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bigginsking
Joined: 25 Sep 2012
Posts: 27
Location: San Diego, California
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 Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 2:58 pm Post subject: Delayed tail cone attaching? |
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Greetings,I'm figuring out space for building an RV-10, translation is that my wife and I are passively shopping for a house.
I'm wondering if you can delay attaching the tail cone until after you've completed the firewall forward, interior, windows, doors and just about everything else that takes forever to finish?
Seems like you'd be able to build the RV-10 in a much smaller place if you didn't have to attach the tail cone until much later, like at the airport.
Anyway, I'd love to hear some opinions on this.
Thanks,
Bill Judge
N84WJ, RV-8, 843 hrshttp://rv-8.blogspot.com/
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philperry9
Joined: 23 Nov 2011
Posts: 381
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 3:09 pm Post subject: Delayed tail cone attaching? |
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I don't think that would be a problem. The only issue that I can think of would be at the baggage bulkhead. I think you'd have to wait to do that until the tailcone is attached.
On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 4:56 PM, Bill Judge <bjudge(at)gmail.com (bjudge(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
[quote]Seems like you'd be able to build the RV-10 in a much smaller place if you didn't have to attach the tail cone until much later, like at the airport.
[b]
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rv10pro(at)gmail.com
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 3:09 pm Post subject: Delayed tail cone attaching? |
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Longerons are integral to FWF and fuselage.
John 40600 On Dec 4, 2012 3:02 PM, "Bill Judge" <bjudge(at)gmail.com (bjudge(at)gmail.com)> wrote:[quote] Greetings,I'm figuring out space for building an RV-10, translation is that my wife and I are passively shopping for a house.
I'm wondering if you can delay attaching the tail cone until after you've completed the firewall forward, interior, windows, doors and just about everything else that takes forever to finish?
Seems like you'd be able to build the RV-10 in a much smaller place if you didn't have to attach the tail cone until much later, like at the airport.
Anyway, I'd love to hear some opinions on this.
Thanks,
Bill Judge
N84WJ, RV-8, 843 hrshttp://rv-8.blogspot.com/
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get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
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jesse(at)saintaviation.co
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 3:57 pm Post subject: Delayed tail cone attaching? |
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You really need the tailbone attached to be able to do doors and other things. You could possibly attach the rear windows to the cabin top, but that's not a big job. The cabin top installation requires the tailbone to be attached.
On the firewall forward, you would really want the upper forward fuselage at a minimum, and I may worry about things being deformed in the back if I didn't have the tailcone on, as John mentioned. I have replaced a tailcone on a finished plane before, so it isn't physically impossible, but the tailcone had originally been on when the rest had been done.
In short, it can probably be done, but it would introduce more risks than I would want. At the very least I would want to Cleco the tailcone on and install the cabin top permanently before going to the fwf, and that would be absolutely necessary, IMHO, before doing the doors.
Jesse SaintI-TEC, Inc.
jesse(at)itecusa.org (jesse(at)itecusa.org)
www.itecusa.org
www.mavericklsa.com
C: 352-427-0285
O: 352-465-4545
F: 815-377-3694
Sent from my iPhone
On Dec 4, 2012, at 6:09 PM, John Cox <rv10pro(at)gmail.com (rv10pro(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
[quote]
Longerons are integral to FWF and fuselage.
John 40600 On Dec 4, 2012 3:02 PM, "Bill Judge" <bjudge(at)gmail.com (bjudge(at)gmail.com)> wrote: | Quote: | Greetings,I'm figuring out space for building an RV-10, translation is that my wife and I are passively shopping for a house.
I'm wondering if you can delay attaching the tail cone until after you've completed the firewall forward, interior, windows, doors and just about everything else that takes forever to finish?
Seems like you'd be able to build the RV-10 in a much smaller place if you didn't have to attach the tail cone until much later, like at the airport.
Anyway, I'd love to hear some opinions on this.
