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raymondj(at)frontiernet.n
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 Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 6:53 pm Post subject: 9 lb battery/jumpstart kits |
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That's what I needed, thanks Ron.
Will treating larger 12V lead acid batteries with the 15.5v voltage do
the same thing as far as restoring some life to them? I assume it will
but I figured I'd ask.
Later,
Raymond Julian
Kettle River, MN.
"And you know that I could have me a million more friends,
and all I'd have to lose is my point of view." - John Prine
On 06/08/2012 07:51 PM, rparigoris wrote:
| Quote: |
Hi Raymond
Hmm, I sent this through my ISP an hour and a half ago but it never posted? Here it goes again through Matronics:
"how to hook the parts"
Here is some insight to the 9 pound batteries:
**At a 1/10C discharge, capacity is not far off from a 9aH battery. They weigh about 9 pounds. A 17 or 18aH battery with approximately the same dimensions but really has 17 or 18aH capacity is 13 or more pounds. The best deal we found for the purchase of 500 batteries was 30$ each and we had to pay for shipping. There is nothing wrong with the 9aH batteries except they are 9aHs.
**The 9aH batteries are very happy being charged with the supplied charger which is a constant current charger and turns off at ~14.5 volts. They are pretty happy being charged at a 1,000mA rate, so if you parallel two of the supplied chargers, that works fine or I my Yuasa (battery tender rip off) charger 1,000 mA charger. We have a 3,000mA three stage charger and it kinda works, it sometimes will not give as good a charge as the 500 mA or 1,000mA charger. I find that after charging and waiting a day, if you have `13 volts ar so the battery is fully charged. Sometimes the 3,000mA charger does not get the battery to that level.
**If you allow the battery to fall below 50% charge state and sit there for a while (12.4 volts) it can get hurt. I found that the very best way to bring a battery that got hurt back to life is to use the 500mA charger and charge control board and let it peak (red LED turns off meaning that it reached at least ~ 14.5 volts). Then connect the battery directly to the 500mA transformer and chase the voltage till it gets to 15.5 volts and turn it off. We have saved batteries in the field by doing this countless times. We are talking it may take a few days in a bad case battery to get to 15.5 volts.
As far as hooking up the chargers, it is very simple.
Connect a source (2 wires) and connect output (2 wires) to the battery.
INPUT:
There are two ways to hook up the input, from the back of the board or the front. To hook up from the back, hook up the transformer positive (black wire with white stripe) to the tail of a wire (black wire with white stripe) and do the same with the negative wires. Some transformers are already connected, some were cut off.Or you can connect the input through the front side of the control board. i supplied a wire with athe proper connector attached to it to fit the female recepticle on the front of the board. Connect positive to black wire (with white stripe) and negative to the black wire. You can use the supplied transformer, or you can use a 12 volt source. Note you will not get a full charge from a static 12 volt battery, but can get close from a running vehicle. There was a male cigarette plug that came connected to this wire.
OK now for the output, this is the side that connects to your battery..
Connect red to the positive of the battery and black to the negative of the battery.
Solder or use a clip to connect to the positive bus on the board: R3, R2,D4,R6,R7 and connect to the positive of the battery.
Solder or clip to the negative bus. It is the three holes to the right of the R5 resistor and connect to the negative of the battery.
When the LED D3 is on and the battery is connected, you are charging, when the Red LED D3 goes off the battery is charged (it means it peaked at ~ 14.5 volts). Now you can disconnect your battery.
NOTE, if you put another discharged battery on the charger it will not begin a charge cycle until you disconnect the input power for at least a few seconds to unlatch a latched holding relay. Give it a try for yourself, put a battery on charge and get the Red LED to come on. Now disconnect an output lead and you will hear a click and the Red LED will go off. If you reconnect the output lead the Red LED will remain off. Now leaving the output connected to the control board, disconnect the input power for a few seconds. You will hear a click and see the LED flash shortly. Now reconnect the input power and you will again see the RED is on.
Good Luck!
Ron Parigoris
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=375058#375058
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raymondj(at)frontiernet.n
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| Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 7:45 pm Post subject: 9 lb battery/jumpstart kits |
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Ron, any recommendations on using the 15 amp breaker?
