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graeme bird

Joined: 15 Jul 2010
Posts: 434

Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 12:06 pm Post subject: Use of reserve tank

First sorry I didn't make it to the UK AGM - too windy for me.



I mentioned in my Gumpy Scotland post that I landed with 11 litres remaining. That was the reading on my FP-5L and I was able to put in 57 litres of fuel and so it was confirmed.



I was tempted to switch to reserve on approach for a sure 9 ltrs or so  hopefully there.  I didn't but I was ready to switch. Opinions?

Also I wondered how much would be on the reserve side after a few (gentle)turns. I guess you would actually have a bit longer on main and less than expected in reserve.



Also I filled to the top, I cant recall if the 68ltrs included the neck etc (Mono rubber style.

_________________
Graeme Bird
kit4 (Wagstaff) TBD
Kit3 G-CLXU (Gregory) mono 914 xs Woodcomp
Kit2 G-PATS - (kesterton) Mono Classic 912 warpdrive
Kit 1 G-UMPY - Mono Classic/XS 912S, Woodcomp G(@)gdbmk.co.uk

davidjoyce(at)doctors.org
Guest

Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 12:28 pm Post subject: Use of reserve tank

Graeme, I measured my reserve long ago as having 11 litres 

useable in it, a comfortable 1/2 hr reserve. It shouldn't 

make any difference if you do turns (or even a loop!) as 

they should be balanced so that neither you nor the fuel 

wants to slide off to one side, but on top of that while 

you are on main the reserve is constantly being topped up 

by the return line.

     I have a low pressure warning light and on several 

occasions I have flown until the main ran dry. This put my 

light on, fairly soon followed by the engine running a bit 

hesitantly! but with either the light or the hesitation 

giving enough time to switch to reserve and carry on 

normally. You would probably not want that to happen at a 

critical stage of a demanding landing so switching to 

reserve if you are close to running out makes excellent 

sense if about to land. If you find yourself having to do 

several go arounds and you cough on reserve, you can 

always switch back to main!

regards, David Joyce, GXSDJ

On Sun, 23 Jun 2013 13:06:56 -0700

  "graeme bird" <graeme(at)gdbmk.co.uk> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   

<graeme(at)gdbmk.co.uk>

 

First sorry I didn't make it to the UK AGM - too windy 

for me.

 

 I mentioned in my Gumpy Scotland post that I landed with 

11 litres remaining. That was the reading on my FP-5L and 

I was able to put in 57 litres of fuel and so it was 

confirmed.

 

 I was tempted to switch to reserve on approach for a 

sure 9 ltrs or so  hopefully there.  I didn't but I was 

ready to switch. Opinions?

 Also I wondered how much would be on the reserve side 

after a few (gentle)turns. I guess you would actually 

have a bit longer on main and less than expected in 

reserve.

 

 Also I filled to the top, I cant recall if the 68ltrs 

included the neck etc (Mono rubber style.

 

 --------

 Graeme Bird

 G-UMPY

 Mono 912S/Woodcomp 3000/3W

 Newby: 55 hours 1 year 

 g(at)gdbmk.co.uk

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=403228#403228

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Un/Subscription,

Forums!

Admin.

rlborger(at)mac.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Jun 24, 2013 4:57 am Post subject: Use of reserve tank

Frans,



Thanks very much for your detailed observation and explanation!



Blue skies & tailwinds,

Bob Borger

Europa XS Tri, Rotax 914, Airmaster C/S Prop.

Little Toot Sport Biplane, Lycoming Thunderbolt AEIO-320 EXP

3705 Lynchburg Dr.

Corinth, TX  76208-5331

Cel: 817-992-1117

rlborger(at)mac.com



On Jun 24, 2013, at 7:12 AM, Frans Veldman <frans(at)privatepilots.nl> wrote:






On 06/24/2013 12:10 PM, Sidsel & Svein Johnsen wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   I maintain that the best procedure is to run the main tank almost empty (or

 until coughing engine, if one dares to), and only then switch to the reserve

 tank.  If that tank should run dry, there is nothing left in the main tank

 (no return flow has spilled over to the main tank after consumption from

 reserve tank started) - you have used all fuel there was.


	


I have two tank sensors, one in the main and one in the reserve side. My

tank sensors are very sensitive near the tank bottom and they display

the amount of fuel with a resolution of 1 liter! So I can offer some

insight in how the tank empties.



