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occom
Joined: 26 Aug 2006
Posts: 404
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 Posted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 9:23 am Post subject: Getting off the Pennzoil Air Cooled habit |
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Hi Rick, at the risk of starting another oil thread that will have the 912 guys rolling their eye and moaning "not again!" I wonder if the TCW-3 is the right package. The current Rotax manual specifies API-TC for all Rotax 2cycle engines air and water cooled. I have used Bombardiers own oil available here in 4 litre jugs and very occasionally other API-TC oils, usually Castrol super two stroke which is sometimes labelled snowmobile oil. I recall though that the manuals and the information available from sources like CPS specifically say to NOT use the oil for marine applications labelled TCW-3. Now it possible that this is outdated info as things change and possibly they are labelled for both now, but as I understand things it is the API-TC that you just removed that you actually want to use. Might be worth checking out when you have a chance.
[quote] From: owner-rotaxengines-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rotaxengines-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Girard
Sent: January-07-12 10:13 PM
To: rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com; kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Getting off the Pennzoil Air Cooled habit
Shell, which owns the Pennzoil brand, has discontinued making Pennzoil Air Cooled two cycle oil and, according to Shell engineers, the API-TC additive package in Air Cooled is incompatible with the TCW-3 additive package found in most of the two cycle oils on the store shelves these days. The incompatibility is such that one causes the other to congeal. If you premix don't sweat it, the dilution of the oil in the gasoline takes care of the difference, but if your Rotax engine has an oil injection pump you have to make a clean change over. Here's a simple way to do it. Empty the oil tank, remove it from its mount with the lines up to the pump and clean it and the line with some clean gas, Use the gas you cleaned with and mix a gallon or two of premix. Put the premix in your fuel tank. Remount and reconnect the oil tank and lines, fill it half way with clean gas. Start the engine and warm it up to operating temps, shut down. Drain the gas from the oil tank and fill with your new favorite oil (I went with Pennzoil Marine Full Synthetic, because I can almost always get it at the local Wally's in gallons). Drain the float bowl(s) of your carb(s). Start the engine and bring to operating temps again (I'm extra cautious about the tiny amount of gas left in the pump and want to make sure the engine always has oil). Fill your fuel tank with fresh gas and go fly. The whole process takes about thirty minutes start to finish.
Rick Girard
--
Zulu Delta
Mk IIIC
Thanks, Homer GBYM
It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy.
- Groucho Marx
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rickofudall
Joined: 19 Sep 2009
Posts: 1392
Location: Udall, KS, USA
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| Posted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 10:53 am Post subject: Getting off the Pennzoil Air Cooled habit |
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Lockwood tested both, and two others;
http://www.ultralightnews.com/features/oiltest.htm
and found little difference between Marine and Air Cooled after 280 hours of running, but they did give the nod to Air Cooled as the preferred oil. I premix and have been using petro based Marine oil for six years and I don't see any major carbon build up or other problems when I pull the exhaust "Y" for annuals. If you can get API-TC rated oils, go for it. I can't, at least not at prices I'm willing to pay, so I made the switch.
Rick Girard
On Sun, Jan 8, 2012 at 11:16 AM, Dave <occom(at)ns.sympatico.ca (occom(at)ns.sympatico.ca)> wrote:
| Quote: | Hi Rick, at the risk of starting another oil thread that will have the 912 guys rolling their eye and moaning "not again!" I wonder if the TCW-3 is the right package. The current Rotax manual specifies API-TC for all Rotax 2cycle engines air and water cooled. I have used Bombardiers own oil available here in 4 litre jugs and very occasionally other API-TC oils, usually Castrol super two stroke which is sometimes labelled snowmobile oil. I recall though that the manuals and the information available from sources like CPS specifically say to NOT use the oil for marine applications labelled TCW-3. Now it possible that this is outdated info as things change and possibly they are labelled for both now, but as I understand things it is the API-TC that you just removed that you actually want to use. Might be worth checking out when you have a chance.
