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airmanv2
Joined: 01 Dec 2013
Posts: 49
Location: France - Normandy
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 Posted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 12:13 am Post subject: Cj6 lift off without jacks |
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Hi every body,
always with my gear retraction problem.
Looking for advices to lift the cj6 without the special jacks.
is it ok to get a small crane and tide a rope to engine mount, putting the back of the plane on a drum ???
thank you for help
Bruno
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j.mevis(at)computer.org
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| Posted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 12:26 am Post subject: Cj6 lift off without jacks |
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The airplane structure will be damaged if you do that.
There¹s a good reason why you need jacks to lift the plane off the ground:
they support the plane at the wings.
Try and find some jacks, they are not that expensive and you can use them
for your annual inspection or exactly for this kind of issues.
Only my 2 cents,
Jan
On 21/08/2017, 10:13, "airmanv2" <owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com on
behalf of bruno.blanchard2(at)gmail.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
Hi every body,
always with my gear retraction problem.
Looking for advices to lift the cj6 without the special jacks.
is it ok to get a small crane and tide a rope to engine mount, putting
the back of the plane on a drum ???
thank you for help
Bruno
--------
Fly safe
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=472027#472027
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draftsjust417(at)gmail.co
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| Posted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 2:48 am Post subject: Cj6 lift off without jacks |
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Oh wow, I would find some good jacks and tail stand.
This is what the engineers originally intended for lifting the aircraft and properly distributing its weight. Anything else and I think you would put the wrong bending stresses throughout the airframe. Better safe than sorry.
My thoughts...
Justin
On Aug 21, 2017 3:49 AM, "airmanv2" <bruno.blanchard2(at)gmail.com (bruno.blanchard2(at)gmail.com)> wrote: | Quote: | --> Yak-List message posted by: "airmanv2" <bruno.blanchard2(at)gmail.com (bruno.blanchard2(at)gmail.com)>
Hi every body,
always with my gear retraction problem.
Looking for advices to lift the cj6 without the special jacks.
is it ok to get a small crane and tide a rope to engine mount, putting the back of the plane on a drum ???
thank you for help
Bruno
--------
Fly safe
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=472026#472026
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dsavarese0812(at)bellsout
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| Posted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 3:28 am Post subject: Cj6 lift off without jacks |
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There are 4 jacks needed to jack the CJ properly, and all 4 should be used when jacking the airplane. Not 3...all 4. Nose, Tail and two wing jacks. The wing jacks must allow for the gear doors to clear the jacks when retracting the gear. Also the wing jacks must be designed to properly support the aircraft because with the gear doors having to clear the jacks, there will be an offset needed at the top of the jack to fit into the jack point socket in the wing. That means the wing jack weight distribution is not directly below the jack point. You definitely do not want the airplane "leaning" or back on the wing jacks when the airplane is raised off the ground. Doug Sapp probably has photos of both the original Chinese jacks or of the specialty jacks he designed and sold for the CJ. You may be able duplicate them.
The nose jack, which cradles the bottom of the engine around the rocker box covers on cylinders 4, 5, 6, and 7, keeps the nose from tipping over. The tail stand is also required because the CJ, unlike the Yak 52, is balanced fore and aft at the wing jack points. (On the Yak 52, the jack points are well aft of the main spar and thus well aft of the CG, making the Yak 52 extremely nose heavy) On the CJ, if you did not have the tail stand and were to step onto the left wing to do a gear retraction test, the tail of the CJ would immediately go right to the ground.
My recommendation, and I concur 100% with what others have said, is to invest in a PROPER set of jacks for the CJ. Don't be "penny wise and pound foolish" because it can cause you a lot of grief if you use the wrong jacks.
Dennis
From: Justin Drafts <draftsjust417(at)gmail.com>
To: yak-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2017 6:49 AM
Subject: Re: Cj6 lift off without jacks
Oh wow, I would find some good jacks and tail stand.
This is what the engineers originally intended for lifting the aircraft and properly distributing its weight. Anything else and I think you would put the wrong bending stresses throughout the airframe. Better safe than sorry.
My thoughts...
Justin
On Aug 21, 2017 3:49 AM, "airmanv2" <bruno.blanchard2(at)gmail.com (bruno.blanchard2(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> Yak-List message posted by: "airmanv2" <bruno.blanchard2(at)gmail.com (bruno.blanchard2(at)gmail.com)>
Hi every body,
always with my gear retraction problem.
