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JohnF
Joined: 13 May 2010
Posts: 124
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 Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2012 10:04 am Post subject: Starter Oddity |
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I did my best to insure good contact on all points from battery to starter. The RV-12 that this Rotax 912 ULS is installed in is incredibly difficult to get at things aft of the engine...no room for even your hands in most cases unless you want to physically pull the engine - not a pleasant prospect.
I found nothing suspicious excent that my cheapo digital multimete shows battery terminal voltage well over 14 volts, so I am disregarding that reading...
After doing what I could about terminal condition I tried the starter without any ignition turned on. I did 10 prop starts and stops with no abnormal outcomes. I waited a while and did another 10, again no problems. I again waited a while and did another 10 and still no problems. (Battery seemed very strong during this effort)
I hate intermittent problems; I know they always come back to bite you. For now I am going to leave things alone and see what turns up.
Will post outcome.
John
[quote][b]
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BARRY CHECK 6
Joined: 15 Mar 2011
Posts: 738
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| Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2012 12:42 pm Post subject: Starter Oddity |
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John:
Doing voltage checks with a meter that you are not comfortable with or that reads incorrect is a waste of time. Get a second meter of a different brand and compare the two. Use a simple NEW 1.5 VDC (D Cell) and see what that reads, then stack 8 D Cells and verify the meter accuracy (1.5 V x 8 = 12V).
Doing your 10 prop starts is totally useless, SINCE there is a strong possibility the problem is your Starter Relay. As I mentioned before repeated starts burns off or knocks off carbon on the contacts and give a FALSE - Positive.
Here is a test for that:
1 - REMOVE the wire TO the starter.
2 - Close the switch so the Starter Relay is engaged. {DO NOT DISENGAGE THE STARTER SWITCH ONCE YOU START THIS TEST}
3 - Read the Voltage across (INPUT to OUTPUT) the Starter Relay [INPUT to Ground... OUTPUT to Ground] - It should read the SAME as the Voltage going INTO (INPUT) the Starter Relay.
4 - Next with the Starter RELAY still closed {DO NOT DISENGAGE THE STARTER SWITCH ONCE YOU START THIS TEST}
Read the Voltage ACROSS the Starter Relay - It should Read ZERO VOLTS. Any voltage means REPLACE the starter.
5 - A variation on the above test - With the Starter Relay STILL closed - {DO NOT DISENGAGE THE STARTER SWITCH ONCE YOU START THIS TEST} Read the RESISTANCE across the INPUT to OUTPUT terminals of the Starter Relay. - It should read ZERO OHMS on the LOWEST SCALE. ALSO - - - ZERO out the meter resistance OR subtract the meter resistance from your reading. Anything between 0 and 0.1 Ohms accept... ANYTHING OVER that - Replace the Starter Relay.
John, if yo would like to add pictures please do so - They Help!
Barry
On Wed, Oct 10, 2012 at 2:03 PM, JohnF <n29cx(at)ridgeviewtel.us (n29cx(at)ridgeviewtel.us)> wrote:
[quote] I did my best to insure good contact on all points from battery to starter. The RV-12 that this Rotax 912 ULS is installed in is incredibly difficult to get at things aft of the engine...no room for even your hands in most cases unless you want to physically pull the engine - not a pleasant prospect.
I found nothing suspicious excent that my cheapo digital multimete shows battery terminal voltage well over 14 volts, so I am disregarding that reading...
After doing what I could about terminal condition I tried the starter without any ignition turned on. I did 10 prop starts and stops with no abnormal outcomes. I waited a while and did another 10, again no problems. I again waited a while and did another 10 and still no problems. (Battery seemed very strong during this effort)
I hate intermittent problems; I know they always come back to bite you. For now I am going to leave things alone and see what turns up.
Will post outcome.
John
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JohnF
Joined: 13 May 2010
Posts: 124
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| Posted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 2:27 pm Post subject: Re: Starter Oddity |
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The starting oddity that arose in early October has been resolved.
The problem described above happened perhaps once in 10-15 starts. After exhausting all ideas I purchased and installed a new battery. The terminal voltage of the old battery looked fine, but it now seems that the battery could not deliver the current rush needed for starting often times.
The new battery starts the engine on the first blade over and is amazing compared to the original battery that was perhaps a bit over 2-years old. Seems rather fast for a battery to show trouble, but all is now well.
(Old saying that throwing money at a problem is crude, but often effective.)
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Roger Lee
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1464
Location: Tucson, Az.
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| Posted: Sun Mar 03, 2013 6:32 am Post subject: Re: Starter Oddity |
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Hi John,
Glad you finally have a resolution. Chasing ghost is certainly frustrating. It is hard to convince some that a battery that seems to turn over okay should be investigated further. It must turn over a certain rpm and to the naked eye looks fine, but just a few rpm too slow and the engine won't produce the electrical power to put enough fire in the plugs. I always tell people to help rule out a battery either jump it from a good live battery or replace it. Some that aren't real familiar with the Rotax equate it to a car engine where even a little battery life so long as it turns over a little may make the car engine fire. Our batteries like to stay charged so they either need to be flown once every two weeks or more or better to put them on a FLOAT charger not a trickle charger. A few extra dollars spent on a good float, temperature compensating charger can make a difference if you leave it on all the time.
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_________________
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Rotax Instructor & Rotax IRC
Light Sport Repairman
Home 520-574-1080 TRY HOME FIRST
Cell 520-349-7056 |
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Thom Riddle
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1597
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA (9G0)
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| Posted: Sun Mar 03, 2013 9:35 am Post subject: Re: Starter Oddity |
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....A few extra dollars spent on a good float, temperature compensating charger can make a difference if you leave it on all the time....
No need to spend a lot to get float charging. I've used a BatteryTender Junior for many years on multiple airplanes with excellent results. This is a float charger but not expensive at all.
http://www.amazon.com/Battery-Tender-021-0123-Junior-Charger/dp/B000CITK8S
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Thom Riddle
Buffalo, NY (9G0)
Don't worry about old age... it doesn't last very long.
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