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Don Maxwell
Joined: 04 Sep 2014
Posts: 4
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 Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 6:08 am Post subject: Bad Carburetor Floats |
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Has anyone heard recently of new Rotax four-stroke engines with faulty carburetor floats?
I'm curious because I know of three brand new engines--one 912ULS, two 914UL--that have had multiple floats fill with gasoline and sink within the first 50 hours of operation in new airplanes. Each of these engines has had at least two bad floats and one had 3 of 4. I don't know the engine serial numbers, but all three engines are on brand new, factory-fresh S-LSA Seareys, all produced within a few weeks of each other.
The sunken floats caused flooding in all three engines--so severe that the engine wouldn't run at low throttle settings and soon the 914s wouldn't run at all with either fuel pump on. One owner had to make an emergency landing by turning the fuel pumps off until the engine stumbled and then switching one on just long enough to get it running again.
One of the 914s had fuel staining in an air box drain hose. Fuel was discovered running from the 912 carburetor vent while burping the engine during preflight.
Lockwood is assisting the owners, and one hopes that by now Rotax has been informed.
But The Question is: How many more bad floats are in service?
[quote][b]
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Roger Lee
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1464
Location: Tucson, Az.
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| Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 7:17 am Post subject: Re: Bad Carburetor Floats |
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I haven't heard of any large batches of failed floats on new planes. That said it is possible Bing got a bad batch. It is the outside coating on the float that seals the airy foam inside from the fuel. If the outside gets a hole then fuel can enter the inside of the float.
The floats and carbs are made by Bing here in the US. I have seen sunken floats, but it isn't that common. I did just have a bad float on an RV12 with 60 hrs. Symptoms are fuel smell and fuel coming out the vent. If you suspect a bad float by a rough running engine and fuel venting then just pop the bowl off and look at the floats in the fuel. The pins that stick out the side of the float should be equal to the fuel level. If the float is bad that pin and float will be down under the fuel level. These are covered by warranty if you are still under your warranty.
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_________________
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Rotax Instructor & Rotax IRC
Light Sport Repairman
Home 520-574-1080 TRY HOME FIRST
Cell 520-349-7056
Last edited by Roger Lee on Fri Sep 05, 2014 4:35 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Guy Buchanan
Joined: 16 Jul 2006
Posts: 1204
Location: Ramona, CA
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| Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 10:46 am Post subject: Bad Carburetor Floats |
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Sounds like having one or two in the repair kit might not be a bad idea. Speaking of which, what 912 spares do you guys generally carry? I was thinking:
- Float
- Needle
- Fuel filter
- Spark plug(s)
- 1 qt. oil
Can't think of anything else. Carb boot?
Guy Buchanan Normal Guy Buchanan 2 21 2011-09-20T05:05:00Z 2011-09-20T05:05:00Z 1 31 183 1 1 213 14.00 <![endif]--> 59 false false false false EN-US X-NONE X-NONE MicrosoftInternetExplorer4 <![endif]--> <![endif]--> /* Style Definitions */ table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style-priority:99; mso-style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para-margin:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-font-family:Calibri; mso-ascii-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-hansi-font-family:Calibri; mso-hansi-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-bidi-font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-bidi-theme-font:minor-bidi;} <![endif]--> <![endif]--> <![endif]-->Guy Buchanan
Ramona, CA
Kitfox IV-1200 / 912-S / Warp 3cs / 500 hrs. and grounded
Now a glider pilot, too.
On 9/5/2014 7:08 AM, Don Maxwell wrote:
[quote] Has anyone heard recently of new Rotax four-stroke engines with faulty carburetor floats?
I'm curious because I know of three brand new engines--one 912ULS, two 914UL--that have had multiple floats fill with gasoline and sink within the first 50 hours of operation in new airplanes. Each of these engines has had at least two bad floats and one had 3 of 4. I don't know the engine serial numbers, but all three engines are on brand new, factory-fresh S-LSA Seareys, all produced within a few weeks of each other.
The sunken floats caused flooding in all three engines--so severe that the engine wouldn't run at low throttle settings and soon the 914s wouldn't run at all with either fuel pump on. One owner had to make an emergency landing by turning the fuel pumps off until the engine stumbled and then switching one on just long enough to get it running again.
One of the 914s had fuel staining in an air box drain hose. Fuel was discovered running from the 912 carburetor vent while burping the engine during preflight.
Lockwood is assisting the owners, and one hopes that by now Rotax has been informed.
But The Question is: How many more bad floats are in service?
[b]
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_________________
Guy Buchanan
Deceased K-IV 1200
A glider pilot too. |
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kgderosier(at)gmail.com
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| Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 10:55 am Post subject: Bad Carburetor Floats |
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With a Rotax you could go all the way to Alaska and back without using any oil. There is virtually no oil consumption on the road tax per Lockwood at Oshkosh. On Sep 5, 2014 1:50 PM, "Guy Buchanan" <gebuchanan(at)cox.net (gebuchanan(at)cox.net)> wrote:[quote] Sounds like having one or two in the repair kit might not be a bad idea. Speaking of which, what 912 spares do you guys generally carry? I was thinking:
- Float
- Needle
- Fuel filter
- Spark plug(s)
- 1 qt. oil
Can't think of anything else. Carb boot?