What I observed when I got home with little fuel left, is that once the

main tank is zero, quite a lot of fuel sloshes from the reserve to the

main side. While draining the main side, all return fuel (for the 914 a

multiple of what the engine actually uses) returns to the reserve side,

so although fuel is sloshed over constantly, it is also refilled

constantly. So, the main tank slowly decreases until it reaches zero and

the reserve side remains filled to the brim all the time.



When switching to the reserve side, the situation changes dramatically.

Fuel being sloshed over from reserve to main is now no longer pumped

back automatically. And a lot of fuel sloshes over because the tank is

wide near the top of the saddle and of course the reserve is filled just

to the edge of it. It is like walking with a bucket completely filled

with water and you don't need much movement to loose quite a lot of the

contents. In a short while I had collected 4 liters in main again (4

liters isn't much but it is half the contents of the reserve side!). It

was just moderately turbulent, the usual thing on a hot summer day with

some cumulus above the airplane, and being aware of the low fuel I tried

to keep things as calm as possible.



So, if you don't switch back to main, you can't count on having 9 liters

in reserve, but only half of it.



When I switched back to main, the main tank got empty again in two

minutes, because the 914 pumps displace 120 liters per hour and all the

excess fuel is put in the reserve side again. I kept my hand on the fuel

valve, it was just a matter of counting down and seeing the fuel quickly

move from the main to the reserve side again. Now I had 8 liters again

in the reserve side.



I had to repeat this once more, and after that the fuel level was low

enough to stay in the reserve side. And of course about that time I was

landing, with 4 liters left plus a silent amount of 2 liters of

"unusable" fuel.



The lessons here:

1) If you don't switch back to main, you only have half the amount of

the reserve tank available.

2) Avoid to empty the reserve side while there is still (or again) fuel

in main left, because once you switch back to main the fuel will be

pumped over again in the reserve side in just a minute!

3) Be prepared to switch a few times between main and reserve to keep

the fuel as much as possible in the reserve side.

4) Be aware, especially with a 914, that the main tank will drain very

quickly once the reserve tank is no longer full.

5) If you don't have separate fuel sensors, fuel management will become

very difficult while flying on reserve: The reserve will empty more

quickly than anticipated, and once it is empty, you will find fuel again

in main, but as it is pumped over, it will quickly disappear and then

the reserve side has fuel again!



Frans

graeme bird

Joined: 15 Jul 2010
Posts: 434

Posted: Mon Jun 24, 2013 9:31 am Post subject: Re: Use of reserve tank

thanks for the contributions, that is all really helpful. Handy to know how long it takes, that it runs rough before cutting and of course that the fuel pressure gauge can be very useful then. Also that if running on reserve is essential, and conditions are bumpy switching back to main for a minute in the early ltrs will increase the range.

terrys(at)cisco.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Jun 24, 2013 10:20 am Post subject: Use of reserve tank

I have one comment on the subject of allowing the main to completely run out, then switching to the reserve.  We did that once to check the procedure in a safe, controlled, environment.  The engine quit but was still wind milling.  After switching to reserve, the engine restarted and went to high RPMs because the Airmaster CS prop had gone to full fine pitch when the engine cut out, and took some time to recover once the engine restarted.

The lesson of the story is, pull the throttle back to idle before switching in the reserve tank.



Regards,

Terry



--

ptag.dev(at)tiscali.co.uk
Guest

Posted: Mon Jun 24, 2013 12:50 pm Post subject: Use of reserve tank

Hi! Terry /all.

I had an unplanned such event but with the direct drive Jabiru 6 fitted. I

have a long range tank fitted and although full did a wing over to position

for a photos shoot of a hotel as we left Majorca.  Unbeknown that stopped

the siphon from the long range tank to the main tank , About 2 hours later

over the Pyranees to the West Spanish coast we suddenly had total silence!

Which is about the most sensitive thing that can happen to a powered flight

pilot ! I estimate I lost about 50 feet of my then 5,000ft before the engine

windmilled to start immediately. My friend with me asked what we would do to

which I replied "you will need to turn round in your seat and pump that

siphon hand ball to re-establish the siphon like you are milking a cow (or

something like that !) When I could see the gauge was back reasonable again

we switched to main tank but actually landed on the reserve tank by which

time we knew was full to over flow the saddle.  I must say I have never

tried an in flight re-start with the gearbox Rotax Engine,  I just don't

like to tempt providence ! If someone has the minimum windmill speed of a

914 Rotax I'll be obliged to know ? and you would be doing me a real

service. 

