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Guy Buchanan
Joined: 16 Jul 2006
Posts: 1204
Location: Ramona, CA
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 Posted: Thu Jun 11, 2015 3:00 pm Post subject: 1st Engine Start |
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Woohoo! 1st engine start in four years. Just got the 912s running today. I didn't do much since I didn't bring any hearing protection but I did generate some questions:
- At 12.5d at the tip of a 70" Warp taper tip I'm getting 5500 rpm WOT. Any guesses on what I should try next to get 5200?
- It took FOREVER for the temperature to come up and the most I saw was CHT 175F and oil temp 170F. (5 minutes run time.) I have a water thermostat. I'm contemplating the oil thermostat but will wait for more testing. My thermostat is 190F, so I expected the radiator to be cold, but it wasn't, indicating that the water temperature was probably much higher than 175F. My question is: should I run water temperature and pressure? I'm thinking I could incorporate these into the thermostat manifold. (It's downstream of the water spider.) Is it worth the hassle? (Particularly water temp, which Rotax says I MUST have for the regular coolant I'm running. I've got a GRT 2000 engine monitor so the display part is easy.)
- I'm idling at about 2200. What should I use for us Kitfoxers? (Manual says 1400. Is that possible?)
Thanks in advance for the consideration. Looking forward to flying when my cowl gets done.
Guy Buchanan
Ramona, CA
Kitfox IV-1200 / 912-S / Warp 3cs / 500 hrs. and grounded
Now a glider pilot, too.
[quote][b]
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_________________
Guy Buchanan
Deceased K-IV 1200
A glider pilot too. |
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michaellogan41(at)gmail.c
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| Posted: Thu Jun 11, 2015 7:42 pm Post subject: 1st Engine Start |
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Guy,
What did you do to the Kitfox that took you four years? I am deep into the eighth year. I started the engine about three years ago but have been rebuilding building the cowling to fit the new gearbox since then. Currently building a hangar and house so I do not see getting the plane flying this year.
Mike Logan
Series 5 EA81
On Thu, Jun 11, 2015 at 6:00 PM, Guy Buchanan <gebuchanan(at)cox.net (gebuchanan(at)cox.net)> wrote:
[quote] Woohoo! 1st engine start in four years. Just got the 912s running today. I didn't do much since I didn't bring any hearing protection but I did generate some questions:
- At 12.5d at the tip of a 70" Warp taper tip I'm getting 5500 rpm WOT. Any guesses on what I should try next to get 5200?
- It took FOREVER for the temperature to come up and the most I saw was CHT 175F and oil temp 170F. (5 minutes run time.) I have a water thermostat. I'm contemplating the oil thermostat but will wait for more testing. My thermostat is 190F, so I expected the radiator to be cold, but it wasn't, indicating that the water temperature was probably much higher than 175F. My question is: should I run water temperature and pressure? I'm thinking I could incorporate these into the thermostat manifold. (It's downstream of the water spider.) Is it worth the hassle? (Particularly water temp, which Rotax says I MUST have for the regular coolant I'm running. I've got a GRT 2000 engine monitor so the display part is easy.)
- I'm idling at about 2200. What should I use for us Kitfoxers? (Manual says 1400. Is that possible?)
Thanks in advance for the consideration. Looking forward to flying when my cowl gets done.
Guy Buchanan
Ramona, CA
Kitfox IV-1200 / 912-S / Warp 3cs / 500 hrs. and grounded
Now a glider pilot, too.
| Quote: |
arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
|
[b]
| | - The Matronics Kitfox-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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Dick Maddux
Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Posts: 516
Location: Milton, Fl
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| Posted: Fri Jun 12, 2015 3:43 am Post subject: 1st Engine Start |
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Guy,
You can increase the prop pitch about a degree I believe to get the proper 5200 rpm. I get about 5300 WOT on my take off roll (close enough) I have a Kiev but used to have a Warp taper tip. (hanging on the wall now)
Your warm up time is about the same as mine. I don't have a thermo so I use tape on my radiator in addition to cockpit controllable shutters. It works fine. Takes me about 5 minutes before I get 120 on my oil temp and that equates to about 170 or so on the water temp.I usually run about 180 on the water temp in the air but with the shutters I can squeak it a little higher.(shutters on the oil radiator also)
My idle is set about 1600 or so although I manually keep it at 1800 on the ground for the gearbox. If you can set your idle at 1400 it would probably make for a better and more controllable approach. The air load increases the idle and It is difficult to get the airplane on the ground with the idle set too high. If it is too low then the engine might quit on final. (happened to me 3 times) Once you fly the airplane ,you will have to do some tweaking. Sounds like you are in the ballpark though.
It is 0630 down here in hot,humid,flat,miserable Florida. I think I will go fly before it hits 95. (75now) Glad you suggested that ! Sounds like coffee and a breakfast sandwich at the local store enroute.
Have fun
Dick Maddux
Fox 4, 912UL
[quote][b]
| | - The Matronics Kitfox-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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Pat Reilly
Joined: 06 Aug 2009
Posts: 345
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| Posted: Fri Jun 12, 2015 7:44 am Post subject: 1st Engine Start |
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Guy, I run a 582. But, you would increase the degree of prop pitch to lower the static rpm. Try another 1/2 a degree, which would bring you to 13 degrees, and see what happens.
Pat Reilly
Mod 3 582 Rebuilt
Rockford, IL
On Thu, Jun 11, 2015 at 10:41 PM, Michael Logan <michaellogan41(at)gmail.com (michaellogan41(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | Guy,
What did you do to the Kitfox that took you four years? I am deep into the eighth year. I started the engine about three years ago but have been rebuilding building the cowling to fit the new gearbox since then. Currently building a hangar and house so I do not see getting the plane flying this year.