Thanks,
Bill Judge
N84WJ, RV-8, 843 hrshttp://rv-8.blogspot.com/
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rleffler
Joined: 05 Nov 2006
Posts: 680
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 6:10 pm Post subject: Delayed tail cone attaching? |
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I built 90% of my project in one half of a two car garage. You'll want to attach the tail cone, but you'll can leave the horizontal and vertical off until the airport. The biggest issue is where to store the empennage parts while building the wings. I hung mine from the ceiling, but I have 14' ceilings in the garage. I couldn't put on the engine mount on in my garage due to other things in the garage, but if your two car is empty, it shouldn't be an issue.
The fuselage and wings will take about the same amount of space.
You won't be able to complete many tasks without the tail cone riveted to the fuselage. Leaving it off wouldn't be my recommendation.
Bob
[quote] On Dec 4, 2012 3:02 PM, "Bill Judge" <bjudge(at)gmail.com (bjudge(at)gmail.com)> wrote: | Quote: | Greetings,I'm figuring out space for building an RV-10, translation is that my wife and I are passively shopping for a house.
I'm wondering if you can delay attaching the tail cone until after you've completed the firewall forward, interior, windows, doors and just about everything else that takes forever to finish?
Seems like you'd be able to build the RV-10 in a much smaller place if you didn't have to attach the tail cone until much later, like at the airport.
Anyway, I'd love to hear some opinions on this.
Thanks,
Bill Judge
N84WJ, RV-8, 843 hrshttp://rv-8.blogspot.com/
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Bob Leffler
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bigginsking
Joined: 25 Sep 2012
Posts: 27
Location: San Diego, California
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| Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 7:36 am Post subject: Delayed tail cone attaching? |
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Thanks for the advice.
So, if you were length constrained, it sounds like the best you could do would be to cleco the tailcone on, fit the cabin top, finish the doors and interior then pull the tail cone off to do the fire wall forward work. In that case all you're saving is the length from the firewall to the spinner, bottom line is that you need 20 feet at least.
Wing and empannage storage isn't a problem, I've got a hangar for that, I just know that the longer you stay at the house the faster you get done.
VR,
Bill
On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 12:01 AM, RV10-List Digest Server <rv10-list(at)matronics.com (rv10-list(at)matronics.com)> wrote:
[quote] *
=========================
Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
=========================
Today's complete RV10-List Digest can also be found in either of the
two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted
in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
of the RV10-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor
such as Notepad or with a web browser.
HTML Version:
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EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
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RV10-List Digest Archive
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Total Messages Posted Tue 12/04/12: 5
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Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 02:58 PM - Delayed tail cone attaching? (Bill Judge)
2. 03:09 PM - Re: Delayed tail cone attaching? (Phillip Perry)
3. 03:09 PM - Re: Delayed tail cone attaching? (John Cox)
4. 03:57 PM - Re: Delayed tail cone attaching? (Jesse Saint)
5. 06:10 PM - Re: Delayed tail cone attaching? (Bob Leffler)
________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________
Time: 02:58:17 PM PST US
From: Bill Judge <bjudge(at)gmail.com (bjudge(at)gmail.com)>
Subject: Delayed tail cone attaching?
Greetings,
I'm figuring out space for building an RV-10, translation is that my wife
and I are passively shopping for a house.
I'm wondering if you can delay attaching the tail cone until after you've
completed the firewall forward, interior, windows, doors and just about
everything else that takes forever to finish?
Seems like you'd be able to build the RV-10 in a much smaller place if you
didn't have to attach the tail cone until much later, like at the airport.
Anyway, I'd love to hear some opinions on this.
Thanks,
Bill Judge
N84WJ, RV-8, 843 hrs
http://rv-8.blogspot.com/
________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________
Time: 03:09:09 PM PST US
Subject: Re: Delayed tail cone attaching?
From: Phillip Perry <philperry9(at)gmail.com (philperry9(at)gmail.com)>
I don't think that would be a problem. The only issue that I can think of
would be at the baggage bulkhead. I think you'd have to wait to do that
until the tailcone is attached.
