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JLuckey(at)pacbell.net
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 Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 5:33 pm Post subject: What'w wrong with this circuit? |
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Please see attached jpg (and forgive my scribbling).
Schematic is simplified – omitting things like contactors. Looking for discussion on the general theory of feeding main bus thru isolation diodes for max protection from failure in batt -> contactor -> feed cable chain
Mission:
To provide reliable power to the Bus
Assume:
The diodes are big & well heat-sunk (sinked?)
Analysis:
1. What are the top 3 reasons not to use a circuit like this
2. Other ways to accomplish the same thing
Thanks,
Jeff Luckey
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mrspudandcompany(at)veriz
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| Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2012 5:07 am Post subject: What'w wrong with this circuit? |
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| Quote: |
Schematic is simplified – omitting things like contactors. Looking for discussion on the general theory of feeding main bus thru isolation diodes for max protection from failure in batt -> contactor -> feed cable chain
Mission:
To provide reliable power to the Bus
Assume:
The diodes are big & well heat-sunk (sinked?)
Analysis:
1. What are the top 3 reasons not to use a circuit like this
2. Other ways to accomplish the same thing
Thanks,
Jeff Luckey
| Quote: |
Your system will work, but there are many unanswered questions that must be addressed before the final design can be reached. Among other things you need to decide the utility of the craft ie., day VFR, IFR, etc. Instrumentation, lights etc. that will need to be powered. Is the engine ignition battery dependent? This along with system integrity and reliability, much of which has been discussed on this forum.
My suggestion is to go through the schematics offered on the Aeroelectric site and pick the one that is the simplest and will suit your needs. No reason to reinvent the wheel,"Bob already did it"
If you do not feel comfortable selecting a schematic, or need some help with special mods, then this is a great place to ask. You will only be able to get help if you detail your aircraft and how it will be used. As you can see, from looking at Bob's library of schmatics there are a variety of options to craft a good reliable electrical system.
Roger |
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[quote][b]
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Eric M. Jones
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 565
Location: Massachusetts
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| Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2012 5:16 am Post subject: Re: What'w wrong with this circuit? |
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Basically it's fine. I have been selling a Power-Schottky part that will do this function for some time. I think others do to. See attached.
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Download |
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Power_Deuce_Schottky_ Manual.pdf |
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307 Time(s) |
_________________
Eric M. Jones
www.PerihelionDesign.com
113 Brentwood Drive
Southbridge, MA 01550
(508) 764-2072
emjones(at)charter.net |
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henador_titzoff(at)yahoo.
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| Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2012 10:36 am Post subject: What'w wrong with this circuit? |
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Roger,
The only thing that concerns me is how you're going to connect the alternator to BOTH batteries. That will essentially short their positives together, thus paralleling them. Do you have two alternators?
Henador Titzoff
--- On Tue, 6/26/12, Roger <mrspudandcompany(at)verizon.net> wrote:
| Quote: |
From: Roger <mrspudandcompany(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: What'w wrong with this circuit?
To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Tuesday, June 26, 2012, 6:04 AM
| Quote: |
Schematic is simplified – omitting things like contactors. Looking for discussion on the general theory of feeding main bus thru isolation diodes for max protection from failure in batt -> contactor -> feed cable chain
Mission:
To provide reliable power to the Bus
Assume:
The diodes are big & well heat-sunk (sinked?)
Analysis:
1. What are the top 3 reasons not to use a circuit like this
2. Other ways to accomplish the same thing
Thanks,
Jeff Luckey
| Quote: |
Your system will work, but there are many unanswered questions that must be addressed before the final design can be reached. Among other things you need to decide the utility of the craft ie., day VFR, IFR, etc. Instrumentation, lights etc. that will need to be powered. Is the engine ignition battery dependent? This along with system integrity and reliability, much of which has been discussed on this forum.
My suggestion is to go through the schematics offered on the Aeroelectric site and pick the one that is the simplest and will suit your needs. No reason to reinvent the wheel,"Bob already did it"
If you do not feel comfortable selecting a schematic, or need some help with special mods, then this is a great place to ask. You will only be able to get help if you detail your aircraft and how it will be used. As you can see, from looking at Bob's library of schmatics there are a variety of options to craft a good reliable electrical system.
Roger |
http://www.matron="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution============
|
|
[quote][b]
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JLuckey(at)pacbell.net
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2012 12:34 pm Post subject: What'w wrong with this circuit? |
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Henador,
The diodes shown isolate the batts from each other.
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Henador Titzoff
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 11:35
To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: What'w wrong with this circuit?
Roger,
The only thing that concerns me is how you're going to connect the alternator to BOTH batteries. That will essentially short their positives together, thus paralleling them. Do you have two alternators?
Henador Titzoff
--- On Tue, 6/26/12, Roger <mrspudandcompany(at)verizon.net> wrote:
From: Roger <mrspudandcompany(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: What'w wrong with this circuit?