Looking for advices to lift the cj6 without the special jacks.
is it ok to get a small crane and tide a rope to engine mount, putting the back of the plane on a drum ???
thank you for help
Bruno
--------
Fly safe
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/ viewtopic.php?p=472026#472026
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Clouddog
Joined: 02 Jun 2016
Posts: 119
Location: Lebanon, TN
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| Posted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 7:07 am Post subject: Cj6 lift off without jacks |
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Bruno, Â Please, Please, Please read everything everyone is telling you. Jacking the CJ improperly can cause you more trouble and grief than you want to experience!!! Things like the airplane falling off the jacks and going through the wings, or raising the gear and having the Airplane fall off the jacks ending up on the floor! My first experience was two good Jack's withÂ
On Aug 21, 2017 6:30 AM, "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812(at)bellsouth.net (dsavarese0812(at)bellsouth.net)> wrote: | Quote: | There are 4 jacks needed to jack the CJ properly, and all 4 should be used when jacking the airplane. Not 3...all 4. Nose, Tail and two wing jacks.  The wing jacks must allow for the gear doors to clear the jacks when retracting the gear. Also the wing jacks must be designed to properly support the aircraft because with the gear doors having to clear the jacks, there will be an offset needed at the top of the jack to fit into the jack point socket in the wing.  That means the wing jack weight distribution is not directly below the jack point. You definitely do not want the airplane "leaning" or back on the wing jacks when the airplane is raised off the ground. Doug Sapp probably has photos of both the original Chinese jacks or of the specialty jacks he designed and sold for the CJ. You may be able duplicate them. Â
The nose jack, which cradles the bottom of the engine around the rocker box covers on cylinders 4, 5, 6, and 7, keeps the nose from tipping over. The tail stand is also required because the CJ, unlike the Yak 52, is balanced fore and aft at the wing jack points.  (On the Yak 52, the jack points are well aft of the main spar and thus well aft of the CG, making the Yak 52 extremely nose heavy)  On the CJ, if you did not have the tail stand and were to step onto the left wing to do a gear retraction test, the tail of the CJ would immediately go right to the ground.
My recommendation, and I concur 100% with what others have said, is to invest in a PROPER set of jacks for the CJ. Don't be "penny wise and pound foolish" because it can cause you a lot of grief if you use the wrong jacks.
Dennis
From: Justin Drafts <draftsjust417(at)gmail.com (draftsjust417(at)gmail.com)>
To: yak-list(at)matronics.com (yak-list(at)matronics.com)
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2017 6:49 AM
Subject: Re: Cj6 lift off without jacks
Oh wow, I would find some good jacks and tail stand.
This is what the engineers originally intended for lifting the aircraft and properly distributing its weight. Anything else and I think you would put the wrong bending stresses throughout the airframe. Better safe than sorry.
My thoughts...
Justin
On Aug 21, 2017 3:49 AM, "airmanv2" <bruno.blanchard2(at)gmail.com (bruno.blanchard2(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> Yak-List message posted by: "airmanv2" <bruno.blanchard2(at)gmail.com (bruno.blanchard2(at)gmail.com)>
Hi every body,
always with my gear retraction problem.
Looking for advices to lift the cj6 without the special jacks.
is it ok to get a small crane and tide a rope to engine mount, putting the back of the plane on a drum ???
thank you for help
Bruno
--------
Fly safe
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/ viewtopic.php?p=472026#472026
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eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
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rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/ contribution
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Clouddog
Joined: 02 Jun 2016
Posts: 119
Location: Lebanon, TN
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| Posted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 7:31 am Post subject: Cj6 lift off without jacks |
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Sorry, somehow a partial message was sent. To continue........ I had two good Jack's but the off sets were longer than necessary. I used a weighed tail stand and with the gear down the aircraft tipped backwards and fell off the jacks. Fortunately nothing was damaged. I have redesigned my Jacks, Â tail stand AND added the nose stand. It's rock solid. If you have never experienced a gear retraction and especially an emmergecy extension, it can be quite violent especially if someone has removed the restrictors in your air lines over the years. Get good jacks AND both stands!!!!!!!
