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Using 87 MOGAS

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h&jeuropa

Joined: 07 Nov 2006
Posts: 645

Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:02 am Post subject: Using 87 MOGAS

We recently did a trip to Colorado and purchased MOGAS when possible.  Most of the MOGAS available at airports was 87 not 91.  We are flying a Europa with a 914.  Since we usually operate at 70% power and only use 100% for takeoff (have never used 115% except for ground testing), is it OK to use the lower octane MOGAS?



Jim & Heather

jackinkeywest

Joined: 20 Mar 2012
Posts: 36
Location: Key West, FL

Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:45 am Post subject: Using 87 MOGAS

Jim,



I'm by no means an expert on fuel, however I would have no reservations about using 87 instead of 91 OCT as long as I had enough OCTANE Boost (plastic bottle) found at NAPA, Advance and O'Reilly Auto Parts stores....



Jack in Key West

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klinefelter.kevin(at)gmai
Guest

Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 4:52 am Post subject: Using 87 MOGAS

Hi Jim & Heather,

I operate my 914 much the same as you. It is my understanding that running lower than 91 octane would be risky. You can mix 50/50, 87 Mogas with 100 LL.

I have looked in to octane boosters from auto parts stores, but most of them are alcohol based and I don't want to increase the alcohol.

I travel with a 5 gallon gas container and use that if I can borrow the "crew car", and even have taken my long ranger tank in to town for car gas and lunch on trips.

Kevin

Planning the trip to Oshkosh! How bout you?



On Jun 13, 2012, at 4:02 AM, "h&jeuropa" <butcher43(at)att.net> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

 We recently did a trip to Colorado and purchased MOGAS when possible.  Most of the MOGAS available at airports was 87 not 91.  We are flying a Europa with a 914.  Since we usually operate at 70% power and only use 100% for takeoff (have never used 115% except for ground testing), is it OK to use the lower octane MOGAS?

 

 Jim & Heather

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=375495#375495

Roger Lee

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1464
Location: Tucson, Az.

Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 5:34 am Post subject: Re: Using 87 MOGAS

Hi Jim,



Absolutely do not use straight 87 oct. You can use up to a 50/50 mix of 87 and 100LL. No less then 50% 100LL. You can use less 87, but not less 100LL. Detonation can happen before you have any warning and then you just cost yourself a minimum or $4500+.  If you only use the 100LL once in a great while when traveling then don't worry about it and use the 91 oct all other times at your home field where most owners spend the majority of the flying time. If you are using 100LL then use a lead scavenger like Decalin. It is 1/2 oz. per 10 gal. You can pick it up from Aircraft Spruce for about $20

_________________
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Rotax Instructor & Rotax IRC
Light Sport Repairman
Home 520-574-1080 TRY HOME FIRST
Cell 520-349-7056

jackinkeywest

Joined: 20 Mar 2012
Posts: 36
Location: Key West, FL

Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 6:01 am Post subject: Using 87 MOGAS

Roger,



What are your thoughts/concerns/comments regarding the use of Octane Booster in the Rotax engines (2-stroke and 4-strokers)?



Would like to hear your 'professional opinion' ....



Thanks for your time. 



Jack in Key West



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BARRY CHECK 6

Joined: 15 Mar 2011
Posts: 738

Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 9:49 am Post subject: Using 87 MOGAS

Kevin:

You cheep SOB!    [img]cid:360(at)goomoji.gmail[/img][img]cid:360(at)goomoji.gmail[/img][img]cid:360(at)goomoji.gmail[/img] You barrow the airports car and you don't even buy 5 Gallons of AvGas from them!  

 I'm laughing here and saying it tong in cheek.  Come on, do the math - How much are you saving?  But, wait - If your airport is like some around here... $8/Gal Shaft them royally - - - GO FOR IT!

 Barry

On Wed, Jun 13, 2012 at 8:51 AM,  <klinefelter.kevin(at)gmail.com (klinefelter.kevin(at)gmail.com)> wrote:

  	  Quote: 	
		  --> RotaxEngines-List message posted by: klinefelter.kevin(at)gmail.com (klinefelter.kevin(at)gmail.com)

 Hi Jim & Heather,

 I operate my 914 much the same as you. It is my understanding that running lower than 91 octane would be risky. You can mix 50/50, 87 Mogas with 100 LL.