To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Tuesday, June 26, 2012, 6:04 AM
| Quote: |
Schematic is simplified – omitting things like contactors. Looking for discussion on the general theory of feeding main bus thru isolation diodes for max protection from failure in batt -> contactor -> feed cable chain
Mission:
To provide reliable power to the Bus
Assume:
The diodes are big & well heat-sunk (sinked?)
Analysis:
1. What are the top 3 reasons not to use a circuit like this
2. Other ways to accomplish the same thing
Thanks,
Jeff Luckey
| Quote: |
Your system will work, but there are many unanswered questions that must be addressed before the final design can be reached. Among other things you need to decide the utility of the craft ie., day VFR, IFR, etc. Instrumentation, lights etc. that will need to be powered. Is the engine ignition battery dependent? This along with system integrity and reliability, much of which has been discussed on this forum.
My suggestion is to go through the schematics offered on the Aeroelectric site and pick the one that is the simplest and will suit your needs. No reason to reinvent the wheel,"Bob already did it"
If you do not feel comfortable selecting a schematic, or need some help with special mods, then this is a great place to ask. You will only be able to get help if you detail your aircraft and how it will be used. As you can see, from looking at Bob's library of schmatics there are a variety of options to craft a good reliable electrical system.
Roger |
http://www.matron="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution============ |
012345678901
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
06/26/12 [quote][b]
| | - The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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JLuckey(at)pacbell.net
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2012 12:39 pm Post subject: What'w wrong with this circuit? |
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That was an incomplete answer…
If on a single-alternator system, the alternator will have to charge thru a charge divider circuit.
From: Jeff Luckey [mailto:JLuckey(at)pacbell.net]
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 13:33
To: 'aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com'
Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: What'w wrong with this circuit?
Henador,
The diodes shown isolate the batts from each other.
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Henador Titzoff
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 11:35
To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: What'w wrong with this circuit?
Roger,
The only thing that concerns me is how you're going to connect the alternator to BOTH batteries. That will essentially short their positives together, thus paralleling them. Do you have two alternators?
Henador Titzoff
--- On Tue, 6/26/12, Roger <mrspudandcompany(at)verizon.net> wrote:
From: Roger <mrspudandcompany(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: What'w wrong with this circuit?
To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Tuesday, June 26, 2012, 6:04 AM
| Quote: |
Schematic is simplified – omitting things like contactors. Looking for discussion on the general theory of feeding main bus thru isolation diodes for max protection from failure in batt -> contactor -> feed cable chain
Mission:
To provide reliable power to the Bus
Assume:
The diodes are big & well heat-sunk (sinked?)
Analysis:
1. What are the top 3 reasons not to use a circuit like this
2. Other ways to accomplish the same thing
Thanks,
Jeff Luckey
| Quote: |
Your system will work, but there are many unanswered questions that must be addressed before the final design can be reached. Among other things you need to decide the utility of the craft ie., day VFR, IFR, etc. Instrumentation, lights etc. that will need to be powered. Is the engine ignition battery dependent? This along with system integrity and reliability, much of which has been discussed on this forum.
My suggestion is to go through the schematics offered on the Aeroelectric site and pick the one that is the simplest and will suit your needs. No reason to reinvent the wheel,"Bob already did it"
If you do not feel comfortable selecting a schematic, or need some help with special mods, then this is a great place to ask. You will only be able to get help if you detail your aircraft and how it will be used. As you can see, from looking at Bob's library of schmatics there are a variety of options to craft a good reliable electrical system.
Roger |
http://www.matron="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution============ |
012345678901
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
06/26/12 [quote][b]
| | - The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List |
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henador_titzoff(at)yahoo.
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2012 3:11 pm Post subject: What'w wrong with this circuit? |
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What's a charge divider circuit, Jeff? Is it an electronic hatchet comprised of one, two or a PLC controlled by a laptop? Can you send us a screamatic?
Henador Titzoff
--- On Tue, 6/26/12, Jeff Luckey <JLuckey(at)pacbell.net> wrote:
| Quote: |
From: Jeff Luckey <JLuckey(at)pacbell.net>
Subject: RE: What'w wrong with this circuit?
To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Tuesday, June 26, 2012, 1:38 PM
That was an incomplete answer…
If on a single-alternator system, the alternator will have to charge thru a charge divider circuit.
From: Jeff Luckey [mailto:JLuckey(at)pacbell.net]
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 13:33
To: ' aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com '
Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: What'w wrong with this circuit?
Henador,
The diodes shown isolate the batts from each other.
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Henador Titzoff
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 11:35
To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: What'w wrong with this circuit?
Roger,
The only thing that concerns me is how you're going to connect the alternator to BOTH batteries. That will essentially short their positives together, thus paralleling them. Do you have two alternators?
Henador Titzoff
--- On Tue, 6/26/12, Roger <mrspudandcompany(at)verizon.net> wrote:
From: Roger <mrspudandcompany(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: What'w wrong with this circuit?
To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Tuesday, June 26, 2012, 6:04 AM
| Quote: |
Schematic is simplified – omitting things like contactors. Looking for discussion on the general theory of feeding main bus thru isolation diodes for max protection from failure in batt -> contactor -> feed cable chain
Mission:
To provide reliable power to the Bus
Assume:
The diodes are big & well heat-sunk (sinked?)
