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kkcmax(at)msn.com
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 Posted: Mon Jan 11, 2016 2:49 am Post subject: Kolb-List Digest: 14 Msgs - 01/10/16 |
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I have two also have well over 100 hours driving ultralight of many kinds the base for all of Kolb but at best a mark Xtra is a over grown Firestarter they are not mentioned to have glass cockpits rockets bombs or all the stuff people want to stuff in the wings they are ment to have fun with not to fly to Alaska in sorry but you asked for my 2 cents
Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE smartphone
-------- Original message --------
From: Kolb-List Digest Server <kolb-list(at)matronics.com>
Date: 01/11/2016 3:04 AM (GMT-06:00)
To: Kolb-List Digest List <kolb-list-digest(at)matronics.com>
Subject: Kolb-List Digest: 14 Msgs - 01/10/16
*
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EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
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----------------------------------------------------------
Kolb-List Digest Archive
---
Total Messages Posted Sun 01/10/16: 14
----------------------------------------------------------
Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:30 AM - Re: Weight in one wing...? (Patrick Ladd)
2. 07:58 AM - Re: Weight in one wing...? (Martin Koxxy)
3. 09:12 AM - Re: Re: Horizontal stabilizer seals (Richard Girard)
4. 09:37 AM - Re: Re: Horizontal stabilizer seals (william sullivan)
5. 10:15 AM - Re: Re: Horizontal stabilizer seals (Charlie England)
6. 11:43 AM - Re: Re: Horizontal stabilizer seals (mojavjoe(at)comcast.net)
7. 11:44 AM - Re: Kolb-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 01/09/16 (Keith Callfas)
8. 11:47 AM - Re: Re: Aileron trim (Jack B. Hart)
9. 12:11 PM - Re: Re: Horizontal stabilizer seals (Jack B. Hart)
10. 12:59 PM - Re: Re: Horizontal stabilizer seals (John Hauck)
11. 01:07 PM - Re: Re: Kolb-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 01/09/16 (John Hauck)
12. 01:29 PM - Re: Re: Kolb-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 01/09/16 (Richard Neilsen)
13. 05:13 PM - Re: Re: Kolb-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 01/09/16 (kinne russ)
14. 06:20 PM - Re: Re: Kolb-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 01/09/16 (Bradley Nation)
________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________
Time: 03:30:05 AM PST US
From: Patrick Ladd <patrickjladd(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Weight in one wing...?
Hi Charlie,
i suppose what I was asking in a guarded manner was why would anyone in
a ultralight, or indeed any light aircraft want an unnecessary
complication like this. Still we all pimp our rides to suit ourselves.
As far as the extra 11 ozs goes I would have thought that in the fight
to keep ultralight below the legal weight limit even 11 ozs. needs to be
watched. Weight increases naturally after the initial weighing anyway
with radios, GPS, cameras etc.
The guy who built my Extra added all sorts of odd little brackets or a
bit of stiffening or beefing up wherever he saw what he considered a
weak point. All without consulting me a couple of hundred miles away.
This caused all sorts of fancy maths to get her certified as a
microlight.
Cheers
Pat
From: Charlie England
Sent: Saturday, January 9, 2016 8:00 PM
Subject: Re: Weight in one wing...?
LRI's are basically angle of attack indicators. I suppose you could
argue that you don't need them on an ultralite (type) a/c, but then, we
don't know how he intends to use the a/c. US Navy pilots depend on AOA
indicators to land on carriers safely, and some 'bush' pilots do, too.
As far as balance goes, odds are high that component tolerances and
build errors will easily mask an 11 oz weight difference. On a plane
with wing tanks, just over 0.1 gallons of fuel difference between tanks
would cause that much imbalance.
Charlie
On 1/9/2016 12:29 PM, Patrick Ladd wrote:
I installed a Lift Reserve Indicator probe with a plate>>
What the hell is that and why do you need it.Particularly if you are
adding 11 ozs. Totally ignorant. Pat
From: Nick Cassara
Sent: Monday, January 4, 2016 7:56 PM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Weight in one wing...?
mailto:nickc(at)mtaonline.net (nickc(at)mtaonline.net)
Hello Kolber flyers,
I am covering my left wing. I installed a Lift Reserve Indicator probe
with a plate, that weights about 11oz, in the next bay out board of the
strut mount on my left wing. Should I add an equivalent amount of weight
in the right wing for balance?
Thanks,
Nick Cassara
Palmer, AK
Kolbra #1 p; -- Please Support Your Lists This Month (And Get
Annual List below to Incentive Gifts
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
Thank you for your generous ; -Matt Dralle, List
nbsp; Navigator Photoshare, and
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronic
p; the Web
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
_p; generous bsp;
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
================
________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________
Time: 07:58:57 AM PST US
Subject: Re: Weight in one wing...?
