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wdaniell.longport(at)gmai
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 Posted: Mon Oct 12, 2020 10:08 am Post subject: In line fuseholder |
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I have a Z 16 which includes the fusible link between the capacitor and the starter contactor. However in a recent thread I saw that the 16 awg fuselink must be 8 inches - mine is about 4 inches. Also In the same thread I understood that fuselink could be replaced with a time delay fuse.
Can I replace the 16awg fuselink with a 30A time delay maxi fuse?
thanks
Will
William Daniell
LONGPORT
+1 786 878 0246
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nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect
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| Posted: Mon Oct 12, 2020 11:20 am Post subject: In line fuseholder |
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At 01:16 PM 10/12/2020, you wrote:
| Quote: | I have a Z 16 which includes the fusible link between the capacitor and the starter contactor.Â
However in a recent thread I saw that the 16 awg fuselink must be 8 inches - mine is about 4 inches. |
Throw a loop in it.
| Quote: | |  Also In the same thread I understood that fuselink could be replaced with a time delay fuse.Can I replace the 16awg fuselink with a 30A time delay maxi fuse? |
The MAX series are not especially 'time delay'
but yes, you can use that device in lieu of
fuselink wire.
Bob . . .
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user9253
Joined: 28 Mar 2008
Posts: 1921
Location: Riley TWP Michigan
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| Posted: Mon Oct 12, 2020 3:40 pm Post subject: Re: In line fuseholder |
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500 RV-12s are flying. They all have a 30 amp ATO fuse in series with the charging system. The fuse is not time delay.
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rparigoris
Joined: 24 Nov 2009
Posts: 792
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wdaniell.longport(at)gmai
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| Posted: Tue Oct 13, 2020 3:41 am Post subject: In line fuseholder |
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Interesting that the ato fuse life is affected by ambient temperature.  So if the fuse is in the engine bay the fuse life is shorter than if it's in the cockpit? And likewise shorter in miami than in anchorage?
William Daniell
+1 786 878 0246
On Mon, Oct 12, 2020, 22:56 rparigoris <rparigor(at)hotmail.com (rparigor(at)hotmail.com)> wrote:
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wdaniell.longport(at)gmai
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| Posted: Tue Oct 13, 2020 3:46 am Post subject: In line fuseholder |
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Joe thanks.Simple is normally better. And you can easily find a replacement.
I have ato fuses for the rest of the system.
William Daniell
+1 786 878 0246
On Mon, Oct 12, 2020, 19:50 user9253 <fransew(at)gmail.com (fransew(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "user9253" <fransew(at)gmail.com (fransew(at)gmail.com)>
500 RV-12s are flying. They all have a 30 amp ATO fuse in series with the charging system. The fuse is not time delay.
--------
Joe Gores
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=498787#498787
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nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect
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| Posted: Tue Oct 13, 2020 5:23 am Post subject: In line fuseholder |
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At 09:47 PM 10/12/2020, you wrote:
| Quote: | --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "rparigoris" <rparigor(at)hotmail.com>
Hi William
Here's comparison for ATO, MIDI, MAXI and ANL. ANL sure does take a long time to melt. |
That's because the ANL is not a fuse, it's
a fault current limiter intended for used
in power distribution systems with
lower-energy protections downstream. I.e.
protection of a long feed to a bus structure.
Same thing with fusible links. These devices
are expected to operate on occurrence of a
hard fault on the distribution system . . .
not on a protected feeder to an appliance.
Bob . . .
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Voyager
Joined: 30 Jun 2020
Posts: 77
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| Posted: Tue Oct 13, 2020 6:51 am Post subject: In line fuseholder |
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As I read it, they were talking about life at overload conditions, not general life. Almost all things have shorter lives at elevated temps though, but I doubt you will see a significant difference in general fuse life between Miami and Anchorage. However, if a fuse is located in a hot environment, then it does need to be rated properly for the current it needs to carry and not carry.
A fuse is a thermal device. All it knows is that it should melt a a certain temperature. It doesn’t much matter when you heat it resistively with electric current or heat it with a torch. Heat is heat.
Sent from my iPad
| Quote: | On Oct 13, 2020, at 7:48 AM, William Daniell <wdaniell.longport(at)gmail.com> wrote:
Interesting that the ato fuse life is affected by ambient temperature. So if the fuse is in the engine bay the fuse life is shorter than if it's in the cockpit? And likewise shorter in miami than in anchorage?
William Daniell
+1 786 878 0246
On Mon, Oct 12, 2020, 22:56 rparigoris <rparigor(at)hotmail.com (rparigor(at)hotmail.com)> wrote:
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nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect
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| Posted: Tue Oct 13, 2020 2:14 pm Post subject: In line fuseholder |
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At 06:40 AM 10/13/2020, you wrote:
| Quote: | | Interesting that the ato fuse life is affected by ambient temperature.  So if the fuse is in the engine bay the fuse life is shorter than if it's in the cockpit? And likewise shorter in miami than in anchorage? |
All protection technologies function
by 'melting' should be de-rated by a
significant factor of it's rated current
to compensate for two effects. One is
ambient temperature . . . just like wire
insulation, elevated ambient depresses
temperature rise headroom. See
https://tinyurl.com/yxdovxhj
The second effect is not so well understood
but it can be equally significant: Any
device that depends on temperature to
melt can be 'hammered' by a series of
transient events that push the fusible
element close to but just short of melting.
Common examples of transient inrush
currents include incandescent landing lights, motors,
heated pitot tubes, etc.
Fuses sized for nominal running currents
would fail inexplicably after many operating
hours. The fuses were 'hammered' over a
series of inrush events that depressed
their T=K*I(squared)R numbers . . .
I forget which supplier document cites
it but at least one manufacturer recommends that
small fuses not be nominally loaded to more than 70
percent of rating. They might need further
de-rating due to elevated ambient temperatures.
Just keep in mind that fuses protect wires.
Wires are sized conservatively for acceptable
temperature rises and voltage drops. A builder
on this forum once raised the question about
wiring the majority of low current feeders
with 18 or 20 AWG wire (I think he got a
really good deal on a big spool of the
stuff) and then protecting all the feeders
at 10A.
Nothing at all wrong with that . . . and
he sure didn't have to fuss over procurement
and circuit sizing.
ANL, MANL, fusible links, and similar
products are already de-rated by 50 percent
or more. An ANL35 will carry 80A indefinitely
at room temperature.
Bob . . .
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nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect
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| Posted: Tue Oct 13, 2020 7:14 pm Post subject: In line fuseholder |
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| Quote: |
All protection technologies THAT function
by 'melting' should be de-rated by a
significant factor of it's rated current
to compensate for two effects: |
<snip>
Protection technologies that function
by 'bending' of a bi-metal spring are
not subject to 'hammering' but their
calibration is still influenced by ambient
temperature.
Getting to the original question, elevated
temperature combined with hammering
could appear to shorten the life of
a fuse. When in doubt for fuses ahead
of fire wall, design rules call for
conservative de-rating. If you have
a fuse blowing for non-obvious reasons
after significant service in a high
temperature environment, going up
one step in fuse rating is a good fix
that does not increase risk.
Bob . . .
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