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Fuel senders

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bob88

Joined: 24 Feb 2013
Posts: 99

Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 6:22 pm Post subject: Fuel senders

Are the Van's fuel float senders inferior to capacitative (sp?) senders? Are there problems with installation of the capacitative units (I have QB wings)?

Bob Turner

Joined: 03 Jan 2009
Posts: 885
Location: Castro Valley, CA

Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 7:49 pm Post subject: Re: Fuel senders

Capacitive senders are more accurate than floats. But, when calibrated thru an EFIS (I have GRT) the floats are surprisingly accurate, except that they cannot see the top 5 gallons. But on top of that nearly eveyone puts in a fuel flow transducer, and their accuracy is amazing. My advice is to just put in the floats, and spend your money somewhere else.

_________________
Bob Turner
RV-10 QB

bill.peyton

Joined: 19 Sep 2010
Posts: 198
Location: St. Louis, MO

Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 4:01 am Post subject: Re: Fuel senders

I agree with Bob.  The float type fuel senders are pretty accurate if you spend some quality time calibrating them with your EFIS.  Coupled with the fuel flow sending unit you usually know within a couple of tenths of a gallon, your fuel consumption

_________________
Bill
WA0SYV
Aviation Partners, LLC

Lenny Iszak

Joined: 23 Mar 2008
Posts: 270

Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 8:15 am Post subject: Re: Fuel senders

Capacitive fuel senders are only worthwhile if you build your own tanks.

If you install them in QB tanks they won't see the top 5 gallons, just like the floats, because of the wing dihedral.

Tim Olson

Joined: 25 Jan 2007
Posts: 2879

Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 8:39 am Post subject: Fuel senders

I find the floats plenty accurate after calibration to the EFIS anyway, and really don't much miss the top few gallons of reading, because where I really care about it is when it's under 1/2.  With the totalizer on board, the floats are more a 2nd reference anyway.  The totalizer is very precise when I top off the tanks.

Tim



 	  Quote: 	
		   On Aug 19, 2014, at 11:15 AM, "Lenny Iszak" <lenard(at)rapiddecision.com> wrote:

 

 

 

 Capacitive fuel senders are only worthwhile if you build your own tanks.

 If you install them in QB tanks they won't see the top 5 gallons, just like the floats, because of the wing dihedral.

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=428757#428757

schmoboy

Joined: 26 Feb 2006
Posts: 130

Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 9:30 am Post subject: Fuel senders

I kind of refer to the floats as a backup to the totalizer also.  I 

visually inspect and stick the tanks as part of preflight.



One thing that annoys me during flight when maneuvering is that the 

floats will obviously be incorrect for a given period of time.  This is 

acceptable because I know that it will happen.  The issue for me is that 

my AFS EFIS will audible and visual warn me that the float readings 

don't match the totalizer.  I've thought about disabling that feature, 

but I really like the reminder while on the ground after fill-up as a 

trigger to reset the totalizer for full mains.  Have others turned off 

the float/totalizer mismatch warning?



-Sean #40303 (phase one complete, dreading more fiberglass work to 

finish pants on mains)



 	  Quote: 	
		   Tim Olson <mailto:Tim(at)MyRV10.com>

 August 19, 2014 at 11:38 AM

 



 I find the floats plenty accurate after calibration to the EFIS 

 anyway, and really don't much miss the top few gallons of reading, 

 because where I really care about it is when it's under 1/2. With the 

 totalizer on board, the floats are more a 2nd reference anyway. The 

 totalizer is very precise when I top off the tanks.

 Tim

saylor.dave(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 9:58 am Post subject: Fuel senders

I adjusted the warning on mine for a pretty large difference, like maybe 15 gallons.  Still warns if I don't reset it, and less spam.



"The system will give the audible warning “Check Fuel Computer” on startup if the fuel computer’s gallons remaining value 

   does not match the fuel tanks level. This feature (if turned on in Instrument Calibration) should warn you if you have added 

fuel and forget to adjust the fuel computer. The number of gallons that will generate an error is adjusted in Instrument 

   Calibrate. Since the fuel levels are NOT accurate when the tanks are near full this value is doubled when the tanks show 

full".

That way I don't have to be reminded about my uncoordinated turns  



--Dave

On Tue, Aug 19, 2014 at 10:28 AM, Sean Stephens <sean(at)stephensville.com (sean(at)stephensville.com)> wrote:

   [quote]--> RV10-List message posted by: Sean Stephens <sean(at)stephensville.com (sean(at)stephensville.com)>

    

 I kind of refer to the floats as a backup to the totalizer also.  I visually inspect and stick the tanks as part of preflight.

