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rampil
Joined: 04 May 2007
Posts: 870
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 Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2012 7:00 pm Post subject: Rotax 912is / 912iSc |
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Better than the press release, the Install, Operators, and Light Maint Manuals are up on the ROAN site.
From a quick perusal:
Looks like it will fit under the Europa hood with the new steel air box
sitting on top of the engine.
No description of the new engine/panel instrumentation based on the CANbus interface to the ECU.
ECU requires a dongle for service - Is this a dealer only device?
Two alternators built-in to the engine now with automatic rollover for failure on one to keep the dual fuel pumps turning.
Manuals have altitude power performance chart now, but not fuel
consumption with altitude. From claim about 10% improvement in consumption, I'll bet the EFI reduces richness at altitude better than the
Bing 64s
No word yet on update kit to existing 912s
Looks like something to check out at SnF later this month
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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budyerly(at)msn.com
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| Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 7:35 am Post subject: Rotax 912is / 912iSc |
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<?xml:namespace prefix="v" /><?xml:namespace prefix="o" /><![endif]--> Fellow Rotax owners:
Having worked with Jason Parker on the SDS setup, I am not surprised by the requirements, electrical, fuel and air will change.
Eric's wedding takes precedence over the review of the new manuals for this week.
Concerns I have, like you:
ECU will be proprietary you can bet. Dealer only settings etc.
Rotax will have a special class on it you for sure.
Plumbing will be tight with two pumps and revised air intake.
I had hopes they would use an engine driven pump but if it needs dual alternators, one can bet it is dual electric pumps.
Are the pumps in the fuselage only, and now must we contend with 40 psi fuel in the fuselage. Quite the hazard.
Are the pumps designed to be in the engine compartment. which is safer in a crash if proper fuel shutoffs are included.
This would allow a retrofit to any kit without changing normal Rotax plumbing.
Rotax is not keen on making things retrofitable, so I doubt any of us current owners will benefit. I hope I am wrong.
I know that putting the Jason Parker setup with turbo fuel injection didn't warrant the cost as it would be years to get payback,
so learn to service the carbs was my opinion.
Many more questions abound, but I will patiently wait for a proper manuals and documentation review.
Damn, just as I really got proficient with the dual bings and could make them sing, another thing to go wrong and have to learn how to fix.
Regards,
Bud Yerly
Custom Flight Creations, Inc.
www.customflightcreations.com
(813) 653-4989
[quote] ---
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List |
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Speedbird
Joined: 18 Jan 2008
Posts: 9
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| Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 2:24 pm Post subject: Rotax 912is / 912iSc |
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Why not Go all the way and check out the UL-Power engine instead?
Bet the spare parts are very reasonable if compared...
That will be my future choice!
Cheers!
Ivan Midwing
9 mar 2012 kl. 16:34 skrev "Bud Yerly" <budyerly(at)msn.com (budyerly(at)msn.com)>:
[quote] <?xml:namespace prefix="v" /><?xml:namespace prefix="o" /><![endif]--> Fellow Rotax owners:
Having worked with Jason Parker on the SDS setup, I am not surprised by the requirements, electrical, fuel and air will change.
Eric's wedding takes precedence over the review of the new manuals for this week.
Concerns I have, like you:
ECU will be proprietary you can bet. Dealer only settings etc.
Rotax will have a special class on it you for sure.
Plumbing will be tight with two pumps and revised air intake.
I had hopes they would use an engine driven pump but if it needs dual alternators, one can bet it is dual electric pumps.
Are the pumps in the fuselage only, and now must we contend with 40 psi fuel in the fuselage. Quite the hazard.
Are the pumps designed to be in the engine compartment. which is safer in a crash if proper fuel shutoffs are included.
This would allow a retrofit to any kit without changing normal Rotax plumbing.
Rotax is not keen on making things retrofitable, so I doubt any of us current owners will benefit. I hope I am wrong.
I know that putting the Jason Parker setup with turbo fuel injection didn't warrant the cost as it would be years to get payback,
so learn to service the carbs was my opinion.
Many more questions abound, but I will patiently wait for a proper manuals and documentation review.
Damn, just as I really got proficient with the dual bings and could make them sing, another thing to go wrong and have to learn how to fix.
Regards,
Bud Yerly
Custom Flight Creations, Inc.
www.customflightcreations.com
(813) 653-4989
[quote] ---
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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nigel_graham(at)m-tecque.
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| Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 2:36 pm Post subject: Rotax 912is / 912iSc |
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Here you go guys, If you haven't already seen it, here is a nice animation of the new 912iS.
It does use twin electric pumps housed in a neat stainless box within the engine compartment.
Nigel
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azXdDXWpZ_I BODY { font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:12px; }
europa-list(at)matronics.com
Re: Rotax 912is / 912iSc
On 09/03/2012 15:34, Bud Yerly wrote: [quote] Fellow Rotax owners:
Having worked with Jason Parker on the SDS setup, I am not surprised by the requirements, electrical, fuel and air will change.
Eric's wedding takes precedence over the review of the new manuals for this week.
Concerns I have, like you:
ECU will be proprietary you can bet. Dealer only settings etc.
Rotax will have a special class on it you for sure.
Plumbing will be tight with two pumps and revised air intake.
I had hopes they would use an engine driven pump but if it needs dual alternators, one can bet it is dual electric pumps.
Are the pumps in the fuselage only, and now must we contend with 40 psi fuel in the fuselage. Quite the hazard.
Are the pumps designed to be in the engine compartment. which is safer in a crash if proper fuel shutoffs are included.
