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Staking a Housai exhaust valve (or M-14)

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keithmckinley

Joined: 11 Aug 2008
Posts: 434

Posted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 5:56 am Post subject: Staking a Housai exhaust valve (or M-14)

Anyone that has done this... can you share your "gotchas"



Keith

rmhou(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 9:52 am Post subject: Staking a Housai exhaust valve (or M-14)

I had a sticky valve in #5 that staking did not help. Filling the cylinder head with MMO for a few nights cured it. It has been about 20 hours since the MMO treatment and it is still running well. Last conditional inspection a month ago #5 read in the mid-70's, so I was pleased.

        From: keithmckinley <cetopfed(at)gmail.com>

 To: yak-list(at)matronics.com 

 Sent: Monday, October 14, 2013 6:56 AM

 Subject: Staking a Housai exhaust valve (or M-14)

 --> Yak-List message posted by: "keithmckinley" <cetopfed(at)gmail.com (cetopfed(at)gmail.com)>

Anyone that has done this... can you share your "gotchas"

Keith

--------

Keith McKinley

700HS

X26 Sebastian, FL

Read this topic online here:

http://forums.matronics.com/viewtosp;     ========================

jackpot

Joined: 13 Jul 2010
Posts: 65
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada

Posted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 11:07 am Post subject: Staking a Housai exhaust valve (or M-14)

This is some info I was supplied with from a reliable source. What type of oil are you using? It has been observed that there is a valve sticking problem with multi grade oils.  Not sure what brand. It has been a couple of years since I got the info. But the suggestion that straight grade oils have not been having the problem.  I know there will be people with different personal opinions.  I am just the messenger.  Don't try to shoot me.  Won't do any good.    Gary G.   CJ. N22YK



Sent from my iPhone



On Oct 14, 2013, at 10:49, Robin Hou <rmhou(at)yahoo.com (rmhou(at)yahoo.com)> wrote:

[quote]I had a sticky valve in #5 that staking did not help. Filling the cylinder head with MMO for a few nights cured it. It has been about 20 hours since the MMO treatment and it is still running well. Last conditional inspection a month ago #5 read in the mid-70's, so I was pleased.

        From: keithmckinley <cetopfed(at)gmail.com (cetopfed(at)gmail.com)>

 To: yak-list(at)matronics.com (yak-list(at)matronics.com) 

 Sent: Monday, October 14, 2013 6:56 AM

 Subject: Staking a Housai exhaust valve (or M-14)

  

 

 --> Yak-List message posted by: "keithmckinley" <cetopfed(at)gmail.com (cetopfed(at)gmail.com)>



Anyone that has done this... can you share your "gotchas"



Keith



--------

Keith McKinley

700HS

X26 Sebastian, FL





Read this topic online here:



http://forums.matronics.com/viewtosp;     ========================



 

 

  

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[b]

keithmckinley

Joined: 11 Aug 2008
Posts: 434

Posted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 4:14 pm Post subject: Re: Staking a Housai exhaust valve (or M-14)

Phillips 25/60 down here in Florida. 3&4 are low and also happen to be the hottest two on my CJ with a Housai.

mark.bitterlich(at)navy.m
Guest

Posted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 6:02 am Post subject: Staking a Housai exhaust valve (or M-14)

Not trying to shoot you Gary, but I would like to know what you consider a "reliable source" to be.   



I have used both multi-weight and single weight oils.  I found the single weight to be a real pain in the tail, especially in anything less than HOT weather.  50 weight just did not want to drain out of the intake drain kit, and with a tail dragger (YAK-50) that is a serious problem as oil left in the intakes can get "gulped in" and that is bad ju-ju.  Some folks using their airplanes (primarily) for really hard aerobatics switch to single weight in an attempt to cut down on consumption, etc.  The concept being that thicker oil is less likely to creep past piston rings in the short term.  Probably has some basis in fact because the Russian piston rings leak like crazy when they are cold anyway, but I doubt there has been any real study done on how effective that might be for contributing to valves sticking.  



That said, after that experience I have used Phillips Multi Weight Radial Engine Oil (20-60W) with great success for many hundreds of hours.  During that time, I have had to pull just one cylinder for a sticking exhaust valve and that was soon after I purchased the aircraft.  



