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Yaw Damper

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bob88

Joined: 24 Feb 2013
Posts: 99

Posted: Sun Nov 30, 2014 5:28 am Post subject: Yaw Damper

I noticed that Garmin has a yaw damper for the -10 now. For those flying, is this needed? Is the plane unstable in yaw axis or dutch roll in turbulence enough to justify the yaw damper?

arplnplt(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Nov 30, 2014 5:41 am Post subject: Yaw Damper

With out a doubt. No.

I sometimes feel a tiny tail waggle after a bit of turbulence when loaded very after CG, but even then it is very brief and does not continue.



Dave Leikam



 	  Quote: 	
		   On Nov 30, 2014, at 7:28 AM, bob88 <marty.crooks(at)comcast.net> wrote:

 

 

 

 I noticed that Garmin has a yaw damper for the -10 now. For those flying, is this needed? Is the plane unstable in yaw axis or dutch roll in turbulence enough to justify the yaw damper?

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=435088#435088

jesse(at)saintaviation.co
Guest

Posted: Sun Nov 30, 2014 5:45 am Post subject: Yaw Damper

A yaw damper is not needed. It does improve the stability, but very few -10's have yaw dampers and most will say that it is fine without. 



Jesse Saint

Saint Aviation, Inc.

352-427-0285

jesse(at)saintaviation.com



Sent from my iPad



 	  Quote: 	
		   On Nov 30, 2014, at 8:28 AM, bob88 <marty.crooks(at)comcast.net> wrote:

 

 

 

 I noticed that Garmin has a yaw damper for the -10 now. For those flying, is this needed? Is the plane unstable in yaw axis or dutch roll in turbulence enough to justify the yaw damper?

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=435088#435088

davidsoutpost(at)comcast.
Guest

Posted: Sun Nov 30, 2014 7:06 am Post subject: Yaw Damper

No need IMHO.  The -10 is a very stable plane.

From: "bob88" <marty.crooks(at)comcast.net>

To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com

Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2014 8:28:29 AM

Subject: Yaw Damper

--> RV10-List message posted by: "bob88" <marty.crooks(at)comcast.net>

I noticed that Garmin has a yaw damper for the -10 now. For those flying, is this needed? Is the plane unstable in yaw axis or dutch roll in turbulence enough to justify the yaw damper?

Read this topic online here:

http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=435088#435088

bsp;                                    - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -<======

 [quote][b]

stein(at)steinair.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Nov 30, 2014 11:51 am Post subject: Yaw Damper

As others have said, it's not "needed", but those who have them will tell

you it sure is "nice", especially when you basically get free rudder trim

out of the deal.  It also depends on where/how you fly (and how the plane is

loaded obviously) and who is in the back seat. Front seat folks will rarely

notice the waggle, and well heeled small airplane passengers in the back

also won't really notice, but if you have folks who are either not

accustomed to small aircraft or prone to not liking the slight waggle that

you occasionally get, then it's a nice addition.



I've seen several dozen of these installed, and yet to hear a complaint from

those using them....but as previously mentioned (like many things in the

planes), it's not a "must have", but it is a "nice to have". Kind of like

Heated Seats for some of us! 



Cheers,

Stein 



--

rv10(at)texasrv10.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Nov 30, 2014 1:54 pm Post subject: Yaw Damper

Wife wants it. I have it, not installed yet. Stein describes the reasons perfectly.



Gaylon Koenning

[quote] On Nov 30, 2014, at 1:48 PM, Stein Bruch <stein(at)steinair.com> wrote:

 

 

 

 As others have said, it's not "needed", but those who have them will tell

 you it sure is "nice", especially when you basically get free rudder trim

 out of the deal.  It also depends on where/how you fly (and how the plane is

 loaded obviously) and who is in the back seat. Front seat folks will rarely

 notice the waggle, and well heeled small airplane passengers in the back

 also won't really notice, but if you have folks who are either not

 accustomed to small aircraft or prone to not liking the slight waggle that

 you occasionally get, then it's a nice addition.

 

 I've seen several dozen of these installed, and yet to hear a complaint from

 those using them....but as previously mentioned (like many things in the

 planes), it's not a "must have", but it is a "nice to have". Kind of like

 Heated Seats for some of us! 

 

 Cheers,

 Stein 

 

 

 

 --

Kelly McMullen

Joined: 16 Apr 2008
Posts: 1188
Location: Sun Lakes AZ

Posted: Mon Dec 01, 2014 6:54 am Post subject: Yaw Damper

Does anyone know if there is a stand alone yaw damper or one compatible with the Dynon Skyview system?

