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Viperdoc

Joined: 19 Apr 2014
Posts: 484
Location: 08A

Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2019 6:02 am Post subject: Covering Ailerons of YAK

Anybody done their on fabric on the YAK or CJ?

Doc



Sent from my iPad

_________________
Viperdoc

wlannon(at)shaw.ca
Guest

Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2019 10:02 am Post subject: Covering Ailerons of YAK

Do yourself a huge favor Doc.  Hire a pro.



Cheers;

Walt

--

cjpilot710(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2019 6:28 pm Post subject: Covering Ailerons of YAK

I did.  Its been many years ago.  Its pretty simple.  Simply follow the instruction of the system (I used Stits) that you choose..  The EAA has a good instruction book that gives the general practices and techniques.  You're a doc so stitching up fabric is sort of like stitching up skin.   

 

  I've done flight controls for a TBM,  two Champs (the whole airplane) and other stuff.  You can get all the materials and tools from Aircraft Spruce.  You don't have to worry about the old process using cotton, nitrate and buttrate dopes anymore.  The buzz they gave wasn't worth the terrible hangover the next morning.  Really bad.  But still stay well ventilated.

  

 

  Jim "Pappy" Goolsby

  

 

  

 

 

  --

Viperdoc

Joined: 19 Apr 2014
Posts: 484
Location: 08A

Posted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 6:43 pm Post subject: Covering Ailerons of YAK

To late Walt. I have one Aileron left to cover. 🤪

Doc



Sent from my iPad



[quote] On Mar 29, 2019, at 12:57 PM, Walter Lannon <wlannon(at)shaw.ca> wrote:

 

 

 

 Do yourself a huge favor Doc.  Hire a pro.

 

 Cheers;

 Walt

 

 

 --

_________________
Viperdoc

wlannon(at)shaw.ca
Guest

Posted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 7:47 pm Post subject: Covering Ailerons of YAK

That's great Doc.  Hope it all works out well for you.



Walt



--

Viperdoc

Joined: 19 Apr 2014
Posts: 484
Location: 08A

Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2019 5:12 am Post subject: Covering Ailerons of YAK

Walt,

Have had a great deal of help from 3 EAA gurus on stick and fabric airplanes. A lot of tricks learned from those 3. 

It is a good thing I undertook this project. There were three cracked ribs along with the trailing edge that were almost completely broken through. The two worst were where the trim tab mounted. I now know why I had a ratcheting right snap roll. 

To stiffen it some RU Afro engineer put a strip of 1/8 inch x 1 inch flat plate steel  1/2 of the length of the trailing edge. None of that mod was found in the right aileron. 

It was a good thing I tore it down. That one was about to  test my piloting skills. 

Doc



Sent from my iPad



[quote] On Mar 30, 2019, at 10:47 PM, Walter Lannon <wlannon(at)shaw.ca> wrote:

 

 

 

 That's great Doc.  Hope it all works out well for you.

 

 Walt

 

 --

_________________
Viperdoc

Viperdoc

Joined: 19 Apr 2014
Posts: 484
Location: 08A

Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2019 5:28 am Post subject: Covering Ailerons of YAK

Walt,

This is a pics of my rudder getting the MEK wipe down before applying poly spray. My tail feathers are poly sprayed now hanging on a rack in my hanger awaiting the fourth coat of poly spray. Then I will paint them. ( with the help of my EAA gurus). 😜🥴

Sent from my iPad



[quote] On Mar 30, 2019, at 10:47 PM, Walter Lannon <wlannon(at)shaw.ca> wrote:

 

 

 

 That's great Doc.  Hope it all works out well for you.

 

 Walt

 

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Viperdoc

stephen.hayne

Joined: 01 Nov 2013
Posts: 59
Location: United States

Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2019 7:06 pm Post subject: Re: Covering Ailerons of YAK

I had never done this before, and I did mine with the oversight of an EAA guru too.  It was so cool to learn how to do this!



I could have done them better, but hey, 100 hours and they still look good.  I also had a cracked trailing edge that I fixed.  Here is a link to my "New Fabric" album...



https://photos.app.goo.gl/AnatC9pxLqJFNSxE9

_________________
-
Stephen Hayne, Cyber Security Consultant, Professor Emeritus (retired)
443LM Nanchang CJA
http://selfsynchronize.com/hayne/plane/cj6.asp

draftsjust417(at)gmail.co
Guest

Posted: Mon Apr 01, 2019 5:49 am Post subject: Covering Ailerons of YAK

Wow, pix look great!How long did you invest in this project?

Just curious---

Justin

N280NC

On Sun, Mar 31, 2019 at 11:11 PM stephen.hayne <stephen.hayne(at)gmail.com (stephen.hayne(at)gmail.com)> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  --> Yak-List message posted by: "stephen.hayne" <stephen.hayne(at)gmail.com (stephen.hayne(at)gmail.com)>

 

 I had never done this before, and I did mine with the oversight of an EAA guru too.  It was so cool to learn how to do this!

