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fluid level sensor

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kenryan

Joined: 20 Oct 2009
Posts: 426

Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2017 7:23 am Post subject: fluid level sensor

Can you guys tell me if this (153064) would be an appropriate sensor for my 5 gallon header tank to turn on an LED if the tank is not full?



sensor: http://ecatalog.gemssensors.com/ecatalog/singlepoint-level/en/153064

LED: https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/lstestled.php?clickkey=485496

sensor catalog page: http://www.gemssensors.com/level/Single-Point-Level-Switches/Electro-optic/Engineered-Plastic/~/media/GemsNA/CatalogPages/ELS-1100HT-cat.ashx

Thanks,

Ken

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Bob McC

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 258
Location: Toronto, ON

Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2017 8:49 am Post subject: fluid level sensor

Looking up the chemical resistance of the plastic from which this sensor is manufactured it appears to have excellent resistance to all forms of gasoline, benzine, astm fuels and astm oils as well as ethylene glycol and brake fluid.. So yes, it would appear suitable for use in a header tank. However a query to the manufacturer requesting their opinion would yield the safest answer. Tell them the application is for level in a fuel storage tank NOT an aircraft header tank.😄   

Bob McC   [quote]    --------

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_________________
Bob McC
Falco #908
(just starting)

nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect
Guest

Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2017 11:25 am Post subject: fluid level sensor

At 09:19 AM 2/6/2017, you wrote:

  	  Quote: 	
		  Can you guys tell me if this (153064) would be an appropriate sensor for my 5 gallon header tank to turn on an LED if the tank is not full? 	


   Polysulfone enclosure material for this device is

   very compatible with motor fuels.



   I proposed using this sensor as a component of

   an upgrade to a series of low liquid level sensors

   I worked on for Electro-Mech WAaaayyy back when . . .



   We crafted a series of optical liquid level sensors

   that were widely used on Beech products. It looks

   like they still make some version of them . . .



  http://tinyurl.com/hgs24nt



   When the Premier was still under development, I

   became aware of dismal failure rate in these

   devices. Given the simplicity of the product,

   it was rather astounding.  Dean Matson and I

   were co-developers of the original concept and

   we were working together at Beech's Targets

   division when the news came to us.



   To make a long story short, this program proved

   to be a fine example of what can happen when a

   small, tightly coupled design, development and

   manufacturing operation gets bought out and

   'upgraded' with all the albatrosses and millstones

   of the parent corporation after a buyout.



   I suggested that the fast-turn solution for the

   failures was to modify a GEM sensor to fit into

   the stock Electro-Mech enclosure. Had this

   problem surfaced in the same regulatory and

   business environment I enjoyed in 1985, we could

   have put the fix into production in a couple

   months at most. But in 2004 . . . well . . .



   I was pretty busy fighting other fires then and

   I don't know what they wound up doing to fix

   the EM product . . . but the short answer to your

   question is that the GEM sensor is well suited to

   the application you are proposing.



   For those interested in the history of this technology

   in aircraft, I've posted a few snapshots of my own

   experience with it at  http://tinyurl.com/h586hp9 



 

 

   Bob . . .

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hilltopkid

Joined: 10 Jul 2016
Posts: 10
Location: Richmond, VA

Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2017 2:55 pm Post subject: fluid level sensor

Ken,



For what it's worth, here is the information on the two level switches we bought for our Subaru back in 2009. I just dialed the phone number for e-Components International and got voice mail which appeared to be the same person, Tammy, which we dealt with back then.

Manufacturer: Fozmula Limited Griffiths House, Hermes Close, Tachbrook Park, Warwick, CV34 6UF, United Kingdom

Tel: +44 (0) 1926 466700   |   Fax: +44 (0) 1926 450473   | 

http://www.fozmula.com/



Tammy was the local rep we dealt with at:

e-Components International Inc.

