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100 LL vs Mogas

 
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andynfultz(at)bellsouth.n
Guest
PostPosted: Thu Oct 24, 2013 9:51 am    Post subject: 100 LL vs Mogas Reply with quote
Jim,
I'm curious as to how many hours you had on your engine when you started to have problems?
Andy F

Sent from my iPad

On Oct 24, 2013, at 7:52 AM, "Jim Weston" <k4cod(at)bellsouth.net (k4cod(at)bellsouth.net)> wrote:
[quote] v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} .shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);} <![endif]--> st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) } <![endif]-->
Sorry that it's taken me, only, six months to catch up on reading my Stratus emails. But I do have some recent experience/info on this subject.

Fortunately, I haven't had problems with the auto gas gumming up the carbs. But I did switch to avgas (100LL) for about a year; for other reasons. Recently, my engine ended up with a loss of compression on one cylinder. Remembering from the past when I've had lower compression aircraft engines (those designed to run on the old 80 octane avgas) that the 100LL, even though it's called Low Lead is actually very high in lead content and will form lead deposits on the valve seats; causing the valve to not seal well, I decided to run the engine some and see how it did. I tied the plane down well and ran the engine for a good warmup and a couple of full power runs. This caused the lead to clear and the compression came back up. I then proceeded with my plans and took my grandson for a ride to an airport about 60 miles south of us. All was uneventful. But when I went to the airport a few days later and pulled the engine thru to feel the compression, after the engine had cooled thoroughly, I now had almost no compression on three of the four cylinders. At this point, I decided that it was time to do two things. One, get the avgas out of the plane, and go back to car gas. And, two, do as I used to on one of my previous planes and add some TCP to the fuel. TCP used to be added to leaded car gas (most advertised by Shell; remember 'Buy Shell with TCP' was the slogan?) to scavenge out the lead. (By the way, lead in this situation can build up lead deposits on the spark plugs and foul out the plugs; saw it several times on my 150hp Lycoming in my Piper Tri-Pacer years back; that's how I learned about adding TCP) Anyway, I ran the engine, on the ground, for about 10 minutes with most of the fuel replaced with auto gas (ran out of gas cans to drain the avgas into) and TCP added. The compression came up nicely on two of the three low cylinders. The third one was still pretty mushy feeling. I decided to take it one spin around the pattern to get the temps up and work it at full power on takeoff. When I checked the next day, after a good cool down, three of the four cylinders were nice and snappy on compression, and the fourth one was almost there; just slightly less than the other three. So, I took it for a 45 minute flight and I'm very happy to say that all four cylinders are nice and strong/snappy on compression again. This is the same scenario that I remember from my past experiences with my Lycoming.

Anyway, sorry for the fairly long writeup. I just wanted to pass along some experience that I hope might be of some help to someone. The moral to the story is the avgas will run fine, just be careful about lead buildup long term in lower compression engines. Maybe this info will save someone from tearing the engine apart when the compression drops off for what turns out to be a simple reason.

Jim Weston
CH601HDS w/Stratus, flying it since 1998


From: owner-stratus-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-stratus-list-server(at)matronics.com) [mailto:owner-stratus-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-stratus-list-server(at)matronics.com)] On Behalf Of ron hansen
Sent: Friday, April 19, 2013 5:44 PM
To: stratus-list(at)matronics.com (stratus-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Bing carb body


Gary,


Sorry I don't have a carb body for you, but I can also say auto gas gummed up my carbs causing lots of delays and expense. Fortunately all prior to my first flight. I switched to avgas after getting the carbs cleaned out and I'm not going back. Auto gas starts getting cloudy and gummy very quickly especially her in California.


Ron Hansen

Los Angeles






On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 7:28 AM, gary krysztopik <pelican640(at)yahoo.com (pelican640(at)yahoo.com)> wrote:
Hello Stratus owners,

Does anyone have a Bing Model 64 carb or carb body that they could sell? Auto gas gummed up a jet and it broke off, and I wrecked the carb body trying to get it out.