On Sun, Nov 30, 2014 at 2:51 PM, RV10(at)TEXASRV10.COM (RV10(at)TEXASRV10.COM) <rv10(at)texasrv10.com (rv10(at)texasrv10.com)> wrote:

[quote]--> RV10-List message posted by: "RV10(at)TEXASRV10.COM (RV10(at)TEXASRV10.COM)" <rv10(at)texasrv10.com (rv10(at)texasrv10.com)>

 

 Wife wants it. I have it, not installed yet. Stein describes the reasons perfectly.

 

 Gaylon Koenning

 

 

 > On Nov 30, 2014, at 1:48 PM, Stein Bruch <stein(at)steinair.com (stein(at)steinair.com)> wrote:

 >

 > --> RV10-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com (stein(at)steinair.com)>

 >

 > As others have said, it's not "needed", but those who have them will tell

 > you it sure is "nice", especially when you basically get free rudder trim

 > out of the deal.  It also depends on where/how you fly (and how the plane is

 > loaded obviously) and who is in the back seat. Front seat folks will rarely

 > notice the waggle, and well heeled small airplane passengers in the back

 > also won't really notice, but if you have folks who are either not

 > accustomed to small aircraft or prone to not liking the slight waggle that

 > you occasionally get, then it's a nice addition.

 >

 > I've seen several dozen of these installed, and yet to hear a complaint from

 > those using them....but as previously mentioned (like many things in the

 > planes), it's not a "must have", but it is a "nice to have". Kind of like

 > Heated Seats for some of us! 

 >

 > Cheers,

 > Stein

 >

 >

 >

 > --

_________________
Kelly McMullen
A&P/IA, EAA Tech Counselor
KCHD

jesse(at)saintaviation.co
Guest

Posted: Mon Dec 01, 2014 7:14 am Post subject: Yaw Damper

Not that I am aware of. 



Jesse SaintI-TEC, Inc.

jesse(at)itecusa.org (jesse(at)itecusa.org)

www.itecusa.org

www.mavericklsa.com

C: 352-427-0285

O: 352-465-4545

F: 815-377-3694

Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 1, 2014, at 9:49 AM, Kelly McMullen <apilot2(at)gmail.com (apilot2(at)gmail.com)> wrote:

[quote]Does anyone know if there is a stand alone yaw damper or one compatible with the Dynon Skyview system?

On Sun, Nov 30, 2014 at 2:51 PM, RV10(at)TEXASRV10.COM (RV10(at)TEXASRV10.COM) <rv10(at)texasrv10.com (rv10(at)texasrv10.com)> wrote:

[quote]--> RV10-List message posted by: "RV10(at)TEXASRV10.COM (RV10(at)TEXASRV10.COM)" <rv10(at)texasrv10.com (rv10(at)texasrv10.com)>

 

 Wife wants it. I have it, not installed yet. Stein describes the reasons perfectly.

 

 Gaylon Koenning

 

 

 > On Nov 30, 2014, at 1:48 PM, Stein Bruch <stein(at)steinair.com (stein(at)steinair.com)> wrote:

 >

 > --> RV10-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com (stein(at)steinair.com)>

 >

 > As others have said, it's not "needed", but those who have them will tell

 > you it sure is "nice", especially when you basically get free rudder trim

 > out of the deal.  It also depends on where/how you fly (and how the plane is

 > loaded obviously) and who is in the back seat. Front seat folks will rarely

 > notice the waggle, and well heeled small airplane passengers in the back

 > also won't really notice, but if you have folks who are either not

 > accustomed to small aircraft or prone to not liking the slight waggle that

 > you occasionally get, then it's a nice addition.

 >

 > I've seen several dozen of these installed, and yet to hear a complaint from

 > those using them....but as previously mentioned (like many things in the

 > planes), it's not a "must have", but it is a "nice to have". Kind of like

 > Heated Seats for some of us! 

 >

 > Cheers,

 > Stein

 >

 >

 >

 > --

stein(at)steinair.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Dec 01, 2014 7:30 am Post subject: Yaw Damper

At the moment I think TruTrak and Garmin have the only systems available, and neither as standalone as far as I know.

 

Cheers,

Stein 

 

 

 

From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kelly McMullen

Sent: Monday, December 01, 2014 8:49 AM

To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com

Subject: Re: Yaw Damper

 

Does anyone know if there is a stand alone yaw damper or one compatible with the Dynon Skyview system?



 

On Sun, Nov 30, 2014 at 2:51 PM, RV10(at)TEXASRV10.COM (RV10(at)TEXASRV10.COM) <rv10(at)texasrv10.com (rv10(at)texasrv10.com)> wrote:

--> RV10-List message posted by: "RV10(at)TEXASRV10.COM (RV10(at)TEXASRV10.COM)" <rv10(at)texasrv10.com (rv10(at)texasrv10.com)>



Wife wants it. I have it, not installed yet. Stein describes the reasons perfectly.



