake and vibration. My immediate reaction was to go around and land immediately but abandoned because wind was so furious and I felt I cannot do that (a succesful landing).
I decided to try to fly to the next possible sensible airfield EFHV which was 10 minutes apart.
Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a 2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode (in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. My airspeed was w that selection about 110 knots but because of a strong headwind GS was only about 70 knots (wanted to be clearly over the ground at 3000 ft because it was well over sunset and totally dark, yesterday we got sunset around 1600 Zulutime and time was well over 1630 when flying).
So, I pushed home one looooong hour. All the aerodynamics were well. I was a bit worried my engine will separate or so. When trying to push more pwr it was more vibra and when trying to pull less pwr same. I Followed a main highway and decided to land there if feeling so. Cars there with lights are almost like a lighted runway...
Finally landing to the EFTP flawlesly.
***
Today we had a FHGP (Family Hangar Grill Party). I tried to check my plane as well as I can. I found something. Very small evidence but something anyway. I tried to fix it and had a test run. I elected to go to fly – hey I am a test pilot who else – and She was better than ever!
I managed to do 2 touches and goes when C172 did one with same runway.
140 knots during downwind makes me always happy.
***
So – dear Ladies and Gentlemen – what was wrong?
It would be nice and very life-useful to hear your opinions or guesses what was wrong.
***
The Rules: one single guess per person, please.
The Prize: The Best Guess will get a Very Special Xmas Present from Finland!
***
I will let you know a solution after a week – be patient.
Have a nice weekend and
Cheers, Raimo Toivio
<Europa%20A2A-ala2OK[1].png>
Europa XS Mono OH-XRT #417
Updated flight hours /landings: 258,3
37500 Lempaala
FINLAND
p +358-3-3753 777
f +358-3-3753 100
toivio(at)fly.to (toivio(at)fly.to)
www.rwm.fi
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronhref=/"http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronhref=/"http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
|
ef="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List
s.matronics.com/">http://forums.matronics.com
p://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
|
|
[quote]http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Eurank" href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://www.matronics.com/contri===
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
[b]
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2011 9:14 am Post subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle |
|
|
Luc,
what is your girlfriend´s opinion?
If your wife´s name is Francoise, I am sure you have a mistress or even several.
R
do not archive
From: Luc Michaud (rambug(at)gmail.com)
Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2011 2:09 AM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Hello this is Françoise, Luc's wife.
Could it be something that obstructed the airflow to the airbox in an intermittent manner ? Such as a leaf flapping ?
I assume that now, as all spouses, I do get a 2nd chance... I will use it soon...
Regards from Montreal,
Françoise, Luc and little Iris...
On Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 09:58, Raimo Toivio <raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)> wrote:
| Quote: | Hanna,
are you sure you are Hanna or in fact Tim, Hanna´s dad (who is going to try to win desperately the shipment from Finland) ?
If you really are Hanna; you may try 2nd time, because you are a pilot´s daughter.
Please read my first mail once again carefully: I wrote
“Soon until well over the ground at altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on ... “
Notice also, these words below are really essential info, something maybe to do with prop/pwr –settings:
“Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a 2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode (in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. “
***
All,
One of you is now really close, physically say 50 mm /2" inches.
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT Finland
From: Tim Ward (ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz)
Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2011 9:39 PM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
Raimo,
Two thoughts.
Fuel starvation with the fuel pumps not turned on for take off?
Cheers,
Hannah
Tim daughter
Tim Ward 12 Waiwetu Street
Fendalton,
Christchurch, 8052
New Zealand.
ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz (ward.t(at)xtra.co.nz)
Ph 64 3 3515166
Mob 0210640221
On 3/10/2011, at 4:58 AM, "Raimo Toivio" <raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)> wrote:
| Quote: | All
I have got plenty of good guesses via list and also direct.
Some of you have hoped I will not publish them with their names and do not worry I wont´t.
Graham – I /we got an empty message from you – please retype it – I am sure it will be a good info.
One of you have guessed the problem was because a broken de-icing rubber in the prop blade. That´s good but unfortunately my Europa is so far still missing de-icing systems totally. They would be soon very useful in Finland.
***
No one has so far found a reason for my vibra.
So there are still a possibility to get an Xmas packet from Finland.
I quarantee the shipment will be worth of making a good guess.
***
Tips:
- the reason was off /on or black /white –type and very easy to repair; it was fixed in seconds.
- when finally found it was not invisible at all.
Go On!
Cheers, Raimo OH-XRT
From: Raimo Toivio (raimo.toivio(at)rwm.fi)
Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2011 10:44 PM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Heavy In-flight Vibration Riddle
All
I have hope-so a nice riddle for you.
Maybe all the answers are useful – let´s collect them all:
***
Yesterday I took off from a very remote /small /windy (90 degrees 12 knots and gusting MUCH) grass strip. Soon until well over the ground at altitude +500 feet with full power and 2nd fuel pump still on and gears up I felt suddenly let us say medium or more shake and vibration. My immediate reaction was to go around and land immediately but abandoned because wind was so furious and I felt I cannot do that (a succesful landing).
I decided to try to fly to the next possible sensible airfield EFHV which was 10 minutes apart.
Those minutes were long: I put my prob (Airmaster CS) to manual and drived it from fine to coarse, tried all the power settings and also a 2nd fuel filter. Finally I noticed that when prop was in a climb mode (in my case 5400 rpm /Rotax 912S) and MAP around 20 inches I got quite a comfortable flying mode and I headed straight home. My airspeed was w that selection about 110 knots but because of a strong headwind GS was only about 70 knots (wanted to be clearly over the ground at 3000 ft because it was well over sunset and totally dark, yesterday we got sunset around 1600 Zulutime and time was well over 1630 when flying).
So, I pushed home one looooong hour. All the aerodynamics were well. I was a bit worried my engine will separate or so. When trying to push more pwr it was more vibra and when trying to pull less pwr same. I Followed a main highway and decided to land there if feeling so. Cars there with lights are almost like a lighted runway...
Finally landing to the EFTP flawlesly.
***
Today we had a FHGP (Family Hangar Grill Party). I tried to check my plane as well as I can. I found something. Very small evidence but something anyway. I tried to fix it and had a test run. I elected to go to fly – hey I am a test pilot who else – and She was better than ever!
I managed to do 2 touches and goes when C172 did one with same runway.
140 knots during downwind makes me always happy.
***
So – dear Ladies and Gentlemen – what was wrong?
It would be nice and very life-useful to hear your opinions or guesses what was wrong.
***
The Rules: one single guess per person, please.
The Prize: The Best Guess will get a Very Special Xmas Present from Finland!
***
I will let you know a solution after a week – be patient.
Have a nice weekend and
Cheers, Raimo Toivio
<Europa%20A2A-ala2OK[1].png>
Europa XS Mono OH-XRT #417
Updated flight hours /landings: 258,3
37500 Lempaala
FINLAND
p [url=tel:%2B358-3-3753%20777]+358-3-3753 777[/url]
f [url=tel:%2B358-3-3753%20100]+358-3-3753 100[/url]
toivio(at)fly.to (toivio(at)fly.to)
www.rwm.fi
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
|
| Quote: |
arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
|
|
[quote]
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
[b]
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum
|
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
|
Get Email Distribution Too!
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