I looked on ebay and there are a few old ones for about $120 so that's my plan right now.

I appreciate any help,
Gary


Quote:
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Stratus-Listtp://forums.matronics.com_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution




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k4cod(at)bellsouth.net
Guest
PostPosted: Thu Oct 24, 2013 4:36 pm    Post subject: 100 LL vs Mogas Reply with quote
It was at about the 245 hr point when I started using avgas.   Now at 263 hr when I had the lead buildup problem.  However, the problem that I've encountered really has nothing to do with total time on the engine.

Jim


Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE Smartphone

-------- Original message --------
From: Andy Fultz <andynfultz(at)bellsouth.net>
Date: 10/24/2013 1:51 PM (GMT-05:00)
To: stratus-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Stratus-List: 100 LL vs Mogas

Jim, 
  I'm curious as to how many hours you had on your engine when you started to have problems?

Andy F

Sent from my iPad

On Oct 24, 2013, at 7:52 AM, "Jim Weston" <k4cod(at)bellsouth.net> wrote:

Sorry that it's taken me, only, six months to catch up on reading my Stratus emails.  But I do have some recent experience/info on this subject.
 
Fortunately, I haven't had problems with the auto gas gumming up the carbs.  But I did switch to avgas (100LL) for about a year; for other reasons.  Recently, my engine ended up with a loss of compression on one cylinder.  Remembering from the past when I've had lower compression aircraft engines (those designed to run on the old 80 octane avgas) that the 100LL, even though it's called Low Lead is actually very high in lead content and will form lead deposits on the valve seats; causing the valve to not seal well, I decided to run the engine some and see how it did.  I tied the plane down well and ran the engine for a good warmup and a couple of full power runs.  This caused the lead to clear and the compression came back up.  I then proceeded with my plans and took my grandson for a ride to an airport about 60 miles south of us.  All was uneventful.  But when I went to the airport a few days later and pulled the engine thru to feel the compression, after the engine had cooled thoroughly, I now had almost no compression on three of the four cylinders.  At this point, I decided that it was time to do two things. One, get the avgas out of the plane, and go back to car gas.  And, two, do as I used to on one of my previous planes and add some TCP to the fuel.  TCP used to be added to leaded car gas (most advertised by Shell; remember 'Buy Shell with TCP' was the slogan?) to scavenge out the lead.  (By the way, lead in this situation can build up lead deposits on the spark plugs and foul out the plugs; saw it several times on my 150hp Lycoming in my Piper Tri-Pacer years back; that's how I learned about adding TCP)  Anyway, I ran the engine, on the ground, for about 10 minutes with most of the fuel replaced with auto gas (ran out of gas cans to drain the avgas into) and TCP added.  The compression came up nicely on two of the three low cylinders.  The third one was still pretty mushy feeling.  I decided to take it one spin around the pattern to get the temps up and work it at full power on takeoff.  When I checked the next day, after a good cool down, three of the four cylinders were nice and snappy on compression, and the fourth one was almost there; just slightly less than the other three.  So, I took it for a 45 minute flight and I'm very happy to say that all four cylinders are nice and strong/snappy on compression again.  This is the same scenario that I remember from my past experiences with my Lycoming.
 
Anyway, sorry for the fairly long writeup.  I just wanted to pass along some experience that I hope might be of some help to someone.  The moral to the story is the avgas will run fine, just be careful about lead buildup long term in lower compression engines.  Maybe this info will save someone from tearing the engine apart when the compression drops off for what turns out to be a simple reason.
 
Jim Weston
CH601HDS w/Stratus, flying it since 1998
 
From: owner-stratus-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-stratus-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of ron hansen
Sent: Friday, April 19, 2013 5:44 PM
To: stratus-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Stratus-List: Bing carb body
 
Gary,
 
Sorry I don't have a carb body for you, but I can also say auto gas gummed up my carbs causing lots of delays and expense.  Fortunately all prior to my first flight.  I switched to avgas after getting the carbs cleaned out and I'm not going back.  Auto gas starts getting cloudy and gummy very quickly especially her in California.
 