Also If Mark Burton is reading this would he advise if the Woodcomp Prop

with the Smart Controller is likely to motor to fully fine in the event of

an abrupt un intended engine stop ?

Happy Days !

Best regards

Bob Harrison. G-PTAG



--

frans(at)privatepilots.nl
Guest

Posted: Mon Jun 24, 2013 1:13 pm Post subject: Use of reserve tank

On 06/24/2013 10:47 PM, Bob Harrison wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   Also If Mark Burton is reading this would he advise if the Woodcomp Prop

 with the Smart Controller is likely to motor to fully fine in the event of

 an abrupt un intended engine stop ?


	


Although I'm not Mark Burton I think that indeed it will motor to fully

fine. The controller tries to maintain the target RPM, if the RPM drops

it will set a finer pitch, that's what it is supposed to do. If the

engine is out of fuel, the RPM drops, so the prop will be set to fully fine.



Frans

terrys(at)cisco.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Jun 24, 2013 1:25 pm Post subject: Use of reserve tank

Hi Bob,



We have shut the engine down in flight with both the Whirlwind CS prop and the Airmaster.  In both cases, the prop stops turning just above 50 knots, and once stopped, does not begin wind milling again until a little over 100 knots.  This is with the 912S, which has higher compression than the 914, so your numbers may vary from this.



Regards,

Terry



--

klinefelter.kevin(at)gmai
Guest

Posted: Mon Jun 24, 2013 3:31 pm Post subject: Use of reserve tank

Hi Terry and all,

I stopped my 914 a couple days ago,feathered the Airmaster and went for a long glide. Windmill start happens at about 90 knots.



I was doing touch and goes a while back in my Mono and ran out of fuel on the main just after liftoff. No problem, I just landed on the remaining runway, but that really got me thinking! I didn't realize my fuel was quite that low. So now my Takeoff and Landing checklist includes fuel selector on reserve.



Kevin



On Jun 24, 2013, at 2:25 PM, "Terry Seaver (terrys)" <terrys(at)cisco.com> wrote:



[quote] 

 

 Hi Bob,

 

 We have shut the engine down in flight with both the Whirlwind CS prop and the Airmaster.  In both cases, the prop stops turning just above 50 knots, and once stopped, does not begin wind milling again until a little over 100 knots.  This is with the 912S, which has higher compression than the 914, so your numbers may vary from this.

 

 Regards,

 Terry

 

 --

kpeng

Joined: 01 Apr 2011
Posts: 18

Posted: Mon Jun 24, 2013 5:26 pm Post subject: Use of reserve tank

Gentlemen ,

I'm stunned by this discussion. Why would you wish to go anywhere near running out of fuel? I would never take  p2 with you or allow my family to take a flight  with any of you!!. This talk about changing from one side of the tank and guessing what is sloshing about in the reserve is crazy and what kills people. In 14 years of Europa flight I have had no reason to go anywhere near  running out of fuel. How is it that some guys have to tape up the filler cap  ? Or extract litre's of water out because it was in a shower ? It's news to me.... I think I'll buy an umbrella   Kevin the safe one.

Sent from my iPhone

On 25 Jun 2013, at 00:30, Kevin Klinefelter <klinefelter.kevin(at)gmail.com> wrote:

[quote] 

 Hi Terry and all,

 I stopped my 914 a couple days ago,feathered the Airmaster and went for a long glide. Windmill start happens at about 90 knots.

 I was doing touch and goes a while back in my Mono and ran out of fuel on the main just after liftoff. No problem, I just landed on the remaining runway, but that really got me thinking! I didn't realize my fuel was quite that low. So now my Takeoff and Landing checklist includes fuel selector on reserve.

 Kevin

 On Jun 24, 2013, at 2:25 PM, "Terry Seaver (terrys)" <terrys(at)cisco.com> wrote:

> 

> 

> Hi Bob,

> 

> We have shut the engine down in flight with both the Whirlwind CS prop and the Airmaster.  In both cases, the prop stops turning just above 50 knots, and once stopped, does not begin wind milling again until a little over 100 knots.  This is with the 912S, which has higher compression than the 914, so your numbers may vary from this.

> 

> Regards,

> Terry

> 

> --

kpeng

Joined: 01 Apr 2011
Posts: 18

Posted: Mon Jun 24, 2013 5:38 pm Post subject: Use of reserve tank

Ps, Go buy Powerflarm so you don't crash into me or fall on me because you ran out of fuel. Kevin the safe one.

