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nickc(at)mtaonline.net
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 Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2014 9:10 am Post subject: Question for the builders... |
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Hello Kolb builders,
I have all my surfaces ready to cover. I have laid out my wings flaps and ailerons. The only thing I have not done is drill the holes to test mount the hinges. Is there any reason I could not wait and drill the hinge rivet holes once everything is covered? Thanks as always for your thought!
Nick Cassara
Palmer, Alaska
Kolbra N607AK
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azjimmyb(at)gmail.com
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| Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2014 9:31 am Post subject: Question for the builders... |
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Nick... I'm not certain why, but the constr. manual calls for all 1,000 holes to be drilled & deburred prior to covering.
This also allows you to clean out all the drilling debris, probably a good idea.
On Thu, Oct 16, 2014 at 10:10 AM, Nick Cassara <nickc(at)mtaonline.net (nickc(at)mtaonline.net)> wrote:
[quote]
Hello Kolb builders,
I have all my surfaces ready to cover. I have laid out my wings flaps and ailerons. The only thing I have not done is drill the holes to test mount the hinges. Is there any reason I could not wait and drill the hinge rivet holes once everything is covered? Thanks as always for your thought!
Nick Cassara
Palmer, Alaska
Kolbra N607AK
| Quote: |
get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
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John Hauck
Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)
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| Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2014 9:33 am Post subject: Question for the builders... |
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Nick:
I find it much easier to trim the hinges to fit, drill all the rivet holes in the hinges, then fit, adjust, and drill all the holes in the spars using the predrilled hinges, secured with Clecos, as a template.
When I finish covering wings, ailerons, and flaps, I use a pencil tip soldering iron to open rivet and drain holes. After Polybrush, I cement the gap seal, complete processing the wing through finish paint. Finally, I rivet the hinges to the wings, flaps, and ailerons. Makes a much finer looking job.
john h
mkIII
Crawfordville, Florida
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Nick Cassara
Sent: Thursday, October 16, 2014 12:10 PM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Question for the builders...
Hello Kolb builders,
I have all my surfaces ready to cover. I have laid out my wings flaps and ailerons. The only thing I have not done is drill the holes to test mount the hinges. Is there any reason I could not wait and drill the hinge rivet holes once everything is covered? Thanks as always for your thought!
Nick Cassara
Palmer, Alaska
Kolbra N607AK01234567890123
[quote][b]
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John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama |
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Rex Rodebush
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 209
Location: Branson West area, Missouri
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| Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2014 10:08 am Post subject: Re: Question for the builders... |
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I agree. Drilling the hinge holes with the fabric on would be a real mess. The hot solder iron trick works great.
Caution: When I covered my flaps and ailerons I went too far with the heat shrink and bowed the leading edges. Not a lot but enough that the hinges could not be installed. Had to recover. Just watch the L..E. and when it just starts to bend...STOP.
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rowedenny
Joined: 09 Mar 2008
Posts: 338
Location: Western PA
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| Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2014 10:11 am Post subject: Question for the builders... |
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I'd drill em now, just use aluminum rivets in every 6th hole or so to hold things aligned as you drill, than remove and deburr before covering. Than burn out the holes in fabric with a solder pencil before you paint while you can still see the holes.
If you drill after you cover you are going to be patching holes.
Dennis "Skid" RoweMk3, Rotax 670,
Leechburg, PA
On Oct 16, 2014, at 1:10 PM, "Nick Cassara" <nickc(at)mtaonline.net (nickc(at)mtaonline.net)> wrote:
[quote] <![endif]--> <![endif]-->
Hello Kolb builders,
I have all my surfaces ready to cover. I have laid out my wings flaps and ailerons. The only thing I have not done is drill the holes to test mount the hinges. Is there any reason I could not wait and drill the hinge rivet holes once everything is covered? Thanks as always for your thought!
Nick Cassara
Palmer, Alaska
Kolbra N607AK
[b]
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stuart(at)harnerfarm.net
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| Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2014 10:34 am Post subject: Question for the builders... |
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Nick,
My firefly was a quick build where the factory had already attached all the hinges with temporary rivets. All of the other rivet locations had a “dimple” where the holes were to be located but they were not dilled out.
I drilled out the temporary rivets so I could use the drill press to finish the holes in the hinges. I then waited until all covering and painting were done before drilling the rest of the holes in the airframe, using the now drilled hinges as guides. As I covered, I kept the holes cleaned out, so they were easy to locate later.
Although what I did worked out well, I kind of wished I had drilled everything before covering. I think it would have made final assembly easier.
One think that I do regret is when I put the rudder half hinges on the rudder laying on the bench. Then I mounted the tail post halves on to the airframe separately, thinking I could just line up the hinges and drop the pins in place. I had done this on the wings with no problems, but on the rudder, for some reason the lower hinge would not align without a LOT of force on the rudder. I wound up slightly bending the bottom of the rudder and put a wrinkle in the fabric. Did not even notice it until it was all done. L
My take is to pre-drill all the holes and be VERY careful with light weight structures.