Ron Hansen
Los Angeles
 
 

On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 7:28 AM, gary krysztopik <pelican640(at)yahoo.com> wrote:
Hello Stratus owners,

Does anyone have a Bing Model 64 carb or carb body that they could sell?  Auto gas gummed up a jet and it broke off, and I wrecked the carb body trying to get it out.

I looked on ebay and there are a few old ones for about $120 so that's my plan right now.

I appreciate any help,
Gary

 
 
 
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tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
 
 
 
 
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http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
 

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andynfultz(at)bellsouth.n
Guest
PostPosted: Thu Oct 24, 2013 9:56 pm    Post subject: 100 LL vs Mogas Reply with quote
I'm pushing 400 hours on mine running avgas and have not noticed the problems you have encountered. Maybe I should run a tank of Mogas once in a while to "delead" mine so I won't have any problems. I just don't trust Mogas to be the same stuff every time I get it and I know avgas is the same every time.
Andy F.

Sent from my iPad

On Oct 24, 2013, at 7:36 PM, Jim Weston <k4cod(at)bellsouth.net (k4cod(at)bellsouth.net)> wrote:
[quote]It was at about the 245 hr point when I started using avgas. Now at 263 hr when I had the lead buildup problem. However, the problem that I've encountered really has nothing to do with total time on the engine.
Jim


Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE Smartphone


-------- Original message --------
From: Andy Fultz <andynfultz(at)bellsouth.net (andynfultz(at)bellsouth.net)>
Date: 10/24/2013 1:51 PM (GMT-05:00)
To: stratus-list(at)matronics.com (stratus-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Stratus-List: 100 LL vs Mogas


Jim,
I'm curious as to how many hours you had on your engine when you started to have problems?
Andy F

Sent from my iPad

On Oct 24, 2013, at 7:52 AM, "Jim Weston" <k4cod(at)bellsouth.net (k4cod(at)bellsouth.net)> wrote:
Quote:
v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} .shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);} <![endif]--> st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) } <![endif]-->
Sorry that it's taken me, only, six months to catch up on reading my Stratus emails. But I do have some recent experience/info on this subject.

Fortunately, I haven't had problems with the auto gas gumming up the carbs. But I did switch to avgas (100LL) for about a year; for other reasons. Recently, my engine ended up with a loss of compression on one cylinder. Remembering from the past when I've had lower compression aircraft engines (those designed to run on the old 80 octane avgas) that the 100LL, even though it's called Low Lead is actually very high in lead content and will form lead deposits on the valve seats; causing the valve to not seal well, I decided to run the engine some and see how it did. I tied the plane down well and ran the engine for a good warmup and a couple of full power runs. This caused the lead to clear and the compression came back up. I then proceeded with my plans and took my grandson for a ride to an airport about 60 miles south of us. All was uneventful. But when I went to the airport a few days later and pulled the engine thru to feel the compression, after the engine had cooled thoroughly, I now had almost no compression on three of the four cylinders. At this point, I decided that it was time to do two things. One, get the avgas out of the plane, and go back to car gas. And, two, do as I used to on one of my previous planes and add some TCP to the fuel.  TCP used to be added to leaded car gas (most advertised by Shell; remember 'Buy Shell with TCP' was the slogan?) to scavenge out the lead. (By the way, lead in this situation can build up lead deposits on the spark plugs and foul out the plugs; saw it several times on my 150hp Lycoming in my Piper Tri-Pacer years back; that's how I learned about adding TCP) Anyway, I ran the engine, on the ground, for about 10 minutes with most of the fuel replaced with auto gas (ran out of gas cans to drain the avgas into) and TCP added. The compression came up nicely on two of the three low cylinders. The third one was still pretty mushy feeling. I decided to take it one spin around the pattern to get the temps up and work it at full power on takeoff. When I checked the next day, after a good cool down, three of the four cylinders were nice and snappy on compression, and the fourth one was almost there; just slightly less than the other three. So, I took it for a 45 minute flight and I'm very happy to say that all four cylinders are nice and strong/snappy on compression again. This is the same scenario that I remember from my past experiences with my Lycoming.

