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lcottrell

Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 1494
Location: Jordan Valley, Or

Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2006 7:23 pm Post subject: EIS

Just a bit of useful information regarding EIS and capacitance  senders. I bought a new EIS model 2000 for 2 stroke engines when I began the  rebuild on my Firestar. The main reason that I went with the EIS is that the new  pod from TNK is shaped different, longer and more streamlined, and my analog  gages were not going in there like I would have liked. Plus I had intended to  use a 503 motor with dual EGT and CHT senders. My gages were for only one of  each. So for me the cost was worth it. Plus when I talked with the gal at Grand  Rapids Tech she informed me that I could get a remote to do the changes in the  display rather than have to lean forward or as Ralph said, carry a big stick. So  I got a stick grip with five buttons on it, which I configured to the EIS. Works  great! Then Boyd tells me that he is using his EIS to monitor his fuel. So I  talk to the gal at GRT and she walks me through the set up for the fuel. Last  year my fuel gages had quit reading my fuel levels. I "thought" that it was the  senders that had malfunctioned, so I bought two new ones (at) $95 each. They didn't  work at all, so it was going to be the gages that needed to be replaced this  time. I really did not like that set up because I had to run the fuel lines to a  selector valve up to the front where I could monitor them. That is quite a long  run, requiring a facet fuel pump to make sure that the gas got back up to the  motor. 

  

 Now the way that it is set up is that both tanks are plumbed  together, with the facet pump next in line then through a "Heffner" gascolater  to a filter then to the pulse pump and the engine. The EIS AUX line reads the  capacitance sender and at full (10gal) shows 56 on my display. 8 gals is 50, 6  is 35, 4 is 20 and 2 gals is 6. I have the alarm set to go off at 9 which  means that I have 3 gal of usable gas. I took the top of tank pickup tubes out  and installed a weighted filter on the ends of the pickup tubes via some fuel  line. This is so that I use all the gas that I have available. I had  previously raised the tubes up off the bottom just as a precaution to prevent  picking up any water or garbage that might have accumulated on the bottom of the  tanks. With the gascolator I can drain all that out and it will not be a  factor. 

  

 I did not realize that the EIS would do this when I bought it.  Thanks Boyd! One of the factors that cause me the greatest unease when I fly  here is how much fuel I have. Every place can be hazardous to landing here, and  it is a looooooooooong way to more fuel.

 Larry, Or

    [quote][b]

lcottrell

Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 1494
Location: Jordan Valley, Or

Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 10:10 am Post subject: eis

I forgot to mention in my earlier post about the fuel  capacitance sender. EIS sells the Princeton model that measures in increments  that are comparable to gallons. The model of sender that I now  have, four  of, is the Westach. The only requirement is that the output is 5 volts and they  do that. I do not find that the differences in numbers that confusing. The  important part to me is that the rascal has a flashing red light right in front  of my eyes that I cannot forget or ignore. 

 Larry, Oregon

    [quote][b]

Ralph Hoover

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 206
Location: Central Ohio

Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 11:10 am Post subject: Re: EIS

Larry, I am amazed that they didn't tell  you that part. THey also must have failed to inform you of the gun locate point system imbeded in the master chip, nor the "ON Service" internal phone chip. 



Man, People are falling down at the job out there.

Larry, there are 38 million additional things these chips can do that they haven't found uses for. Give them time. 



I know they didn't tell you about the built in Kolb "Yellper" device, which advises you via horn device when you want to "pull back stick" for your flair.



That was an option on my gauges.



Just kidding. 

DO not archive.



Ohio Ralph

lcottrell

Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 1494
Location: Jordan Valley, Or

Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 11:44 am Post subject: EIS

I suppose that they also included the "stick" that you use to change your 

display screens as well? Was it Hickory or perhaps "Piss Fir Pine"? 

Couldn't resist!