| Quote: | From: owner-rotaxengines-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-rotaxengines-list-server(at)matronics.com) [mailto:owner-rotaxengines-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-rotaxengines-list-server(at)matronics.com)] On Behalf Of Richard Girard
Sent: January-07-12 10:13 PM
To: rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com (rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com); kolb-list(at)matronics.com (kolb-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Getting off the Pennzoil Air Cooled habit
Shell, which owns the Pennzoil brand, has discontinued making Pennzoil Air Cooled two cycle oil and, according to Shell engineers, the API-TC additive package in Air Cooled is incompatible with the TCW-3 additive package found in most of the two cycle oils on the store shelves these days. The incompatibility is such that one causes the other to congeal. If you premix don't sweat it, the dilution of the oil in the gasoline takes care of the difference, but if your Rotax engine has an oil injection pump you have to make a clean change over. Here's a simple way to do it. Empty the oil tank, remove it from its mount with the lines up to the pump and clean it and the line with some clean gas, Use the gas you cleaned with and mix a gallon or two of premix. Put the premix in your fuel tank. Remount and reconnect the oil tank and lines, fill it half way with clean gas. Start the engine and warm it up to operating temps, shut down. Drain the gas from the oil tank and fill with your new favorite oil (I went with Pennzoil Marine Full Synthetic, because I can almost always get it at the local Wally's in gallons). Drain the float bowl(s) of your carb(s). Start the engine and bring to operating temps again (I'm extra cautious about the tiny amount of gas left in the pump and want to make sure the engine always has oil). Fill your fuel tank with fresh gas and go fly. The whole process takes about thirty minutes start to finish.
Rick Girard
--
Zulu Delta
Mk IIIC
Thanks, Homer GBYM
It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy.
- Groucho Marx
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ist" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RotaxEngines-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
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--
Zulu Delta
Mk IIIC
Thanks, Homer GBYM
It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy.
- Groucho Marx
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dave
Joined: 22 Sep 2006
Posts: 1382
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| Posted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 2:15 pm Post subject: Getting off the Pennzoil Air Cooled habit |
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Rotax spec calls fpr API- TC
Bombarier sells XPS oil
Castrol sells super 2 stroke - avail in Canada at Walmart.
both are API Tc rated.
>> http://www.cfisher.com/oildebate.html
use a oil thats carries that spec.
[quote] ---
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dave
Joined: 22 Sep 2006
Posts: 1382
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| Posted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 3:32 pm Post subject: Getting off the Pennzoil Air Cooled habit |
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Rick we pay about 4 $ a quart in Canada at Walmart. for API - TC rated oil
[quote] ---
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dave
Joined: 22 Sep 2006
Posts: 1382
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| Posted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 6:34 pm Post subject: Getting off the Pennzoil Air Cooled habit |
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Rick do you have a sea doo or Ski dealer near you ?
XPS in bulk is the way to go.
I use mineral but you can get synthetic as well
With injection you use alot less oil and burn cleaner
Dave
http://www.youtube.com/user/kitfoxflyer
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_________________
Realtime Kitfox movies to separate the internet chatter from the truth
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rickofudall
Joined: 19 Sep 2009
Posts: 1392
Location: Udall, KS, USA
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| Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 6:54 am Post subject: Getting off the Pennzoil Air Cooled habit |
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Dave, I am smack dab in the middle of the Great Plains, about twenty miles north of the Oklahoma border. Snowmobiles are as rare here as politically aware people. Like I said before, I've got six years of using both petro and synthetic TCW-3 and I won't go out of my way to change what continues to be the entirely satisfactory performance of water craft oil in my 582. That, and the Lockwood test results make me entirely comfortable with my decision. You have triggered my curiosity about the differences of the API-TC and TCW-3 additive packages, though. If I have time, and can find them, I'll try to put them back to back and see what's there.
Rick
On Sun, Jan 8, 2012 at 8:29 PM, Dave <dave(at)cfisher.com (dave(at)cfisher.com)> wrote:
[quote] Rick do you have a sea doo or Ski dealer near you ?
XPS in bulk is the way to go.
I use mineral but you can get synthetic as well
With injection you use alot less oil and burn cleaner
Dave
http://www.youtube.com/user/kitfoxflyer
[quote] ---
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