Anyway, sorry for the fairly long writeup. I just wanted to pass along some experience that I hope might be of some help to someone. The moral to the story is the avgas will run fine, just be careful about lead buildup long term in lower compression engines. Maybe this info will save someone from tearing the engine apart when the compression drops off for what turns out to be a simple reason.

Jim Weston
CH601HDS w/Stratus, flying it since 1998


From: owner-stratus-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-stratus-list-server(at)matronics.com) [mailto:owner-stratus-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-stratus-list-server(at)matronics.com)] On Behalf Of ron hansen
Sent: Friday, April 19, 2013 5:44 PM
To: stratus-list(at)matronics.com (stratus-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Bing carb body


Gary,


Sorry I don't have a carb body for you, but I can also say auto gas gummed up my carbs causing lots of delays and expense. Fortunately all prior to my first flight. I switched to avgas after getting the carbs cleaned out and I'm not going back. Auto gas starts getting cloudy and gummy very quickly especially her in California.


Ron Hansen

Los Angeles






On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 7:28 AM, gary krysztopik <pelican640(at)yahoo.com (pelican640(at)yahoo.com)> wrote:
Hello Stratus owners,

Does anyone have a Bing Model 64 carb or carb body that they could sell?  Auto gas gummed up a jet and it broke off, and I wrecked the carb body trying to get it out.

I looked on ebay and there are a few old ones for about $120 so that's my plan right now.

I appreciate any help,
Gary


Quote:
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Stratus-Listtp://forums.matronics.com_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution




[b]

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k4cod(at)bellsouth.net
Guest
PostPosted: Fri Oct 25, 2013 8:22 am    Post subject: 100 LL vs Mogas Reply with quote
Can’t argue with your logic. I know that there are a lot of variables that could affect the lead buildup situation. For instance, I don’t run mine at very high rpm in cruise. I learned years ago that if I kept the rpm below 5000 in cruise that the engine ran cooler in the summertime. Have my prop pitched at 14.5 degrees to accomplish this. Run about 4700 rpm in cruise.

I always buy my fuel at the same gas station (BP) to have some small degree of constancy in the fuel. Almost all of my 260+ hours are with mogas.

Jim

From: Andy Fultz (andynfultz(at)bellsouth.net)
Sent: Friday, October 25, 2013 1:56 AM
To: stratus-list(at)matronics.com (stratus-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: 100 LL vs Mogas


I'm pushing 400 hours on mine running avgas and have not noticed the problems you have encountered. Maybe I should run a tank of Mogas once in a while to "delead" mine so I won't have any problems. I just don't trust Mogas to be the same stuff every time I get it and I know avgas is the same every time.

Andy F.

Sent from my iPad

On Oct 24, 2013, at 7:36 PM, Jim Weston <k4cod(at)bellsouth.net (k4cod(at)bellsouth.net)> wrote:
[quote] It was at about the 245 hr point when I started using avgas. Now at 263 hr when I had the lead buildup problem. However, the problem that I've encountered really has nothing to do with total time on the engine.

Jim


Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE Smartphone


-------- Original message --------
From: Andy Fultz <andynfultz(at)bellsouth.net (andynfultz(at)bellsouth.net)>
Date: 10/24/2013 1:51 PM (GMT-05:00)
To: stratus-list(at)matronics.com (stratus-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: 100 LL vs Mogas
Jim,
I'm curious as to how many hours you had on your engine when you started to have problems?