307 Spring Hill Road

Lancaster, VA 22503

United States

ph: 804-462-5679

fax: 804-462-0556

sales(at)e-components.net (sales(at)e-components.net)



We bought:

S85/03 1/4" NPTF capacitive Fozmula switch for engine coolant

S86/03 Capacitive Fozmula switch 1/4" switch for gasoline



Dee



DeWitt (Dee) WhittingtonRichmond, VA

804-677-4849 iPhone

804-358-4333 Home

 

On Mon, Feb 6, 2017 at 10:19 AM, Ken Ryan <keninalaska(at)gmail.com (keninalaska(at)gmail.com)> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  Can you guys tell me if this (153064) would be an appropriate sensor for my 5 gallon header tank to turn on an LED if the tank is not full?



sensor: http://ecatalog.gemssensors.com/ecatalog/singlepoint-level/en/153064

LED: https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/lstestled.php?clickkey=485496

sensor catalog page: http://www.gemssensors.com/level/Single-Point-Level-Switches/Electro-optic/Engineered-Plastic/~/media/GemsNA/CatalogPages/ELS-1100HT-cat.ashx

Thanks,

Ken

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_________________
DeWitt (Dee) Whittington
Richmond, VA

jim(at)PoogieBearRanch.co
Guest

Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2017 4:51 pm Post subject: fluid level sensor

One other potential approach for your consideration...  Belite

Electronics makes lightweight, low-cost instrumentation for ultralight

and experimental aircraft. They have developed a line of fuel sensors

and gauges that are pretty cool. You can go to

http://www.beliteaircraft.com, then go to their "electronics" page to

see all the gauges.



They sell capacitance fuel probes that are much lighter and less

expensive than the "commercial" ones, and will custom make them to your

length if desired. And they make several different single- and dual-tank

gauges (including the "Radiant" gauges that were featured in Kitplanes

and AvWeb feature articles).



But the one I really like is the "Low Profile Fuel Probe," which is a

MEMS-based "pressure-reading" transducer that effectively measures the

mass of the fuel in the tank. It can be purchased with a "fuel computer"

that calibrates and translates the fuel probe's output into 0.0 volts

(empty) to 5.0 volts (full), with intermediate calibration points at

1/4, 1/2, and 3/4 levels. It can also be purchased without the fuel

computer, for use with the "Radiant" fuel gauges that already have the

calibration/translation feature built in.



I plan to use the low-profile fuel probe (without computer - $100) and

the Radiant dual-tank gauge ($300) as the primary fuel level indicator

for the Bearhawk Patrol I'm building. I'll have sight glass tubes as a

backup, but they are harder to see from the pilot's seat. The two probes

and the gauge together will add only a few ounces to the empty weight -

probably about as much as the wiring from panel to wing tanks!



But that solution would probably be major overkill for your intended

purpose of monitoring the fuel level in the header tank. For that, I

would use the Low Profile Fuel Probe (with fuel computer - $200) and the

single-display Fuel Gauge ($80). 



Some of you are probably be creative (and skilled) enough to forgo the

fuel computer or even the gauge, creating your own circuit to measure

the sensor output and decide when to turn on a "warning light" when the

level drops below your desired level. But me – I'm too much of a

"newb" to even attempt such a thing, so I'll stick to a "professionally

designed" system.



Jim Parker

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kenryan

Joined: 20 Oct 2009
Posts: 426

Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 1:03 pm Post subject: fluid level sensor

Thanks for the responses. I'll probably use the Gems but it's good to know there are other options.



On Mon, Feb 6, 2017 at 3:48 PM,  <jim(at)poogiebearranch.com (jim(at)poogiebearranch.com)> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: <jim(at)poogiebearranch.com (jim(at)poogiebearranch.com)>

 

 One other potential approach for your consideration...  Belite

 Electronics makes lightweight, low-cost instrumentation for ultralight

 and experimental aircraft. They have developed a line of fuel sensors

 and gauges that are pretty cool. You can go to

 http://www.beliteaircraft.com, then go to their "electronics" page to

 see all the gauges.

 

 They sell capacitance fuel probes that are much lighter and less

 expensive than the "commercial" ones, and will custom make them to your

 length if desired. And they make several different single- and dual-tank

 gauges (including the "Radiant" gauges that were featured in Kitplanes

 and AvWeb feature articles).

 

 But the one I really like is the "Low Profile Fuel Probe," which is a

 MEMS-based "pressure-reading" transducer that effectively measures the

 mass of the fuel in the tank. It can be purchased with a "fuel computer"

 that calibrates and translates the fuel probe's output into 0.0 volts

 (empty) to 5.0 volts (full), with intermediate calibration points at

 1/4, 1/2, and 3/4 levels. It can also be purchased without the fuel

 computer, for use with the "Radiant" fuel gauges that already have the

 calibration/translation feature built in.

