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schmoboy
Joined: 26 Feb 2006
Posts: 130
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 Posted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 4:26 pm Post subject: Knocking In Lord Mount at Idle |
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I am experiencing a "knocking" which sounds kinda like metal on metal in
the top right lord mount when the engine is at full idle (~750 RPM) or
right at shutdown when the vibration is the most. I took the lord mount
off and inspected, but all looks right. Well, there does seem to be a
very minute amount of play with the lord mount inside the ears.
Took me a while to isolate it to the top right mount, but finally
arrived there with and extra pair of hands.
Has anyone experienced anything similar to this with their lord mounts?
Not sure what is actually causing the knocking sound.
One further note is that this knocking sound is not present at greater
than idle and the engine is very smooth otherwise.
Thanks,
-Sean #40303
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jmjones2000(at)mindspring
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| Posted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 4:58 pm Post subject: Knocking In Lord Mount at Idle |
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Was it loose at all when you removed it? There should be an insert in there that will rattle around when loose or cracked.
On Sep 3, 2014, at 16:26, Sean Stephens <sean(at)stephensville.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
I am experiencing a "knocking" which sounds kinda like metal on metal in the top right lord mount when the engine is at full idle (~750 RPM) or right at shutdown when the vibration is the most. I took the lord mount off and inspected, but all looks right. Well, there does seem to be a very minute amount of play with the lord mount inside the ears.
Took me a while to isolate it to the top right mount, but finally arrived there with and extra pair of hands.
Has anyone experienced anything similar to this with their lord mounts? Not sure what is actually causing the knocking sound.
One further note is that this knocking sound is not present at greater than idle and the engine is very smooth otherwise.
Thanks,
-Sean #40303
|
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philperry9
Joined: 23 Nov 2011
Posts: 381
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| Posted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 6:37 pm Post subject: Knocking In Lord Mount at Idle |
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I'd try a stethoscope with a long probe on it to isolate it first. They work very well with knocks and cost less than 10 bucks usually. You can find them in just about any parts store, sears, or harbor freight.
You certainly want to know that it's not a lifter knocking with low oil pressure (idle or shutdown). But I'd isolate it for sure so I know 100% where it's coming from.
Phil
On Wed, Sep 3, 2014 at 7:57 PM, Justin Jones <jmjones2000(at)mindspring.com (jmjones2000(at)mindspring.com)> wrote:
[quote]--> RV10-List message posted by: Justin Jones <jmjones2000(at)mindspring.com (jmjones2000(at)mindspring.com)>
Was it loose at all when you removed it? There should be an insert in there that will rattle around when loose or cracked.
On Sep 3, 2014, at 16:26, Sean Stephens <sean(at)stephensville.com (sean(at)stephensville.com)> wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Sean Stephens <sean(at)stephensville.com (sean(at)stephensville.com)>
>
> I am experiencing a "knocking" which sounds kinda like metal on metal in the top right lord mount when the engine is at full idle (~750 RPM) or right at shutdown when the vibration is the most. I took the lord mount off and inspected, but all looks right. Well, there does seem to be a very minute amount of play with the lord mount inside the ears.
>
> Took me a while to isolate it to the top right mount, but finally arrived there with and extra pair of hands.
>
> Has anyone experienced anything similar to this with their lord mounts? Not sure what is actually causing the knocking sound.
>
> One further note is that this knocking sound is not present at greater than idle and the engine is very smooth otherwise.
>
> Thanks,
>
> -Sean #40303
>
>
>
>
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Gordon Anderson
Joined: 16 Apr 2012
Posts: 41
Location: Switzerland
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| Posted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 9:55 pm Post subject: Knocking In Lord Mount at Idle |
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Hi Sean, If the mounts are old and sagged, or the assembly is off center, additional movement from shutdown vibration can cause the bolt sleeve to knock against the inside bore of the mounts. That should be a metal on rubber contact, but might cause the mount to tap on the bore in the ear giving a metal to metal contact.
Good luck with the search.
Gordon
41015 Switzerland
On 04.09.2014, at 02:57, Justin Jones <jmjones2000(at)mindspring.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
Was it loose at all when you removed it? There should be an insert in there that will rattle around when loose or cracked.
On Sep 3, 2014, at 16:26, Sean Stephens <sean(at)stephensville.com> wrote:
>
>
> I am experiencing a "knocking" which sounds kinda like metal on metal in the top right lord mount when the engine is at full idle (~750 RPM) or right at shutdown when the vibration is the most. I took the lord mount off and inspected, but all looks right. Well, there does seem to be a very minute amount of play with the lord mount inside the ears.
>
> Took me a while to isolate it to the top right mount, but finally arrived there with and extra pair of hands.
>
> Has anyone experienced anything similar to this with their lord mounts? Not sure what is actually causing the knocking sound.
>
> One further note is that this knocking sound is not present at greater than idle and the engine is very smooth otherwise.
>
> Thanks,
>
> -Sean #40303
>
>
>
>
|
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schmoboy
Joined: 26 Feb 2006
Posts: 130
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| Posted: Thu Sep 04, 2014 5:08 am Post subject: Knocking In Lord Mount at Idle |
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I'll check the mount again. From page FF1-5 of the plans...