Sent from my iPhone

On 25 Jun 2013, at 02:26, Kevin Kedward <kpeng1(at)hotmail.co.uk> wrote:

[quote] Gentlemen ,

 I'm stunned by this discussion. Why would you wish to go anywhere near running out of fuel? I would never take  p2 with you or allow my family to take a flight  with any of you!!. This talk about changing from one side of the tank and guessing what is sloshing about in the reserve is crazy and what kills people. In 14 years of Europa flight I have had no reason to go anywhere near  running out of fuel. How is it that some guys have to tape up the filler cap  ? Or extract litre's of water out because it was in a shower ? It's news to me.... I think I'll buy an umbrella   Kevin the safe one.

 Sent from my iPhone

 On 25 Jun 2013, at 00:30, Kevin Klinefelter <klinefelter.kevin(at)gmail.com> wrote:

> 

> 

> Hi Terry and all,

> I stopped my 914 a couple days ago,feathered the Airmaster and went for a long glide. Windmill start happens at about 90 knots.

> 

> I was doing touch and goes a while back in my Mono and ran out of fuel on the main just after liftoff. No problem, I just landed on the remaining runway, but that really got me thinking! I didn't realize my fuel was quite that low. So now my Takeoff and Landing checklist includes fuel selector on reserve.

> 

> Kevin

> 

> On Jun 24, 2013, at 2:25 PM, "Terry Seaver (terrys)" <terrys(at)cisco.com> wrote:

> 

>> 

>> 

>> Hi Bob,

>> 

>> We have shut the engine down in flight with both the Whirlwind CS prop and the Airmaster.  In both cases, the prop stops turning just above 50 knots, and once stopped, does not begin wind milling again until a little over 100 knots.  This is with the 912S, which has higher compression than the 914, so your numbers may vary from this.

>> 

>> Regards,

>> Terry

>> 

>> --

frans(at)privatepilots.nl
Guest

Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 1:56 am Post subject: Use of reserve tank

On 06/25/2013 03:26 AM, Kevin Kedward wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   Gentlemen , I'm stunned by this discussion. Why would you wish to go

 anywhere near running out of fuel?


	


I guess it is nobody's wish but it sometimes happens. That is why we

have a reserve after all, to use it when it is needed. Some of us

(mostly the frequent flyers, the people that travel long distances and

explore the world with their Europa) have had to use the reserve fuel,

and that is why we have the reserve fuel after all. Nobody has crashed.

Be happy that some people are able to describe what happens when you are

low on fuel and how to get the most out of your reserve fuel.



In my case it was at my homefield, I had radio contact with them, knew

that I could land there (with many suitable farmer fields on the way to

it), with a very accurate fuel flow sensor (and return flow sensor, no

guessing here!), fuel computer with GPS ground speed input, fuel flow

and fuel level, calibrated tank sensors with a resolution of 1 liter. It

was a highly reliable exercise in a very safe and predictable

environment and I arrived with the exact amount of fuel as calculated.

I'm happy to have had this experience, so I know that I can and know how

to actually use my reserve in the event of a genuine unforseen situation.



 	  Quote: 	
		   This talk about

 changing from one side of the tank and guessing what is sloshing

 about in the reserve is crazy and what kills people.


	


No, it saves people. Maybe some day someone runs nearly out of fuel and

remembers this discussion, that you can't use the 9 liters of fuel

unless you switch back to main to retrieve the sloshed over fuel.

What't the idea of carrying around some pounds of fuel for an emergency

if you don't know how to use it when it is really needed?

Quite often the uninformed people get killed, people who never dare to

explore the limits when it is safe to do so. In this case you could get

killed because you count on having 9 liters of reserve but don't know

that in reality you can only use 4 liters of it, unless you know how to

deal with it properly. And that under no circumstance you should switch

to reserve too early and try to save some fuel in main for the landing.



 	  Quote: 	
		   In 14 years of

 Europa flight I have had no reason to go anywhere near  running out

 of fuel.


	


Maybe some day you will have. You are facing an unpredicted head wind

over sea with no suitable airfield for an extra fuel stop. Or you have a

faulty gasket in your carb and the engine is suddenly running rich and

consuming more fuel than expected, or the choosen airfield is suddenly

closed and you have to divert and are put in a holding pattern. Are you

going to declare a fuel emergency because you have only 20 liters of

fuel left?