On Aug 21, 2017 10:07 AM, "Greg Wrobel" <clouddog22(at)gmail.com (clouddog22(at)gmail.com)> wrote: | Quote: | Bruno, Â Please, Please, Please read everything everyone is telling you. Jacking the CJ improperly can cause you more trouble and grief than you want to experience!!! Things like the airplane falling off the jacks and going through the wings, or raising the gear and having the Airplane fall off the jacks ending up on the floor! My first experience was two good Jack's withÂ
On Aug 21, 2017 6:30 AM, "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812(at)bellsouth.net (dsavarese0812(at)bellsouth.net)> wrote: | Quote: | There are 4 jacks needed to jack the CJ properly, and all 4 should be used when jacking the airplane. Not 3...all 4. Nose, Tail and two wing jacks.  The wing jacks must allow for the gear doors to clear the jacks when retracting the gear. Also the wing jacks must be designed to properly support the aircraft because with the gear doors having to clear the jacks, there will be an offset needed at the top of the jack to fit into the jack point socket in the wing.  That means the wing jack weight distribution is not directly below the jack point. You definitely do not want the airplane "leaning" or back on the wing jacks when the airplane is raised off the ground. Doug Sapp probably has photos of both the original Chinese jacks or of the specialty jacks he designed and sold for the CJ. You may be able duplicate them. Â
The nose jack, which cradles the bottom of the engine around the rocker box covers on cylinders 4, 5, 6, and 7, keeps the nose from tipping over. The tail stand is also required because the CJ, unlike the Yak 52, is balanced fore and aft at the wing jack points.  (On the Yak 52, the jack points are well aft of the main spar and thus well aft of the CG, making the Yak 52 extremely nose heavy)  On the CJ, if you did not have the tail stand and were to step onto the left wing to do a gear retraction test, the tail of the CJ would immediately go right to the ground.
My recommendation, and I concur 100% with what others have said, is to invest in a PROPER set of jacks for the CJ. Don't be "penny wise and pound foolish" because it can cause you a lot of grief if you use the wrong jacks.
Dennis
From: Justin Drafts <draftsjust417(at)gmail.com (draftsjust417(at)gmail.com)>
To: yak-list(at)matronics.com (yak-list(at)matronics.com)
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2017 6:49 AM
Subject: Re: Cj6 lift off without jacks
Oh wow, I would find some good jacks and tail stand.
This is what the engineers originally intended for lifting the aircraft and properly distributing its weight. Anything else and I think you would put the wrong bending stresses throughout the airframe. Better safe than sorry.
My thoughts...
Justin
On Aug 21, 2017 3:49 AM, "airmanv2" <bruno.blanchard2(at)gmail.com (bruno.blanchard2(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> Yak-List message posted by: "airmanv2" <bruno.blanchard2(at)gmail.com (bruno.blanchard2(at)gmail.com)>
Hi every body,
always with my gear retraction problem.
Looking for advices to lift the cj6 without the special jacks.
is it ok to get a small crane and tide a rope to engine mount, putting the back of the plane on a drum ???
thank you for help
Bruno
--------
Fly safe
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/ viewtopic.php?p=472026#472026
==== ============================== ==
List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/ Navigator?Yak-List
==== ============================== ==
FORUMS -
eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
==== ============================== ==
WIKI -
errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com
==== ============================== ==
b Site -
     -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/ contribution
==== ============================== ==
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wlannon(at)shaw.ca
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| Posted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 10:29 am Post subject: Cj6 lift off without jacks |
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For routine maintenance purposes using the original Chinese equipment only the two jacks and the tail support are required.
The tail support is designed to entrap the tail skid and provides hooks for the attachment of 3 50 lb. sandbags which are absolutely necessary. The other two supports (engine and rear fuselage) are meant for more extensive service/repair etc.
The emergency gear down test can be done simply, quietly and safely by selectively balancing down air against system up air (make that < 20 Atm.). This can be done with a loss of emerg. air < 5 Atm. Since I keep my emerg. tank charged with N2 that is important.
