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Chinese rebuild engine
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Flibob

Joined: 25 Jun 2014
Posts: 28
Location: Indiana

Posted: Wed May 09, 2018 5:25 pm Post subject: Chinese rebuild engine

I just got through replacing my 1400 hour Hosai engine.  Old engine ran good but new engine just sitting in the back of hangar didn't make sense.  



Got it installed now for the run in.  Chinese Manuel just says install engine.  I assume all stops are correctly set so cables and levers should be adjusted.  On the first start seemed that a mag was off.  Will run with start button and pumping on primer.  But, stops when button is released or prime stops.  Any ideas.

pilotdog57(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Wed May 09, 2018 6:29 pm Post subject: Chinese rebuild engine

Check for preserving packing material inside the carburetor.



Sent from my iPad



 	  Quote: 	
		   On May 9, 2018, at 6:25 PM, Flibob <Flibob(at)att.net> wrote:

 

 

 

 I just got through replacing my 1400 hour Hosai engine.  Old engine ran good but new engine just sitting in the back of hangar didn't make sense.  

 

 Got it installed now for the run in.  Chinese Manuel just says install engine.  I assume all stops are correctly set so cables and levers should be adjusted.  On the first start seemed that a mag was off.  Will run with start button and pumping on primer.  But, stops when button is released or prime stops.  Any ideas.

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=480008#480008

ldakos(at)bigpond.net.au
Guest

Posted: Wed May 09, 2018 7:06 pm Post subject: Chinese rebuild engine

Have a look inside carbie for a little cap over jet.



--

wlannon(at)shaw.ca
Guest

Posted: Wed May 09, 2018 7:47 pm Post subject: Chinese rebuild engine

The Chinese do not say "just install the engine"  Did you follow the manual 

de-inhibiting process?



What you describe is probably a non functioning carburettor.  Two items 

here:  1.  Carb is full of inhibiting oil and/or:  2.  They sometimes put a 

protective "condom" over the  ambient pressure sensing tube in the carb 

throat.

With item 1. only it will start eventually and run like a shit box.  With 

item 2 it will never start.



In addition they also usually protect the magneto points with a small piece 

of oiled paper or cloth between the points.   These have to be removed and 

the points thoroughly cleaned of oil.



Walt



--

cjpilot710(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Thu May 10, 2018 2:22 am Post subject: Chinese rebuild engine

I agree with Walt.  Also check that you turn the main fuel valve open. Jim "Pappy" Goolsby

 

 

  --

Flibob

Joined: 25 Jun 2014
Posts: 28
Location: Indiana

Posted: Thu May 10, 2018 3:23 am Post subject: Chinese rebuild engine

Thanks Walt as usual you are a great help.



GiddyUp,



Bob



On May 9, 2018, at 11:45 PM, Walter Lannon <wlannon(at)shaw.ca> wrote:






The Chinese do not say "just install the engine"  Did you follow the manual de-inhibiting process?



What you describe is probably a non functioning carburettor.  Two items here:  1.  Carb is full of inhibiting oil and/or:  2.  They sometimes put a protective "condom" over the  ambient pressure sensing tube in the carb throat.

With item 1. only it will start eventually and run like a shit box.  With item 2 it will never start.



In addition they also usually protect the magneto points with a small piece of oiled paper or cloth between the points.   These have to be removed and the points thoroughly cleaned of oil.



Walt



--

Viperdoc

Joined: 19 Apr 2014
Posts: 484
Location: 08A

Posted: Thu May 10, 2018 4:46 pm Post subject: Chinese rebuild engine

Fuel pressure? On the YAK the fuel pump can be installed 180 out. Will not run. Well at least mine did not until I reversed it. 

Doc



Sent from my iPad



 	  Quote: 	
		   On May 9, 2018, at 8:25 PM, Flibob <Flibob(at)att.net> wrote:

 

 

 

 I just got through replacing my 1400 hour Hosai engine.  Old engine ran good but new engine just sitting in the back of hangar didn't make sense.  

 

 Got it installed now for the run in.  Chinese Manuel just says install engine.  I assume all stops are correctly set so cables and levers should be adjusted.  On the first start seemed that a mag was off.  Will run with start button and pumping on primer.  But, stops when button is released or prime stops.  Any ideas.

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=480008#480008

_________________
Viperdoc

Viperdoc

Joined: 19 Apr 2014
Posts: 484
Location: 08A

Posted: Thu May 10, 2018 5:03 pm Post subject: Chinese rebuild engine

Never mind. Seems the Chinese have different way of pickling there engines. Condoms on jets. Who woulda thunk it? Oiled gauze between the points is similar to The YAK.they put something like a silicon grease on theirs. Can misfire like a son of a gun if you don’t get every nanogram off the points.  

Doc

Sent from my iPad

 	  Quote: 	
		   On May 10, 2018, at 7:44 PM, Roger Kemp <f16viperdoc(at)me.com> wrote:

 Fuel pressure? On the YAK the fuel pump can be installed 180 out. Will not run. Well at least mine did not until I reversed it. 

