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stuart(at)harnerfarm.net
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 Posted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 2:03 pm Post subject: Firefly control cable questions |
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Hi,
After installing the elevator and rudder control cables I have noticed a couple of things.
<![if !supportLists]>1) <![endif]>The cables lay on the bottom of the inside of the tail boom.
<![if !supportLists]>2) <![endif]>The pulleys at the front of the boom (by the gear legs) do not rotate, even though they rotate easily by hand. There is not enough tension from the cable to cause them to turn.
<![if !supportLists]>3) <![endif]>With the stick full aft, the rudder cables rub on the elevator control horn.
The questions are:
<![if !supportLists]>1) <![endif]>As dirt and grit accumulates on the cables, does this cause any concern about wear and tear on the inside of the tail boom?
<![if !supportLists]>2) <![endif]>If the pulleys are only “guiding” the cables and not rotating, will they get a flat spot worn on them, or is there any reason to be concerned?
<![if !supportLists]>3) <![endif]>Do I need an up limit stop on the elevator to keep it from hitting the rudder cables?
<![if !supportLists]>4) <![endif]>What is the normal full up deflection angle for the elevator?
Thanks,
Stuart
[quote][b]
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Ducati SS
Joined: 15 Oct 2009
Posts: 93
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| Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 7:41 am Post subject: Re: Firefly control cable questions |
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Clearance in the aft end of the boom tube is tight, I did a lot of adjusting when building mine and was able to reduce but not eliminate interference. I used two rudder horns cut apart and re welded to make one and also tweaked the cable attaching ends to get maximum rudder cable clearance.
One of the problems is that due to the location of the elevator bell crank pivot the bell crank moves up and down with fore and aft stick movements. The instructions stress the need to space the forward horz. stabilizer mounts to allow fore and aft movement of the stab. Certainly the space should be provided but if during construction the elevator hinge line is kept exactly in line with the center of the elevator pivot bolt there will be little or no movement of the stab. The further off from perfect alignment the more sliding of the stab will occur . elevator travel on the Firefly is basically determined by stick placement during rigging. The plans show proper neutral stick position and then up elevator is limited by rearward stick travel.
If I remember correctly I had the same issue with the pulleys not turning, not much down force at this location. In my opinion setting cable tensions is a balancing act. We want the best control feel and minimum slapping in the boom but the more tension on the elevator cables the stronger the pull on the bell crank pivot bolts. As there are no replaceable bearings or bushings at the pivot I am concerned with high cable tension elongating the holes in the tail ring.
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John Hauck
Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)
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| Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 8:09 am Post subject: Firefly control cable questions |
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Good Morning Kolbers:
Pretty difficult to center the elevator hinge lines. I got one side pretty
close and the other side not so close to center. There's a little fore and
aft movement to both sides. I have space at the forward horizontal
stabilizer attach points to prevent binding.
In 3,200.0+ hours the holes in the tail boom ring have worn a little bit,
but still have many hours left before something would have to be done with
them.
I have found that loose elevator cables make an uncomfortable flying
aircraft. Nice snug cables produce crisp, concise elevator input. In other
words, loose elevator cables make a Kolb fly like a dog.
Here is how I adjust elevator cables. I am sure some will disagree with me,
but that is perfectly ok. This is not gospel, but the way I do it.
Get someone to hold the elevators, locking them in place. Then try to move
the control stick fore and aft. If there is fore and aft slop, tighten the
cables some more. I do not want any slack/slop in fore and aft stick
movement.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama - Waiting for my airstrip to dry out so I can go fly, even in
near freezing weather. Been wet for a month or more.
--
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_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama |
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lcottrell
Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 1494
Location: Jordan Valley, Or
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| Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 8:30 am Post subject: Firefly control cable questions |
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John said- "Get someone to hold the elevators, locking them in place. Then try to move the control stick fore and aft. If there is fore and aft slop, tighten thecables some more. I do not want any slack/slop in fore and aft stick movement."
I was having trouble with my landings in my Firestar. It seemed to drop out from under me as I slowed down. John checked the slop in my elevator and we tightened it up. The difference was dramatic and so very much better.
Worth doing,
Larry
On Thu, Jan 16, 2014 at 9:08 AM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)> wrote:
[quote]--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)>
Good Morning Kolbers:
Pretty difficult to center the elevator hinge lines. I got one side pretty
close and the other side not so close to center. There's a little fore and
aft movement to both sides. I have space at the forward horizontal
stabilizer attach points to prevent binding.
In 3,200.0+ hours the holes in the tail boom ring have worn a little bit,
but still have many hours left before something would have to be done with
them.
I have found that loose elevator cables make an uncomfortable flying
aircraft. Nice snug cables produce crisp, concise elevator input. In other
words, loose elevator cables make a Kolb fly like a dog.
Here is how I adjust elevator cables. I am sure some will disagree with me,
but that is perfectly ok. This is not gospel, but the way I do it.
Get someone to hold the elevators, locking them in place. Then try to move
the control stick fore and aft. If there is fore and aft slop, tighten the
cables some more. I do not want any slack/slop in fore and aft stick
movement.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama - Waiting for my airstrip to dry out so I can go fly, even in
near freezing weather. Been wet for a month or more.
--
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stuart(at)harnerfarm.net
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| Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 8:32 am Post subject: Firefly control cable questions |
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Understood.
Mine was a quick build so all the tail feathers were completed at the
factory. I had to make up and install the cables.
The only time there is any interference is at the very top of the elevator
travel. Mostly it is the ferules that are hitting the elevator horn. I
don't really like the idea of limiting travel, as I may need it someday.
Likewise, it is not likely to be too much of a problem unless full up is
used regularly. I just don't like parts that rub on each other. Ditto for
the cables in the bottom of the tail tube.
I considered covering the ends of the cables with heat shrink tubing to make
them "ride" easier over the elevator horn, but don't like that because it
could promote, and then hide corrosion of the rudder cables.
I guess I should not get too concerned about it until final assembly. Maybe
by then some kind of inspiration will hit me.
Stuart
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