Mike Logan
Series 5 EA81
On Thu, Jun 11, 2015 at 6:00 PM, Guy Buchanan <gebuchanan(at)cox.net (gebuchanan(at)cox.net)> wrote:
| Quote: | Woohoo! 1st engine start in four years. Just got the 912s running today. I didn't do much since I didn't bring any hearing protection but I did generate some questions:
- At 12.5d at the tip of a 70" Warp taper tip I'm getting 5500 rpm WOT. Any guesses on what I should try next to get 5200?
- It took FOREVER for the temperature to come up and the most I saw was CHT 175F and oil temp 170F. (5 minutes run time.) I have a water thermostat. I'm contemplating the oil thermostat but will wait for more testing. My thermostat is 190F, so I expected the radiator to be cold, but it wasn't, indicating that the water temperature was probably much higher than 175F. My question is: should I run water temperature and pressure? I'm thinking I could incorporate these into the thermostat manifold. (It's downstream of the water spider.) Is it worth the hassle? (Particularly water temp, which Rotax says I MUST have for the regular coolant I'm running. I've got a GRT 2000 engine monitor so the display part is easy.)
- I'm idling at about 2200. What should I use for us Kitfoxers? (Manual says 1400. Is that possible?)
Thanks in advance for the consideration. Looking forward to flying when my cowl gets done.
Guy Buchanan
Ramona, CA
Kitfox IV-1200 / 912-S / Warp 3cs / 500 hrs. and grounded
Now a glider pilot, too.
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| Quote: |
arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
|
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--
Pat Reilly
Mod 3 582 Rebuild
Rockford,IL
[quote][b]
| | - The Matronics Kitfox-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List |
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Jim Shumaker
Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 106
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| Posted: Fri Jun 12, 2015 7:25 pm Post subject: 1st Engine Start |
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Hi Guy
The slower the idle the shorter and easier the landing. That being said, it is difficult to get the engine to idle smoothly at 1400. I set it to idle as close to 1400 as it would run smoothly. To really land short you can set it to stop at idle, but then you have to be a little more careful with the throttle on landing.
5 minutes doesn't sound like a long time to get the temps up and then it never got over 175 for me unless I was flying and 195 took warm weather. I used the water temp sensor (in the spider) for a few years and then changed to the cylinder head temp...which is basically the water temp at that location as I understand it.
Was that a static rpm? If so the engine will likely reduce rpm when you start accelerating. I believe I was running closer to 10.5 degrees, but its been a couple of years. The taper tip Warp drive seems to lose grip when static and then when run up to a higher rpm. It will catch, slow down a bit and then come back up as you accelerate above stall. The only way I found to set it is to fly. I liked 5800 WOT at sea level max rpm.
Jim Shumaker
Kitfox III 912 ul for 12 years.
Citabria 7GCAA 150hp
On Friday, June 12, 2015 8:49 AM, Patrick Reilly <patreilly43(at)gmail.com> wrote:
Guy, I run a 582. But, you would increase the degree of prop pitch to lower the static rpm. Try another 1/2 a degree, which would bring you to 13 degrees, and see what happens.
Pat Reilly
Mod 3 582 Rebuilt
Rockford, IL
On Thu, Jun 11, 2015 at 10:41 PM, Michael Logan <michaellogan41(at)gmail.com (michaellogan41(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | Guy,
What did you do to the Kitfox that took you four years? I am deep into the eighth year. I started the engine about three years ago but have been rebuilding building the cowling to fit the new gearbox since then. Currently building a hangar and house so I do not see getting the plane flying this year.
Mike Logan
Series 5 EA81
On Thu, Jun 11, 2015 at 6:00 PM, Guy Buchanan <gebuchanan(at)cox.net (gebuchanan(at)cox.net)> wrote:
| Quote: | Woohoo! 1st engine start in four years. Just got the 912s running today. I didn't do much since I didn't bring any hearing protection but I did generate some questions:
- At 12.5d at the tip of a 70" Warp taper tip I'm getting 5500 rpm WOT. Any guesses on what I should try next to get 5200?
- It took FOREVER for the temperature to come up and the most I saw was CHT 175F and oil temp 170F. (5 minutes run time.) I have a water thermostat. I'm contemplating the oil thermostat but will wait for more testing. My thermostat is 190F, so I expected the radiator to be cold, but it wasn't, indicating that the water temperature was probably much higher than 175F. My question is: should I run water temperature and pressure? I'm thinking I could incorporate these into the thermostat manifold. (It's downstream of the water spider.) Is it worth the hassle? (Particularly water temp, which Rotax says I MUST have for the regular coolant I'm running. I've got a GRT 2000 engine monitor so the display part is easy.)
- I'm idling at about 2200. What should I use for us Kitfoxers? (Manual says 1400. Is that possible?)
Thanks in advance for the consideration. Looking forward to flying when my cowl gets done.
Guy Buchanan
Ramona, CA
Kitfox IV-1200 / 912-S / Warp 3cs / 500 hrs. and grounded
Now a glider pilot, too.
|
| Quote: |
arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
|
|
--
Pat Reilly
Mod 3 582 Rebuild
Rockford,IL
| Quote: |
arget="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List
el="nofollow">http://forums.matronics.com
_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
|
[quote][b]
| | - The Matronics Kitfox-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List |
|
_________________
Jim Shumaker |
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