Just FYI, sticking exhaust valves are typically caused by lead deposits and not oil. That was true in my case, and was in my opinion caused by me running the engine at 60-70% and letting it get too cool resulting in lead precipitation onto the valve.  My M-14 does not have shutters by the way, so running it that low caused it to have cylinder head temps down in the "yellow" range.  Increasing the normal operating RPM to get cylinder head temps up, and adding MMO to the fuel ended the sticking exhaust valve issue.  



Over the next 700 hours following that, I have had to stake one valve, and that procedure worked.  



I am writing all of this because I want folks to be very cautious considering things to do to their airplane that come from a "reliable source".  Many things have been recommended in the same fashion over the years, one of the best known being squirting air tool oil into the pneumatic system.  Something in my ignorance I actually went ahead and tried, followed shortly there-after by total failure of both landing gear actuator chevron seals.  Luckily I avoided a gear up landing.  



Making a decision on whether to run a single or multi weight oil is based on many factors, but I would consider the least of them to be "preventing valves sticking".  



And the reliable source in this particular case is myself.  :-=)   



Mark Bitterlich

 



--

markdavis(at)wbsnet.org
Guest

Posted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 7:59 am Post subject: Staking a Housai exhaust valve (or M-14)

Mark,

     I've had the same experience with sticking valves, two of which 

wouldn't stake and required the jugs being replaced with spares I had.  Both 

happened while running X/C 25W60, with MMO and either Decalin or TCP in the 

fuel.  I had been adding MMO to the oil only immediately prior to an oil 

change, flying it for 30 minutes to warm it up and draining the oil while 

hot.  I don't run an oil filter, but never run the oil past 25 hours.  Since 

my last cylinder replacement 18 months ago, I've been running MMO per Jill's 

recommendation in the oil continuously and haven't had a problem 

since....knock on wood.  I run half the recommended amount in hot summer 

months and a full dose in winter months.  I occasionally fly in very cold 

temps in the winter time, which may have aggravated the lead accumulation as 

you suggested.  Sometimes running with the gills full closed at cruise is 

necessary to keep the cylinders warm enough to scavenge a little heat for my 

cold blooded wife in the back seat!  I mix the MMO in with the new Phillips 

in the 2.5 gallon jug so I don't have to do the higher level math to add the 

right amount every time I add oil.  My engine is approaching 900 hrs and I 

believe it may be using just a bit more oil due to the thinning by the MMO, 

but it's cheaper than replacing cylinders.  As they say, YMMV.



Mark Davis

N44YK

---

keithmckinley

Joined: 11 Aug 2008
Posts: 434

Posted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 9:13 am Post subject: Re: Staking a Housai exhaust valve (or M-14)

I religiously use 2 oz/ 5 gal in my fuel but have never put it in the oil. DO you use the same dilution ratio?



K

markdavis(at)wbsnet.org
Guest

Posted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 12:32 pm Post subject: Staking a Housai exhaust valve (or M-14)

Keith,

     I add it at the rate recommended on the label in the cold months and 

cut it in half in the summer.  Just my personal choice to not dilute the oil 

so much in high temps when I know the oil temp may be nudging the red arc.



Mark



---

keithmckinley

Joined: 11 Aug 2008
Posts: 434

Posted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 6:42 pm Post subject: Re: Staking a Housai exhaust valve (or M-14)

I know just about everyone on this list is saying "for the love of GOD not again" so I'll stop it right here and get back to the staking question at the heart of this post and not MMO.....

....but thanks!

viperdoc(at)mindspring.co
Guest

Posted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 7:35 pm Post subject: Staking a Housai exhaust valve (or M-14)

But the real question we want to know 

Was it the lack of MMO 

That precipitated  your situation

Doc



Sent from my iPad



On Oct 15, 2013, at 9:42 PM, "keithmckinley" <cetopfed(at)gmail.com> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

 I know just about everyone on this list is saying "for the love of GOD not again" so I'll stop it right here and get back to the staking question at the heart of this post and not MMO.....

 

 

 ....but thanks! 

 

 

  [Wink]

 

 --------

 Keith McKinley

 700HS

 X26 Sebastian, FL

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=410670#410670

keithmckinley

Joined: 11 Aug 2008
Posts: 434

Posted: Sun Nov 03, 2013 8:23 pm Post subject: Re: Staking a Housai exhaust valve (or M-14)

That would be a big NO!

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