On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 4:56 PM, Bill Judge <bjudge(at)gmail.com (bjudge(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
> Seems like you'd be able to build the RV-10 in a much smaller place if you
> didn't have to attach the tail cone until much later, like at the airport.
>
________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________
Time: 03:09:41 PM PST US
Subject: Re: Delayed tail cone attaching?
From: John Cox <rv10pro(at)gmail.com (rv10pro(at)gmail.com)>
Longerons are integral to FWF and fuselage.
John 40600
On Dec 4, 2012 3:02 PM, "Bill Judge" <bjudge(at)gmail.com (bjudge(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
> Greetings,
> I'm figuring out space for building an RV-10, translation is that my wife
> and I are passively shopping for a house.
>
> I'm wondering if you can delay attaching the tail cone until after you've
> completed the firewall forward, interior, windows, doors and just about
> everything else that takes forever to finish?
>
> Seems like you'd be able to build the RV-10 in a much smaller place if you
> didn't have to attach the tail cone until much later, like at the airport.
>
> Anyway, I'd love to hear some opinions on this.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Bill Judge
> N84WJ, RV-8, 843 hrs
> http://rv-8.blogspot.com/
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________
Time: 03:57:55 PM PST US
Subject: Re: Delayed tail cone attaching?
From: Jesse Saint <jesse(at)saintaviation.com (jesse(at)saintaviation.com)>
You really need the tailbone attached to be able to do doors and other thing
s. You could possibly attach the rear windows to the cabin top, but that's n
ot a big job. The cabin top installation requires the tailbone to be attache
d.
On the firewall forward, you would really want the upper forward fuselage at
a minimum, and I may worry about things being deformed in the back if I did
n't have the tailcone on, as John mentioned. I have replaced a tailcone on a
finished plane before, so it isn't physically impossible, but the tailcone h
ad originally been on when the rest had been done.
In short, it can probably be done, but it would introduce more risks than I w
ould want. At the very least I would want to Cleco the tailcone on and insta
ll the cabin top permanently before going to the fwf, and that would be abso
lutely necessary, IMHO, before doing the doors.
Jesse Saint
I-TEC, Inc.
jesse(at)itecusa.org (jesse(at)itecusa.org)
www.itecusa.org
www.mavericklsa.com
C: [url=tel:352-427-0285]352-427-0285[/url]
O: [url=tel:352-465-4545]352-465-4545[/url]
F: [url=tel:815-377-3694]815-377-3694[/url]
Sent from my iPhone
On Dec 4, 2012, at 6:09 PM, John Cox <rv10pro(at)gmail.com (rv10pro(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
> Longerons are integral to FWF and fuselage.
>
> John 40600
>
> On Dec 4, 2012 3:02 PM, "Bill Judge" <bjudge(at)gmail.com (bjudge(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
>> Greetings,
>> I'm figuring out space for building an RV-10, translation is that my wife
and I are passively shopping for a house.
>>
>> I'm wondering if you can delay attaching the tail cone until after you've
completed the firewall forward, interior, windows, doors and just about eve
rything else that takes forever to finish?
>>
>> Seems like you'd be able to build the RV-10 in a much smaller place if yo
u didn't have to attach the tail cone until much later, like at the airport.
>>
>> Anyway, I'd love to hear some opinions on this.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Bill Judge
>> N84WJ, RV-8, 843 hrs
>> http://rv-8.blogspot.com/
>>
>>
>>
>> _blank">www.aeroelectric.com
>> .com" target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com
>> ="_blank">www.homebuilthelp.com
>> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>> get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
>> tp://forums.matronics.com
>>
>
>
>
=
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>
________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________
Time: 06:10:05 PM PST US
Subject: Re: Delayed tail cone attaching?
From: Bob Leffler <rv(at)thelefflers.com (rv(at)thelefflers.com)>
I built 90% of my project in one half of a two car garage. You'll want to a
ttach the tail cone, but you'll can leave the horizontal and vertical off un
til the airport. The biggest issue is where to store the empennage parts w
hile building the wings. I hung mine from the ceiling, but I have 14' ceil
ings in the garage. I couldn't put on the engine mount on in my garage due
to other things in the garage, but if your two car is empty, it shouldn't b
e an issue.
