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100LL and TCP100LL and TCP

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MichaelGibbs(at)cox.net
Guest

Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 8:03 am Post subject: 100LL and TCP100LL and TCP

Noel sez:



 	  Quote: 	
		  The reasons for using 100 LL for Contis, Lycs and even P&W are well 

documented.... Your 912 is neither of those and while it can use 

100LL in small quantities extended use may damage your engine or 

shorten your TBO...


	


Baloney.  My 912S ran exclusively on 100LL and still does (in another 

airplane).  Many of the Rotax engines used by members of the Desert 

Fox squadron do as well.  No damage, no shortened life.



My next one will, too.  Unlike auto fuel, at least we know what's in 100LL.



Mike G.

N728KF

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dave

Joined: 22 Sep 2006
Posts: 1382

Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 8:42 am Post subject: 100LL and TCP100LL and TCP

Only  2 strokes get that issue with the lead.



Dave

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Float Flyr

Joined: 19 Jul 2006
Posts: 2704
Location: Campbellton, Newfoundland

Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 10:01 am Post subject: 100LL and TCP100LL and TCP

You left out the next line.... Do whatever the manufacturer says.



And yes just about the only fuel you can depend on is 100LL



BTW what kind of main bearings are in the 912??  



Noel



[quote] --

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_________________
Noel Loveys
Kitfox III-A
Aerocet 1100 Floats

eskflyer(at)lvcisp.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 4:29 pm Post subject: 100LL and TCP100LL and TCP

I  agree  I run my 582 on 100LL all the time and never a problem. I do make 

shure my egt's are right on and my water temp is around 170 all the time .

Have never seen any deposits on the crank bearings or ever had any issues 

with lead on the rings .

John Perry

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eskflyer(at)lvcisp.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 5:41 pm Post subject: 100LL and TCP100LL and TCP

My apologies do go to Roger Standley who asked for this, about a 912 . 

I replied about a 582 and 100LL



Fly safe

John Perry

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Float Flyr

Joined: 19 Jul 2006
Posts: 2704
Location: Campbellton, Newfoundland

Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 7:58 pm Post subject: 100LL and TCP100LL and TCP

John :



Just a few specific questions.  

Are you using the TCP or equivalent with the 100LL?  

How many hours have you been using the 100LL?( an approximation is good for

that)

How often do you change your plugs? 

Do you get much slag on the spark plugs?

Noel

Kitfox III-A

582UL "B"box

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Noel Loveys
Kitfox III-A
Aerocet 1100 Floats

eskflyer(at)lvcisp.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 9:12 pm Post subject: 100LL and TCP100LL and TCP

Noel

No I am not using TCP . Straight 100LL and never not any ever problems .327 

hours and going strong . Just changed plugs , all looked good but replaced 

anyway at 25 hours . I gap to .018   . No not much slag at all just the 

normal little bit of buildup   that any 2 stroke has .

     Jetting and EGT'S and Water temp are very important i believe to the 

proper care of the rotax and longevityof the engine .

Keep the EGT'S below 1175 never exceed this temp .1125 in normal flight . 

Water temp around 170-175 in flight  .

never exceed 2200 rpm before the temp reaches 140 stabilized after 

thermostat has opened . Keep air filter clean and oiled properly .

With the time on my engine now I would not be afraid to get in my bird and 

fly her to Alaska right now . Roughly 3500 miles one way . I did replace the 

piston pin's and needle bearings at 300 hours . They did not show any wear 

but that is a  weak spot on the 582 , the Needle bearings .

I hope this helps you .

I love my 582 and like the HP vs weight of bigger 4 strokes .



fly safe

John Perry

Kitfox 2 N718PD

Serial#718

582 c box

 	  Quote: 	
		  

 Just a few specific questions.

 Are you using the TCP or equivalent with the 100LL?

 How many hours have you been using the 100LL?( an approximation is good 

 for

 that)

 How often do you change your plugs?

 Do you get much slag on the spark plugs?

 Noel

 Kitfox III-A

 582UL "B"box

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dave

Joined: 22 Sep 2006
Posts: 1382

Posted: Thu Jan 18, 2007 4:12 am Post subject: 100LL and TCP100LL and TCP

I agree to not use 100LL on 2 strokes regularly. Occasionaly is not going to 

cause much concern.

This list is great for separating the facts from fiction.  And the guys who 

run hundreds of hours a year are solid proof of what works and what does 

not.  I used over 1300 US gals of Gas in One 582 last year alone and it was 

all regular pump gas. My plugs are at 122 hours now since July 2006 ands 

still going strong.



I have Met the owner of this site and attended his Rotax Class.  Highly 

creditable Rotax Guru.  AS a matter of Fact Daniel And Bob Robertson in 

Canada are the only 2 Rotax guys that have the respect from many.  They both 

run Rotax Shops and teach Rotax School .



Hope this helps you all in successful operations .

Dave



Here is some creditable info on 100LL and Rotax 2 strokes.

http://www.rotaxservice.com/rotax_tips/rotax_feed2.htm



Aviation Fuels



It is possible but not recommended to use 100LL AVGAS, since the the lead 

content will increase deposits in the combustion chamber and on crankshaft 

ball bearings, inducing premature wear. Its higher octane rating does not 

bring any significant advantage to the engine's operation.



Now for 4 strokes that same site tells about the same.



http://www.rotaxservice.com/rotax_tips/rotax_feed4.htm



Aviation Fuels



It is possible but not recommended to use 100LL AVGAS, since the the lead 

content is like cholesterol to your engine: it will accelerate wear on the 

valve seats, create deposits in the combustion chamber and sediments in the 

lubrication system and gearbox. Increased maintenance is necessary to 

compensate. Unlike "conventional" aircraft engines, lead is absolutely not 

essential to the proper lubrication and operation of a Rotax 4-stroke 

aircraft engine. The increased octane rating also has no marked advantage 

for the operation of your engine.



To be avoided:



  a.. "Regular" fuel except if used in the 912 A/F/UL and burned entirely on 

the day of purchase;

  b.. "Premium" fuel which is more than 3 weeks old

  c.. AVGAS except when the required automotive fuel is not available



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