 

 I could have done them better, but hey, 100 hours and they still look good.  I also had a cracked trailing edge that I fixed.  Here is a link to my "New Fabric" album...

 

 https://photos.app.goo.gl/AnatC9pxLqJFNSxE9

 

 --------

 -

 Dr. Stephen C. Hayne, Professor, CIS, Colorado State University

 666CJA 

  http://selfsynchronize.com/hayne/plane/cj6.asp

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=488391#488391

 

 

 

 

 

 

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dougsappllc(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Apr 01, 2019 8:21 am Post subject: Covering Ailerons of YAK

Steven,I noted that you repaired the damaged trailing edge of your rudder.  Should you have the need for this type of repair in the future, note that we carry this trailing edge in stock.  Good looking job!!

Best,

Doug

On Sun, Mar 31, 2019 at 8:11 PM stephen.hayne <stephen.hayne(at)gmail.com (stephen.hayne(at)gmail.com)> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  --> Yak-List message posted by: "stephen.hayne" <stephen.hayne(at)gmail.com (stephen.hayne(at)gmail.com)>

 

 I had never done this before, and I did mine with the oversight of an EAA guru too.  It was so cool to learn how to do this!

 

 I could have done them better, but hey, 100 hours and they still look good.  I also had a cracked trailing edge that I fixed.  Here is a link to my "New Fabric" album...

 

 https://photos.app.goo.gl/AnatC9pxLqJFNSxE9

 

 --------

 -

 Dr. Stephen C. Hayne, Professor, CIS, Colorado State University

 666CJA 

  http://selfsynchronize.com/hayne/plane/cj6.asp

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=488391#488391

 

 

 

 

 

 

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 List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List

 ===========

  FORUMS -

 eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com

 ===========

 WIKI -

 errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com

 ===========

 b Site -

           -Matt Dralle, List Admin.

 rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution

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Viperdoc

Joined: 19 Apr 2014
Posts: 484
Location: 08A

Posted: Mon Apr 01, 2019 2:49 pm Post subject: Covering Ailerons of YAK

Sweet!

Doc



Sent from my iPad



 	  Quote: 	
		   On Mar 31, 2019, at 10:06 PM, stephen.hayne <stephen.hayne(at)gmail.com> wrote:

 

 

 

 I had never done this before, and I did mine with the oversight of an EAA guru too.  It was so cool to learn how to do this!

 

 I could have done them better, but hey, 100 hours and they still look good.  I also had a cracked trailing edge that I fixed.  Here is a link to my "New Fabric" album...

 

 https://photos.app.goo.gl/AnatC9pxLqJFNSxE9

 

 --------

 -

 Dr. Stephen C. Hayne, Professor, CIS, Colorado State University

 666CJA 

 http://selfsynchronize.com/hayne/plane/cj6.asp

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=488391#488391

_________________
Viperdoc

stephen.hayne

Joined: 01 Nov 2013
Posts: 59
Location: United States

Posted: Tue Apr 09, 2019 7:31 pm Post subject: Re: Covering Ailerons of YAK

 	  draftsjust417(at)gmail.co wrote: 	
		  Wow, pix look great!How long did you invest in this project?

	


Hey - thanks.  IIRC, took me a month or so in the summer, working fairly sporadically while waiting for things to dry/cure, get the correct color shade for final coat, etc.



One thing I wish I had paid more attention to, is getting the tape to settle "down" over or into the rib lacing/sewing "channel".  Much of it has a bit of a bubble the channel.  It is well secured, but not beautifully level as some other work I have seen.  Next time... !!

_________________
-
Stephen Hayne, Cyber Security Consultant, Professor Emeritus (retired)
443LM Nanchang CJA
http://selfsynchronize.com/hayne/plane/cj6.asp

Rich Langer

Joined: 10 Apr 2007
Posts: 26
Location: Florida

Posted: Thu Nov 28, 2019 8:12 am Post subject: Re: Covering Ailerons of YAK

Stephen , I am recovering my flight controls and I would like to know how you did the stitching. We can not figure out how the chinese got the knots tied after the fabric was put on. See pictures attached.



Also what weight fabric did you use. Thanks.



Rich

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stephen.hayne

Joined: 01 Nov 2013
Posts: 59
Location: United States

Posted: Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:31 am Post subject: Re: Covering Ailerons of YAK

 	  draftsjust417(at)gmail.co wrote: 	
		  Wow, pix look great!How long did you invest in this project?

Just curious---



Justin

N280NC

	


Sorry to take so long to reply, I missed your question.  The whole airplane re-assembly and refurbish (from pieces!) took about 4.5 years, of part time work.  The web link below shows some pics trailering it to flying it...