Guy Buchanan
Ramona, CA
Kitfox IV-1200 / 912-S / Warp 3cs / 500 hrs. and grounded
Now a glider pilot, too.
On 9/5/2014 7:08 AM, Don Maxwell wrote:
| Quote: | Has anyone heard recently of new Rotax four-stroke engines with faulty carburetor floats?
I'm curious because I know of three brand new engines--one 912ULS, two 914UL--that have had multiple floats fill with gasoline and sink within the first 50 hours of operation in new airplanes. Each of these engines has had at least two bad floats and one had 3 of 4. I don't know the engine serial numbers, but all three engines are on brand new, factory-fresh S-LSA Seareys, all produced within a few weeks of each other.
The sunken floats caused flooding in all three engines--so severe that the engine wouldn't run at low throttle settings and soon the 914s wouldn't run at all with either fuel pump on. One owner had to make an emergency landing by turning the fuel pumps off until the engine stumbled and then switching one on just long enough to get it running again.
One of the 914s had fuel staining in an air box drain hose. Fuel was discovered running from the 912 carburetor vent while burping the engine during preflight. Â
Lockwood is assisting the owners, and one hopes that by now Rotax has been informed.
But The Question is:Â How many more bad floats are in service?
ist" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RotaxEngines-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
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[b]
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Roger Lee
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1464
Location: Tucson, Az.
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| Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 4:39 pm Post subject: Re: Bad Carburetor Floats |
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If you look at the shear numbers of Rotax engines with Bing carbs on them then any failure rate is very minuscule. They tend to hold up well for long periods. I don't know of a single person that carries carb parts as spares.
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http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RotaxEngines-List |
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_________________
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Rotax Instructor & Rotax IRC
Light Sport Repairman
Home 520-574-1080 TRY HOME FIRST
Cell 520-349-7056 |
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John Hauck
Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)
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| Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 6:30 pm Post subject: Bad Carburetor Floats |
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20 years ago I flew a 17,400.0 sm flight. I had a spare set of spark plugs
for my 912 80 hp. In 1993, there was no 912UL or ULS. I had 100 hours on
the oil when I got to North Pole, Alaska. Got the guys at Bradley Sky Ranch
to run me down to NAPA to pick up two qts of Mobile I and a Fram PH3614. I
dumped my spare qt of oil in the tank, and never carried any spare oil after
that. That was 3,000.0 plus hours and three 912's ago. On that flight I
flew 232.0 hours in 41 days. Averaged 8 hours per day for the 30 days I
actually flew. The only engine problem I had was occasional spark plug lead
fouling. When that happened, I would feel a periodic tapping in the
airframe. Next landing, pull the plugs, take my pen knife, clean out the
lead, put them back in and keep on flying. I was extremely impressed with
the 912 on that flight, and every long flight since then.
I did have a carb tuning problem that I encountered once I got up into BC
where the temps dropped on me. Didn't know it at the time, nor did any of
the Rotax experts from Eric Tucker right on down, what to do with me as I
sat weathered-in at Deadhorse, AK. Only on my return to Alabama, where I
had no fear of losing a carb part if I should be so club fisted, did I
finally solve my problem. On a flight down to Ronnie Smith's in Lucedale,
MS, I was flying with some slower ULs. Flying at about 4,200 rpm there was
a really rough spot. I don't know why, but I pulled on the enricher. The
engine picked up 200 rpm. Push off the enricher, the engine lost 200 rpm
and ran a rough again. When I landed I raised the fuel needles one notch.
That fixed my problem, a midrange, very lean condition. Never had that
problem with my 912ULS's. They have run great, right out of the box, hot or
cold weather.
Getting ready to fly from Alabama to my friends at the Rock House, near
Burns Junction, Oregon. Plan to depart first light Sunday morning, if I can
get up and get going that early. Route of flight is Sherman, TX, Clovis,
NM, Los Lunas, NM, Gallup, NM, Monument Valley, UT, Bryce Canyon, UT, Ely,
NV, Owyhee, NV, and finally the Rock House, OR. We are having our
annual/semi-annual Kolb (and any other airplane) Flyin. A bunch of us have
been getting together since 2003 when we had our first Monument Valley Kolb
Unplanned/Unorganized Flyin. Plan to RON Sherman, Los Lunas, MV, and Elko.
Give me a shout if you have time for a cup of coffee and I am in your neck
of the woods.
john hauck
Kolb MKIII
Titus, Alabama
334-315-2621
If you look at the shear numbers of Rotax engines with Bing carbs on them
then any failure rate is very minuscule. They tend to hold up well for long
periods. I don't know of a single person that carries carb parts as spares.
--------
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Light Sport Repairman - Maintenance Rated Rotax Repair Center - Heavy Maint.
Rated Home 520-574-1080 TRY HOME FIRST Cell 520-349-7056
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430088#430088
| | - The Matronics RotaxEngines-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama |
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