Why would you fly around with all this fuel if you are so sure you will

never have to use it? You probably tried to built your airplane as light

as possible, and now you are spoiling it by carrying around pounds of

useless fuel?



 	  Quote: 	
		   How is it that some guys have to tape up the filler cap  ?

 Or extract litre's of water out because it was in a shower ?


	


What would you do, leave the water in the tank? I'm sure that "someone"

was not amused to find the water in his tank, and I think it is fully

understandable that he from now on tapes of his fuel cap as an extra

precaution to prevent water ingress.



How can you be sure it will hever happen to you? Unless of course you

keep your airplane sheltered and only take it out on a sunny day for a

trip around the home field. Are you actually hosing over your aircraft

anually for a few hours to see whether the fuel cap is really water

tight, or are you just assuming the cap is tight and remains that way

for the rest of its life?



I'm happy that people are willing to share their experience, even if it

sounds "stupid" to some who think they are wiser than the rest of us.



I will be giving the fuel cap some more attention, thanks Bob!



Frans

ptag.dev(at)talktalk.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 2:10 am Post subject: Use of reserve tank

Thanks for that Kevin  don't suppose you remember what you did with the

throttle do you ? ......Mine starts hot on the ground with half throttle

just instantly.

I don't believe it's necessary for each one of us to experiment when the

information is readily available(except there will be a slight variation

between different props as well as engines obviously the main ting is to get

it restarted and surely the starter would be more instantaneous and the

windmill effect would only be needed in the event of the starter failing for

whatever reason .. Actually I'm surprised  it starts anyway with the gearbox

effect! The Direct drive on the Jabiru was as if nothing had happened!.

Regards

Bob Harrison G-PTAG



--

ptag.dev(at)tiscali.co.uk
Guest

Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 2:22 am Post subject: Use of reserve tank

Thanks for that Terry, I'm a bit of a wimp and not ashamed to admit it !

Regards

Bob Harrison G-PTAG



--

ptag.dev(at)tiscali.co.uk
Guest

Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 2:25 am Post subject: Use of reserve tank

Thanks Frans 

..........which I guess provides most instant torque to wind up the engine

anyway !

It is good to see the damn English weather is now better after it was so

desperately needed to be good over the weekend.

Regards

Bob Harrison



--

Roland

Joined: 30 Nov 2009
Posts: 334
Location: EDLE

Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 2:32 am Post subject: Re: Use of reserve tank

Absolutely well said, Frans. 



And also from me thank you very much for that exact description what happens with the main/reserve. I will keep that well in mind and notice it somewhere to have it at hand when the need arises - especially because I don't have such accurate fuel gouges than you.



Bob, thanks for the tip to taper the fuel inlet when parking in rain.



Roland

PH-ZTI

XS Trigear 914

ptag.dev(at)tiscali.co.uk
Guest

Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 2:34 am Post subject: Use of reserve tank

Hi! Frans, 

You are welcome to hear of my learning experiences my philosophy is  like

landing gear up   "there's those that have done it and those that will".

My insurance is to have the long range tank and as you are well aware I

therefore fly slower, but I just dropped my carb needles back to where they

were fitted the spats and now fly more efficiently, I'm wishing I had done

that before our North Cape trip! 

Regards

Bob H .

PS any photos yet ?



--

frans(at)privatepilots.nl
Guest

Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 2:47 am Post subject: Use of reserve tank

On 06/25/2013 12:33 PM, Bob Harrison wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   My insurance is to have the long range tank and as you are well aware I

 therefore fly slower, but I just dropped my carb needles back to where they

 were fitted the spats and now fly more efficiently, I'm wishing I had done

 that before our North Cape trip! 


	


Yep, I guess the extra fuel has been costing you almost as much as a

carb overhaul.



 	  Quote: 	
		   PS any photos yet ?


	


Ilona is working on it right now. We made (oh no, "took") so many

pictures that it is quite a job to make a selection.

(thanks for teaching us some proper English  ).



Frans

klinefelter.kevin(at)gmai
Guest

Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 5:06 am Post subject: Use of reserve tank

Bob,

I advance the throttle about half also, and it fired right up. It seems easy to keep my left hand on the stick after switching on, push the nose down and right hand on the throttle to start.

Kevin



On Jun 25, 2013, at 3:10 AM, "Bob Harrison" <ptag.dev(at)talktalk.net> wrote:



[quote] 

 

 Thanks for that Kevin  don't suppose you remember what you did with the

 throttle do you ? ......Mine starts hot on the ground with half throttle

 just instantly.