Larry, Oregon



---

Ralph Hoover

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 206
Location: Central Ohio

Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 12:31 pm Post subject: Re: EIS

Thank you Larry for noting that. The stick, in staying with high tech, whilst also applying light weight is made of 1/4" diameter Poly / Kevlar. It will handle 6,000 pounds end loading (it could hold a car in the air if it were placed on c.g.), while weighing only 3.7 oz. I added little plastic red pointer ends that weigh a bit more but the overall weight is 5.0 oz.



My problem is reaching to get it and then "pointing it onto (at) the buttons. I asked the manufacturer to employ a remote switch (say on the stick, or near the throttle)  with momentary contact in order to "reset" the "flashing, blinking, blinking, flashing" lights used as warning. I know enough about chip tech to say that they have that already built in, but haven't learned to access it or applied the necessary software patch. It really is the Achilles' heel to the glass gauges that I have.



If any one would want to buy these new, tell them that they need to fix that problem. We "STRAP' Ourselves in and we cant reach the &^%&^% buttons!



The company that sells them is ;



Stratomaster through Sport Flying Shop. Maybe if enough people want this corrected, they will fix it and then the instrument is "unbeatable"!



Ohio Ralph



Do not archive!

Possum

Joined: 12 Jan 2006
Posts: 112
Location: Georgia

Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 6:23 pm Post subject: EIS

At 04:31 PM 10/4/2006, you wrote:

 >--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ralph Hoover" <flht99reh(at)Columbus.rr.com (flht99reh(at)Columbus.rr.com)>

 >

 >

 >My problem is reaching to get it and then "pointing it onto (at) the 

 >buttons. I asked the manufacturer to employ a remote switch (say on 

 >the stick, or near the throttle)  with momentary contact in order to 

 >"reset" the "flashing, blinking, blinking, flashing" lights used as 

 >warning. I know enough about chip tech to say that they have that 

 >already built in, but haven't learned to access it or applied the 

 >necessary software patch. It really is the Achilles' heel to the 

 >glass gauges that I have.

 

 

 Here's what he remote buttons look like (they're are "3" - one under 

 the helmet plug).

 Just for those that don't know what the remote buttons on the EIS 

 system looks like.

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WillUribe(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 8:19 pm Post subject: EIS

At 04:31 PM 10/4/2006, you wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  --> Kolb-List message posted  by: "Ralph Hoover" <flht99reh(at)Columbus.rr.com (flht99reh(at)Columbus.rr.com)>

My  problem is reaching to get it and then "pointing it onto (at) the  

buttons. I asked the manufacturer to employ a remote switch (say on  

the stick, or near the throttle) with momentary contact in order to  

"reset" the "flashing, blinking, blinking, flashing" lights used as  

warning. I know enough about chip tech to say that they have that  

already built in, but haven't learned to access it or applied the  

necessary software patch. It really is the Achilles' heel to the  

glass gauges that I have.    

  
	


 I installed the remote switches under the seat pan so all I do is reach  down and push the corresponding button.

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lcottrell

Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 1494
Location: Jordan Valley, Or

Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 8:48 pm Post subject: EIS

Or there is this method of mounting the eis  buttons.

 Larry, Oregon

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Richard Pike

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 1671
Location: Blountville, Tennessee

Posted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 3:09 am Post subject: EIS

We put all the switches in a plastic box from Radio Shack and attached it  to the side of the FSII fuselage. Worked pretty easy, and easy to reach.

  

 Richard Pike

 MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)

  

 http://www.bcchapel.org/pages/0003/Panel%20Switches.html

  [quote][b]

_________________
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0

Forgiving is tough, being forgiven is wonderful, and God's grace really is amazing.

Ralph Hoover

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 206
Location: Central Ohio

Posted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 6:20 am Post subject: Re: EIS

"EIS sells the Princeton model" which offers the addition of the remote switch.



Well Larry, My glass gauges are from the "Harvard model" and "included the stick!

