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cjhukill(at)cox.net Guest
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Posted: Thu Apr 24, 2014 4:21 pm Post subject: camlocs on the bottom of cowl |
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I saw a post on VansAirforce about Camlocs causing problems on the bottom of the cowl. I am installing the cowling on my RV10 right now with hinges on the side of the bottom cowl and camlocs on the bottom. My RV8 has hinges on the side and nutplates on the bottom, and I am very happy with the way the cowl slides aft and the hinges hold it up until I install the pins, a one man job. I was thinking that the camlocs might prevent that smooth installation because the camlocs would hang up the cowl from sliding aft. I can easily change now to nutplates. Can anyone give me any feedback on this configuration?
Chris Hukill
getting closer everyday
[quote][b]
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flying-nut(at)cfl.rr.com Guest
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Posted: Thu Apr 24, 2014 4:33 pm Post subject: camlocs on the bottom of cowl |
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No experience with camlocs on the bottom of lower cowl. I put nutplates and screws all across the bottom.
I'm not flying yet but my reasoning was screws/nutplates are less espensive and I already have to crawl under the plane to unscrew the bracket in the ramp so why not the ones on the side. I think the camlocs would get in the way as you slide the lower cowl in place.
I did put camlocs on the upper cowl and hinges down the sides.
Linn
On 4/24/2014 8:20 PM, Chris Hukill wrote:
[quote] I saw a post on VansAirforce about Camlocs causing problems on the bottom of the cowl. I am installing the cowling on my RV10 right now with hinges on the side of the bottom cowl and camlocs on the bottom. My RV8 has hinges on the side and nutplates on the bottom, and I am very happy with the way the cowl slides aft and the hinges hold it up until I install the pins, a one man job. I was thinking that the camlocs might prevent that smooth installation because the camlocs would hang up the cowl from sliding aft. I can easily change now to nutplates. Can anyone give me any feedback on this configuration?
Chris Hukill
getting closer everyday
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
04/24/14 [b]
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davidsoutpost(at)comcast. Guest
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Posted: Thu Apr 24, 2014 4:35 pm Post subject: camlocs on the bottom of cowl |
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I have camloc's on the bottome of my lower cowling and have no issues getting it on or off.
From: "Chris Hukill" <cjhukill(at)cox.net>
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, April 24, 2014 8:20:41 PM
Subject: camlocs on the bottom of cowl
I saw a post on VansAirforce about Camlocs causing problems on the bottom of the cowl. I am installing the cowling on my RV10 right now with hinges on the side of the bottom cowl and camlocs on the bottom. My RV8 has hinges on the side and nutplates on the bottom, and I am very happy with the way the cowl slides aft and the hinges hold it up until I install the pins, a one man job. I was thinking that the camlocs might prevent that smooth installation because the camlocs would hang up the cowl from sliding aft. I can easily change now to nutplates. Can anyone give me any feedback on this configuration?
Chris Hukill
getting closer everyday
Quote: |
get="_blank" data-mce-href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
ta-mce-href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
_blank" data-mce-href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
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[quote][b]
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jdriggs49(at)msn.com Guest
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Posted: Thu Apr 24, 2014 5:15 pm Post subject: camlocs on the bottom of cowl |
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I've used CamLocks on both pieces of the cowl. No problems to date.
Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2014 20:32:10 -0400
From: flying-nut(at)cfl.rr.com
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: RV10-List: camlocs on the bottom of cowl
No experience with camlocs on the bottom of lower cowl. I put nutplates and screws all across the bottom.
I'm not flying yet but my reasoning was screws/nutplates are less espensive and I already have to crawl under the plane to unscrew the bracket in the ramp so why not the ones on the side. I think the camlocs would get in the way as you slide the lower cowl in place.
I did put camlocs on the upper cowl and hinges down the sides.
Linn
On 4/24/2014 8:20 PM, Chris Hukill wrote:
[quote] I saw a post on VansAirforce about Camlocs causing problems on the bottom of the cowl. I am installing the cowling on my RV10 right now with hinges on the side of the bottom cowl and camlocs on the bottom. My RV8 has hinges on the side and nutplates on the bottom, and I am very happy with the way the cowl slides aft and the hinges hold it up until I install the pins, a one man job. I was thinking that the camlocs might prevent that smooth installation because the camlocs would hang up the cowl from sliding aft. I can easily change now to nutplates. Can anyone give me any feedback on this configuration?