 I have looked in to octane boosters from auto parts stores, but most of them are alcohol based and I don't want to increase the alcohol.

 I travel with a 5 gallon gas container and use that if I can borrow the "crew car", and even have taken my long ranger tank in to town for car gas and lunch on trips.

 Kevin

 Planning the trip to Oshkosh! How bout you?

 On Jun 13, 2012, at 4:02 AM, "h&jeuropa" <butcher43(at)att.net (butcher43(at)att.net)> wrote:

 > --> RotaxEngines-List message posted by: "h&amp;jeuropa" <butcher43(at)att.net (butcher43(at)att.net)>

 >

 > We recently did a trip to Colorado and purchased MOGAS when possible.  Most of the MOGAS available at airports was 87 not 91.  We are flying a Europa with a 914.  Since we usually operate at 70% power and only use 100% for takeoff (have never used 115% except for ground testing), is it OK to use the lower octane MOGAS?

  >

 > Jim & Heather

 >

 >

 >

 >

 > Read this topic online here:

 >

 > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=375495#375495

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 =

 -List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RotaxEngines-List

 ===========

 http://forums.matronics.com

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 le, List Admin.

 ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution

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dirtfly7(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 10:57 am Post subject: Using 87 MOGAS

Its not about the cost its about getting what you want. If airports would provide 91 octane unleaded fuel I would pay whatever price they wanted even if it was more than the 100LL.  I always make that clear to the FBO when I take their courtesy car into town to fill up my gas cans.  

Joel

--- On Wed, 6/13/12, FLYaDIVE <flyadive(at)gmail.com> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	

From: FLYaDIVE <flyadive(at)gmail.com>

Subject: Re: RotaxEngines-List: Using 87 MOGAS

To: rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com

Date: Wednesday, June 13, 2012, 11:46 AM

Kevin:

You cheep SOB!    [img]cid:1.3966843140(at)web161703.mail.bf1.yahoo.com[/img][img]cid:1.3966843140(at)web161703.mail.bf1.yahoo.com[/img][img]cid:1.3966843140(at)web161703.mail.bf1.yahoo.com[/img] You barrow the airports car and you don't even buy 5 Gallons of AvGas from them!  

 I'm laughing here and saying it tong in cheek.  Come on, do the math - How much are you saving?  But, wait - If your airport is like some around here... $8/Gal Shaft them royally - - - GO FOR IT!

 Barry

On Wed, Jun 13, 2012 at 8:51 AM,  <[url=/mc/compose?to=klinefelter.kevin(at)gmail.com]klinefelter.kevin(at)gmail.com[/url]> wrote:

  	  Quote: 	
		  --> RotaxEngines-List message posted by: [url=/mc/compose?to=klinefelter.kevin(at)gmail.com]klinefelter.kevin(at)gmail.com[/url]

 Hi Jim & Heather,

 I operate my 914 much the same as you. It is my understanding that running lower than 91 octane would be risky. You can mix 50/50, 87 Mogas with 100 LL.

 I have looked in to octane boosters from auto parts stores, but most of them are alcohol based and I don't want to increase the alcohol.

 I travel with a 5 gallon gas container and use that if I can borrow the "crew car", and even have taken my long ranger tank in to town for car gas and lunch on trips.

 Kevin

 Planning the trip to Oshkosh! How bout you?

 On Jun 13, 2012, at 4:02 AM, "h&jeuropa" <[url=/mc/compose?to=butcher43(at)att.net]butcher43(at)att.net[/url]> wrote:

 > --> RotaxEngines-List message posted by: "h&amp;jeuropa" <[url=/mc/compose?to=butcher43(at)att.net]butcher43(at)att.net[/url]>

 >

 > We recently did a trip to Colorado and purchased MOGAS when possible.  Most of the MOGAS available at airports was 87 not 91.  We are flying a Europa with a 914.  Since we usually operate at 70% power and only use 100% for takeoff (have never used 115% except for ground testing), is it OK to use the lower octane MOGAS?

  >

 > Jim & Heather

 >

 >

 >

 >

 > Read this topic online here:

 >

 > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=375495#375495

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 =

 -List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RotaxEngines-List

 ===========

 http://forums.matronics.com

 ===========

 le, List Admin.

 ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution

 ===========

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klinefelter.kevin(at)gmai
Guest

Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 11:35 am Post subject: Using 87 MOGAS

It's not so much about saving$. It's about not not using leaded fuel.

But your right, I am a cheap SOB!

Always fly with a smile!

Kevin

On Jun 13, 2012, at 10:46 AM, FLYaDIVE <flyadive(at)gmail.com (flyadive(at)gmail.com)> wrote:

[quote]Kevin:

You cheep SOB!    <360.gif><360.gif><360.gif> You barrow the airports car and you don't even buy 5 Gallons of AvGas from them!  

 I'm laughing here and saying it tong in cheek.  Come on, do the math - How much are you saving?  But, wait - If your airport is like some around here... $8/Gal Shaft them royally - - - GO FOR IT!

 Barry

On Wed, Jun 13, 2012 at 8:51 AM,  <klinefelter.kevin(at)gmail.com (klinefelter.kevin(at)gmail.com)> wrote:

  	  Quote: 	
		  --> RotaxEngines-List message posted by: klinefelter.kevin(at)gmail.com (klinefelter.kevin(at)gmail.com)

 Hi Jim & Heather,

 I operate my 914 much the same as you. It is my understanding that running lower than 91 octane would be risky. You can mix 50/50, 87 Mogas with 100 LL.

 I have looked in to octane boosters from auto parts stores, but most of them are alcohol based and I don't want to increase the alcohol.

 I travel with a 5 gallon gas container and use that if I can borrow the "crew car", and even have taken my long ranger tank in to town for car gas and lunch on trips.

 Kevin

 Planning the trip to Oshkosh! How bout you?

 On Jun 13, 2012, at 4:02 AM, "h&jeuropa" <butcher43(at)att.net (butcher43(at)att.net)> wrote:

 > --> RotaxEngines-List message posted by: "h&amp;jeuropa" <butcher43(at)att.net (butcher43(at)att.net)>

 >

 > We recently did a trip to Colorado and purchased MOGAS when possible.  Most of the MOGAS available at airports was 87 not 91.  We are flying a Europa with a 914.  Since we usually operate at 70% power and only use 100% for takeoff (have never used 115% except for ground testing), is it OK to use the lower octane MOGAS?

  >

 > Jim & Heather

 >

 >

 >

 >

 > Read this topic online here:

 >

 > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=375495#375495

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 =

 -List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RotaxEngines-List

 ===========

 http://forums.matronics.com

 ===========

 le, List Admin.

 ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution

 ===========

[b]

h&jeuropa

Joined: 07 Nov 2006
Posts: 645

Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:24 am Post subject: Re: Using 87 MOGAS

Kevin,



Thanks for sharing your experience.



Do you have a 5 gal can that folds down when empty?    I haven't found one and really don't have the space to carry a hard plastic can.



Probably won't do Oshkosh even though it's only an hour away.  Just too hot and too expensive.  



Jim & Heather

dirtfly7(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 10:19 am Post subject: Using 87 MOGAS

http://akbushwheels.com/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage.pbv.tpl&product_id=40&category_id=6&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=116

I  have two of these, they work great.  A little pricey but well worth it when you go to use it.



Joel

 

--- On Thu, 6/14/12, h&amp;jeuropa <butcher43(at)att.net> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  

From: h&jeuropa <butcher43(at)att.net>

Subject: Re: Using 87 MOGAS

To: rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com

Date: Thursday, June 14, 2012, 11:24 AM



--> RotaxEngines-List message posted by: "h&amp;jeuropa" <[url=/mc/compose?to=butcher43(at)att.net]butcher43(at)att.net[/url]>



Kevin,



Thanks for sharing your experience.



Do you have a 5 gal can that folds down when empty?    I haven't found one and really don't have the space to carry a hard plastic can.



Probably won't do Oshkosh even though it's only an hour away.  Just too hot and too expensive.  



Jim & Heather





Read this topic online here:



http://forums.matronics.com/viewtop; --> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RotaxEngines-Listhttp://ww=======================





	
 [quote][b]

h&jeuropa

Joined: 07 Nov 2006
Posts: 645

Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 12:29 pm Post subject: Re: Using 87 MOGAS

Joel,



Are they resistant to gasoline, at least for short periods - so you can go to station, fill them and empty them into plane?