QUOTES:



"I installed the remote switches under the seat pan so all I do is reach down and push the corresponding button. "



"We put all the switches in a plastic box from Radio Shack and attached it to the side of the FSII fuselage. Worked pretty easy, and easy to reach."



"Here's what he remote buttons look like (they're are "3" - one under 

the helmet plug). 

Just for those that don't know what the remote buttons on the EIS 

system looks like."

And finally, from Larry:



"I suppose that they also included the "stick" that you use to change your 

display screens as well? Was it Hickory or perhaps "Piss Fir Pine"?  

Couldn't resist! 

Larry, Oregon "



And you guys thought I was crazy using a stick! No wires, little additional weight, no fancy mountings, least cost, quite a conversation piece, can be used on any model aircraft, no instructions needed, simple to install, easly removable and reparability is unimportant.



DON'T LEAVE HOME WITHOUT "the stick"!



Ohio Ralph



Do not archive, unless you have the &*%&^% gauges I have!

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 6:38 am Post subject: EIS

|

| DON'T LEAVE HOME WITHOUT "the stick"!

|

| Ohio Ralph

Ralph:



The stick might become a little distracting, in addition to that damn 

flashing light, when you are trying to fly a little airplane, 

especially at the worst possible time when you are at your busiest to 

keep it flying.



IMHO controls, switches, etc., need to be in a place where the hands 

and/or eyes can find and operate them naturally without distraction 

from flying the aircraft.



Take care,



john h

mkIII

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

Ralph Hoover

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 206
Location: Central Ohio

Posted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 7:55 am Post subject: Re: EIS

John, No truer words were ever spoken. It is extreemly distracting. A major flau' in an otherwise superior product (over standard gauges).



I really thought that I needed "every" avalaible gadget to make flying within my own abilities better. Not! As I am learning more and getting more comfortable with looking around, not driving by the gauges, etc. I am begining to see that some is necessary, more is a nusance, less is better. They were calling me "Go, Go Gadget", for a while at the hanger!



I deserved it. I am in a hurry to absorb more and more. One doesn't learn to fly in a hurry unless they are landing for the first time by themselves. Learning to fly is a lot like trying to understand the Bible. It ain't no "story" book, its a "lifes operational manual". Flying requires a great deal of patients. Something I have, in the past had little "time" for. I am learning to relax and the blinking light in the forgorund only causes me to examine that I am still within the parameters.



Thanks John.



Ohio Ralph

Michael Sharp

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 118
Location: Oak Grove, MO (Kansas City)

Posted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 9:16 am Post subject: EIS

_________________
The air up there in the clouds is very pure and fine...And why shouldn't it be?-
--It is the same the angels breathe.
Mark Twain,
Roughing it' 1886

Mike

Ralph Hoover

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 206
Location: Central Ohio

Posted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 2:47 pm Post subject: Re: EIS

Michael, That was profound! I have heard the addage "Always listen to a man of few words". But really Michael, unlike the great guru that you appear, what was it you said?



What, slip of the send finger. I've had that before. Talk to me brother. 



I wait with baited breath. Here in Ohio as Ralph.

Michael Sharp

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 118
Location: Oak Grove, MO (Kansas City)

Posted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 3:03 pm Post subject: EIS

Wow that was weird!!!

   

  My statement was that I have an Infinity Stick grip which has a "cooley hat" switch on top.  I wired the EIS buttons to it and with just a flick of the thumb I can toggle all over the place... 

   

  I enjoy seeing the different ways that we figure out how to accomplish the goal.