Chris Hukill
getting closer everyday
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - [url=http://www.avg.com]www.avg.com[/url]
04/24/14
ist" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
ank>http://forums.matronics.com
rget=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
[b]
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jesse(at)saintaviation.co Guest
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Posted: Thu Apr 24, 2014 5:17 pm Post subject: camlocs on the bottom of cowl |
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Some 1/4 turn fasteners cause more of a problem in that type if thing than others. I have installed Skybolt fasteners on a couple if cowls there without trouble. Screws and nutplates are definitely cheaper. The biggest reason to go screws, IMHO, is the reason already given, that you still have 6 screws on the bottom of the cowl to remove, so you'll already be down there.
Jesse SaintI-TEC, Inc.
jesse(at)itecusa.org (jesse(at)itecusa.org)
www.itecusa.org
www.mavericklsa.com
C: 352-427-0285
O: 352-465-4545
F: 815-377-3694
Sent from my iPhone
On Apr 24, 2014, at 8:35 PM, David Clifford <davidsoutpost(at)comcast.net (davidsoutpost(at)comcast.net)> wrote:
[quote]I have camloc's on the bottome of my lower cowling and have no issues getting it on or off.
From: "Chris Hukill" <cjhukill(at)cox.net (cjhukill(at)cox.net)>
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com (rv10-list(at)matronics.com)
Sent: Thursday, April 24, 2014 8:20:41 PM
Subject: camlocs on the bottom of cowl
I saw a post on VansAirforce about Camlocs causing problems on the bottom of the cowl. I am installing the cowling on my RV10 right now with hinges on the side of the bottom cowl and camlocs on the bottom. My RV8 has hinges on the side and nutplates on the bottom, and I am very happy with the way the cowl slides aft and the hinges hold it up until I install the pins, a one man job. I was thinking that the camlocs might prevent that smooth installation because the camlocs would hang up the cowl from sliding aft. I can easily change now to nutplates. Can anyone give me any feedback on this configuration?
Chris Hukill
getting closer everyday
Quote: |
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
List"">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
//forums.matronics.com
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ot;">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
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partner14
Joined: 12 Jan 2008 Posts: 540 Location: Granbury Texas
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Posted: Thu Apr 24, 2014 5:50 pm Post subject: camlocs on the bottom of cowl |
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3 screws on each side, 650 hours, not even a remote issue.... besides, with a makita, it pretty quick.
Don McDonald
From: Danny Riggs <jdriggs49(at)msn.com>
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, April 24, 2014 8:14 PM
Subject: RE: RV10-List: camlocs on the bottom of cowl
I've used CamLocks on both pieces of the cowl. No problems to date.
Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2014 20:32:10 -0400
From: flying-nut(at)cfl.rr.com
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: RV10-List: camlocs on the bottom of cowl
No experience with camlocs on the bottom of lower cowl. I put nutplates and screws all across the bottom.
I'm not flying yet but my reasoning was screws/nutplates are less espensive and I already have to crawl under the plane to unscrew the bracket in the ramp so why not the ones on the side. I think the camlocs would get in the way as you slide the lower cowl in place.
I did put camlocs on the upper cowl and hinges down the sides.
Linn
On 4/24/2014 8:20 PM, Chris Hukill wrote:
[quote] I saw a post on VansAirforce about Camlocs causing problems on the bottom of the cowl. I am installing the cowling on my RV10 right now with hinges on the side of the bottom cowl and camlocs on the bottom. My RV8 has hinges on the side and nutplates on the bottom, and I am very happy with the way the cowl slides aft and the hinges hold it up until I install the pins, a one man job. I was thinking that the camlocs might prevent that smooth installation because the camlocs would hang up the cowl from sliding aft. I can easily change now to nutplates. Can anyone give me any feedback on this configuration?