Andy F

Sent from my iPad

On Oct 24, 2013, at 7:52 AM, "Jim Weston" <k4cod(at)bellsouth.net (k4cod(at)bellsouth.net)> wrote:
Quote:
v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} .shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);} st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) }
Sorry that it's taken me, only, six months to catch up on reading my Stratus emails. But I do have some recent experience/info on this subject.

Fortunately, I haven't had problems with the auto gas gumming up the carbs. But I did switch to avgas (100LL) for about a year; for other reasons. Recently, my engine ended up with a loss of compression on one cylinder. Remembering from the past when I've had lower compression aircraft engines (those designed to run on the old 80 octane avgas) that the 100LL, even though it's called Low Lead is actually very high in lead content and will form lead deposits on the valve seats; causing the valve to not seal well, I decided to run the engine some and see how it did. I tied the plane down well and ran the engine for a good warmup and a couple of full power runs. This caused the lead to clear and the compression came back up. I then proceeded with my plans and took my grandson for a ride to an airport about 60 miles south of us. All was uneventful. But when I went to the airport a few days later and pulled the engine thru to feel the compression, after the engine had cooled thoroughly, I now had almost no compression on three of the four cylinders. At this point, I decided that it was time to do two things. One, get the avgas out of the plane, and go back to car gas. And, two, do as I used to on one of my previous planes and add some TCP to the fuel. TCP used to be added to leaded car gas (most advertised by Shell; remember 'Buy Shell with TCP' was the slogan?) to scavenge out the lead. (By the way, lead in this situation can build up lead deposits on the spark plugs and foul out the plugs; saw it several times on my 150hp Lycoming in my Piper Tri-Pacer years back; that's how I learned about adding TCP) Anyway, I ran the engine, on the ground, for about 10 minutes with most of the fuel replaced with auto gas (ran out of gas cans to drain the avgas into) and TCP added. The compression came up nicely on two of the three low cylinders. The third one was still pretty mushy feeling. I decided to take it one spin around the pattern to get the temps up and work it at full power on takeoff. When I checked the next day, after a good cool down, three of the four cylinders were nice and snappy on compression, and the fourth one was almost there; just slightly less than the other three. So, I took it for a 45 minute flight and I'm very happy to say that all four cylinders are nice and strong/snappy on compression again. This is the same scenario that I remember from my past experiences with my Lycoming.

Anyway, sorry for the fairly long writeup. I just wanted to pass along some experience that I hope might be of some help to someone. The moral to the story is the avgas will run fine, just be careful about lead buildup long term in lower compression engines. Maybe this info will save someone from tearing the engine apart when the compression drops off for what turns out to be a simple reason.

Jim Weston
CH601HDS w/Stratus, flying it since 1998


From: owner-stratus-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-stratus-list-server(at)matronics.com) [mailto:owner-stratus-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-stratus-list-server(at)matronics.com)] On Behalf Of ron hansen
Sent: Friday, April 19, 2013 5:44 PM
To: stratus-list(at)matronics.com (stratus-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Bing carb body


Gary,


Sorry I don't have a carb body for you, but I can also say auto gas gummed up my carbs causing lots of delays and expense. Fortunately all prior to my first flight. I switched to avgas after getting the carbs cleaned out and I'm not going back. Auto gas starts getting cloudy and gummy very quickly especially her in California.


Ron Hansen

Los Angeles




On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 7:28 AM, gary krysztopik <pelican640(at)yahoo.com (pelican640(at)yahoo.com)> wrote:
Hello Stratus owners,

Does anyone have a Bing Model 64 carb or carb body that they could sell? Auto gas gummed up a jet and it broke off, and I wrecked the carb body trying to get it out.

I looked on ebay and there are a few old ones for about $120 so that's my plan right now.

I appreciate any help,
Gary


Quote:
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Stratus-Listtp://forums.matronics.com_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution






href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Stratus-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Stratus-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
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