Gordon, the J-3804-20 spacer is supposed to float around inside the
J-3804-20 durometer, but may be contacting the inside wall of the
durometer? I'll check again to see if there are signs of that
happening. Another possibility that I just thought of is that if the
hole in the WD-1001 motor mount that the AN7-26 bolt passes through has
too much play, then the bolt itself could be rattling in there? The
bolt was torqued to ~40 ft. lbs. according to Section 5V.
The engine has been hung on the mounts for roughly a year and the engine
has about 50 tach hours on it, so hoping it is not because they are old.
-Sean
| Quote: | Gordon <mailto:mregoan(at)hispeed.ch>
September 4, 2014 at 12:55 AM
Hi Sean, If the mounts are old and sagged, or the assembly is off
center, additional movement from shutdown vibration can cause the bolt
sleeve to knock against the inside bore of the mounts. That should be
a metal on rubber contact, but might cause the mount to tap on the
bore in the ear giving a metal to metal contact.
Good luck with the search.
Gordon
41015 Switzerland
|
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lljjss22(at)yahoo.com
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| Posted: Thu Sep 04, 2014 6:37 am Post subject: Knocking In Lord Mount at Idle |
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I had the same problem early on. Found that the through bolt was not tightened/torqued properly. Torqued the bolts on all four mounts and never had the problem again. Jearl Strickland
From: Sean Stephens <sean(at)stephensville.com>;
To: <rv10-list(at)matronics.com>;
Subject: Re: Knocking In Lord Mount at Idle
Sent: Thu, Sep 4, 2014 1:06:30 PM
--> RV10-List message posted by: Sean Stephens <[url=javascript:return]sean(at)stephensville.com[/url]>
I'll check the mount again. From page FF1-5 of the plans...
Gordon, the J-3804-20 spacer is supposed to float around inside the
J-3804-20 durometer, but may be contacting the inside wall of the
durometer? I'll check again to see if there are signs of that
happening. Another possibility that I just thought of is that if the
hole in the WD-1001 motor mount that the AN7-26 bolt passes through has
too much play, then the bolt itself could be rattling in there? The
bolt was torqued to ~40 ft. lbs. according to Section 5V.
The engine has been hung on the mounts for roughly a year and the engine
has about 50 tach hours on it, so hoping it is not because they are
[quote][b]
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Gordon Anderson
Joined: 16 Apr 2012
Posts: 41
Location: Switzerland
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| Posted: Thu Sep 04, 2014 10:45 am Post subject: Knocking In Lord Mount at Idle |
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Sean, not quite. The spacer and durometers should be clamped as a rigid stack to the engine mount by the bolt if properly torqued. When the engine shakes the durometers deform in shear, allowing the dynafocal engine mount boss to move laterally. There should normally be enough clearance, but if the elastomers are already deformed when static this clearance can be used up.
Another thought - perhaps the stack could be loose if the nut is torqued up onto the runout of the bolt thread. I ran into this problem on one of my mounts and added another washer under the nut to prevent it.
Gordon
On 04.09.2014, at 15:06, Sean Stephens <sean(at)stephensville.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
I'll check the mount again. From page FF1-5 of the plans...
Gordon, the J-3804-20 spacer is supposed to float around inside the J-3804-20 durometer, but may be contacting the inside wall of the durometer? I'll check again to see if there are signs of that happening. Another possibility that I just thought of is that if the hole in the WD-1001 motor mount that the AN7-26 bolt passes through has too much play, then the bolt itself could be rattling in there? The bolt was torqued to ~40 ft. lbs. according to Section 5V.
The engine has been hung on the mounts for roughly a year and the engine has about 50 tach hours on it, so hoping it is not because they are old.
-Sean
> Gordon <mailto:mregoan(at)hispeed.ch>
> September 4, 2014 at 12:55 AM
>
>
> Hi Sean, If the mounts are old and sagged, or the assembly is off center, additional movement from shutdown vibration can cause the bolt sleeve to knock against the inside bore of the mounts. That should be a metal on rubber contact, but might cause the mount to tap on the bore in the ear giving a metal to metal contact.
>
> Good luck with the search.
>
> Gordon
> 41015 Switzerland
>
>
>
>
>
|
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schmoboy
Joined: 26 Feb 2006
Posts: 130
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| Posted: Thu Sep 04, 2014 3:40 pm Post subject: Knocking In Lord Mount at Idle |
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Gordon, you are the man. It was indeed because the nut torqued on the
bolt thread runout. Added a washer and problem solved. No more knocking.
If we ever cross paths I owe you a cold one. Thanks!
-Sean
| Quote: | Gordon <mailto:mregoan(at)hispeed.ch>
September 4, 2014 at 1:44 PM
Sean, not quite. The spacer and durometers should be clamped as a
rigid stack to the engine mount by the bolt if properly torqued. When
the engine shakes the durometers deform in shear, allowing the
dynafocal engine mount boss to move laterally. There should normally
be enough clearance, but if the elastomers are already deformed when
static this clearance can be used up.
Another thought - perhaps the stack could be loose if the nut is
torqued up onto the runout of the bolt thread. I ran into this problem
on one of my mounts and added another washer under the nut to prevent it.
Gordon
|
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http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List |
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