I was just looking over the charger boards and noticed one of the
resistor leads got clipped when the wires were being cut. It's the end
of R3 by where the red wire was cut. It would be easy to over look.
Just an FYI in case someone has a problem.
Later,
Raymond Julian
Kettle River, MN.
"And you know that I could have me a million more friends,
and all I'd have to lose is my point of view." - John Prine
On 06/08/2012 09:51 PM, rayj wrote:
| Quote: |
That's what I needed, thanks Ron.
Will treating larger 12V lead acid batteries with the 15.5v voltage do
the same thing as far as restoring some life to them? I assume it will
but I figured I'd ask.
Later,
Raymond Julian
Kettle River, MN.
"And you know that I could have me a million more friends,
and all I'd have to lose is my point of view." - John Prine
On 06/08/2012 07:51 PM, rparigoris wrote:
>
> "rparigoris"<rparigor(at)suffolk.lib.ny.us>
>
> Hi Raymond
>
> Hmm, I sent this through my ISP an hour and a half ago but it never
> posted? Here it goes again through Matronics:
>
> "how to hook the parts"
>
> Here is some insight to the 9 pound batteries:
>
> **At a 1/10C discharge, capacity is not far off from a 9aH battery.
> They weigh about 9 pounds. A 17 or 18aH battery with approximately the
> same dimensions but really has 17 or 18aH capacity is 13 or more
> pounds. The best deal we found for the purchase of 500 batteries was
> 30$ each and we had to pay for shipping. There is nothing wrong with
> the 9aH batteries except they are 9aHs.
>
> **The 9aH batteries are very happy being charged with the supplied
> charger which is a constant current charger and turns off at ~14.5
> volts. They are pretty happy being charged at a 1,000mA rate, so if
> you parallel two of the supplied chargers, that works fine or I my
> Yuasa (battery tender rip off) charger 1,000 mA charger. We have a
> 3,000mA three stage charger and it kinda works, it sometimes will not
> give as good a charge as the 500 mA or 1,000mA charger. I find that
> after charging and waiting a day, if you have `13 volts ar so the
> battery is fully charged. Sometimes the 3,000mA charger does not get
> the battery to that level.
>
> **If you allow the battery to fall below 50% charge state and sit
> there for a while (12.4 volts) it can get hurt. I found that the very
> best way to bring a battery that got hurt back to life is to use the
> 500mA charger and charge control board and let it peak (red LED turns
> off meaning that it reached at least ~ 14.5 volts). Then connect the
> battery directly to the 500mA transformer and chase the voltage till
> it gets to 15.5 volts and turn it off. We have saved batteries in the
> field by doing this countless times. We are talking it may take a few
> days in a bad case battery to get to 15.5 volts.
>
> As far as hooking up the chargers, it is very simple.
>
> Connect a source (2 wires) and connect output (2 wires) to the battery.
>
> INPUT:
>
> There are two ways to hook up the input, from the back of the board or
> the front. To hook up from the back, hook up the transformer positive
> (black wire with white stripe) to the tail of a wire (black wire with
> white stripe) and do the same with the negative wires. Some
> transformers are already connected, some were cut off.Or you can
> connect the input through the front side of the control board. i
> supplied a wire with athe proper connector attached to it to fit the
> female recepticle on the front of the board. Connect positive to black
> wire (with white stripe) and negative to the black wire. You can use
> the supplied transformer, or you can use a 12 volt source. Note you
> will not get a full charge from a static 12 volt battery, but can get
> close from a running vehicle. There was a male cigarette plug that
> came connected to this wire.
>
> OK now for the output, this is the side that connects to your battery..
>
> Connect red to the positive of the battery and black to the negative
> of the battery.
>
> Solder or use a clip to connect to the positive bus on the board: R3,
> R2,D4,R6,R7 and connect to the positive of the battery.
>
> Solder or clip to the negative bus. It is the three holes to the right
> of the R5 resistor and connect to the negative of the battery.
>
> When the LED D3 is on and the battery is connected, you are charging,
> when the Red LED D3 goes off the battery is charged (it means it
> peaked at ~ 14.5 volts). Now you can disconnect your battery.