Worth what you paid for it….
Stuart
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Nick Cassara
Sent: Thursday, October 16, 2014 12:10 PM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Question for the builders...
Hello Kolb builders,
I have all my surfaces ready to cover. I have laid out my wings flaps and ailerons. The only thing I have not done is drill the holes to test mount the hinges. Is there any reason I could not wait and drill the hinge rivet holes once everything is covered? Thanks as always for your thought!
Nick Cassara
Palmer, Alaska
Kolbra N607AK | Quote: | | http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List |
01234567
[quote][b]
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WhiskeyVictor36(at)aol.co
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| Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2014 8:32 am Post subject: Question for the builders... |
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Nick,
When I was a youngster, my dad used to argue with me saying "you can do it any way you want to, but if I were doing it", and then he would proceed to tell me his way to do something.
Well, I won't say it quite that way, but here's an idea that is especially useful for the wings and ailerons.
Drill the holes smaller than for the rivets and use # 6 sheet metal screws (4 per hinge) to hold things together. After checking the folding operation and making any minor adjustments to hole location, remove the screws and drill all the holes out to the rivet size. Be sure to mark each hinge assembly so it can be properly repositioned after covering, because the hole locations will probably not all be exactly alike.
This was not my idea, read it somewhere, maybe even in my Kolb FireStar builders manual.
Bill Varnes
Original Kolb FireStar
Audubon NJ
Do Not Archive
In a message dated 10/16/2014 1:11:01 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, nickc(at)mtaonline.net writes:
| Quote: |
Hello Kolb builders,
I have all my surfaces ready to cover. I have laid out my wings flaps and ailerons. The only thing I have not done is drill the holes to test mount the hinges. Is there any reason I could not wait and drill the hinge rivet holes once everything is covered? Thanks as always for your thought!
Nick Cassara
Palmer, Alaska
Kolbra N607AK
| Quote: |
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tp://forums.matronics.com/">http://forums.matronics.com
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href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
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rickofudall
Joined: 19 Sep 2009
Posts: 1392
Location: Udall, KS, USA
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| Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2014 12:51 pm Post subject: Question for the builders... |
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As James and John pointed out, you need to deburr all the rivet holes before riveting. This does two things; removes a potential starting point for a crack later on, and if left on, the burr acts as a shim that deteriorates with time due to vibration and gradually allows movement of the no longer tight joint to begin wallowing out the rivet holes.One other thing about drilling around tightened, doped fabric; if your drill bit slips off the tube and slides to the wrong side of the tube you get to practice patching on your nice new cover job.
On the up side you'll create combinations of swear words and descriptions of ancestry probably never heard before.
Rick Girard
do not archive
On Thu, Oct 16, 2014 at 1:33 PM, Stuart Harner <stuart(at)harnerfarm.net (stuart(at)harnerfarm.net)> wrote:
| Quote: |
Nick,
My firefly was a quick build where the factory had already attached all the hinges with temporary rivets. All of the other rivet locations had a “dimple” where the holes were to be located but they were not dilled out.
I drilled out the temporary rivets so I could use the drill press to finish the holes in the hinges. I then waited until all covering and painting were done before drilling the rest of the holes in the airframe, using the now drilled hinges as guides. As I covered, I kept the holes cleaned out, so they were easy to locate later.
Although what I did worked out well, I kind of wished I had drilled everything before covering. I think it would have made final assembly easier.
One think that I do regret is when I put the rudder half hinges on the rudder laying on the bench. Then I mounted the tail post halves on to the airframe separately, thinking I could just line up the hinges and drop the pins in place. I had done this on the wings with no problems, but on the rudder, for some reason the lower hinge would not align without a LOT of force on the rudder. I wound up slightly bending the bottom of the rudder and put a wrinkle in the fabric. Did not even notice it until it was all done. L
My take is to pre-drill all the holes and be VERY careful with light weight structures.
Worth what you paid for it….
Stuart
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com) [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com)] On Behalf Of Nick Cassara
Sent: Thursday, October 16, 2014 12:10 PM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com (kolb-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Question for the builders...
Hello Kolb builders,
I have all my surfaces ready to cover. I have laid out my wings flaps and ailerons. The only thing I have not done is drill the holes to test mount the hinges. Is there any reason I could not wait and drill the hinge rivet holes once everything is covered? Thanks as always for your thought!
Nick Cassara
Palmer, Alaska
Kolbra N607AK01234567
8
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Believe those who are seeking the truth, doubt those who find it.
-Andre Gide
[quote][b]
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The smallest miracle right in front of you is enough to make you happy.... |
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