Gaylon Koenning

[quote] On Nov 30, 2014, at 1:48 PM, Stein Bruch <stein(at)steinair.com (stein(at)steinair.com)> wrote:



 --> RV10-List message posted by: "Stein Bruch" <stein(at)steinair.com (stein(at)steinair.com)>



 As others have said, it's not "needed", but those who have them will tell

 you it sure is "nice", especially when you basically get free rudder trim

 out of the deal.  It also depends on where/how you fly (and how the plane is

 loaded obviously) and who is in the back seat. Front seat folks will rarely

 notice the waggle, and well heeled small airplane passengers in the back

 also won't really notice, but if you have folks who are either not

 accustomed to small aircraft or prone to not liking the slight waggle that

 you occasionally get, then it's a nice addition.



 I've seen several dozen of these installed, and yet to hear a complaint from

 those using them....but as previously mentioned (like many things in the

 planes), it's not a "must have", but it is a "nice to have". Kind of like

 Heated Seats for some of us! 



 Cheers,

 Stein



 --

johngoodman

Joined: 18 Sep 2006
Posts: 530
Location: GA

Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2014 6:48 am Post subject: Re: Yaw Damper

I have never noticed the need for a yaw damper, but it's very rare that my back seats are occupied. My wife much prefers the heated seats, same here. Besides, I'm a little more nose heavy that most, which would reduce the issue.

Nice to see that manufacturers are paying attention to the experimental market....

John

_________________
#40572 Phase One complete in 2011

aerosport1

Joined: 07 Nov 2007
Posts: 231

Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2014 12:23 pm Post subject: Yaw Damper

Being involved with the RV-10  for over 8 years now.  I have never seen or

heard of anyone other than 

Trutrak that ever had a yaw damper installed. This has been a discussion

many times at Oshkosh RV-10

Headquarters and other RV get together. I have yet to know anyone has that

installed one. The consensus was it was not a needed 

Item at all and would be a waste of money. This was from most people that

had been flying their 10's for at least a year or more.

I would be interested to hear how many people actually have the Trutrak or

some other yaw damper installed in the RV-10. 

Since Garmin just came out with theirs I would say only a few Garmin have

been installed in aircraft for testing.



Just Curious 

Geoff Combs



--

_________________
Geoff Combs
RV-10 QB N829GW
Flying 500 hrs
40033

Tim Olson

Joined: 25 Jan 2007
Posts: 2879

Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2014 12:39 pm Post subject: Yaw Damper

I haven't heard of many either, but I'll add my comments I guess.



Personally, I would not spend the money and add the weight.

It's not something that you NEED on an RV-10, but,

I do notice in turbulence that it can wag it's tail.

I just use my feet then to keep it more stable.



But, if you have the one in a hundred wives who just can't

stand any waggle, then it is something you may be interested

in trying.  So, while I would never justify it for myself,

and I would never recommend someone buy it BEFORE they fly

their RV-10 for a while, I can see that there may be the

occasional person who could benefit from it.

So, if you think you need it, after flying, go ahead.

If you're not flying yet, I'd say hold off and gather some

good experience first.



Tim

On 12/2/2014 2:21 PM, Geoff Combs wrote:

[quote] 



 Being involved with the RV-10  for over 8 years now.  I have never seen or

 heard of anyone other than

 Trutrak that ever had a yaw damper installed. This has been a discussion

 many times at Oshkosh RV-10

 Headquarters and other RV get together. I have yet to know anyone has that

 installed one. The consensus was it was not a needed

 Item at all and would be a waste of money. This was from most people that

 had been flying their 10's for at least a year or more.

 I would be interested to hear how many people actually have the Trutrak or

 some other yaw damper installed in the RV-10.

 Since Garmin just came out with theirs I would say only a few Garmin have

 been installed in aircraft for testing.



 Just Curious

 Geoff Combs



 --

woxofswa

Joined: 12 Aug 2008
Posts: 349
Location: AZ

Posted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 10:55 am Post subject: Re: Yaw Damper

If I were building again and Dynon had an option that was equivelent in cost to combined electric rudder and aileron trim, I would do it, and just delete the aileron trim which hasn't proved necessary. I see the value of the damper products in the trim feature (which is useful) and not the damper.

_________________
Myron Nelson
Mesa, AZ
Flew May 10 2014

bob88

Joined: 24 Feb 2013
Posts: 99

Posted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 12:04 pm Post subject: Re: Yaw Damper

Related question:

If one has the Garmin aileron servo, is the Van's aileron trim needed?

stein(at)steinair.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 1:05 pm Post subject: Yaw Damper

While the autopilot is engages, it "could" probably be used to trim the

airplane, but that's not a good way to do things - it's better to have the

stand alone trim and either then let the A/P trim it for you, or manually

trim the plane so that the forces on the control surfaces are neutral (at

least from a flight control rigging standpoint).



Cheers,



Stein

--

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