 

 One thing that annoys me during flight when maneuvering is that the floats will obviously be incorrect for a given period of time.  This is acceptable because I know that it will happen.  The issue for me is that my AFS EFIS will audible and visual warn me that the float readings don't match the totalizer.  I've thought about disabling that feature, but I really like the reminder while on the ground after fill-up as a trigger to reset the totalizer for full mains.  Have others turned off the float/totalizer mismatch warning?

    

 -Sean #40303 (phase one complete, dreading more fiberglass work to finish pants on mains)

 

  	  Quote: 	
		   Tim Olson <mailto:Tim(at)MyRV10.com (Tim(at)MyRV10.com)>

 August 19, 2014 at 11:38 AM

 --> RV10-List message posted by: Tim Olson <Tim(at)myrv10.com (Tim(at)myrv10.com)>

 

 I find the floats plenty accurate after calibration to the EFIS anyway, and really don't much miss the top few gallons of reading, because where I really care about it is when it's under 1/2. With the totalizer on board, the floats are more a 2nd reference anyway. The totalizer is very precise when I top off the tanks.

    Tim

 

 

 

 

 

 

 	
 

 ====================================

 -List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List

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 _blank">http://forums.matronics.com

 ====================================

 b Site -

           -Matt Dralle, List Admin.

 target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution

 ====================================

 

 

 

 [b]

schmoboy

Joined: 26 Feb 2006
Posts: 130

Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 10:17 am Post subject: Fuel senders

Ya.  Think I have mine set at 10 gallon difference right now.  Maybe 

just increasing that will give me enough spread to reduce the warnings.



Working on IFR approaches now and that damn warning causes undesired eye 

movement and interruptions after my uncoordinated turns. 



-Sean



 	  Quote: 	
		   David Saylor <mailto:saylor.dave(at)gmail.com>

 August 19, 2014 at 12:57 PM

 I adjusted the warning on mine for a pretty large difference, like 

 maybe 15 gallons.  Still warns if I don't reset it, and less spam.



 "The system will give the audible warning “Check Fuel Computer” on 

 startup if the fuel computer’s gallons remaining value

 does not match the fuel tanks level. This feature (if turned on in 

 Instrument Calibration) should warn you if you have added

 fuel and forget to adjust the fuel computer.*The number of gallons 

 that will generate an error is adjusted in Instrument *

 *Calibrate*. Since the fuel levels are NOT accurate when the tanks are 

 near full this value is doubled when the tanks show

 full".



 That way I don't have to be reminded about my uncoordinated turns 



 --Dave



 *

 *

saylor.dave(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 11:06 am Post subject: Fuel senders

Off topic but I found auto trim (TruTrak) to be a big help during approaches.  It wasn't really the trim forces that bothered me as they aren't that big, it was the annunciator on the AP that I found distracting.  Any yeah, getting all those little annoying things cleaned up help a lot not just with approaches but with general enjoyment of the plane.  



do not archive



On Tue, Aug 19, 2014 at 11:16 AM, Sean Stephens <sean(at)stephensville.com (sean(at)stephensville.com)> wrote:

  [quote]--> RV10-List message posted by: Sean Stephens <sean(at)stephensville.com (sean(at)stephensville.com)>

   

 Ya.  Think I have mine set at 10 gallon difference right now.  Maybe just increasing that will give me enough spread to reduce the warnings.

 

 Working on IFR approaches now and that damn warning causes undesired eye movement and interruptions after my uncoordinated turns. 

 

 -Sean

 

  	  Quote: 	
		   David Saylor <mailto:saylor.dave(at)gmail.com (saylor.dave(at)gmail.com)>

 August 19, 2014 at 12:57 PM

 I adjusted the warning on mine for a pretty large difference, like maybe 15 gallons.  Still warns if I don't reset it, and less spam.

 

 "The system will give the audible warning “Check Fuel Computer” on startup if the fuel computer’s gallons remaining value

 does not match the fuel tanks level. This feature (if turned on in Instrument Calibration) should warn you if you have added

 fuel and forget to adjust the fuel computer.*The number of gallons that will generate an error is adjusted in Instrument *

 *Calibrate*. Since the fuel levels are NOT accurate when the tanks are near full this value is doubled when the tanks show

 full".

 

 That way I don't have to be reminded about my uncoordinated turns 

 

 --Dave

 

 

 

 *

 

 

 *

 	
 

 ====================================

 -List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List

 ====================================

  FORUMS -

 _blank">http://forums.matronics.com

 ====================================

 b Site -

           -Matt Dralle, List Admin.

 target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution

 ====================================

 

 

 

 [b]

bwestfall

Joined: 22 Oct 2008
Posts: 131
Location: Portland, OR

Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 10:56 am Post subject: Fuel senders

My next question would be does the D-180 recognize a fuel imbalance any other time than startup?  I think the decision to alert based on real-time changes is to identify the rare event of a tank issue in flight.