   

  I also made a snooty remark to Lar that since he has had another mishap I may still beat him into the air... LOL

   

  Mike

  Mark III the real one no X  LOL

  Suzuki 1.3 4cyl



Ralph Hoover <flht99reh(at)columbus.rr.com> wrote:

  [quote]--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ralph Hoover" 



Michael, That was profound! I have heard the addage "Always listen to a man of few words". [quote][b]

_________________
The air up there in the clouds is very pure and fine...And why shouldn't it be?-
--It is the same the angels breathe.
Mark Twain,
Roughing it' 1886

Mike

Steven Green

Joined: 05 Feb 2006
Posts: 118

Posted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 4:38 pm Post subject: EIS

That light is one of the "shining" features of the EIS.  One glance at the

light and you know that no monitored engine parameter has exceeded its

limit.  That light will get your attention much quicker than the needle of

one of a half dozen gauges moving a radian or two.  And speeking from

experience, that flashing light was the last thing on my mind when the

engine went silent.



Steven Green

EIS with remote mounted switches



 	  Quote: 	
		   The stick might become a little distracting, in addition to that damn

 flashing light, when you are trying to fly a little airplane,

 especially at the worst possible time when you are at your busiest to

 keep it flying.

_________________
Steven Green

Ralph Hoover

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 206
Location: Central Ohio

Posted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 6:01 pm Post subject: Re: EIS and ramblimg

Steven Green said: "That light is one of the "shining" features of the EIS. One glance at the light and you know that no monitored engine parameter has exceeded its limit. That light will get your attention much quicker than the needle of one of a half dozen gauges moving a radian or two. And speeking from experience, that flashing light was the last thing on my mind when the engine went silent." 



Steven Green 

EIS with remote mounted switches 



And Steven, I have to agree and have both engine and flight "blinking lights".

I presume you were responding to John Hauck's message as follows:



"Ralph: 



The stick might become a little distracting, in addition to that damn  flashing light, when you are trying to fly a little airplane, especially at the worst possible time when you are at your busiest to keep it flying. 



IMHO controls, switches, etc., need to be in a place where the hands and/or eyes can find and operate them naturally without distraction  from flying the aircraft. 



Take care, 



john h"



Therefore, not speaking for John but clarifying my earlier statements regarding MY instruments NOT the EIS system, which is , as I understand specific to engine info. You have that ability, not even luxury (read this real close "Stratomaster"): There isn't any "remote" shut-off available to these glass gauges. Therefore, one has to douse the light from afar, in a Kolb, adding another "distraction" to the (as John stated) already stated in his words, while flying the aircraft. 



I will make an attempt to break the contact of the "light bulb", momentarily and see if that cancels out the continuation of the blinking. If so, I have added a new dimension to the Stratomaster gauges. If not, They have an issue to correct.



A reason that I may have the blinking, and probably should have been stated before to alleviate confusion, is because I have settable parameters on ALL information. Both from the engine and the aircraft. Therefore, a blinking light on the right on my instrument panel indicates a flight issue while on the left an engine issue. I have NEVER had a LEFT light blink. The right light may come from: settable ASI, (to include stall warning as well as approach to VNe) and low fuel.  I have at differing times had the opportunity to see the BLINKING LIGHT on each issue, including stall, after, or while landing. But again, I say never on the left light.



And I read what I believe Steven, your conveying in your message, â€œAnd speeking from experience, that flashing light was the last thing on my mind when the engine went silent.â€ 



And its because of that and many other things I have read here on the Kolb site,  I love referring back to Possums response to one post. In so many words, This is flying and dangerous. Without the dangerous, itâ€™s just another boring body flexure (my reanimation of what I read from what he wrote). What we do, is so on the edge in today's world, they couldnâ€™t fathom the experience from our perspective. With that â€œedgeâ€ comes additional responsibility. I really believe that  becoming comfortable while flying is asking for it. I know I am new to the flying experience, but I never want the edge to wear down to the point that its â€œcomfortableâ€. I see certain individuals on this site and the work they do now or have done in their life and I know why they need living on the edge of  the compass of life. John Hauck being one. Possum being another, and others of you , I know, though you may know that I know. 