From: Martin Koxxy <martinkoxxy(at)gmail.com>
Mark Beierle, the designer of the Earthstar line of planes (Thundergull,
Gull 2000, Odyssey), makes exactly that point. Ultralights and
near-ultralights tend to be flown a lot more by seat-of-the-pants and
exterior view clues than by instruments, and the added weight and
complication goes contrary to the Ultralight "spirit".
That said, while learning to fly my eGull, I would have appreciated an LRI
or AOA (angle of attack) indicator to calibrate myself. But now, after only
10 hours, I can tell this calibration process is well under way, and my
instrument scans are getting shorter and less frequent, with more attention
paid to the sight picture (and traffic in the pattern).
Weight: If I had gone through with an AOA instrument, I would have added
only a second, angled pitot tube and hose, and my GRT EFIS would have been
able to display AOA on the screen - a weight penalty in the 3-4 oz range.
On Sun, Jan 10, 2016 at 3:29 AM, Patrick Ladd <patrickjladd(at)hotmail.com>
wrote:
> Hi Charlie,
> i suppose what I was asking in a guarded manner was why would anyone in a
> ultralight, or indeed any light aircraft want an unnecessary complication
> like this. Still we all pimp our rides to suit ourselves. As far as the
> extra 11 ozs goes I would have thought that in the fight to keep ultralight
> below the legal weight limit even 11 ozs. needs to be watched. Weight
> increases naturally after the initial weighing anyway with radios, GPS,
> cameras etc.
> The guy who built my Extra added all sorts of odd little brackets or a bit
> of stiffening or beefing up wherever he saw what he considered a weak
> point. All without consulting me a couple of hundred miles away. This
> caused all sorts of fancy maths to get her certified as a microlight.
> Cheers
> Pat
>
> *From:* Charlie England <ceengland7(at)gmail.com>
> *Sent:* Saturday, January 9, 2016 8:00 PM
> *To:* kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> *Subject:* Re: Weight in one wing...?
>
> LRI's are basically angle of attack indicators. I suppose you could argue
> that you don't need them on an ultralite (type) a/c, but then, we don't
> know how he intends to use the a/c. US Navy pilots depend on AOA indicators
> to land on carriers safely, and some 'bush' pilots do, too.
>
> As far as balance goes, odds are high that component tolerances and build
> errors will easily mask an 11 oz weight difference. On a plane with wing
> tanks, just over 0.1 gallons of fuel difference between tanks would cause
> that much imbalance.
>
> Charlie
>
> On 1/9/2016 12:29 PM, Patrick Ladd wrote:
>
> I installed a Lift Reserve Indicator probe with a plate>>
>
> What the hell is that and why do you need it.Particularly if you are
> adding 11 ozs. Totally ignorant. Pat
>
> *From:* Nick Cassara <nickc(at)mtaonline.net>
> *Sent:* Monday, January 4, 2016 7:56 PM
> *To:* kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> *Subject:* Weight in one wing...?
>
> <nickc(at)mtaonline.net>
>
> Hello Kolber flyers,
>
> I am covering my left wing. I installed a Lift Reserve Indicator probe
> with a plate, that weights about 11oz, in the next bay out board of the
> strut mount on my left wing. Should I add an equivalent amount of weight in
> the right wing for balance?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Nick Cassara
> Palmer, AK
>
> Kolbra #1 p; -- Please Support Your Lists This Month (And Get Annual
> List below to Incentive Gifts href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution"
> <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>>http://www.matronics.com/cThank
> you for your generous ; -Matt Dralle, List nbsp;
> Navigator Photoshare, and href
> "http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List"
> <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List>>http://www.matronicp;
> the Web href="http://forums.matronics.com" <http://forums.matronics.com>>
> http://forums.matronics.com
> _p; generous bsp; href
> "http://www.matronics.com/contribution"
> <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>>
> http://www.matronics.com/c================
>
>
________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________
Time: 09:12:54 AM PST US
Subject: Re: Re: Horizontal stabilizer seals
From: Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com>
I believe what happens is that the air leaking through the slot between the
horizontal stabilizer and the boom tube causes the flow to go more
vertically over the rudder rather than horizontally. I base this on the
results of tuft testing I did on the Mk III's rear fuselage segment as seen
in the video I shot of the tests:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IG796iiymYw
I attached photos of the gap seals to the original post but just in
case...... The photo shows the second set of seals with their peel ply
covering with the first set of seals all trimmed up and ready to bond to
the second set when they are cured and trimmed. This style of construction
was only possible because the "plane from hell" had the horizontal
stabilizer set on the center line of the tube.