>
> NOTE, if you put another discharged battery on the charger it will not
> begin a charge cycle until you disconnect the input power for at least
> a few seconds to unlatch a latched holding relay. Give it a try for
> yourself, put a battery on charge and get the Red LED to come on. Now
> disconnect an output lead and you will hear a click and the Red LED
> will go off. If you reconnect the output lead the Red LED will remain
> off. Now leaving the output connected to the control board, disconnect
> the input power for a few seconds. You will hear a click and see the
> LED flash shortly. Now reconnect the input power and you will again
> see the RED is on.
>
> Good Luck!
>
> Ron Parigoris
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=375058#375058
>
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rparigoris
Joined: 24 Nov 2009
Posts: 797
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| Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 7:58 pm Post subject: 9 lb battery/jumpstart kits |
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Hi Raymond
"> Will treating larger 12V lead acid batteries with the 15.5v voltage do > the same thing as far as restoring some life to them? I assume it will > but I figured I'd ask."
Off the cuff I would say it could perhaps help, but all lead batteries are not created equal.
I tried putting two 500mA transformers on the 9 pound batteries (no charge controller) because it took so long to reach 15.5 with one, but didn't like the noises that started to come out from the battery. Perhaps Ok but if quiet I could hear a bubbling.
I know that some chargers have a pulse or de-sulfated boost cycle, but all batteries probably do not react the same.
Bob N., what secrets have you found for helping to bring back a battery that has either been left below 50% for a while?
Ron Parigoris
BTW, when I was a young kid (9-12) making electric 2, 3 and 4 wheeled vehicles, the batteries we used for the most part were used batteries from my parents cars that were no longer very reliable. Dad and I would empty out the acid, hand cut them apart with a large wood saw, scoop out the white goop that collected in the bottom and hit the plates with a brush and garden hose cleaning off white goop. Reassemble with some black tar type sealant and refill with acid. If we were lucky we would have fresh acid mix, but more often than not we would charge the batteries first, and we would use only the acid from cells that would take a charge according to the hydrometer. We would drill holes in the batteries so we could screw hardware in the bus so we could charge the good cells together. There were only some 12 volt batteries we could do this with. More 6 volt cells were happier to be dissected. The best success I ever had was putting together a 7 cell battery made from 6 volt batteries (dissected and de-sulfated) on a three wheeled vehicle that fit under our workbench using a 12 volt Ford starter motor. The secret was the motor cooling, I used a 1 gallon milk jug with a few small holes that leaked water on the motor to keep it cool enough to get some time on it. 8 cells would burn things up even with cooling after a short time, but because it drew more amps, distance was quite a bit shorter than 7 cells with not much extra speed. 7 cells was pretty exciting. 5 cells and regearing would give greatest distance, but at grandma speed. In order to easily charge these odd number of cells with either a 6 or 12 volt charger, I would always have some spare cells hanging around. These were abtteries that I would only leave 1 cell left but leave the rest of the battery case that was terrific to put all model aeroplane flying gear in. A mutilated solenoid from a copier was wound to make the perfect resistor so i didn't burn up the 1.5 volt glow plugs. I had various loads where i woulod discharge all cells close to each other so I could charge in series with reasonable success. [quote][b]
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rparigoris
Joined: 24 Nov 2009
Posts: 797
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| Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 8:21 pm Post subject: 9 lb battery/jumpstart kits |
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Hi Raymond
"> Ron, any recommendations on using the 15 amp breaker?" "> I was just looking over the charger boards and noticed one of the > resistor leads got clipped when the wires were being cut. It's the end > of R3 by where the red wire was cut. It would be easy to over look. > Just an FYI in case someone has a problem."
Hi Raymond.
Thx. for the heads up on cut resistor. I have not seen one of them cut. There were four guys who disassembled the 500 plus packs. Out of probably a hundred charge boards i have set up, one left the red LED on all the time, and one smoked a 3 legged component. Other than that they all worked.
The 15 amp resettable breaker was in series with a 12 volt female cigarette style receptacle, so that would be a good choice.
The most useful thing I have used these batteries for is turning a cordless Dewalt drill into a corded drill. You need to use pretty thick wires so as to not get too much of a voltage drop.:
https://skydrive.live.com/redir?resid=550FC20DBDDB521D!694&authkey=!APwe6830ArzXncc
I just used 2 conductors and ground in parallel on the cord we had hanging around.
Ron Parigoris [quote][b]
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