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Limited Range

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Dennis.Kirby(at)kirtland.
Guest

Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 2:36 pm Post subject: Limited Range

Kolb Friends -



All the recent discussion on bigger fuel tanks for our Kolbs has just

hit home for me.  In flight planning for my first REAL cross-country

trip, I am currently making plans for the upcoming Monument Valley trip

in May.  



The cold, hard truth has suddenly become clear: ten gallons of fuel is

proving to be quite limiting for me, especially in northwest New Mexico

and the four-corners region, where we are hard-pressed to find airports

within 200 miles of each other!



Up to now, the stock 10 gallons of fuel in my Mark-III was adequate for

local flying, and the occasional round-robin flights (usually under 100

miles) that always begin and end at my home airport.  But now I'm

finding that it's gonna take some real planning to hopscotch my way to

Goulding's without running dry en route.



At this point, I'm considering bringing an extra 5 gal gas can with me

(full, of course) as emergency backup.  In case I encounter unforcast

headwinds that would cause me to burn up all my gas before reaching my

destination, I'm thinking it would be better to land on a lonely dirt

road and refill rather than land on that dirt road and be out of gas!



John H is right - I'm already thinking about options for more fuel

capacity.



Dennis Kirby

Mark-III, 912ul, and only 200 miles of range, in

Cedar Crest, NM

jim

Joined: 03 Nov 2006
Posts: 107
Location: N. Idaho

Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 3:08 pm Post subject: Limited Range

Can you land on a lonely dirt road next to a gas station?

Jim

N. Idaho



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 <Dennis.Kirby(at)kirtland.af.mil>



 . . .I'm thinking it would be better to land on a lonely dirt

 road and refill rather than land on that dirt road and be out of gas!

_________________
Jim
N. Idaho

dhkey(at)msn.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 3:28 pm Post subject: Limited Range

Dennis,

These look neat. I haven't used one or talked with anyone who has but I'm 

trying to figure out a good excuse to try one.



http://www.imtra.com/downloadtypes/nauta_brochure.pdf



Maybe someone knows something about these.

planecrazzzy
Guest

Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 5:09 pm Post subject: Re: Limited Range

Hey Dennis,

                  A cheap facet pump would transfer the fuel "in Flight"

 But then you have to figure if you need it in both tanks or one...

( I don't know your fuel system )



Gotta Fly...

Mike in MN ...FSII / N381PM  ( needs more fuel too )

.

.

.





 	  Dennis.Kirby(at)kirtland. wrote: 	
		   I'm thinking it would be better to land on a lonely dirt

road and refill rather than land on that dirt road and be out of gas!



Dennis Kirby

Mark-III, 912ul, and only 200 miles of range, in

Cedar Crest, NM

kfackler(at)ameritech.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 7:57 pm Post subject: Limited Range

 	  Quote: 	
		   Can you land on a lonely dirt road next to a gas station?


	


Let me share a story about that, if I may. I wasn't flying a Kolb at the

time, but anyone who flies anything might learn from this.



I found myself running short of fuel and happened to spot just what you

described, a gas station on a lonely road. And it had a large open area

right next to it. I mean, it looked so good that I could practically taxi to

the gas pump from that area, so down I went.



What I couldn't tell from altitude (and was too green a pilot to analyze)

was that this spot was an access point for heavy trucks going into and out

of a construction area nearby. There had been some rain a few days

previously and these big trucks had rutted the area badly. And I mean HUGE.



The landing nearly beat me to pieces, not fun. But I got down okay, got my

gas, and got ready to leave. By now, as is usual with these birds, I'd drawn

quite a crowd. After dispensing with the usual questions (how fast, how

high, do you need a license) I managed to get my bird cranked and turned to

depart.



This is when I made the biggest mistake of all up to this point. I failed to

walk the spanI planned to takeoff from. The ruts were unbelievable and I was

actually bounced into the air, VERY hard, before the plane was quite ready

to fly. I managed to get the nose down and caught it before smashing back

down and established my  climb.



After a few minutes of letting the nerves settle, I thought, "Man, that was

one rough landing and takeoff. I sure hope this bird is holding together."

So I began a visual scan. Wings okay, tail okay, right main okay. Left main?

Left main? Gone! Yeah, that last bump literally ripped the main gear and

gear leg off the airplane.



I had the 'pleasure' then of completing the flight to my home field

wondering just how badly I was going to be mauled when I crashed this thing

on two wheels. I'd actually seen a two wheel landing done once, when a guy's

wheel just fell off as he rolled down the runway. (Rushed his pre-flight it

turned out and forgot the safety pin.) So I knew the technique, which is to

land real soft, wait for the wing on the damaged side to start to drop, then

give it all the opposite inputs you've got.



I had to buzz the runway several times to get the attention of my buddies

(no radios in use back then) and they cleared all the parked airplanes out

of my way. I got it down with no additional damage other than to my already

frazzled nerves, but it was probably way more luck than skill. I was even

able to drive back to the gas station and retrieve the gear assembly and

later put it back on the plane. Again, dumb (and I mean dumb) luck.



But the lesson is, I hope, all too obvious. Landing where you don't know the

ground truth is risky. And always walk your takeoff run at a strange

location.