Rick
On Thu, Jan 7, 2016 at 11:49 PM, wakataka <wakataka(at)charter.net> wrote:
>
> Any idea why sealing the elevator gap had such an effect on the rudder
> effectiveness? I wouldn't have expected that.
>
> I'd love to see a photo of the seals you built. I'm planning to recover m
y
> Firestar next year and gap seals are one of the things I need to figure o
ut
> how to install.
>
> --------
> There is something fascinating about science. One gets such wholesale
> returns of conjecture out of such a trifling investment of fact.
>
> Mark Twain
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=451801#451801
>
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
===========
>
>
--
=9CBlessed are the cracked, for they shall let in the light.=9D
Groucho Marx
<http://www.goodreads.com/author/show/43244.Groucho_Marx>
________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________
Time: 09:37:28 AM PST US
From: william sullivan <williamtsullivan(at)att.net>
Subject: Re: Re: Horizontal stabilizer seals
Rick- How do you fold it? It looks to be a rigid assembly.
Bill Sullivan
________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________
Time: 10:15:48 AM PST US
Subject: Re: Re: Horizontal stabilizer seals
From: Charlie England <ceengland7(at)gmail.com>
Wouldn't the air be going *down* through the tube-stabilizer gap? (Higher
pressure on top of the tail.) That would still reduce the rudder's
effectiveness, since vertical flow would disrupt horizontal flow across the
rudder.
On Sun, Jan 10, 2016 at 10:56 AM, Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com>
wrote:
> I believe what happens is that the air leaking through the slot between
> the horizontal stabilizer and the boom tube causes the flow to go more
> vertically over the rudder rather than horizontally. I base this on the
> results of tuft testing I did on the Mk III's rear fuselage segment as se
en
> in the video I shot of the tests:
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IG796iiymYw
>
> I attached photos of the gap seals to the original post but just in
> case...... The photo shows the second set of seals with their peel ply
> covering with the first set of seals all trimmed up and ready to bond to
> the second set when they are cured and trimmed. This style of constructio
n
> was only possible because the "plane from hell" had the horizontal
> stabilizer set on the center line of the tube.
>
> Rick
>
>
> On Thu, Jan 7, 2016 at 11:49 PM, wakataka <wakataka(at)charter.net> wrote:
>
>>
>> Any idea why sealing the elevator gap had such an effect on the rudder
>> effectiveness? I wouldn't have expected that.
>>
>> I'd love to see a photo of the seals you built. I'm planning to recover
>> my Firestar next year and gap seals are one of the things I need to figu
re
>> out how to install.
>>
>> --------
>> There is something fascinating about science. One gets such wholesale
>> returns of conjecture out of such a trifling investment of fact.
>>
>> Mark Twain
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=451801#451801
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ==========
>> br> fts!)
>> r> > w.buildersbooks.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">
>> www.buildersbooks.com
>> rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contributi
on
>> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
>> ==========
>> -List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">
>> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
>> ==========
>> FORUMS -
>> eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
>> ==========
>> b Site -
>> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
>> rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contributi
on
>> ==========
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> =9CBlessed are the cracked, for they shall let in the light.
=9D Groucho Marx
> <http://www.goodreads.com/author/show/43244.Groucho_Marx>
>
>
________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________
Time: 11:43:30 AM PST US
From: mojavjoe(at)comcast.net
Subject: Re: Re: Horizontal stabilizer seals
Couldn't the seals be attached to the boom tube under the horizontal stab.
so it could be folded. Also if properly braced it might take the place of t
he upper wire bracing.
---
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Richard Pike
Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 1671
Location: Blountville, Tennessee
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| Posted: Mon Jan 11, 2016 6:17 am Post subject: Re: Kolb-List Digest: 14 Msgs - 01/10/16 |
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No, we didn't ask for your two cents. In your previous post you just sort of popped on, said something annoying (Like the anti-religion goober who was on last fall) because your purpose is simply to stir stuff up.
You are nothing but an internet troll.
Unlike the rest of us, you have never contributed anything useful to the list, or anything to edify or help anybody on this list, you are simply an annoying pest.
Go away and don't come back until you learn some manners and have something useful to contribute.
(And the lists's resident (and often unwelcome) pastor shakes the dust off his feet and goes out to the hangar to start pulling the 582 off so he can rebuild the magneto harness...)
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_________________
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0
Forgiving is tough, being forgiven is wonderful, and God's grace really is amazing. |
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