 Doc

 Sent from my iPad

> On May 9, 2018, at 8:25 PM, Flibob <Flibob(at)att.net> wrote:

> 

> 

> 

> I just got through replacing my 1400 hour Hosai engine.  Old engine ran good but new engine just sitting in the back of hangar didn't make sense.  

> 

> Got it installed now for the run in.  Chinese Manuel just says install engine.  I assume all stops are correctly set so cables and levers should be adjusted.  On the first start seemed that a mag was off.  Will run with start button and pumping on primer.  But, stops when button is released or prime stops.  Any ideas.

> 

> 

> 

> 

> Read this topic online here:

> 

> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=480008#480008

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

>

_________________
Viperdoc

Flibob

Joined: 25 Jun 2014
Posts: 28
Location: Indiana

Posted: Thu May 31, 2018 2:22 pm Post subject: Re: Chinese rebuild engine

Still working on this engine. Starts but won't run unless 1. Throttle is pumped constantly or 2 wobble is pumped or 3 primer is pumped.  Any of which will keep engine running at 1500 +\_.  



I have taken the carberater and fuel pump off running engine with no effect.  Also cleaned points in both mags. 



Any ideas?

dsavarese0812(at)bellsout
Guest

Posted: Thu May 31, 2018 5:07 pm Post subject: Chinese rebuild engine

Serious look into the mags. Check to make sure points are clean and dry. CJ point gap, .010-.014. Check timing. Note what number is stamped in the cover mating surface and correlate that number to timing chart. Once timing has been checked, then check the rotor leading finger in the counterclockwise rotation position alignment to the scribed mark on the cover mating surface. It close to the HV stick. 

Dennis



Sent from my iPhone



 	  Quote: 	
		   On May 31, 2018, at 6:22 PM, Flibob <Flibob(at)att.net> wrote:

 

 

 

 Still working on this engine. Starts but won't run unless 1. Throttle is pumped constantly or 2 wobble is pumped or 3 primer is pumped.  Any of which will keep engine running at 1500 +_.  

 

 I have taken the carberater and fuel pump off running engine with no effect.  Also cleaned points in both mags. 

 

 Any ideas?

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=480534#480534

Flibob

Joined: 25 Jun 2014
Posts: 28
Location: Indiana

Posted: Thu May 31, 2018 5:37 pm Post subject: Chinese rebuild engine

Thanks Dennis

GiddyUp,



Bob



On May 31, 2018, at 9:07 PM, Anthony Savarese <dsavarese0812(at)bellsouth.net> wrote:






Serious look into the mags. Check to make sure points are clean and dry. CJ point gap, .010-.014. Check timing. Note what number is stamped in the cover mating surface and correlate that number to timing chart. Once timing has been checked, then check the rotor leading finger in the counterclockwise rotation position alignment to the scribed mark on the cover mating surface. It close to the HV stick. 

Dennis



Sent from my iPhone



 	  Quote: 	
		   On May 31, 2018, at 6:22 PM, Flibob <Flibob(at)att.net> wrote:

 

 

 

 Still working on this engine. Starts but won't run unless 1. Throttle is pumped constantly or 2 wobble is pumped or 3 primer is pumped.  Any of which will keep engine running at 1500 +_.  

 

 I have taken the carberater and fuel pump off running engine with no effect.  Also cleaned points in both mags. 

 

 Any ideas?

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=480534#480534

wlannon(at)shaw.ca
Guest

Posted: Thu May 31, 2018 5:56 pm Post subject: Chinese rebuild engine

The engine was most likely overhauled about 30 years ago.  The inhibiting 

oil, in normal circumstances for a military operation, would be cleaned out 

and re-applied in an absolute maximum of 6 years.  It is "running" on the 

start solenoid and the primer NOT the carburettor.



You must follow the de-inhibiting process in the manual TO THE LETTER and 

beyond since the oil has long since turned to hard grease.  Particularly 

true for the carburettor but applies to everthing they list in the manual.



Once you get serious and spend a few days on due diligence it will start and 

run like a top.   Do not mess with the point gap setting.  The factory will 

have set these

at exactly 0.3 mm (0.012").  Just make sure they are perfectly clean



Of course you have already confirmed that the carburetor ambient air tube in 

the carb. throat is not blocked.



Cheers;

Walt

--

dsavarese0812(at)bellsout
Guest

Posted: Thu May 31, 2018 6:26 pm Post subject: Chinese rebuild engine

I spoke to Bob this afternoon and he said he removed and replaced the carburetor using the one from the old engine and there was no difference in the way it ran.

Dennis

       From: Walter Lannon <wlannon(at)shaw.ca>

 To: yak-list(at)matronics.com 

 Sent: Thursday, May 31, 2018 9:59 PM

 Subject: Re: Re: Chinese rebuild engine

--> Yak-List message posted by: "Walter Lannon" <wlannon(at)shaw.ca (wlannon(at)shaw.ca)>

The engine was most likely overhauled about 30 years ago.  The inhibiting 

oil, in normal circumstances for a military operation, would be cleaned out 

and re-applied in an absolute maximum of 6 years.  It is "running" on the 

start solenoid and the primer NOT the carburettor.