 I don't believe it's necessary for each one of us to experiment when the

 information is readily available(except there will be a slight variation

 between different props as well as engines obviously the main ting is to get

 it restarted and surely the starter would be more instantaneous and the

 windmill effect would only be needed in the event of the starter failing for

 whatever reason .. Actually I'm surprised  it starts anyway with the gearbox

 effect! The Direct drive on the Jabiru was as if nothing had happened!.

 Regards

 Bob Harrison G-PTAG

 

 --

kpeng

Joined: 01 Apr 2011
Posts: 18

Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 6:43 am Post subject: Use of reserve tank

Guys

         The only reason for being that low on fuel is if some other aircraft has put bullet holes in your tank 

                  Regards

                                Kevin

Sent from my iPad

On 25 Jun 2013, at 11:00, "Frans Veldman" <frans(at)privatepilots.nl> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	

 On 06/25/2013 03:26 AM, Kevin Kedward wrote:

> Gentlemen , I'm stunned by this discussion. Why would you wish to go

> anywhere near running out of fuel?

 I guess it is nobody's wish but it sometimes happens. That is why we

 have a reserve after all, to use it when it is needed. Some of us

 (mostly the frequent flyers, the people that travel long distances and

 explore the world with their Europa) have had to use the reserve fuel,

 and that is why we have the reserve fuel after all. Nobody has crashed.

 Be happy that some people are able to describe what happens when you are

 low on fuel and how to get the most out of your reserve fuel.

 In my case it was at my homefield, I had radio contact with them, knew

 that I could land there (with many suitable farmer fields on the way to

 it), with a very accurate fuel flow sensor (and return flow sensor, no

 guessing here!), fuel computer with GPS ground speed input, fuel flow

 and fuel level, calibrated tank sensors with a resolution of 1 liter. It

 was a highly reliable exercise in a very safe and predictable

 environment and I arrived with the exact amount of fuel as calculated.

 I'm happy to have had this experience, so I know that I can and know how

 to actually use my reserve in the event of a genuine unforseen situation.

> This talk about

> changing from one side of the tank and guessing what is sloshing

> about in the reserve is crazy and what kills people.

 No, it saves people. Maybe some day someone runs nearly out of fuel and

 remembers this discussion, that you can't use the 9 liters of fuel

 unless you switch back to main to retrieve the sloshed over fuel.

 What't the idea of carrying around some pounds of fuel for an emergency

 if you don't know how to use it when it is really needed?

 Quite often the uninformed people get killed, people who never dare to

 explore the limits when it is safe to do so. In this case you could get

 killed because you count on having 9 liters of reserve but don't know

 that in reality you can only use 4 liters of it, unless you know how to

 deal with it properly. And that under no circumstance you should switch

 to reserve too early and try to save some fuel in main for the landing.

> In 14 years of

> Europa flight I have had no reason to go anywhere near  running out

> of fuel.

 Maybe some day you will have. You are facing an unpredicted head wind

 over sea with no suitable airfield for an extra fuel stop. Or you have a

 faulty gasket in your carb and the engine is suddenly running rich and

 consuming more fuel than expected, or the choosen airfield is suddenly

 closed and you have to divert and are put in a holding pattern. Are you

 going to declare a fuel emergency because you have only 20 liters of

 fuel left?

 Why would you fly around with all this fuel if you are so sure you will

 never have to use it? You probably tried to built your airplane as light

 as possible, and now you are spoiling it by carrying around pounds of

 useless fuel?

> How is it that some guys have to tape up the filler cap  ?

> Or extract litre's of water out because it was in a shower ?

 What would you do, leave the water in the tank? I'm sure that "someone"

 was not amused to find the water in his tank, and I think it is fully

 understandable that he from now on tapes of his fuel cap as an extra

 precaution to prevent water ingress.

 How can you be sure it will hever happen to you? Unless of course you

 keep your airplane sheltered and only take it out on a sunny day for a

 trip around the home field. Are you actually hosing over your aircraft

 anually for a few hours to see whether the fuel cap is really water

 tight, or are you just assuming the cap is tight and remains that way

 for the rest of its life?

 I'm happy that people are willing to share their experience, even if it

 sounds "stupid" to some who think they are wiser than the rest of us.

 I will be giving the fuel cap some more attention, thanks Bob!

 Frans

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