-Ken Fackler

Kolb Mark II / N722KM

Rochester MI

WillUribe(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 8:14 pm Post subject: Limited Range

--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Kirby Dennis Contr MDA/AL"  <Dennis.Kirby(at)kirtland.af.mil>



  	  Quote: 	
		  Up to    now, the stock 10 gallons of fuel in my Mark-III was adequate for

local    flying, and the occasional round-robin flights (usually under 100

miles)    that always begin and end at my home airport.  But now I'm

finding    that it's gonna take some real planning to hopscotch my way to

Goulding's    without running dry en route. 	


 

 Hi Dennis,

 This is how I would do it.

 Take Albuquerque to Milan Grants airport following I-40 79.7 miles.

 Milan Grants airport to Gallup 58.9 miles following I-40

 Gallup west over I-40 to Chambers 36.8 miles then north via 191 to  Chinle 83.1 miles. Fuel up at Chinle with the 5 gal tank I carry in the  jump seat and head on into MV.

  

 Simple

 Will Uribe

 El Paso, TX but working in Arlington, TX

 FireStar II N4GU

 http://www.members.aol.com/willuribe/mv/

  



 [b]Check out free AOL[/b]. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, millions of free high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and much more.

  [quote][b]

Roger Lee

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1464
Location: Tucson, Az.

Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 8:31 pm Post subject: Re: Limited Range

I tried a 5 gal. can in the other seat with a facet pump. It was in the way and could not carry passengers or luggage.

The Imtra 6 gal. fuel bladder works very well. I had a seperate facet pump and fuel shut off to it and it pumped into my main tanks so I could read the level on my EIS. I mounted it jsut behind the main fuel tanks. I was very happy with it and I had 3.5 hours of run time. It wa easy to fill with airport fuel trucks, also. Some of the guys saw it last year at MV.

_________________
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Rotax Instructor & Rotax IRC
Light Sport Repairman
Home 520-574-1080 TRY HOME FIRST
Cell 520-349-7056

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 8:32 pm Post subject: Limited Range

|   Fuel up at Chinle with the 5 gal tank I carry in the  jump seat 

and

| head on into MV.

|

| Simple

| Will Uribe

Gang:



Will knows how to do that, even with an extreme headwind, like last 

year.



Are you planning on flying the FS this year, Will?



john h

mkIII



DO NOT ARCHIVE

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

WillUribe(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 9:25 pm Post subject: Limited Range

In a message dated 2/20/2007 9:33:09 P.M. Mountain Standard Time,  jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com writes:

  	  Quote: 	
		         	  Quote: 	
		  -->      Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck"      <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>



|   Fuel up at Chinle with the      5 gal tank I carry in the  jump seat 

and

| head on into      MV.

|

| Simple

| Will Uribe

Gang:



Will knows how      to do that, even with an extreme headwind, like last 

year.



Are      you planning on flying the FS this year, Will?



john      h

mkIII



DO NOT ARCHIVE  	


	


 

 That is the plan, God willing and my work schedule permits it. Only this  year I plan to talk some Challenger, Rans and X-Air drivers into  flying with me.  The problem is the Challenger driver keeps breaking his  plane, the Rans may not be finished in time and the X-Air driver doesn't  fly much.  

 If we can coordinate it, The Wondering Winch and Larry will also  fly with us when they return from their odyssey to San Antonio.   Dave Rains will be flying his Cessna 175 and our EAA chapter president will be  flying his Piper Tripacer to take the Navajo Young Eagles for a ride.

  

 Regards,

 Will Uribe

 BTW; For those of you who know Dave Rains, his mother passed away last  week, may she RIP.



 [b]Check out free AOL  [quote][b]

NeilsenRM(at)comcast.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 9:45 pm Post subject: Limited Range

Dennis



I have a aux fuel system that has served me well for a number of years in my 

MKIIIc. I bought a cheap 6.5 gallon gas can that I attached a faucet pump 

to. The pump has a cigarette lighter style plug wired to it. I have a self 

sealing quick connect plug on the output line from the pump that I connect 

to its mate which fills my two five gallon tanks when flying cross country. 

When I get a few gallons down on my 5 gallon tanks I plug in the pump and 

transfer fuel. I like to keep my main tanks near full so if there are any 

problems with the fuel transfer process I can adjust my flight plan while I 

still have fuel. So far no problems other than over filling and venting fuel 

once or twice. This set up gives me almost four hours flying time with half 

hour reserve. Most of my flying is close to home so the aux system works 

best for me. If I had a larger main tank I would be carrying allot of extra 

fuel and weight that I wouldn't use or would have to worry about 

condensation from running with a half empty tank most of the time.



Someone mentioned that they couldn't put luggage in the passenger seat with 

their set up but that hasn't been a problem for me. I pack a tent, cot, 

folding chair, sleeping bag, tie downs, brief case sized flight bag and a 

few other items in the passenger seat with my tank. The tent, cot, tie 

downs, and the chair go behind the tank and then are all seat belted into 

place.



Again the information is worth what you paid for it.



Rick Neilsen

Redrive VW powered MKIIIc



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