Chris Hukill
getting closer everyday
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - [url=]www.avg.com[/url]
04/24/14
ist" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
ank>http://forums.matronics.com
rget=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
htthttp://www.matronics.com/contribution=============
[b]
| - The Matronics RV10-List Email Forum - | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List |
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_________________ Don A. McDonald
40636 |
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bill.peyton
Joined: 19 Sep 2010 Posts: 198 Location: St. Louis, MO
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Posted: Fri Apr 25, 2014 6:12 am Post subject: Re: camlocs on the bottom of cowl |
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I posted this on VAF a long time ago. I started down the path of camlocs from Skybolt and changed back to hinge. The issue with the skybolt camlocs is the new cowl does not have enough edge overlap as part of the joggle. You will have to grind the cowl along the upper edge to create a large enough flat area for the camloc strip to sit on. A lot of work and weakening the cowl. The hinge does just fine, after 250 hours it is a piece of cake to remove. I used 5 #8 screws at the bottom on each side.
| - The Matronics RV10-List Email Forum - | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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_________________ Bill
WA0SYV
Aviation Partners, LLC |
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Kellym
Joined: 10 Jan 2006 Posts: 1705 Location: Sun Lakes AZ
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Posted: Fri Apr 25, 2014 7:02 am Post subject: camlocs on the bottom of cowl |
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Interesting, as I have the pink cowl with gray outer coating obtained in
fall of 2010.
I installed Skybolt with their supplied mounting tabs for entire
firewall as well as the horizontal parting line.
There was adequate flange all the way around. I did not need to grind
anything in the honeycomb area.
Kelly
40866, allegedly finishing.
On 4/25/2014 7:12 AM, bill.peyton wrote:
Quote: |
I posted this on VAF a long time ago. I started down the path of camlocs from Skybolt and changed back to hinge. The issue with the skybolt camlocs is the new cowl does not have enough edge overlap as part of the joggle. You will have to grind the cowl along the upper edge to create a large enough flat area for the camloc strip to sit on. A lot of work and weakening the cowl. The hinge does just fine, after 250 hours it is a piece of cake to remove. I used 5 #8 screws at the bottom on each side.
--------
Bill
WA0SYV
Aviation Partners, LLC
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=422366#422366
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_________________ Kelly McMullen
A&P/IA, EAA Tech Counselor # 5286
KCHD |
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philperry9
Joined: 23 Nov 2011 Posts: 381
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Posted: Fri Apr 25, 2014 7:11 am Post subject: camlocs on the bottom of cowl |
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Mine (ordered very close to the same time Kelly's) doesn't have enough flange for my skybolts. Weird.
So I'm switching back to hinges at this point. I've got some photos somewhere of it.
Phil
Sent from my iPhone
On Apr 25, 2014, at 10:01 AM, Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com> wrote:
Interesting, as I have the pink cowl with gray outer coating obtained in fall of 2010.
I installed Skybolt with their supplied mounting tabs for entire firewall as well as the horizontal parting line.
There was adequate flange all the way around. I did not need to grind anything in the honeycomb area.
Kelly
40866, allegedly finishing.
Quote: | On 4/25/2014 7:12 AM, bill.peyton wrote:
I posted this on VAF a long time ago. I started down the path of camlocs from Skybolt and changed back to hinge. The issue with the skybolt camlocs is the new cowl does not have enough edge overlap as part of the joggle. You will have to grind the cowl along the upper edge to create a large enough flat area for the camloc strip to sit on. A lot of work and weakening the cowl. The hinge does just fine, after 250 hours it is a piece of cake to remove. I used 5 #8 screws at the bottom on each side.
--------
Bill
WA0SYV
Aviation Partners, LLC
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=422366#422366
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bwestfall
Joined: 22 Oct 2008 Posts: 131 Location: Portland, OR
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Posted: Fri Apr 25, 2014 9:32 am Post subject: camlocs on the bottom of cowl |
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I have the pink cowl w/o the gray exterior and it had plenty of flange for
the skybolts all around. I am using the skybolt upper kit, hinges on the
lower cowl sides, and 3 #8 screws on each side on the bottom of the cowl.
Not flying yet though.
I would not let the lack of flange deter you from skybolts if you wanted to
use them. It is not a difficult task to remove some of the honeycomb. I
don't think it weakens the cowl at all when you do that because essentially
your making your cowl match how most of them were molded from the start. I
would seal the edge of the honeycomb and potentially layup a thin layer or
two of glass if you felt you sanded the shell a bit thin in spots. In total
it's probably on a couple hour job.