You must follow the de-inhibiting process in the manual TO THE LETTER and 

beyond since the oil has long since turned to hard grease.  Particularly 

true for the carburettor but applies to everthing they list in the manual.

Once you get serious and spend a few days on due diligence it will start and 

run like a top.   Do not mess with the point gap setting.  The factory will 

have set these

at exactly 0.3 mm (0.012").  Just make sure they are perfectly clean

Of course you have already confirmed that the carburetor ambient air tube in 

the carb. throat is not blocked.

Cheers;

Walt

--

wlannon(at)shaw.ca
Guest

Posted: Thu May 31, 2018 6:28 pm Post subject: Chinese rebuild engine

--

ldakos(at)bigpond.net.au
Guest

Posted: Fri Jun 01, 2018 12:53 am Post subject: Chinese rebuild engine

Just a question what about the fuel pump?



--

Flibob

Joined: 25 Jun 2014
Posts: 28
Location: Indiana

Posted: Fri Jun 01, 2018 3:09 am Post subject: Chinese rebuild engine

Lou, I replaced the new fuel pump with the pump off the old working engine no effect.



GiddyUp,



Bob



On Jun 1, 2018, at 4:53 AM, Lou Dakos <ldakos(at)bigpond.net.au> wrote:






Just a question what about the fuel pump?



--

Clouddog

Joined: 02 Jun 2016
Posts: 119
Location: Lebanon, TN

Posted: Fri Jun 01, 2018 5:05 am Post subject: Chinese rebuild engine

Is there any possible way the mixture control can be installed  backwards or it has something to do with the mixture in some way? Just a stupid thought. Heck, push the mixture lever full forward and see what happens. I know, dumb idea and impossible to rig backwards.



On Fri, Jun 1, 2018, 6:14 AM Bob Graves <flibob(at)att.net (flibob(at)att.net)> wrote:



[quote]--> Yak-List message posted by: Bob Graves <flibob(at)att.net (flibob(at)att.net)>

 

 Lou, I replaced the new fuel pump with the pump off the old working engine no effect.

 

 GiddyUp,

 

 Bob

 

 On Jun 1, 2018, at 4:53 AM, Lou Dakos <ldakos(at)bigpond.net.au (ldakos(at)bigpond.net.au)> wrote:

 

 --> Yak-List message posted by: "Lou  Dakos" <ldakos(at)bigpond.net.au (ldakos(at)bigpond.net.au)>

 

 Just a question what about the fuel pump?

 

 --

mark.bitterlich(at)navy.m
Guest

Posted: Fri Jun 01, 2018 7:24 am Post subject: Chinese rebuild engine

It might be worthwhile to pull the fuel line off the carb and then crank the engine to see what kind of flow you get out of the line/hose.   If you have a clog or flow inhibition in any of the fuel filters or fuel lines, you will still get good pressure indications if there is even the most tiny of openings.  It appears clear that when the engine gets fuel from prime, it runs.  Also be careful to check that the return line from the carb back to the tank (if the CJ has one, I am not sure) because if that line is clogged, the carb will also not operate correctly.  Since the carb and fuel pump have been replaced, fuel flow (not pressure but flow) seems to be highly suspect.



Mark

--

Flibob

Joined: 25 Jun 2014
Posts: 28
Location: Indiana

Posted: Fri Jun 01, 2018 8:10 am Post subject: Chinese rebuild engine

Thanks Mark 



Sent from my iPhone



[quote] On Jun 1, 2018, at 11:24 AM, Bitterlich, Mark G CIV NAVAIR, WD <mark.bitterlich(at)navy.mil> wrote:

 

 

 

 It might be worthwhile to pull the fuel line off the carb and then crank the engine to see what kind of flow you get out of the line/hose.   If you have a clog or flow inhibition in any of the fuel filters or fuel lines, you will still get good pressure indications if there is even the most tiny of openings.  It appears clear that when the engine gets fuel from prime, it runs.  Also be careful to check that the return line from the carb back to the tank (if the CJ has one, I am not sure) because if that line is clogged, the carb will also not operate correctly.  Since the carb and fuel pump have been replaced, fuel flow (not pressure but flow) seems to be highly suspect.

 

 Mark

 

 

 --

Flibob

Joined: 25 Jun 2014
Posts: 28
Location: Indiana

Posted: Sat Jun 02, 2018 1:12 pm Post subject: Re: Chinese rebuild engine

Still working on this engine. Starts but won't run unless 1. Throttle is pumped constantly or 2 wobble is pumped or 3 primer is pumped.  Any of which will keep engine running at 1500 +\_.  



I have taken the carberater and fuel pump off running engine with no effect.  Also cleaned points in both mags. 



Any ideas?

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