Analysis:
1. What are the top 3 reasons not to use a circuit like this
2. Other ways to accomplish the same thing
Thanks,
Jeff Luckey
| Quote: |
Your system will work, but there are many unanswered questions that must be addressed before the final design can be reached. Among other things you need to decide the utility of the craft ie., day VFR, IFR, etc. Instrumentation, lights etc. that will need to be powered. Is the engine ignition battery dependent? This along with system integrity and reliability, much of which has been discussed on this forum.
My suggestion is to go through the schematics offered on the Aeroelectric site and pick the one that is the simplest and will suit your needs. No reason to reinvent the wheel,"Bob already did it"
If you do not feel comfortable selecting a schematic, or need some help with special mods, then this is a great place to ask. You will only be able to get help if you detail your aircraft and how it will be used. As you can see, from looking at Bob's library of schmatics there are a variety of options to craft a good reliable electrical system.
Roger |
http://www.matron="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution============ |
| Quote: | | http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List |
01234
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
06/26/12 5
|
[quote][b]
| | - The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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JLuckey(at)pacbell.net
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2012 3:42 pm Post subject: What'w wrong with this circuit? |
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|
There are certainly “intelligent” charge dividers available but in this case I’m thinking about something much more “old-fashioned” – like a couple of diodes in the output of the alternator which isolate the 2 batteries from each other. I will scribble a schematic when time permits.
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Henador Titzoff
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 16:08
To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: What'w wrong with this circuit?
What's a charge divider circuit, Jeff? Is it an electronic hatchet comprised of one, two or a PLC controlled by a laptop? Can you send us a screamatic?
Henador Titzoff
--- On Tue, 6/26/12, Jeff Luckey <JLuckey(at)pacbell.net> wrote:
From: Jeff Luckey <JLuckey(at)pacbell.net>
Subject: RE: What'w wrong with this circuit?
To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Tuesday, June 26, 2012, 1:38 PM
That was an incomplete answer…
If on a single-alternator system, the alternator will have to charge thru a charge divider circuit.
From: Jeff Luckey [mailto:JLuckey(at)pacbell.net]
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 13:33
To: ' aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com '
Subject: RE: What'w wrong with this circuit?
Henador,
The diodes shown isolate the batts from each other.
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Henador Titzoff
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 11:35
To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: What'w wrong with this circuit?
Roger,
The only thing that concerns me is how you're going to connect the alternator to BOTH batteries. That will essentially short their positives together, thus paralleling them. Do you have two alternators?
Henador Titzoff
--- On Tue, 6/26/12, Roger <mrspudandcompany(at)verizon.net> wrote:
From: Roger <mrspudandcompany(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Re: What'w wrong with this circuit?
To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Tuesday, June 26, 2012, 6:04 AM
| Quote: |
Schematic is simplified – omitting things like contactors. Looking for discussion on the general theory of feeding main bus thru isolation diodes for max protection from failure in batt -> contactor -> feed cable chain
Mission:
To provide reliable power to the Bus
Assume:
The diodes are big & well heat-sunk (sinked?)
Analysis:
1. What are the top 3 reasons not to use a circuit like this
2. Other ways to accomplish the same thing
Thanks,
Jeff Luckey
| Quote: |
Your system will work, but there are many unanswered questions that must be addressed before the final design can be reached. Among other things you need to decide the utility of the craft ie., day VFR, IFR, etc. Instrumentation, lights etc. that will need to be powered. Is the engine ignition battery dependent? This along with system integrity and reliability, much of which has been discussed on this forum.
My suggestion is to go through the schematics offered on the Aeroelectric site and pick the one that is the simplest and will suit your needs. No reason to reinvent the wheel,"Bob already did it"
If you do not feel comfortable selecting a schematic, or need some help with special mods, then this is a great place to ask. You will only be able to get help if you detail your aircraft and how it will be used. As you can see, from looking at Bob's library of schmatics there are a variety of options to craft a good reliable electrical system.
Roger |
|
http://www.matron="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution============
| Quote: | | http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-Listhttp://forums.matronics.comhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution |
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
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06/26/12 [quote][b]
| | - The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2012 4:49 pm Post subject: What'w wrong with this circuit? |
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At 06:41 PM 6/26/2012, you wrote:
| Quote: | | There are certainly “intelligent” charge dividers available |
Can you cite such a product we can see on the 'net?
I'm not sure I know what these devices are . . .
| Quote: | | but in this case I’m thinking about something much more “old-fashioned” – like a couple of diodes in the output of the alternator which isolate the 2 batteries from each other. I will scribble a schematic when time permits. |
You might wish to fold ideas in this article
into your deliberations.
http://tinyurl.com/77sf9sx
http://tinyurl.com/78lg7kf
http://tinyurl.com/7lhbbah
What value do you see for solid-state isolation of
batteries? What's the failure you're trying to
make tolerable? What are the cost, weight, energy
benefits ratios for diode isolation versus hard-contacts
isolation?
[quote] Bob . . .[/b] [quote][b]
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