I know the experience of driving at extreme speeds in a car. What we (all of you do, but donâ€™t realize it) is handle a dragster careening down a narrow track at 384 miles per hour in 6 seconds! You just have never experienced that dragster. But you continue to experience the adrenaline that they have for only a few seconds. Each of you have a gift, a travel, a trip that the world would die for in their â€œmundainessâ€ (Spell). All the money, neat cars trick stuff cant equate to what we get from flying. Imagine having so much money that you can buy a Cadillac Escalade  Pearlescent white paint pick-up truck with the 500 H.P. engine and your sitting in bumper to bumper traffic. All your money, all your power, and you are in â€œLINEâ€! 



Here I am with my Twinkie $8,000 aircraft maxing out at 80-85 MPH and going anywhere I want! How long before they want what we have if the knew what it was and how enjoyable? Soon, guys. Soon!



Enjoying here in Ohio the flying while I still can, Ralph

a58r(at)verizon.net
Guest

Posted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 7:38 pm Post subject: EIS

Ralph, Point?

regards,

Bob N.    FireFly 070 Old Kolb

http://www.angelfire.com/rpg/ronoy/

do not archive



 



 [quote][b]

Ralph Hoover

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 206
Location: Central Ohio

Posted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 5:02 am Post subject: Re: EIS

Bob N. Said:



"Ralph,?Point? 

regards, "

Bob, Sometimes like other, I just rant a bit. You know live life, then ya die, and that's all there is.



Actually it was somewhere in the middle of my rant, like some books of the past I read, that I was attempting to clarify that what John H. was referring to and what Steven G. what referring to were different from what I was dealing with. My blinking lights came from flight info as information. Where the EIS blinking came from engine which was more critical. Not only that but those with EIS  glass had a capability of a switch to stop the intermittent blinking which becomes annoying while one is, say landing. I do not have the ease of canceling the blinking, via remote switch, and that the annoying continues until I can reach the button with the stick. Even after the problem corrects (ASI drops or increases), my blinking light, blinks. 



Now I'm not inferring that the flight blinking is any less important that the engine blinking. Just that in my settings, being new to flying, I set them farther than they would need be set, thus allowing me the added grace to adjust to this new environment. The other side is that John is a long time flier with little need for "new fangled" stuff to do a job he has relied upon in the past to be done by good old mechanical gauges. John has little need for blinking and flashing lights. Therefore he was, I believe inferring to the "fact" that during critical times, one does not need the added confusion of one more thing to worry about. Johnâ€™s a man, I hole Iâ€™m not putting words into his mouth, that would need to see a â€œgained advantageâ€ over his present method, in order to change the way he is doing a job.



On the other hand, Steven was pointing out from his perspective the importance of the blinking and flashing light and the need to respond to them. I see both points and noted why I agreed with both, however, my situation was not so much with the warning the lights were supplying me, but the continuance of the warning after their information no longer applied to my situation. That was the clarification of the "inability" to easily stop the blinking and flashing.



I merely incorporated a capsulation of phrase from another Kolber, that of Possum, regarding the delicate nature of what we play with and the reason "most" of us play with it. I perhaps took a little liberty, in which I hope no one was offended, to give reason to the feelings we get from doing what most other individuals could never fathom. We know that our flying is different than the flying associated with the passengers concept of â€œridingâ€ in a 757. I wanted to add that flavor to my depiction. I also felt that, taking it a step further, and adding that no amount of money on the ground can provide the degree of excitement we feel in our little airplanes.



And Bob, everything has a point. Everything has a time, and everything has a reason, and a place, including humorous writings and ranting. I was once told by a valued school teacher that "if" what you say isn't understood by the listener, "you" not "they" are not communication correctly. 



Sorry Bob, that it didn't convey my intent from your perception.



I  also apologize to those that may not have read the above in my previous message.



Ralph, humbled again, and again here in Ohio.

George Myers

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 76
Location: San Marcos, Texas

Posted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 6:22 am Post subject: EIS

mea culpa,

mea culpa,

mea maxima culpa.

Amen



 

----

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