For the recover, I used Poly-Fiber medium fabric and Stits P103 tapes.  As far as stitching, my faint memory is that I would run a up/down loop through a couple holes, tie it off really close to a hole, and then repeat in such a way that as I was pulling the next stitch, if I pulled a little bit "taught", I could pull the knot under/through the hole and everything would tighten up... hard to explain.  I might have a document/image of the stitching process somewhere.  I will look in the fabric box and see if it is tucked in there with the Poly-Fiber instruction booklet.

_________________
-
Stephen Hayne, Cyber Security Consultant, Professor Emeritus (retired)
443LM Nanchang CJA
http://selfsynchronize.com/hayne/plane/cj6.asp

A35plt

Joined: 14 Aug 2013
Posts: 9
Location: Wiesbaden, Germany

Posted: Fri Nov 29, 2019 6:42 pm Post subject: Re: Covering Ailerons of YAK

IIRC the book on doing Poly Fiber covering showed exactly how to tie the knot with pictures and diagrams. I don't remember any substantial difference in the knot used by Poly Fiber vs. The Chinese knot. When done correctly the  knot will be pulled under the surface of the fabric when tightened leaving a smooth finish. 

Experimenting with the Poly Fiber process pays good dividends before doing it for real. I don't remember the name of the pink sealer used (poly coat?) but thinning it out and spraying it on will result in much nicer looking fabric that doesn't need to be sanded versus brushing it on. 

Fabric work is fun!  -Robert Starnes  CJ-6A N8016Q

Viperdoc

Joined: 19 Apr 2014
Posts: 484
Location: 08A

Posted: Sat Nov 30, 2019 11:21 am Post subject: Covering Ailerons of YAK

Rich, 

I know you did not. I use the Stits method Seine knot. Placed at 2 cm ~ 1 inch it is supposed to good for 220 kts. I never could get the RU method to cinch up. When I pulled the cotton of my controls they had some loose strands. With a knot at every loop it’s not going balloon. 



Sent from my iPad



 	  Quote: 	
		   On Nov 28, 2019, at 10:19 AM, Rich Langer <rlanger2(at)comcast.net> wrote:

 

 

 

 Stephen , I am recovering my flight controls and I would like to know how you did the stitching. We can not figure out how the chinese got the knots tied after the fabric was put on. See pictures attached.

 

 Also what weight fabric did you use. Thanks.

 

 Rich

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=493592#493592

 

 

 

 

 Attachments: 

 

 http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_20191128_075054_177.jpg

 http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_20191128_075030_104.jpg

 

 

 

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Viperdoc

Rich Langer

Joined: 10 Apr 2007
Posts: 26
Location: Florida

Posted: Sun Dec 01, 2019 5:31 am Post subject: Re: Covering Ailerons of YAK

Thanks to Stephen, Robert and Doc for your advice and pictures.



 Doc, what do you mean by the RU method? I have the PolyFiber book and am trying to understand the Seine knot. I will need lots of practice. 



Robert, the spray on is called PolyBrush. I will keep this thread updated as to my progress.

GeorgeCoy

Joined: 02 Dec 2010
Posts: 310

Posted: Sun Dec 01, 2019 6:51 am Post subject: Covering Ailerons of YAK

Attached is a diagram of the "Russian" stitching sketched by non-other than

Jill when she worked for us in the late 1990's



George Coy



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Viperdoc

Joined: 19 Apr 2014
Posts: 484
Location: 08A

Posted: Sun Dec 01, 2019 9:34 pm Post subject: Covering Ailerons of YAK

Rich, 

Russian method. 

Do not dispose of the foam plugs that form the control push rod dams. Can not use the foam with MEK because it dissolves them. However you can use them to make fiber glass molds. I unfortunately threw mine away by mistake so I’m experimenting with forms to lay up fiber glass on.

Do a Stits Covering search on YouTube. Their young rep at does a great job of teach you with her rabbit running for the hole how to do the seine knot. 

The STITS Covering Book leaves something to be desired. After watching the video you will be doing seine knots in your sleep.

Sent from my iPad



 	  Quote: 	
		   On Dec 1, 2019, at 7:37 AM, Rich Langer <rlanger2(at)comcast.net> wrote:

 

 

 

 Thanks to Stephen, Robert and Doc for your advice and pictures.

 

 Doc, what do you mean by the RU method? I have the PolyFiber book and am trying to understand the Seine knot. I will need lots of practice. 

 

 Robert, the spray on is called PolyBrush. I will keep this thread updated as to my progress.

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=493698#493698

_________________
Viperdoc

Rich Langer

Joined: 10 Apr 2007
Posts: 26
Location: Florida

Posted: Thu Dec 26, 2019 7:08 am Post subject: Re: Covering Ailerons of YAK

Doc, thanks for the advice about the foam plugs. And thanks to George Coy for sending the stitching diagram. Everyone has been a great help.



Rich

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