-Ben
--
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larkrv10(at)gmail.com Guest
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Posted: Fri Apr 25, 2014 11:01 am Post subject: camlocs on the bottom of cowl |
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Guys, FYI
I have the pink cowl, just fitted recently, and I had to grind away the foam structural part on the top right corner just to make the piano hinge fit. The foam was very crooked along the aft edge. I covered the area that I ground away with fiberglass cloth to replace the structural foam I removed. I am using 4 #8 screws & nut plates.
Rick
#40956
Southampton, Ont
On Fri, Apr 25, 2014 at 1:32 PM, Ben Westfall <rv10(at)sinkrate.com (rv10(at)sinkrate.com)> wrote:
[quote]--> RV10-List message posted by: "Ben Westfall" <rv10(at)sinkrate.com (rv10(at)sinkrate.com)>
I have the pink cowl w/o the gray exterior and it had plenty of flange for
the skybolts all around. I am using the skybolt upper kit, hinges on the
lower cowl sides, and 3 #8 screws on each side on the bottom of the cowl.
Not flying yet though.
I would not let the lack of flange deter you from skybolts if you wanted to
use them. It is not a difficult task to remove some of the honeycomb. I
don't think it weakens the cowl at all when you do that because essentially
your making your cowl match how most of them were molded from the start. I
would seal the edge of the honeycomb and potentially layup a thin layer or
two of glass if you felt you sanded the shell a bit thin in spots. In total
it's probably on a couple hour job.
-Ben
--
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n223rv(at)wolflakeairport Guest
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Posted: Fri Apr 25, 2014 12:38 pm Post subject: camlocs on the bottom of cowl |
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I'm pretty sure the variability we are seeing has to do with both some of the cowling manufacturing variability, and with the variability in the front flange of the engine to the firewall dimension. Since all the cowls are custom cut and fitted, some end up with more or less flange than others.
I'm my experience, the fiberglass on the top and bottom of the foam is significantly thinner than the flanges. If you grind away the foam, you will have to add in several layers of fiberglass.
Sent from my iPhone
[quote] On Apr 25, 2014, at 1:32 PM, "Ben Westfall" <rv10(at)sinkrate.com> wrote:
I have the pink cowl w/o the gray exterior and it had plenty of flange for
the skybolts all around. I am using the skybolt upper kit, hinges on the
lower cowl sides, and 3 #8 screws on each side on the bottom of the cowl.
Not flying yet though.
I would not let the lack of flange deter you from skybolts if you wanted to
use them. It is not a difficult task to remove some of the honeycomb. I
don't think it weakens the cowl at all when you do that because essentially
your making your cowl match how most of them were molded from the start. I
would seal the edge of the honeycomb and potentially layup a thin layer or
two of glass if you felt you sanded the shell a bit thin in spots. In total
it's probably on a couple hour job.
-Ben
--
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dave.saylor.aircrafters(a Guest
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Posted: Fri Apr 25, 2014 2:43 pm Post subject: camlocs on the bottom of cowl |
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In general, 1/4-turns don't clamp as tight as as a screw. That area is pretty flexible so it benefits from good clampup. I don't think anyone has used the stock hinges for very long.
Use the same hardware as the support plate and it's no big deal to pull out all 12 screws.
On Thursday, April 24, 2014, Chris Hukill <[url=javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','cjhukill(at)cox.net');]cjhukill(at)cox.net[/url]> wrote:
Quote: | I saw a post on VansAirforce about Camlocs causing problems on the bottom of the cowl. I am installing the cowling on my RV10 right now with hinges on the side of the bottom cowl and camlocs on the bottom. My RV8 has hinges on the side and nutplates on the bottom, and I am very happy with the way the cowl slides aft and the hinges hold it up until I install the pins, a one man job. I was thinking that the camlocs might prevent that smooth installation because the camlocs would hang up the cowl from sliding aft. I can easily change now to nutplates. Can anyone give me any feedback on this configuration?
Chris Hukill
getting closer everyday
Quote: |
get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
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--
--Dave Saylor
[quote][b]
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jesse(at)saintaviation.co Guest
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Posted: Fri Apr 25, 2014 3:34 pm Post subject: camlocs on the bottom of cowl |
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We have been using the stock hinges for 9 years and 1,300+ hours.