 

 I plan to use the low-profile fuel probe (without computer - $100) and

 the Radiant dual-tank gauge ($300) as the primary fuel level indicator

 for the Bearhawk Patrol I'm building. I'll have sight glass tubes as a

 backup, but they are harder to see from the pilot's seat. The two probes

 and the gauge together will add only a few ounces to the empty weight -

 probably about as much as the wiring from panel to wing tanks!

 

 But that solution would probably be major overkill for your intended

 purpose of monitoring the fuel level in the header tank. For that, I

 would use the Low Profile Fuel Probe (with fuel computer - $200) and the

 single-display Fuel Gauge ($80).

 

 Some of you are probably be creative (and skilled) enough to forgo the

 fuel computer or even the gauge, creating your own circuit to measure

 the sensor output and decide when to turn on a "warning light" when the

 level drops below your desired level. But me – I'm too much of a

 "newb" to even attempt such a thing, so I'll stick to a "professionally

 designed" system.

 

 Jim Parker

 

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ceengland7(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 2:37 pm Post subject: fluid level sensor

Don't forget to check ebay before       purchasing; there are often much better deals there on the Gems       type sensors.

       

       Charlie

       

       On 2/7/2017 3:00 PM, Ken Ryan wrote:

     

      	  Quote: 	
		         Thanks for the responses. I'll probably use the         Gems but it's good to know there are other options.

       

         On Mon, Feb 6, 2017 at 3:48 PM, <jim(at)poogiebearranch.com (jim(at)poogiebearranch.com)>           wrote:

            	  Quote: 	
		  -->             AeroElectric-List message posted by: <jim(at)poogiebearranch.com (jim(at)poogiebearranch.com)>

             

             One other potential approach for your consideration...              Belite

             Electronics makes lightweight, low-cost instrumentation for             ultralight

             and experimental aircraft. They have developed a line of             fuel sensors

             and gauges that are pretty cool. You can go to

             http://www.beliteaircraft.com, then go             to their "electronics" page to

             see all the gauges.

             

             They sell capacitance fuel probes that are much lighter and             less

             expensive than the "commercial" ones, and will custom make             them to your

             length if desired. And they make several different single-             and dual-tank

             gauges (including the "Radiant" gauges that were featured in             Kitplanes

             and AvWeb feature articles).

             

             But the one I really like is the "Low Profile Fuel Probe,"             which is a

             MEMS-based "pressure-reading" transducer that effectively             measures the

             mass of the fuel in the tank. It can be purchased with a             "fuel computer"

             that calibrates and translates the fuel probe's output into             0.0 volts

             (empty) to 5.0 volts (full), with intermediate calibration             points at

             1/4, 1/2, and 3/4 levels. It can also be purchased without             the fuel

             computer, for use with the "Radiant" fuel gauges that             already have the

             calibration/translation feature built in.

             

             I plan to use the low-profile fuel probe (without computer -             $100) and

             the Radiant dual-tank gauge ($300) as the primary fuel level             indicator

             for the Bearhawk Patrol I'm building. I'll have sight glass             tubes as a

             backup, but they are harder to see from the pilot's seat.             The two probes

             and the gauge together will add only a few ounces to the             empty weight -

             probably about as much as the wiring from panel to wing             tanks!

             

             But that solution would probably be major overkill for your             intended

             purpose of monitoring the fuel level in the header tank. For             that, I

             would use the Low Profile Fuel Probe (with fuel computer -             $200) and the

             single-display Fuel Gauge ($80).

             

             Some of you are probably be creative (and skilled) enough to             forgo the

             fuel computer or even the gauge, creating your own circuit             to measure

             the sensor output and decide when to turn on a "warning             light" when the

             level drops below your desired level. But me – I'm too much             of a

             "newb" to even attempt such a thing, so I'll stick to a             "professionally

             designed" system.

             

             Jim Parker

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rick(at)beebe.org
Guest

Posted: Wed Feb 08, 2017 9:02 pm Post subject: fluid level sensor

FWIW, I have the Belite RADIANT dual fuel gauge in my GlaStar and I love 

it. I'm using it with the capacitance senders that came with the plane 

and it works great. The gauge is very readable, very light, and was easy 

to install and configure.



--Rick



On 2/6/2017 7:48 PM, jim(at)PoogieBearRanch.com wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   



 One other potential approach for your consideration...  Belite

 Electronics makes lightweight, low-cost instrumentation for ultralight

 and experimental aircraft. They have developed a line of fuel sensors

 and gauges that are pretty cool. You can go to

 http://www.beliteaircraft.com, then go to their "electronics" page to

 see all the gauges.

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Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

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