Jim & Heather

klinefelter.kevin(at)gmai
Guest

Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 1:43 pm Post subject: Using 87 MOGAS

Jim,

I do not have a "soft" gas container. I saw some once, I think they were called turtlepacs or something.

It's sad that we can't get 91 unleaded commonly at airports. I'm trying plan the flight to KOSH from CA without using 100LL.

Not sure it can be done without driving to town for car gas.

Kevin



On Jun 14, 2012, at 10:24 AM, "h&jeuropa" <butcher43(at)att.net> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

 Kevin,

 

 Thanks for sharing your experience.

 

 Do you have a 5 gal can that folds down when empty?    I haven't found one and really don't have the space to carry a hard plastic can.

 Probably won't do Oshkosh even though it's only an hour away.  Just too hot and too expensive.  

 

 Jim & Heather

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=375657#375657

dirtfly7(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 2:10 pm Post subject: Using 87 MOGAS

Yes, They are made for Gasoline and are very durable.  When empty they are only about 1/4 inch thick and will lay flat in your baggage area.  They are about 2 ft X 2ft square with really nice handles to carry it and to pour into the tank.  There is also a spout that threads onto the end.  The bag will lay on top of the wing while the fuel drains in.  Much easier than a rigid gas can.



Joel



--- On Thu, 6/14/12, h&amp;jeuropa <butcher43(at)att.net> wrote:

[quote]

From: h&jeuropa <butcher43(at)att.net>

Subject: Re: Using 87 MOGAS

To: rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com

Date: Thursday, June 14, 2012, 2:29 PM



--> RotaxEngines-List message posted by: "h&amp;jeuropa" <[url=/mc/compose?to=butcher43(at)att.net]butcher43(at)att.net[/url]>



Joel,



Are they resistant to gasoline, at least for short periods - so you can go to station, fill them and empty them into plane?



Jim & Heather





Read this topic online here:



http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=375681#375681



onics.com/Navigator?RotaxEngines-List" target="_blank">http://www.matroni/forums.matronics.com" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com [quote][b]

Roger Lee

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1464
Location: Tucson, Az.

Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 2:45 pm Post subject: Re: Using 87 MOGAS

I wrote the company and here is their reply.



"The bags are made for gas, the E10 is a little ruff on the lids but the 100LL has been just fine."

 



Alaskan Bushwheel Inc

1-800-442-8473

www.akbushwheel.com

_________________
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Rotax Instructor & Rotax IRC
Light Sport Repairman
Home 520-574-1080 TRY HOME FIRST
Cell 520-349-7056

l_luv2_fly(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 4:56 am Post subject: Using 87 MOGAS

Hi Joel,

I was wondering if you have any problems with the the bags swelling up the residual gasoline left after you have empty them into the airplane gas tanks and put them away in the back of the airplane.

Paul

        From: Joel M. <dirtfly7(at)yahoo.com>

 To: rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com 

 Sent: Thursday, June 14, 2012  1:18 PM

 Subject: Re: Re: Using 87 MOGAS

 http://akbushwheels.com/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage.pbv.tpl&product_id=40&category_id=6&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=116

I  have two of these, they work great.  A little pricey but well worth it when you go to use it.

Joel

 [quote][b]

dirtfly7(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 2:30 pm Post subject: Using 87 MOGAS

They have never swelled up.  There isn't much if any residual gas that remains.



Joel



--- On Fri, 6/15/12, Paul McAllister <l_luv2_fly(at)yahoo.com> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  

From: Paul McAllister <l_luv2_fly(at)yahoo.com>

Subject: Re: Re: Using 87 MOGAS

To: "rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com" <rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com>

Date: Friday, June 15, 2012, 6:51 AM



Hi Joel,

I was wondering if you have any problems with the the bags swelling up the residual gasoline left after you have empty them into  the airplane gas tanks and put them away in the back of the airplane.

Paul

        From: Joel M. <dirtfly7(at)yahoo.com>

 To: rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com 

 Sent: Thursday, June 14, 2012  1:18 PM

 Subject: Re: Re: Using 87 MOGAS

  

 

 http://akbushwheels.com/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage.pbv.tpl&product_id=40&category_id=6&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=116

I  have two of these, they work great.  A little pricey but well worth it when you go to use it.



Joel



 

 

  

  	  Quote: 	
		  http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RotaxEngines-List

target="_blank" href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www======================


	




	
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