 

-Ben

 

 

From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rob Kochman

Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2014 10:39 AM

To: rv10-list

Subject: Re: Re: Fuel senders

 

Weird they implemented it that way.  My old Dynons alert you if the fuel tank level changed since the EFIS was powered off.

 



"The fuel computer can be programmed in EMS > SETUP > FUEL > ADD THRESHOLD to automatically detect the 



addition of fuel while the unit is turned off. When this is configured, the next time you turn the FlightDEK-D180 on, it 



asks you if you added fuel and gives you a shortcut to the add fuel menu."



 

On Tue, Aug 19, 2014 at 11:16 AM, Sean Stephens <sean(at)stephensville.com (sean(at)stephensville.com)> wrote: 	  Quote: 	
		  

--> RV10-List message posted by: Sean Stephens <sean(at)stephensville.com (sean(at)stephensville.com)>



Ya.  Think I have mine set at 10 gallon difference right now.  Maybe just increasing that will give me enough spread to reduce the warnings.



Working on IFR approaches now and that damn warning causes undesired eye movement and interruptions after my uncoordinated turns. 



-Sean 	  Quote: 	
		  

David Saylor <mailto:saylor.dave(at)gmail.com (saylor.dave(at)gmail.com)>

August 19, 2014 at 12:57 PM



I adjusted the warning on mine for a pretty large difference, like maybe 15 gallons.  Still warns if I don't reset it, and less spam.



"The system will give the audible warning “Check Fuel Computer” on startup if the fuel computer’s gallons remaining value

does not match the fuel tanks level. This feature (if turned on in Instrument Calibration) should warn you if you have added



fuel and forget to adjust the fuel computer.*The number of gallons that will generate an error is adjusted in Instrument *

*Calibrate*. Since the fuel levels are NOT accurate when the tanks are near full this value is doubled when the tanks show



full".



That way I don't have to be reminded about my uncoordinated turns 



--Dave





*

* 	






	




 



-- 

Rob Kochman

RV-10 Flying since March 2011



Woodinville, WA



http://kochman.net/N819K



 	  Quote: 	
		   	


  [quote][b]

saylor.dave(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 11:57 am Post subject: Fuel senders

My guess--pure speculation--would be either that 1), AFS wanted a little more distance--no shortcuts--between the gauges and the totalizer, or 2), they didn't think of that.



--Dave

  

On Wed, Aug 20, 2014 at 10:38 AM, Rob Kochman <rv10rob(at)gmail.com (rv10rob(at)gmail.com)> wrote:

  [quote]Weird they implemented it that way.  My old Dynons alert you if the fuel tank level changed since the EFIS was powered off.  



"The fuel computer can be programmed in EMS > SETUP > FUEL > ADD THRESHOLD to automatically detect the 

 addition of fuel while the unit is turned off. When this is configured, the next time you turn the FlightDEK-D180 on, it 

asks you if you added fuel and gives you a shortcut to the add fuel menu."

   



On Tue, Aug 19, 2014 at 11:16 AM, Sean Stephens <sean(at)stephensville.com (sean(at)stephensville.com)> wrote:

    	  Quote: 	
		  --> RV10-List message posted by: Sean Stephens <sean(at)stephensville.com (sean(at)stephensville.com)>

    



 Ya.  Think I have mine set at 10 gallon difference right now.  Maybe just increasing that will give me enough spread to reduce the warnings.

 

 Working on IFR approaches now and that damn warning causes undesired eye movement and interruptions after my uncoordinated turns. 

 

 -Sean

 

  	  Quote: 	
		   David Saylor <mailto:saylor.dave(at)gmail.com (saylor.dave(at)gmail.com)>

 August 19, 2014 at 12:57 PM

 I adjusted the warning on mine for a pretty large difference, like maybe 15 gallons.  Still warns if I don't reset it, and less spam.

 

 "The system will give the audible warning “Check Fuel Computer” on startup if the fuel computer’s gallons remaining value

 does not match the fuel tanks level. This feature (if turned on in Instrument Calibration) should warn you if you have added



 fuel and forget to adjust the fuel computer.*The number of gallons that will generate an error is adjusted in Instrument *

 *Calibrate*. Since the fuel levels are NOT accurate when the tanks are near full this value is doubled when the tanks show

 full".

 

 That way I don't have to be reminded about my uncoordinated turns 

 

 --Dave

 

 

 



 *

 

 

 *

 	
 

 ====================================

 -List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List

 ====================================

  FORUMS -

 _blank">http://forums.matronics.com

 ====================================

 b Site -

           -Matt Dralle, List Admin.

 target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution

 ====================================

 

 

 

 



	




-- 

Rob Kochman

RV-10 Flying since March 2011

 Woodinville, WA

 http://kochman.net/N819K

 

   	  Quote: 	
		  



get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List

tp://forums.matronics.com

_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution



	
[b]

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