Jesse SaintI-TEC, Inc.
jesse(at)itecusa.org (jesse(at)itecusa.org)
www.itecusa.org
www.mavericklsa.com
C: 352-427-0285
O: 352-465-4545
F: 815-377-3694
Sent from my iPhone
On Apr 25, 2014, at 6:42 PM, Dave Saylor <dave.saylor.aircrafters(at)gmail.com (dave.saylor.aircrafters(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
[quote]In general, 1/4-turns don't clamp as tight as as a screw. That area is pretty flexible so it benefits from good clampup. I don't think anyone has used the stock hinges for very long.
Use the same hardware as the support plate and it's no big deal to pull out all 12 screws.
On Thursday, April 24, 2014, Chris Hukill <[url=javascript:_e(%7B%7D,\'cvml\',\'cjhukill(at)cox.net\');]cjhukill(at)cox.net[/url]> wrote:
Quote: | I saw a post on VansAirforce about Camlocs causing problems on the bottom of the cowl. I am installing the cowling on my RV10 right now with hinges on the side of the bottom cowl and camlocs on the bottom. My RV8 has hinges on the side and nutplates on the bottom, and I am very happy with the way the cowl slides aft and the hinges hold it up until I install the pins, a one man job. I was thinking that the camlocs might prevent that smooth installation because the camlocs would hang up the cowl from sliding aft. I can easily change now to nutplates. Can anyone give me any feedback on this configuration?
Chris Hukill
getting closer everyday
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--
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philperry9
Joined: 23 Nov 2011 Posts: 381
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Posted: Fri Apr 25, 2014 5:39 pm Post subject: camlocs on the bottom of cowl |
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Here is the photo that I mentioned showing the interference with the honeycomb and skybolt tabs.
After reading some of the others experiences, I suspect the answer is in the spinner/prop selection. I'm running a 3 blade MT and it came with a factory spinner. I suspect if I fitted vans spinner to a different prop, it would move the cowling further forward by a .25" to .5". The MT spinner does sit back a little further and after you set the gap between the back of the spinner and the front of the cowling, that could easily make up the difference between hitting the honeycomb or not.
I'm not going to put the work in to making the skybolts work with my MT setup. So if anyone is interested in a full set for the upper cowl, lower cowl, and sides, let me know.
Phil
On Friday, April 25, 2014, Phillip Perry <philperry9(at)gmail.com (philperry9(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
Quote: | Mine (ordered very close to the same time Kelly's) doesn't have enough flange for my skybolts. Weird.
So I'm switching back to hinges at this point. I've got some photos somewhere of it.
Phil
Sent from my iPhone
On Apr 25, 2014, at 10:01 AM, Kelly McMullen <[url=javascript:;]kellym(at)aviating.com[/url]> wrote:
--> RV10-List message posted by: Kelly McMullen <[url=javascript:;]kellym(at)aviating.com[/url]>
Interesting, as I have the pink cowl with gray outer coating obtained in fall of 2010.
I installed Skybolt with their supplied mounting tabs for entire firewall as well as the horizontal parting line.
There was adequate flange all the way around. I did not need to grind anything in the honeycomb area.
Kelly
40866, allegedly finishing.
> On 4/25/2014 7:12 AM, bill.peyton wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: "bill.peyton" <[url=javascript:;]peyton.b(at)sbcglobal.net[/url]>
>
> I posted this on VAF a long time ago. I started down the path of camlocs from Skybolt and changed back to hinge. The issue with the skybolt camlocs is the new cowl does not have enough edge overlap as part of the joggle. You will have to grind the cowl along the upper edge to create a large enough flat area for the camloc strip to sit on. A lot of work and weakening the cowl. The hinge does just fine, after 250 hours it is a piece of cake to remove. I used 5 #8 screws at the bottom on each side.
>
> --------
> Bill
> WA0SYV
> Aviation Partners, LLC
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=422366#422366
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rv10flyer
Joined: 25 Aug 2009 Posts: 364
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Posted: Sun Apr 27, 2014 6:35 pm Post subject: Re: camlocs on the bottom of cowl |
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I used stock hinges on mine. 40983 12/1/09-12/1/2011. At 100 hrs bottom left hinge loops all broken and 1 loop on the right side broken. Replaced both sides with .063" and 6 #8's per side.
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