The fuselage and wings will take about the same amount of space.
You won't be able to complete many tasks without the tail cone riveted to th
e fuselage. Leaving it off wouldn't be my recommendation.
Bob
> On Dec 4, 2012 3:02 PM, "Bill Judge" <bjudge(at)gmail.com (bjudge(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
>> Greetings,
>> I'm figuring out space for building an RV-10, translation is that my wife
and I are passively shopping for a house.
>>
>> I'm wondering if you can delay attaching the tail cone until after you've
completed the firewall forward, interior, windows, doors and just about eve
rything else that takes forever to finish?
>>
>> Seems like you'd be able to build the RV-10 in a much smaller place if yo
u didn't have to attach the tail cone until much later, like at the airport.
>>
>> Anyway, I'd love to hear some opinions on this.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Bill Judge
>> N84WJ, RV-8, 843 hrs
>> http://rv-8.blogspot.com/
>>
>>
>>
>> _blank">www.aeroelectric.com
>> .com" target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com
>> ="_blank">www.homebuilthelp.com
>> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>> get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
>> tp://forums.matronics.com
>>
>
>
>
=
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=
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=
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=
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>
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="_blank">www.aeroelectric.com
ooks.com" target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com
et="_blank">www.homebuilthelp.com
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le, List Admin.
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arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
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Phil White
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 45
Location: Downers Grove, IL
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| Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 8:13 am Post subject: Re: Delayed tail cone attaching? |
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Bill: I built my -10 in one half a modest 2 car garage, attached tail cone, and hung my Mazda engine (which with PSRU, is 6" longer than stock to prop flange), and I could close the garage door with 1/2" to spare. Not easy to pull out and re-park, but I did it several times, with jockeying. Also built a cradle that stored both wings leading edge down plus the horiz stab between, and it fit beside the fuse.
All this to maintain marital peace by allowing wife's car to be in out of Chicago winters for several years.
Better by far to build at home than drive to a hangar. Those late nite work session from 10:30 to 11:30 were very productive.
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Tim Olson
Joined: 25 Jan 2007
Posts: 2872
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| Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 11:35 am Post subject: Delayed tail cone attaching? |
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I'd agree with that. I don't think I'd want to even just cleco
it and finish the cabin top, because if you get anything not
solid and aligned it could cause issues with doors and windows
and flex later. So better to just leave everything involving
the cabin top until after you can join the tailcone.
My garage wouldn't handle the airplane straight in, with the
tailcone attached. I had to angle it across the garage. I think
I used 22' or so. I'd just keep shopping for that house with
a bigger garage and work on the other things that you can first.
You could probably even do your entire panel and stuff, if you
make things easily removable, if you have to.
Tim
do not archive
On 12/5/2012 9:34 AM, Bill Judge wrote:
| Quote: | Thanks for the advice.
So, if you were length constrained, it sounds like the best you could do
would be to cleco the tailcone on, fit the cabin top, finish the doors
and interior then pull the tail cone off to do the fire wall forward
work. In that case all you're saving is the length from the firewall to
the spinner, bottom line is that you need 20 feet at least.
Wing and empannage storage isn't a problem, I've got a hangar for that,
I just know that the longer you stay at the house the faster you get done.
VR,
Bill
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rv10flyer
Joined: 25 Aug 2009
Posts: 364
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| Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 1:02 pm Post subject: Re: Delayed tail cone attaching? |
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Follow the plans. There are many structural reasons why aircraft are assembled in a certain order. You'll need a minimum of 23' X23' inside garage wall dimensions without a center support post to have room to work with engine/prop on and HS/VS off. I spent the last 100 hrs with final assembly at the airport. Good luck with the house search and -10 build. If you can find a house with the electrical panel in the garage...all the better. Nice for air compressor, heating or a/c and lighting.
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