Walt
From: Greg Wrobel (clouddog22(at)gmail.com)
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2017 8:07 AM
To: yak-list(at)matronics.com (yak-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Cj6 lift off without jacks
Bruno, Please, Please, Please read everything everyone is telling you. Jacking the CJ improperly can cause you more trouble and grief than you want to experience!!! Things like the airplane falling off the jacks and going through the wings, or raising the gear and having the Airplane fall off the jacks ending up on the floor! My first experience was two good Jack's with
On Aug 21, 2017 6:30 AM, "A. Dennis Savarese" <dsavarese0812(at)bellsouth.net (dsavarese0812(at)bellsouth.net)> wrote: | Quote: | There are 4 jacks needed to jack the CJ properly, and all 4 should be used when jacking the airplane. Not 3...all 4. Nose, Tail and two wing jacks. The wing jacks must allow for the gear doors to clear the jacks when retracting the gear. Also the wing jacks must be designed to properly support the aircraft because with the gear doors having to clear the jacks, there will be an offset needed at the top of the jack to fit into the jack point socket in the wing. That means the wing jack weight distribution is not directly below the jack point. You definitely do not want the airplane "leaning" or back on the wing jacks when the airplane is raised off the ground. Doug Sapp probably has photos of both the original Chinese jacks or of the specialty jacks he designed and sold for the CJ. You may be able duplicate them.
The nose jack, which cradles the bottom of the engine around the rocker box covers on cylinders 4, 5, 6, and 7, keeps the nose from tipping over. The tail stand is also required because the CJ, unlike the Yak 52, is balanced fore and aft at the wing jack points. (On the Yak 52, the jack points are well aft of the main spar and thus well aft of the CG, making the Yak 52 extremely nose heavy) On the CJ, if you did not have the tail stand and were to step onto the left wing to do a gear retraction test, the tail of the CJ would immediately go right to the ground.
My recommendation, and I concur 100% with what others have said, is to invest in a PROPER set of jacks for the CJ. Don't be "penny wise and pound foolish" because it can cause you a lot of grief if you use the wrong jacks.
Dennis
From: Justin Drafts <draftsjust417(at)gmail.com (draftsjust417(at)gmail.com)>
To: yak-list(at)matronics.com (yak-list(at)matronics.com)
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2017 6:49 AM
Subject: Re: Cj6 lift off without jacks
Oh wow, I would find some good jacks and tail stand.
This is what the engineers originally intended for lifting the aircraft and properly distributing its weight. Anything else and I think you would put the wrong bending stresses throughout the airframe. Better safe than sorry.
My thoughts...
Justin
On Aug 21, 2017 3:49 AM, "airmanv2" <bruno.blanchard2(at)gmail.com (bruno.blanchard2(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> Yak-List message posted by: "airmanv2" <bruno.blanchard2(at)gmail.com (bruno.blanchard2(at)gmail.com)>
Hi every body,
always with my gear retraction problem.
Looking for advices to lift the cj6 without the special jacks.
is it ok to get a small crane and tide a rope to engine mount, putting the back of the plane on a drum ???
thank you for help
Bruno
--------
Fly safe
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/ viewtopic.php?p=472026#472026
==== ============================== ==
List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/ Navigator?Yak-List
==== ============================== ==
FORUMS -
eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
==== ============================== ==
WIKI -
errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com
==== ============================== ==
b Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/ contribution
==== ============================== ==
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airmanv2
Joined: 01 Dec 2013
Posts: 49
Location: France - Normandy
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| Posted: Tue Aug 22, 2017 10:30 pm Post subject: Re: Cj6 lift off without jacks |
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Hello ,
Finlay we succeed to raise the Nanchang without jacks and tested the gear without any damage to the plane:
-remove the fairing between the dihedral and horizontal fixed part of the wing.
- you will find 4 mounting brackets with safety nuts , put a sling (4000lbs)below the 2 upper ones to avoid to damage hoses ans wires. Do the same for other side
- remove engine fairing and put a sling (4000lbs) bellow 2 upper bars of he engine mount as close as possible to the engine (in front of the generator)
- use 3 come-along chain attached to the frame of the hangar the both for wing will have to support about 1000lbs each, the nose one will have to support about 600lbs. check the resistance of the hangar frame is enough.
- raise slowly and silmutaneously with friends.
the plane is very stable and you can climb on it carefully.
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j.mevis(at)computer.org
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| Posted: Wed Aug 23, 2017 3:26 am Post subject: Cj6 lift off without jacks |
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I am impressed, when looking at the pictures.
I suppose that you also calculated or estimated the structural strenghth
of the roof of your hangar?
Jan
On 23/08/2017, 08:30, "airmanv2" <owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com on
behalf of bruno.blanchard2(at)gmail.com> wrote:
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