This would allow a retrofit to any kit without changing normal Rotax plumbing.
Rotax is not keen on making things retrofitable, so I doubt any of us current owners will benefit. I hope I am wrong.
I know that putting the Jason Parker setup with turbo fuel injection didn't warrant the cost as it would be years to get payback,
so learn to service the carbs was my opinion.
Many more questions abound, but I will patiently wait for a proper manuals and documentation review.
Damn, just as I really got proficient with the dual bings and could make them sing, another thing to go wrong and have to learn how to fix.
Regards,
Bud Yerly
Custom Flight Creations, Inc.
www.customflightcreations.com
(813) 653-4989
[quote] ---
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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garrys(at)tampabay.rr.com
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| Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 5:36 am Post subject: Rotax 912is / 912iSc |
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What is the relationship of BRP to Bombardier?
Garry Stout
Sent from my iPad
On Mar 9, 2012, at 5:35 PM, Nigel Graham <nigel_graham(at)m-tecque.co.uk (nigel_graham(at)m-tecque.co.uk)> wrote:
[quote]
Here you go guys, If you haven't already seen it, here is a nice animation of the new 912iS.
It does use twin electric pumps housed in a neat stainless box within the engine compartment.
Nigel
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azXdDXWpZ_I BODY { font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:12px; }
europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)
Re: Rotax 912is / 912iSc
On 09/03/2012 15:34, Bud Yerly wrote: [quote] Fellow Rotax owners:
Having worked with Jason Parker on the SDS setup, I am not surprised by the requirements, electrical, fuel and air will change.
Eric's wedding takes precedence over the review of the new manuals for this week.
Concerns I have, like you:
ECU will be proprietary you can bet. Dealer only settings etc.
Rotax will have a special class on it you for sure.
Plumbing will be tight with two pumps and revised air intake.
I had hopes they would use an engine driven pump but if it needs dual alternators, one can bet it is dual electric pumps.
Are the pumps in the fuselage only, and now must we contend with 40 psi fuel in the fuselage. Quite the hazard.
Are the pumps designed to be in the engine compartment. which is safer in a crash if proper fuel shutoffs are included.
This would allow a retrofit to any kit without changing normal Rotax plumbing.
Rotax is not keen on making things retrofitable, so I doubt any of us current owners will benefit. I hope I am wrong.
I know that putting the Jason Parker setup with turbo fuel injection didn't warrant the cost as it would be years to get payback,
so learn to service the carbs was my opinion.
Many more questions abound, but I will patiently wait for a proper manuals and documentation review.
Damn, just as I really got proficient with the dual bings and could make them sing, another thing to go wrong and have to learn how to fix.
Regards,
Bud Yerly
Custom Flight Creations, Inc.
www.customflightcreations.com
(813) 653-4989
[quote] ---
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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nigel_graham(at)m-tecque.
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| Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 2:27 pm Post subject: Rotax 912is / 912iSc |
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BODY { font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:12px; }
Bombardier Recreational Products (BRP) produce things like Seadoo's Skidoos etc, the powertrain division produces engines for a range of other manufacturers, including BMW and Aprilia motorcycles plus the aircraft engines that we use.
Nigel<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />
On 10/03/2012 13:35, Garry Stout wrote: [quote] What is the relationship of BRP to Bombardier?
Garry Stout
Sent from my iPad
On Mar 9, 2012, at 5:35 PM, Nigel Graham <nigel_graham(at)m-tecque.co.uk (nigel_graham(at)m-tecque.co.uk)> wrote:
[b]
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budyerly(at)msn.com
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| Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:22 pm Post subject: Rotax 912is / 912iSc |
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<?xml:namespace prefix="v" /><?xml:namespace prefix="o" /><![endif]--> All,
Still watching the UL. The Jab was such a disappointment, advertised the same low price, ease of maintenance, price advantages, etc.. It has been disappointing watching the early engine buyers painful lessons. The Jab has some improvements and bears watching. I am watching the UL with great hope, as I know many are. Even the high power UL has a limited prop diameter of 64 inches, higher than expected fuel flows, a large drop off in torque above 2400 RPM, a high rev requirement to produce it's 130 horses and an unknown amount of ducting and tweaking necessary to cool.
Of course I have a love hate relationship with everything on an aircraft. I have found dependability, reliability, maintainability, and ease of installation are all considerations first, then price. You get what you pay for, not what you hope for. Right now the big UL is the price of a 912S, or so, I hope it stays that way. I am really looking at a couple guys I have met with UL engines to see just how the UL is working out, right now they have huge inlets and much ducting and instrumenting. Needs a high speed climb to cool so far on one.
Flying is believing, anything else is rubbish.
Just my dumb opinion, I'm getting cranky in my old age. I have the right, as my 914 is one of the oldest models and has had to go through it's problems, ADs and worries. The new 914s are a gem, but just like my RV owner friends, all engines need growth and have issues, even Lycomings.
Bud Yerly
[quote] ---
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fklein(at)orcasonline.com
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| Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:48 pm Post subject: Rotax 912is / 912iSc |
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| Quote: | | The Jab has some improvements and bears watching. I am watching the UL with great hope, as I know many are. Even the high power UL has a limited prop diameter of 64 inches, higher than expected fuel flows, a large drop off in torque above 2400 RPM, a high rev requirement to produce it's 130 horses and an unknown amount of ducting and tweaking necessary to cool. |
Bud...appropos the subject, below is a little table I put together to assist me in understanding prop selection issues for my aftermarket MPEFId Sube by RAM Performance...shows comparison w/ 912S...I too anticipate an unknown amount of tweaking...
Fred
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